Am I screwed!!???

[MedicineMike]

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I posted early this week my situation and then I started calling around to the post-bacc programs. They say that medical schools look highly into a student completing a post-bacc program. The only problem is, how the heck am i going to get into one with my stats???

Im 24 yrs old and a graduate from the university of Georgia with a BS in real estate. I was an athlete in college with a very rigorous schedule and ended up with a 2.66 cum GPA.

My SAT score was like 1000...Didnt need to really care about it much since i was on scholarship to college in high school.

My question is...What would you do in my shoes???? How would i go about getting into a post-bacc program?? Or should i just do 2 years of science classes at a state college????

Mike

 

[deleted248403]

There will be mixed opinion on this.

My thoughts would be try and get into any post-bac program that will take you. If you cannot get in, take some sciences classes at your local college. Boast your GPA and re-try a year from now.

Also, think about taking the GRE as if you rock it, that may buy you some points from post-bac programs. You'll still need to take the MCAT but wait till you've done some or all of the pre-reqs. But the GRE may buy you some leverage as most post-bacc programs accept it.

 

[MedicineMike]

does anyone know which programs i would have the "best" chance getting into???? I hear Harvard takes a lot of applicants....

You think i can study and take the GRE before June 1st?? looks like ill be hunkerin' down this month!!

Mike

 

[deleted248403]

Most deadlines have passed or are quickly approaching. HES does take a lot of applicants but its certainly no sure thing. With a low GPA and no MCAT/GRE - odds are long.

Only take it if you can rock it - cos if you take it and suck, then you will be sinking yourself faster. If needs be take some time, plan this out slowly and carefully. better to hold for a year and get everything planned out and done properly then rush it and tank the GRE/MCAT

 

[gl0baltrader]

I think you should do a second bachelor or more science post-bac before applying into a MSP. The reason I suggest this is that you have very little science background and a negative or poor performance in an SMP might prevent you from getting into a medical school now and in the future.
I believe it is more effective for you to strengthen your science background before and prepare for the rigorous course of Master Science Program, since many requires you to take med school courses.

Take your time in getting it right this time and you should realize that medical school is not a race. I am 24 years old and I am taking post bac classes before going to a MSP program this fall of 2009.

Also if you are taking a second bachelor you are eligible to apply to many clinical program every summer at the NIH and other institution. You will also be able to utilize this time to build your hospital experience, such as shadowing etc.
You will also be able to get more letter of recommendation.

Good Luck,
D

 

[MedicineMike]

i am trying to get into a post-bacc program for pre-med. Not an MSP. Or are they the same thing?

I might try and take the GRE in 2-3 weeks (i got laid off my job recently so i can pretty much study all day everyday if need be). I know i am not supposed to rush this, but it cant hurt.

I spoke to a lady at Agnes-Scott today and told her my situation. She said the only thing that would benefit me would be to Kill the GRE.

I have taken a few science classes in undergrad...Physics(A) Biology (B-) Entomology (A), etc...in fact, my best grades were in those classes!! haha. I kept trying to convince myself that i liked business for some reason bc it was the "cool" thing to do in college.

You think i should go back to a state college and become like a biology major for 2 years, and then apply a post-bacc program? I think that'll take a little too long...

 

[deleted248403]

i am trying to get into a post-bacc program for pre-med. Not an MSP. Or are they the same thing?

I might try and take the GRE in 2-3 weeks (i got laid off my job recently so i can pretty much study all day everyday if need be). I know i am not supposed to rush this, but it cant hurt.

You think i should go back to a state college and become like a biology major for 2 years, and then apply a post-bacc program? I think that'll take a little too long...

1) They are related, not the same. I am sure there is a sticky explaining

2) It absolutely can hurt especially if you wish to apply in the short-term. If you take it, and tank it you will show schools you havent got what it takes. It will stay that way until until you raise your GPA or repeat the GRE and rock it.

3) As someone said, med school isnt a race. I'm 24 too and going to do an SMP/post-bac. If you want to be a doctor tomorrow, then you're in it for the wrong reasons. If you truly want to do it, take the year, rock it, get As, take the MCAT/GRE and rock it, and go from there.

 

[MedicineMike]

1) They are related, not the same. I am sure there is a sticky explaining

2) It absolutely can hurt especially if you wish to apply in the short-term. If you take it, and tank it you will show schools you havent got what it takes. It will stay that way until until you raise your GPA or repeat the GRE and rock it.

