Any MPH non-trads?

[IndigoBoy0]

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Hey all,

I obtained my MPH last May and was wondering if there were any other public health people going the MD route? I love what I do working on global reproductive health issues, however it seems like people see our MPH as a "fake" degree. I'm curious how it will be viewed by potential adcoms. I also have a MA in international affairs as the global health program I did was a dual MA/MPH degree.

I am glad I found this forum. I will definitely use it forum. I will definitely take advantage of it come orgo the second time around in Spring.

Here's my stats. I think I stand a chance (Granted I'll need to take the MCATs at some point)

Rice U grad psychology 3.85 GPA
MPH./MA degree 3.8 GPA
Chem I/II A-,A-
Bio I/II A/A
Physics : AP Credit (although I took "engineering physics" different then pre-med and got a C/B)
Orgo: In process.... (reatking orgo I got a B in lab...)

Cheers!

 

[llp]

hi,
It's great that you started this thread. I'm currently in my last semester of a MPH and there are several doctors in the program with me who view MPH as important to advancing their career as a clinical physician so I think it's great you decided to pursue public health. Even w/out the MPH your stats are very good. Good Luck!

 

[Jolie South]

I have an MSPH and worked with Peace Corps doing public health type stuff. I think my experience more than the degree helped me out in the application process.

As the above poster said, your stats look great and to me most physicians could benefit from public health. It makes us realize that disease does not occur in a vacuum and heightens awareness of social/behavioral factors.

 

[Luxian]

*wave* I'm an MSPH too (Masters of Science in Public Health). In general, I found my MPH program fascinating but deeply undervalued. I worked at the CDC for a year and kept seeing MDs with no public health experience struggling to design studies that would yield any results whatsoever.

Keep your MPH mindset. It will make you a better doctor. But none of the other doctors will value it.

 

[llp]

Luxian, why won't the other doctors value it? What was it like working for the CDC? What did you do there? I always wanted to work for the CDC. Thanks!

 

[llp]

IndigoBoy0 I'm somewhat out of the loop so what have you heard in regards to receiving an MPH as a 'fake' degree? Thanks!

 

[Luxian]

Luxian, why won't the other doctors value it? What was it like working for the CDC? What did you do there? I always wanted to work for the CDC. Thanks!

Mostly it's because they won't know what an MPH actually means. I got the sense (and of course, I'm not a doctor yet, so take this with a grain of salt), that doctors feel they know more than anyone else, forgetting that they know more than anyone else only in a particular area!

At the CDC, I worked in environmental health. As an MPH I got stuck entering data from surveys and doing grant administration for health-related grants to universities. The best moment was the month I spent in the Emergency Operations Center. There at least I was in daily contact with the state health authorities, collecting information on an outbreak. On the whole, however, I felt that MDs were just much better respected. The EIS program (Epidemic Intelligence Service) is almost exclusively for MDs with a sprinkling of PhDs and every other year or so an MPH, even though the work they do requires a deep understanding of epidemiology, far more than most MDs have time to cover. Essentially, the MDs were expending a lot of effort learning public health on the fly and the MPHs were stuck in the office doing the paperwork.

The CDC is a great place if you are in the EIS program, or if you have done your adventuresome career work and are ready to sit back and enjoy a desk job. It would be a great place to work in 10 or 15 years, but as for me, I want to get my hands dirty first.

 

[Jolie South]

at my public health school, public health was always looked down upon by med students. the med students were all of the mindset that public health was something that you did if you couldn't get into med school, which could not be more wrong.

The majority of the people that I knew were solely interested in careers in public health and never aspired to med school.

just a thought. . .

 

[chakavak]

Hi guys,

I am a pre-pharm applicant and I am interested in getting a master in public health. I am not clear about the difference in MPH ans MSPH though. Can someone explain the difference please? Thank you

 

[Crixivan]

Hi guys,

I am a pre-pharm applicant and I am interested in getting a master in public health. I am not clear about the difference in MPH ans MSPH though. Can someone explain the difference please? Thank you

I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing that it would have to do with the number of credit hours for the degree and the emphasis on research. On my campus, the M.S. and Ph.D. (academic degrees) are technically administered by the graduate college and require 36 (4 as thesis) and 90 hours respectively. The MPH and DrPH (Doctor of Public Health) are professional degree programs run by the College of Public Health. The MPH requires 44 hours, and the DrPH necessitates and MPH and another 50 hours.

I'm not able to comment on the marketability of any of the above or what sorts of opportunities the academic degrees have versus the professional programs.

 

[Jolie South]

Hi guys,

I am a pre-pharm applicant and I am interested in getting a master in public health. I am not clear about the difference in MPH ans MSPH though. Can someone explain the difference please? Thank you

I did an MSPH, which was a more science based degree. I specialized in tropical medicine/parasitology and the majority of my classes were based on the science of these diseases and their transmission rather than societal implications. My degree was still offered through a public health school, though.

