Anatomy & Physiology at University or CC?

[Rockinacoustic]

So my University doesn't offer the common classes of Anatomy & Physiology in a two semester sequence. Instead we have Mammalian Physiology as a 3 Credit Lecture (with a separate 3 credit lecture & lab), and Human Anatomy as a 4 credit Lecture and Lab. Both are 300 level courses.

My local CC offers A&P I and II, but both are 100 level courses. My question is would it be better (both gradewise and for pre-req namesake) to take it at the CC? Or would my added efforts and likely lower grades hold more weight in taking the higher level courses at my University?

Thanks in advance!

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[cheeseboy2]

My advice would be to take it at the CC and get A's in it. Although the school the class was taken does hold some weight, I think if you can get A's in them it will help your GPA, while you can still get a B.S. from a good university.

I've talked to some Admissions Directors and they said most of the process is a checklist to see if you have taken the class. Then once they check it all off they will see the B.S. or B.A. with the good school and that will hold weight.

 

[busyizzy]

My advice would be to take it at the CC and get A's in it. Although the school the class was taken does hold some weight, I think if you can get A's in them it will help your GPA, while you can still get a B.S. from a good university.

I've talked to some Admissions Directors and they said most of the process is a checklist to see if you have taken the class. Then once they check it all off they will see the B.S. or B.A. with the good school and that will hold weight.

Actually, if you take hard classes at a cc while attending a university, that will raise some eyebrows. It will look like you're avoiding the "harder" coursework of a university, and taking the "easy" way out. I use quotations cuz I know that some people will start complaining that a cc is NOT easier and blah blah. I know it's highly debated, and I don't want to get into it. For example, taking o chem at a cc is not good when you're attending a uni. I can imagine a & p having the same implications because it's not an easy class either. It's up to you though, which you value more. The weight of the class at a uni with a possible lower grade, or a probable higher grade that might be weighed less.

 

[yappy]

How does this play into you getting your BS/BA degree? For me the choice was easy - If I do the 300 level A&P at my UC it will complete the requirements for my upper level biology electives. If I take them at the CC they count as nothing toward my BS. Its Something to look into.
Also, is it really going to be that different between the two colleges? At my UC the professors that teach the sequence at the CC are the same people that teach A&P at the UC. They're part-time at the CC and full-time at the UC.

 

[rphfan2009]

So my University doesn't offer the common classes of Anatomy & Physiology in a two semester sequence. Instead we have Mammalian Physiology as a 3 Credit Lecture (with a separate 3 credit lecture & lab), and Human Anatomy as a 4 credit Lecture and Lab. Both are 300 level courses.

My local CC offers A&P I and II, but both are 100 level courses. My question is would it be better (both gradewise and for pre-req namesake) to take it at the CC? Or would my added efforts and likely lower grades hold more weight in taking the higher level courses at my University?

Thanks in advance!

Check with the pharmacy school...I'd personally go with a university

 

[delano2000]

What is the big hooplah about taking the same courses that are offered at CCs and taking them at a University?

 

[Passion4Sci]

What is the big hooplah about taking the same courses that are offered at CCs and taking them at a University?

The hooplah is the other way around.

It's generally seen as negative if you're attending a 4-year school but take however many classes at a CC.

 

[delano2000]

The hooplah is the other way around.

It's generally seen as negative if you're attending a 4-year school but take however many classes at a CC.

Oh. So I am guessing it is not very wise to take courses from both a CC and a university but it is best to just stick with just 1.

I just thought there were some negative connotations associated with community colleges.

 

[fenderbiz]

It's hard to say whether a class will be easier at a cc. The hardest professor at a community college is most likely harder than the easiest professor at a university, but, unfortunately, there's no way for the adcoms to know how "hard" your class was. I can say a lot of cc classes may be easier, but my ochem professor (at a cc) was ridiculous. Literally 2/3 of the class dropped, and most of them already had a bachelor's degree.

 

[Passion4Sci]

Oh. So I am guessing it is not very wise to take courses from both a CC and a university but it is best to just stick with just 1.

I just thought there were some negative connotations associated with community colleges.