3) As someone said, med school isnt a race. I'm 24 too and going to do an SMP/post-bac. If you want to be a doctor tomorrow, then you're in it for the wrong reasons. If you truly want to do it, take the year, rock it, get As, take the MCAT/GRE and rock it, and go from there.

If i take the GRE in the short-term and do terrible on it, I will not apply!!

If i take it and do well, i will apply. Granted I still probably wouldnt get in regardless of how good my GRE is.

I cannot take the MCAT until I have taken all the pre-reqs which are on it. Do you have to take the MCAT to get into an SMP?? If so, why not just apply to med school? I, so confused!!😕😕😕😕😕😕😕😕😕

 

[deleted248403]

I dont think SMPs require MCAT. Its an either/or deal with the GRE.

You would not get into med school with a 2.66 and having not done the pre-reqs. Thats why would shouldnt apply. You'd be wasting your thousands of $$

You need to do the pre-reqs - if you cannot get into a post-bac program to do them, then you should enroll at a state school and just do them.

 

[MedicineMike]

I dont think SMPs require MCAT. Its an either/or deal with the GRE.

You would not get into med school with a 2.66 and having not done the pre-reqs. Thats why would shouldnt apply. You'd be wasting your thousands of $$

You need to do the pre-reqs - if you cannot get into a post-bac program to do them, then you should enroll at a state school and just do them.

I am currently enrolled in a state university starting this summer. However, I spoke to the lady at Agnes-Scott pre-med postbacc and she said that med schools definitely look at a post-bacc program as better than doing pre-reqs on your own. That is when i freaked out and wanted to figure out a way to getinto a post-bacc!!!

I just dont know if it's possible with my numbers. However, do some post-bacc schools look at extracurricular? I was a swimmer in college...Got up at 4:45am and went non-stop until 7 (3 workouts, fulltime school) 5 days a week. With 1 workout on saturday. I did that for 4 years...my grades were suffering substantially...I would nap on the bus in the 15 min between classes!!!

 

[deleted248403]

Post-bac is definitely better than doing it on your own. but you might not have the grades (not sure what the reqs are) and some deadlines have already passed. Check out the aamc page, i think it shows deadlines.

Look at the MSAR for med school grade spectrum. lowest 10% tend to have GPAs around 3.2-3.3; id imagine they are athletes or have some trying circumstances. 2.66 is a long way off them.

 

[MedicineMike]

Post-bac is definitely better than doing it on your own. but you might not have the grades (not sure what the reqs are) and some deadlines have already passed. Check out the aamc page, i think it shows deadlines.

Look at the MSAR for med school grade spectrum. lowest 10% tend to have GPAs around 3.2-3.3; id imagine they are athletes or have some trying circumstances. 2.66 is a long way off them.

So if you were in my shoes...What would be your plan that would best position your for being accepted in med school?

 

[deleted248403]

Get into any post-bacc you can starting in the fall. If you cannot get in anywhere, enroll in some intro bio and intro chem classes for the summer/fall. Get as many damn As as humanely possible. Examine whether or not the post-baccs you want require the GRE and take it if necessary. Re-apply to a post-bac program for entrance Fall 2010, but in the mean time take more classes in the springtime.

Consider a second bachelor's in bio or something similar as suggested by globaltrader.

Consider doing some volunteer/healthcare work to boast up that side of your resume.

Even if you take the GRE soon, most deadlines for apps are june 1st if not earlier, so you'd have to have taken it before then and probably gotten your score back. It's possible, but i'd be wary of taking the GRE in a rushed fashion. I did that with the MCAT and it set me back a year.

 

[MedicineMike]

Get into any post-bacc you can starting in the fall. If you cannot get in anywhere, enroll in some intro bio and intro chem classes for the summer/fall. Get as many damn As as humanely possible. Examine whether or not the post-baccs you want require the GRE and take it if necessary. Re-apply to a post-bac program for entrance Fall 2010, but in the mean time take more classes in the springtime.

Consider a second bachelor's in bio or something similar as suggested by globaltrader.

Consider doing some volunteer/healthcare work to boast up that side of your resume.

