another rank list; questions about programs

[porcupinefamily]

Right now these are in no particular order:

Northwestern University
UPMC
University of Washington
Emory University
Duke University

Are there any significant differences of these programs' reputation nationally? I know most say to try and train in the region you're interested in working, but I will say I'm less interested in one of these programs due to some circumstances and personal preferences, even though it is the area that I would likely see myself most long-term.

Lastly, will training at places like Johns Hopkins, MGH, BWH, or University of Michigan really reap that much significant benefit long-term? I'm interested in pursuing an academic career.

Thanks in advance.

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[SunBakedTrash]

These are all good programs, I would say UW, Emory and Duke are probably the more big name of the five and with more famous faculty but I would pick the one you like the most and the area you want to live as all of these places would set you up for any kind of fellowship and career trajectory you want.

The very tip top like JHU and MGH would definitely set you apart but would be most helpful if you wanted to work at one of them. If you would be happy anywhere in academics, the ones you mentioned are just fine. They might even make you a more well-rounded pathologist.

 

[Med Director New England]

Lastly, will training at places like Johns Hopkins, MGH, BWH, or University of Michigan really reap that much significant benefit long-term? I'm interested in pursuing an academic career.

Yes - absolutely. Academia or any job.
But Michigan is not on the same level as the others you mention.

 

[caffeinegirl]

Training at a top program will help you in academics as their academic network will help you find a position. Not the same for private practice.

 

[porcupinefamily]

Thanks for the responses.

I was fortunate enough to get interviews at top tier institutions. The prestige and network is definitely a big draw being that I want to stay academic. Unfortunately I just can't get over the inane cost of living at these places (looking at you, Boston). I'm a single trainee, the thought of having a roommate for another 4 years just so I don't have to spend 50% of my gross income on rent to live in a closet or have a decent commute makes me gag. The MGH/BWH merger also gives me pause. Baltimore is cheaper, but the amount of grossing and work hours of Hopkins residents seemed excessive even for a top-tier institution, and I didn't get the sense that it really paid off diagnostically compared to other programs.

As an aside rant, perhaps I am being naive: really frustrated at the amount of academic inbreeding and find it hard as a result to truly gauge whether training is solid and can cross over. Interviewing with faculty who did not train at the institution was so refreshing. As someone who's trained at multiple institutions and moved around geographically, I would think departments see the value in having a more diverse group of trained faculty but like I said, I am being naive and idealistic.

 

[gbwillner]

Thanks for the responses.

I was fortunate enough to get interviews at top tier institutions. The prestige and network is definitely a big draw being that I want to stay academic. Unfortunately I just can't get over the inane cost of living at these places (looking at you, Boston). I'm a single trainee, the thought of having a roommate for another 4 years just so I don't have to spend 50% of my gross income on rent to live in a closet or have a decent commute makes me gag. The MGH/BWH merger also gives me pause. Baltimore is cheaper, but the amount of grossing and work hours of Hopkins residents seemed excessive even for a top-tier institution, and I didn't get the sense that it really paid off diagnostically compared to other programs.

As an aside rant, perhaps I am being naive: really frustrated at the amount of academic inbreeding and find it hard as a result to truly gauge whether training is solid and can cross over. Interviewing with faculty who did not train at the institution was so refreshing. As someone who's trained at multiple institutions and moved around geographically, I would think departments see the value in having a more diverse group of trained faculty but like I said, I am being naive and idealistic.

I agree that being at a "top" place can be very helpful in academia, but you are talking about top-notch programs that certainly not going to hurt you. Additionally, the pedigree will get you in the door a lot of places but isn't going to punch a ticket for you. If you are at Duke and get your work published in good journals and get grants and are personable and a good communicator, you will trounce applicants who "just went to MGH". So ALL THINGS BEING EQUAL, BWH and JHU and a few other places will be best, but things are not equal, so don't loose too much sleep over it.

Additionally, there are issues in getting appointments at the institution where you trained. I am not so sure it is helpful. Sure, you will much more easily get a Instructor level position at JHU if you did your residency there. Moving from that to Asst Prof is not necessarily better. IMO, sometimes you will always be seen as the trainee, rather than the expert you have become. Lateral moves are imperative in academia if you want to have competitive pay and be taken seriously.

 

[octopusprime]

Additionally, there are issues in getting appointments at the institution where you trained. I am not so sure it is helpful. Sure, you will much more easily get a Instructor level position at JHU if you did your residency there. Moving from that to Asst Prof is not necessarily better. IMO, sometimes you will always be seen as the trainee, rather than the expert you have become. Lateral moves are imperative in academia if you want to have competitive pay and be taken seriously.

Agree with that sentiment--very easy to be pigeon holed not simply as a trainee but a particular pathologist o\r type of person or your rank amongst your peers. Ditto the lateral moves comment.

 

[Med Director New England]

Unfortunately I just can't get over the inane cost of living at these places (looking at you, Boston). I'm a single trainee,

If you are a single person with no kids Boston will be very livable on even a resident’s salary.

If you can get into MGH or B&W - I HIGHLY recommend you go there.