Well, if you mix CC and university, you runt he risk of putting a big question mark on your packet. Like, WHY is this student mixing CC and uni? You'd need to make sure it wasn't all your hard classes at CC and all your easy classes at Uni.

There is a negative stigma attached to CC.

 

[delano2000]

Well, if you mix CC and university, you runt he risk of putting a big question mark on your packet. Like, WHY is this student mixing CC and uni? You'd need to make sure it wasn't all your hard classes at CC and all your easy classes at Uni.

There is a negative stigma attached to CC.

Point taken. What is the negative stigma?

 

[Passion4Sci]

Point taken. What is the negative stigma?

Because CCs really require no application or registration and are thus open to anyone, there is a tacit assumption on behalf of "almost everyone" (i.e., common knowledge) that CC professors need to cater to the lowest common denominator. The biggest "gotcha" is that CCs don't award + or - notation, so GPAs tend to inflate a little bit. For example, a semester where I'd earn a 3.70 at a university (A- average), it'd be a 4.00 at a CC (No A-, so my 91% final grade in 4 classes were all = A flat) Of course, the opposite is true, wherein if I got 89% final grade in all 4 of my classes, it'd just be a 3.00, but then the theory goes CC professors also tend to bump people up if they're on the cusp of the next highest letter, particularly if these students are involved in class, etc.

Clearly it varies institution to institution, if the controversy is even legitimate. But whether it is or it isn't is of no consequence to us - Pharmacy schools have accepted that they will take PRs completed at a CC, so that's all that should matter.

 

[eldiem]

I would check to see if those 300 level classes would fit into your major or fulfill some upper level elective requirements. If not, see if you can look at the syllabi for each of the classes and compare them. It all depends on what you want to get out of the courses.

A&P at a community college may be a 100-level class, but that doesn't mean it's easy. Don't expect to get better grades just because you're taking the class at the CC. In my class, nearly a third of the students dropped because they were failing.

If taking classes at two schools concurrently raises any flags, you can explain why you thought the CC A&P sequence was better for you...IF you get a chance to explain yourself. Just something to consider.

 

[delano2000]

Because CCs really require no application or registration and are thus open to anyone, there is a tacit assumption on behalf of "almost everyone" (i.e., common knowledge) that CC professors need to cater to the lowest common denominator. The biggest "gotcha" is that CCs don't award + or - notation, so GPAs tend to inflate a little bit. For example, a semester where I'd earn a 3.70 at a university (A- average), it'd be a 4.00 at a CC (No A-, so my 91% final grade in 4 classes were all = A flat) Of course, the opposite is true, wherein if I got 89% final grade in all 4 of my classes, it'd just be a 3.00, but then the theory goes CC professors also tend to bump people up if they're on the cusp of the next highest letter, particularly if these students are involved in class, etc.

Clearly it varies institution to institution, if the controversy is even legitimate. But whether it is or it isn't is of no consequence to us - Pharmacy schools have accepted that they will take PRs completed at a CC, so that's all that should matter.

Well duh. I should have guessed that. Well I guess it does have its pros and cons like anywhere else. I can testify about the +/- notations not being awarded. It would have helped this past semester since I had high Bs but they only counted it as a 3.00. But what about the financial aspect of it? What if you can't afford to pay for tuition at a univ. but find that classes at the CCs are affordable? That should be taken into consideration too.

 

[Passion4Sci]

Well duh. I should have guessed that. Well I guess it does have its pros and cons like anywhere else. I can testify about the +/- notations not being awarded. It would have helped this past semester since I had high Bs but they only counted it as a 3.00. But what about the financial aspect of it? What if you can't afford to pay for tuition at a univ. but find that classes at the CCs are affordable? That should be taken into consideration too.

No doubt it is taken into consideration. In fact, Pacific states it pretty readily. So, obviously that fact is not going completely unbeknownst to pharmacy schools.

However, the big question that is begging to be begged is this: "Well hell, you can't get into ANY law school with just a CC education, nor medical school, not even chiropractic. Obviousl those schools know university is expensive and CC is cheap. So why does Pharmacy have such low standards?"