Even if you take the GRE soon, most deadlines for apps are june 1st if not earlier, so you'd have to have taken it before then and probably gotten your score back. It's possible, but i'd be wary of taking the GRE in a rushed fashion. I did that with the MCAT and it set me back a year.

I dont understand why it sets you back a year? Just take it again if you do bad. They don't average them or anything

 

[deleted248403]

It set me back because i took the MCAT late, did poorly, and tried to apply that year with it. If i'd been smarter and planned it better, i could have taken it once, rocked it and given myself a better chance of getting in the first go around. But i rushed it, did poorly, and now have to spend a year taking a post-bac and repeating the mcat

 

[drizzt3117]

I don't think a postbac program is necessarily better than taking classes on your own, unless you're going to one of the very top programs. Most schools don't care where you take your classes. The OP's goal should be to improve their GPA to 3.0 or above, then apply to a SMP program or the caribbean.

 

[MedicineMike]

I don't think a postbac program is necessarily better than taking classes on your own, unless you're going to one of the very top programs. Most schools don't care where you take your classes. The OP's goal should be to improve their GPA to 3.0 or above, then apply to a SMP program or the caribbean.

I am still trying to decide what an SMP program will do for me after a year of post-bacc?? and are SMPs only a year long? Seems like a lot of extra time and, more importantly, $$$$

 

[deleted248403]

Not to be rude or blunt; but you didn't do well as an undergrad, its gonna have its consequences. and that maybe in the form of time and $$

 

[MedicineMike]

Not to be rude or blunt; but you didn't do well as an undergrad, its gonna have its consequences. and that maybe in the form of time and $$

gah i wish i knew at 18yrs old what the hell i was doing!!! oh well...time to step up and do what i gotta do. Would taking a year of post-bacc and then a year of SMP program be better than just taking 1.5years fulltime postbacc at state college and then take mcat/apply for med school for the following fall? I think that might work out better in my opinion...but then again, i dont really know much.

 

[gl0baltrader]

gah i wish i knew at 18yrs old what the hell i was doing!!! oh well...time to step up and do what i gotta do. Would taking a year of post-bacc and then a year of SMP program be better than just taking 1.5years fulltime postbacc at state college and then take mcat/apply for med school for the following fall? I think that might work out better in my opinion...but then again, i dont really know much.

I'm assuming that you're talking about 1.5 years in informal post-bac correct ? That would translate to one year to fulfill the science requirements and leave you with one quarter of upper division science. I would suggest doing a one year post-bac to fulfill the requirements and applying to SMP. That way you have a good chance of getting into medical school after finishing up the SMP instead of just relying on an informal post-bac.

 

[MedicineMike]

I'm assuming that you're talking about 1.5 years in informal post-bac correct ? That would translate to one year to fulfill the science requirements and leave you with one quarter of upper division science. I would suggest doing a one year post-bac to fulfill the requirements and applying to SMP. That way you have a good chance of getting into medical school after finishing up the SMP instead of just relying on an informal post-bac.

yes informal: So I start in May (in a few months), then go full-time fall, full-time spring, apply to SMP and start in fall 2010 right? Then finish Spring 2011 and apply to med school and start Fall 2011??? Does this sound right??

I want to try and avoid the lag year b/w postbacc/smp and med school if at all possible

 

[gl0baltrader]

yes informal: So I start in May (in a few months), then go full-time fall, full-time spring, apply to SMP and start in fall 2010 right? Then finish Spring 2011 and apply to med school and start Fall 2011??? Does this sound right??

I want to try and avoid the lag year b/w postbacc/smp and med school if at all possible

Well technically you can apply to SMP program such as Drexel and NYMC that admit many of their SMP student. So you will apply to the Post-Bac around January of 2010 and apply to Medical school in June of 2010 for the 2011 application. If you do well in the DPMS they will guarantee you an interview. If everything goes well they will admit you for the 2011 class unless you have a specific school that you want to attend ?

 

[MedicineMike]

Well technically you can apply to SMP program such as Drexel and NYMC that admit many of their SMP student. So you will apply to the Post-Bac around January of 2010 and apply to Medical school in June of 2010 for the 2011 application. If you do well in the DPMS they will guarantee you an interview. If everything goes well they will admit you for the 2011 class unless you have a specific school that you want to attend ?

You mean ill apply to SMP around January 2010 (or the start of my spring semester pre-reqs) and apply to med school before i even start my SMP??

Also what is DPMS?