At the same time, I took a public health core which included a class each in biostatistics, epidemiology, environmental health, and community health.

It is possible to do a Doctor of Science in the same concentration.

My program was pretty unique. I don't think that there are any other schools that focus exclusively on this. It's great if you are interested in doing research on infectious diseases that disproportianately affect developing countries or if you want to go into development work that focuses on these diseases. There really aren't many MPHs trained in dealing with these issues specifically. In Peace Corps, I noticed that my public health trained friends had arguably zero knowledge of malaria, while this remained the number one cause of morbidity and mortality in the country that we worked. As a result of their lack of knowledge, none of my friends even attempted to develop interventions dealing with malaria and I felt that it was a great disservice considering the low-cost for treatment and prevention.

 

[llp]

Oh how wonderful, you won't regret it if you do decide to pursue a graduate degree in public health. In my school, the required units to obtain a MPH are 48 units with a concentration in epidemiology, health promotion, health service administration, environmental health or biometry and the required units to obtain a MSPH are 36 with a concentration in Toxicology, Industrial Hygiene or Global Emergency Preparedness. So it depends on what concentration you decide to pursue. What concentration are you interested in?

Hi guys,

I am a pre-pharm applicant and I am interested in getting a master in public health. I am not clear about the difference in MPH ans MSPH though. Can someone explain the difference please? Thank you

 

[Jolie South]

Oh how wonderful, you won't regret it if you do decide to pursue a graduate degree in public health. In my school, the required units to obtain a MPH are 48 units with a concentration in epidemiology, health promotion, health service administration, environmental health or biometry and the required units to obtain a MSPH are 36 with a concentration in Toxicology, Industrial Hygiene or Global Emergency Preparedness. So it depends on what concentration you decide to pursue. What concentration are you interested in?

So, it seems the MSPH is much more specialized.

 

[Tropicana]

Mostly it's because they won't know what an MPH actually means. I got the sense (and of course, I'm not a doctor yet, so take this with a grain of salt), that doctors feel they know more than anyone else, forgetting that they know more than anyone else only in a particular area!

At the CDC, I worked in environmental health. As an MPH I got stuck entering data from surveys and doing grant administration for health-related grants to universities. The best moment was the month I spent in the Emergency Operations Center. There at least I was in daily contact with the state health authorities, collecting information on an outbreak. On the whole, however, I felt that MDs were just much better respected. The EIS program (Epidemic Intelligence Service) is almost exclusively for MDs with a sprinkling of PhDs and every other year or so an MPH, even though the work they do requires a deep understanding of epidemiology, far more than most MDs have time to cover. Essentially, the MDs were expending a lot of effort learning public health on the fly and the MPHs were stuck in the office doing the paperwork.

The CDC is a great place if you are in the EIS program, or if you have done your adventuresome career work and are ready to sit back and enjoy a desk job. It would be a great place to work in 10 or 15 years, but as for me, I want to get my hands dirty first.

I guess the CDC experience depends where you work. While I understand where you are coming from in terms of EIS/MD/Phd getting more respect, I have been fortunate enough to work in an exciting area at the CDC(infectious disease). I have developed and field tested evaluation tools in developing countries, published, presented at conferences, etc. Opportunties also existed for me to go out on outbreak investigations but I could not participate for one reason or another.

 

[UVABranch]

Hey all,

I obtained my MPH last May and was wondering if there were any other public health people going the MD route? I love what I do working on global reproductive health issues, however it seems like people see our MPH as a "fake" degree. I'm curious how it will be viewed by potential adcoms. I also have a MA in international affairs as the global health program I did was a dual MA/MPH degree.

I am glad I found this forum. I will definitely use it forum. I will definitely take advantage of it come orgo the second time around in Spring.

Here's my stats. I think I stand a chance (Granted I'll need to take the MCATs at some point)

Rice U grad psychology 3.85 GPA
MPH./MA degree 3.8 GPA
Chem I/II A-,A-
Bio I/II A/A
Physics : AP Credit (although I took "engineering physics" different then pre-med and got a C/B)
Orgo: In process.... (reatking orgo I got a B in lab...)

Cheers!

I've had mixed reviews from people in medicine. All the MDs I know think an MPH is a great degree to have because of how closely related to two fields have become. Those in admissions think it's a good degree, but that it should be obtained for one's personal interest not as a means of getting into a school (mainly because there aren't many sience based classes). I was on the executive board of the med shcool while working on my MPH (yeah I kinow ramdom considering I wasn't a med student at the time) but we were trying to improve the relationship between the school of PubH and the med school...all the med students on the board didn't convey any negative feelings about the degree, and there were several MD/MPH students at my school...but evey place is different. And there are those who wouldn't say something like that to my face, you know? Either way I think it's a good degree to have, especially if you're interested in reseach but not necessarily a PhD (knowledge of study design and analysis, etc). Although I never ever ever likes SAS. Every place I did research used SPSS, and that's ok with me!