 

[delano2000]

No doubt it is taken into consideration. In fact, Pacific states it pretty readily. So, obviously that fact is not going completely unbeknownst to pharmacy schools.

However, the big question that is begging to be begged is this: "Well hell, you can't get into ANY law school with just a CC education, nor medical school, not even chiropractic. Obviousl those schools know university is expensive and CC is cheap. So why does Pharmacy have such low standards?"

Don't they offer Pre-law at the CC level as well as the Univ. level? Hell, I am doing all my pre-reqs at my CC because I didn't wanna have to start taking out loans until I get into Pharmacy school (assuming I do). I have a question. What is the average or an estimate of the average student to teacher ratio at pharmacy schools? I know it varies but a rough estimate.

 

[Passion4Sci]

Don't they offer Pre-law at the CC level as well as the Univ. level? Hell, I am doing all my pre-reqs at my CC because I didn't wanna have to start taking out loans until I get into Pharmacy school (assuming I do). I have a question. What is the average or an estimate of the average student to teacher ratio at pharmacy schools? I know it varies but a rough estimate.

I did a few pre-requisites at the largest CC in California (And California has a VERY robust CC system) at 38,500 students and there is no "pre law" curriculum. Truth be told, "pre-law" is discouraged by law schools. We paid way too much money for my wife to attend a law school applicant/admissions seminar thing, and they said law schools look for a major/minor combination of stuff like English/Philosophy, so I guess technically English is "pre-law."

Regardless, there is absolutely no way to go from a CC to a law school, even if you take the LSAT, without going through a 4 year university.

You cannot do that, however, for pharmacy school.

Anyway, for your student:faculty ratio question, here are some as I flipped through my Rx for Success:

UCSF - 11:1
UAMS - 6:1
SUNY Buffalo - 10:1
McWhorter - 14:1
Purdue: 9:1
U of Kentucky - 7:1

So yeah, totally runs the gamut.

 

[Rockinacoustic]

Thanks so much for the replies.

I've decided I'll tough it at my university, and not try to take the easy way out at my CC. Looking at Buffalo's Pharm pre-req's it looks like separate Anatomy and Physiology classes will transfer nicely. I also feel I'll get more out of the classes if I truely challenge myself, regardless if the PCAT or Pharm school go as in-depth.

Just to add to the CC vs. Univ. discussion, I think it depends on your University. If you're like me, and go to a large state school, there's less student-teacher interaction. Being able to put a face on a test is a big factor during grading, as your not just a percentile. Also, due to large class sizes, you're more likely to be tested with hit or miss multiple choice questions, instead of free-response concept, which I tend to find more manageable.

Community Colleges and even small private schools have class ratios on the low end, so the teacher will test you by free-response, know you by name, and likely grade you on their class interaction with you; not solely on your exam results. So of course I'd like a way out of my universities Physiology class of 500+ students where the professor multiple choice test reads "choose the most incorrect answer..." Ridiculous? Yes. But if I won't challenge myself now, then what business will I have in Pharmacy school?

 

[Passion4Sci]

Most incorrect answer? Wow, I never even got that treatment at Stanford.

You're right about challenge, though.

 

[delano2000]

I did a few pre-requisites at the largest CC in California (And California has a VERY robust CC system) at 38,500 students and there is no "pre law" curriculum. Truth be told, "pre-law" is discouraged by law schools. We paid way too much money for my wife to attend a law school applicant/admissions seminar thing, and they said law schools look for a major/minor combination of stuff like English/Philosophy, so I guess technically English is "pre-law."

Regardless, there is absolutely no way to go from a CC to a law school, even if you take the LSAT, without going through a 4 year university.

You can do that, however, for pharmacy school.

Anyway, for your student:faculty ratio question, here are some as I flipped through my Rx for Success:

UCSF - 11:1
UAMS - 6:1
SUNY Buffalo - 10:1
McWhorter - 14:1
Purdue: 9:1
U of Kentucky - 7:1

So yeah, totally runs the gamut.

Oh well you learn something new everyday. Those stats by the way are impressive if you ask me.