And I would like to stay in Georgia (thats where i reside) for tuition costs...but south carolina, tennessee, florida are all options for out-of-state.

 

[NewmansOwn]

You mean ill apply to SMP around January 2010 (or the start of my spring semester pre-reqs) and apply to med school before i even start my SMP??

Also what is DPMS?

And I would like to stay in Georgia (thats where i reside) for tuition costs...but south carolina, tennessee, florida are all options for out-of-state.

Look, you need to take a step back and think about the gravity of what you're trying to do. Everything you're saying indicates that you have had a sudden change of heart/mind, whether it be from loss of a job or otherwise, and you want to rush into medicine. Unfortunately, that's not really possible even if you have a good undergraduate record.

While I'm sure it was an enriching experience for you, medical schools could not possibly care less that you were an elite swimmer -- that won't make you a better doctor. You have zero medically-related volunteer experiences, a low GPA and an extremely low SAT score. All of these things will make admission to a postbac very difficult. Since, for whatever reason, you're dying to get started immediately and most deadlines have already passed, your situation is all but impossible.

If everything goes absolutely perfectly, you get some lucky breaks and you're willing to consider Caribbean schools, you might be able to start medical school in 3 years. Otherwise, it will be closer to 4 or 5. You need lots and lots of As to pull up your GPA, you need to score very high on the MCAT and you need to build a repertoire of medically-related volunteer activities.

Your best bet is to start with Gen Chem this summer at your local state school and take the rest of the pre-reqs during the following academic year, starting in the fall. If you get high grades in all of those, you can consider taking the next step -- taking more advanced science classes. As has been said, you can either attempt to apply for an SMP or you can stay at your state institution and take upper level science classes. Again, you must receive As with maybe a few A-s and B+s here and there. You will need to do this for 1-2 additional years after your prereqs. During this time, you must also volunteer regularly to get some hands-on experience and study for/take the MCAT. On the latter, you should probably get above a 33 to turn some heads when you finally apply.

If you're at an SMP, you may have the opportunity to link to a certain medical school, though you'll have to give up your desire to stay in-state. If not, you'll need to tack on another year to apply and interview.

As competitive as it is, there are simply no shortcuts in medicine.

 

[MedicineMike]

Newmansown: I understand...

During your SMP, you can apply to other med-schools correct? You don't have to only apply to the one your SMP is affiliated with, correct?

 

[NewmansOwn]

Newmansown: I understand...

During your SMP, you can apply to other med-schools correct? You don't have to only apply to the one your SMP is affiliated with, correct?

You're asking if there's some sort of law or regulation against applying to medical schools outside of your home institution?

No. You can apply to whichever medical schools you choose.

 

[MedicineMike]

You're asking if there's some sort of law or regulation against applying to medical schools outside of your home institution?

No. You can apply to whichever medical schools you choose.

you sure are full of yourself newmansown

 

[MedicineMike]

and to the others who offer constructive advice...Would it hurt to join any Masters of Science program or should it be an SMP program geared towards pre-med?

 

[deleted248403]

you sure are full of yourself newmansown

He laid it out for you - no need for the catty comments.

I'm just about exhausted laying out what you have to do to get in. Go buy a book, do some reading, and figure it out like the rest of us did. We've all taken our time to explain to you what you have to do.

Go get started on your pre-reqs at your local school, get volunteering, get medical exposure, and worry about an SMP in a year or two.

You've got at least 3-4 years before you'll even be considered for med school

 

[Nuggles]

MedicineMike,

Everyone here has been offering constructive advice to you. Just because someone says something that you don't want to hear, doesn't mean you should go making snide remarks to them. In fact, of all the advice here, NewmansOwn's advice was probably the most detailed and the most realistic. You might think that you've got what it takes to become a doctor, but that's not going to do you any good if you can't convince the admissions people of that. You have a very low GPA, low test scores and no healthcare experience; why in the world would any medical school choose you over someone else who has demonstrated an ability to do well in school and a commitment to medicine?

Medical schools are extremely competitive; the absolute worse thing a person in your situation can do right now is to rush into this without planning carefully. With your track record so far, I doubt you can afford to make any more mistakes. You have to accept that this is going to be an uphill battle for you. And the others are right: you will need to spend several years to undo the damage you've done. Do yourself a favor and drop the attitude, and reread what NewmansOwn wrote. His post is choked full of good advice (it's some of the best you will be able to find on this forum), I don't see how anyone could be offended by what he wrote.