 

[Kingthom]

Hi guys,

I am a pre-pharm applicant and I am interested in getting a master in public health. I am not clear about the difference in MPH ans MSPH though. Can someone explain the difference please? Thank you

Hi- this is my first post here. I'm a nontrad (40 years old) and I just recently decided to start back down the premed road. I just enrolled in a postbac program in an effort to shore up my somewhat mediocre premed performance.

In between completing my BS in Microbiology, I decided to obtain an MPH. I completed my degree 2 years ago. The program I graduated from was previously an MSPH and converted to an approved MPH. The basic difference in the degree is that the MSPH is more of a research-based credential, whereas the MPH is a more practice-focused degree. The MPH is usually accredited as such. When my program converted to an MPH, it installed a practicum requirement that may or may not be a component of the MSPH program, and some MSPH programs may be thesis based whereas the MPH may not be. In any event, my focus was on Public Health Adminstration but I have an interest in primary care and infectious diseases.

 

[Kingthom]

So, it seems the MSPH is much more specialized.

Not necessarily... the MSPH may prepare you for pursuit of a PhD in Public Health, where the MPH will prepare you for a PhD or DrPH (terminal public health degree). Most practice based public health careers require an MPH, and MSPH holders are usually found in research settings. Most medical dual degree programs are MD/MPH. In the Philadelphia area, Drexel, Jeff, Penn, Temple all have dual programs leading to an MD/MPH, and PCOM has a dual degree program with Temple leading to a DO/MPH. The focus on all of these programs is turning out public health professionals who will hold leadership positions.

In my MPH program, you could specialize in one of several areas- Epi, Public Health Administration, Community Health, Environmental Health- but the focus was always on practice based (as a health educator, or someone working on development of programs) as opposed to research based.

 

[Skymastre]

"Those in admissions think it's a good degree, but that it should be obtained for one's personal interest not as a means of getting into a school (mainly because there aren't many sience based classes). "


I agree entirely with this. I completed my MPH in 06, and have worked at the CDC and Harvard. I am in the process of applying to medical school. Everyone (MDs) I have met with have said my background will be valuable as a practitioner, but won't help much in the admin process.

Fact is, there are concentrations within the MPH degree that are not academically challenging. Many see the degree as one that has become a stepping stone to medicine. Also tarnishing the degree is that Universities are rapidly increasing the number of accepted students each year; the MPH degree is a money maker for major universities!

I love my degree and the framework it provides for thinking about public health. However, if the end goal is strictly admin to medicine a postbac is better serving. If you value public health and want meaningful experiences that will help you be a great doctor, this is a good degree!

Make sure to tie it into your personal statements...!

 

[Jolie South]

Fact is, there are concentrations within the MPH degree that are not academically challenging. Many see the degree as one that has become a stepping stone to medicine. Also tarnishing the degree is that Universities are rapidly increasing the number of accepted students each year; the MPH degree is a money maker for major universities!

This was a major complaint from many of my classmates. Some had great stats and saw the fact that standards were lowered to let many people in as a strike against the prestige of my school.

 

[Skymastre]

This was a major complaint from many of my classmates. Some had great stats and saw the fact that standards were lowered to let many people in as a strike against the prestige of my school.

It really is hurting the credibility of programs. I don't know everything about your experience, but I found going to a good program wasn't enough. To land good jobs, I really had to have good ECs while at the program...trips abroad, work experiences etc..

 

[Luxian]

I agree entirely with this. I completed my MPH in 06, and have worked at the CDC and Harvard.

Hey, I did this too (minus the Harvard part)! Nice to see another MPH/CDCer out there. I too think that this will make us better doctors. On the other hand, I was asked point blank about my academic abilities because they saw my 3.8 Master's GPA as insufficient evidence since an MPH isn't "rigorous". And I have an MSPH (the more sciencey type of MPH with some engineering classes thrown in). Totally not helping me in the admissions process.

 

[Skymastre]

...On the other hand, I was asked point blank about my academic abilities because they saw my 3.8 Master's GPA as insufficient evidence since an MPH isn't "rigorous". And I have an MSPH (the more sciencey type of MPH with some engineering classes thrown in). Totally not helping me in the admissions process.

My experience as well. Any ideas yet for where you'll be next year/what you'll be doing? What are you doing in this gap year; CDC?

 

[Luxian]

My experience as well. Any ideas yet for where you'll be next year/what you'll be doing? What are you doing in this gap year; CDC?

Still crossing my fingers for Case Western. They have the most public-health oriented med curriculum I've ever seen and it's a great school! No word yet, but then again I was told I wouldn't hear till the end of the month.

(Two waitlists in hand and waiting for the response from two more interviews)

EDIT: and as for what I'm doing now, I've been doing public health policy work for a government contractor for five years.