Any regrets???

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DanManuel

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I actually was in Pharmacy school and am contemplating if I should continue the program. I always had an eye on Podiatry, due to more direct patient contact and being your own boss. Never applied because of the MCAT. I shadowed a Podiatrist for a week, enjoyed it better than my time in a retail Pharmacy. I just wanted to know if anyone else had a similar experience, not necessarily Pharmacy, in leaving another program for Podiatry or if anyone currently in Podiatry school having doubts in continuing Podiatry?
Any input would be greatly appreciated.
 
In lengthy grad programs, I think almost everyone probably quesitons their career decision at some point. IMO, the best way to be sure you made the right choice is to do plenty of shadowing beforehand and are dedicated to work hard in your studies.

We had a couple people from my school who left and went into various other allied health programs (dent, Carib med, PT, etc). While some may have been by choice, it was usually for academic reasons (failed course, dismissed etc).
 
I got my PharmD the 6 years post-high school, then worked retail pharmacy for 1 year, then did pod school for 4 years and now I'm half way done with my 1st (of 4) years of residency at UPenn. It's not that I planned or didn't like pharmacy (cuz I love knowing about drugs/rxn's), but I thought that I was more capable as a health care professional to be a surgeon/physician. I like being in control of my patients. So, 10 yrs of college (PharmD, BS in Biology, and DPM) cost me 230K, but those 10 yrs were the best times of my life getting to know myself and others. At least I could use my PharmD degree in medicine, thank god! Anyway, choose a pod if you don't care about being on-call or having pt's lives in your hands. Choose pharmacy if drugs and rxn's is all you care to deal with.
 
PharmD/DPM said:
I got my PharmD the 6 years post-high school, then worked retail pharmacy for 1 year, then did pod school for 4 years and now I'm half way done with my 1st (of 4) years of residency at UPenn. .
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4 yrs? whats that residency format? i thought we just had 2yrs and 3yrs program. is that a residency + fellowship program?
 
PharmD/DPM said:
I got my PharmD the 6 years post-high school, then worked retail pharmacy for 1 year, then did pod school for 4 years and now I'm half way done with my 1st (of 4) years of residency at UPenn. It's not that I planned or didn't like pharmacy (cuz I love knowing about drugs/rxn's), but I thought that I was more capable as a health care professional to be a surgeon/physician. I like being in control of my patients. So, 10 yrs of college (PharmD, BS in Biology, and DPM) cost me 230K, but those 10 yrs were the best times of my life getting to know myself and others. At least I could use my PharmD degree in medicine, thank god! Anyway, choose a pod if you don't care about being on-call or having pt's lives in your hands. Choose pharmacy if drugs and rxn's is all you care to deal with.
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Wow, its crazy how similar your situation is with mine. I know I will be doing lots of shadowing before I make my final decision. How were the schools compared to one another as far as difficulty. I hate working retail and will be shadowing clinical Pharmacists as well as Podiatrist. The funny thing is the Podiatrist I shadow insist I continue Pharmacy, saying people knock on your door trying to hire you coming out of school as opposed to you trying to knock on other's door to find patients. Is there anything you would have done differently? and being where you are right now POD graduate, something you wish someone in Podiatry could have told/warned you about in Pharmacy school.
 
DanManuel said:
Wow, its crazy how similar your situation is with mine. I know I will be doing lots of shadowing before I make my final decision. How were the schools compared to one another as far as difficulty. I hate working retail and will be shadowing clinical Pharmacists as well as Podiatrist. The funny thing is the Podiatrist I shadow insist I continue Pharmacy, saying people knock on your door trying to hire you coming out of school as opposed to you trying to knock on other's door to find patients. Is there anything you would have done differently? and being where you are right now POD graduate, something you wish someone in Podiatry could have told/warned you about in Pharmacy school.
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I am just going to throw this out there as a practicing pharmacist. If you want patient contact etc. why not just go for the MD. If not you will probably always want something else.
 