 

[MedicineMike]

MedicineMike,

Everyone here has been offering constructive advice to you. Just because someone says something that you don't want to hear, doesn't mean you should go making snide remarks to them. In fact, of all the advice here, NewmansOwn's advice was probably the most detailed and the most realistic. You might think that you've got what it takes to become a doctor, but that's not going to do you any good if you can't convince the admissions people of that. You have a very low GPA, low test scores and no healthcare experience; why in the world would any medical school choose you over someone else who has demonstrated an ability to do well in school and a commitment to medicine?

Medical schools are extremely competitive; the absolute worse thing a person in your situation can do right now is to rush into this without planning carefully. With your track record so far, I doubt you can afford to make any more mistakes. You have to accept that this is going to be an uphill battle for you. And the others are right: you will need to spend several years to undo the damage you've done. Do yourself a favor and drop the attitude, and reread what NewmansOwn wrote. His post is choked full of good advice (it's some of the best you will be able to find on this forum), I don't see how anyone could be offended by what he wrote.

I understand that it is an uphill battle and I understand what it takes. I have many friends in med school, including my little brother, and my older brother just graduated from Vet school. They all went the traditional route, and I did not know any other way (until now). I dont expect to become a dr. overnight. Nothing worth a damn comes easy.

Thank you Newmansown for your constructive advice. I apologize for the prior statements.

Off to the pre-reqs....

 

[MedicineMike]

oh, and there will be PLENTY of volunteer work in the future. I am going to try to get EMT certified in the midst of all this.

 

[Allopathic13]

I agree with Newmansown...He is well schooled in these topics and is in prob. the top post bacc in the country, Bryn Mawr.


1. Attempt to gain entrance to a Post Bacc. These classes will give you your pre reqs and raise your undergrad GPA. If you done achieve acceptance, take open enrollment classes at a local university to fulfill this requirment.

2. Get that volunteer/research/clinical/Hospital experience...it's key to getting into med school.

3. If your undergrad GPA was better you could get into Med school directly from a Post Bacc, but seemingly, you will have to do an SMP first.

4. Take the GRE, it will help you get into a Post Bacc if you do well, but dont rush it too much.

5. Try to build contacts in the Medical community, those letters of rec. will be invaluable.


Best of Luck

 

[MedicineMike]

I agree with Newmansown...He is well schooled in these topics and is in prob. the top post bacc in the country, Bryn Mawr.


1. Attempt to gain entrance to a Post Bacc. These classes will give you your pre reqs and raise your undergrad GPA. If you done achieve acceptance, take open enrollment classes at a local university to fulfill this requirment.

2. Get that volunteer/research/clinical/Hospital experience...it's key to getting into med school.

3. If your undergrad GPA was better you could get into Med school directly from a Post Bacc, but seemingly, you will have to do an SMP first.

4. Take the GRE, it will help you get into a Post Bacc if you do well, but dont rush it too much.

5. Try to build contacts in the Medical community, those letters of rec. will be invaluable.


Best of Luck

Thanks for the advice allopathic! When I woke up this morning I received an email from a past co-worker asking if I knew anyone interested in volunteering at the ER at Grady Hospital in Atlanta. This is EXACTLY what I have been looking for!! There will definitely be many volunteer work ahead of me.

I don't think I will apply to a post-bacc program since my gpa IS so low. To rush to study/take the GRE in 2 weeks is a bit of a grind. On top of that, I don't think i could get a Letter of Rec from an old professor bc chances are that they don't remember me 2 years down the road...especially not with my gpa!

I will start studying for the GRE today and if I feel comfortable enough to take it, i will!

 

[NewmansOwn]

I understand that it is an uphill battle and I understand what it takes. I have many friends in med school, including my little brother, and my older brother just graduated from Vet school. They all went the traditional route, and I did not know any other way (until now). I dont expect to become a dr. overnight. Nothing worth a damn comes easy.

Thank you Newmansown for your constructive advice. I apologize for the prior statements.

Off to the pre-reqs....

Apology accepted.

You've gotten excellent advice from everyone on this thread, so with some of your own research you should be ready to go. Don't rush anything -- unfortunately, someone in your position will likely only get one chance.

Good luck.