I spent yesterday watching the Superbowl with a group of Pharmacists (along with an Optometrist and a Banker, but we can leave them out of this discussion). Of course work always finds its way into the conversation sooner or later.

Two of the Pharmacists work in the hospital and as far as I can tell they're both pretty happy with their careers and job situations, although the hospital has cut hours for ALL non-contract employees due to ailing finances. One of those two is a close friend and he tells me straight how things are at work. He's not too worried about getting laid off, but then again he has decent seniority. He enjoys rounding in the ICU and on other inpatients, but hates having to endure the occasional tantrum from prima donna physicians.

The third Pharmacist works in retail at a major supermarket chain and he said they're always busting butt. They're the second busiest retail pharmacy in the area after Costco, and I got the impression that he wouldn't mind a job change (job situation change, not career change). The way he put it was that Pharmacists come out of Residency making six figures per year but they're close to maxed out immediately. He said that after the starting salary it's pretty much just small cost of living increases unless one finds some great niche. He also said that his pharmacy school gave him the belief that doctors would be diagnosing the conditions and he, as the Pharmacist, would be the one selecting the meds. He quickly discovered that it wasn't to be like that. In his retail situation it's rare he does anything other than filling orders. Interestingly, this fellow also considered Pod school and interviewed at Des Moines. He was scared away by online messageboards that kept repeating that old mantra that "podiatry eats its young."

All-in-all I think we are mostly happy with our professions despite having some complaints here-and-there. But who doesn't? I wouldn't change my career choice (unless I could be a B-list movie star -- that's my pipe dream) and I don't think any of those Pharmacists would either.
 
UPenn Podiatric Surgical Residency is a 4-year surgical residency that compromises of trauma and reconstruction of the foot, ankle and lower leg. There's 2 pod residency programs in the nation that are 4 yrs, UPenn and Temple. Both are PM&S-36. Penn's program is 4 yrs because it's based closest to an allopathic (MD) surgical residency. Here's our homepage, check it out for yourself: http://www.med.upenn.edu/podiatricresidency/ Plus we're Penn (Ivy League), so the bar for knowledge and respect is raised in the medical community. Which why I went for a 4 yr pod residency instead of a 2 or 3 yr one.
 
PharmD/DPM said:
UPenn Podiatric Surgical Residency is a 4-year surgical residency that compromises of trauma and reconstruction of the foot, ankle and lower leg. There's 2 pod residency programs in the nation that are 4 yrs, UPenn and Temple. Both are PM&S-36. Penn's program is 4 yrs because it's based closest to an allopathic (MD) surgical residency. Here's our homepage, check it out for yourself: http://www.med.upenn.edu/podiatricresidency/ Plus we're Penn (Ivy League), so the bar for knowledge and respect is raised in the medical community. Which why I went for a 4 yr pod residency instead of a 2 or 3 yr one.
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I heard of a few other 4 year programs, such as St. Barnabas in the Bronx. I think Wycoff Heights has a 4 year track too.
 
True but there in NY. Pods aren't allowed to do sx on rearfoot to proximally up the body. Unless you work with orthopods. The laws in NY suck for pods, so residents must learn a lot from ortho, which personally, is like a slap in the face. They (ortho) will then develop superior-minded ego's over pods. And this is very unfortunate. This does not happen at Penn or Temple. Later.

Mike
 
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Can any of you pharm boys (and girls) give any insight or comparison as to earnings between:

DPM, pharm in hospital, pharm in big chain pharmacy, pharm in private sole proprietorship.

Thanks
 
histreetken said:
Can any of you pharm boys (and girls) give any insight or comparison as to earnings between:

DPM, pharm in hospital, pharm in big chain pharmacy, pharm in private sole proprietorship.

Thanks
Click to expand...


I have no clue what a DPM makes but know they do fine and are not hurting for the most part. If you work in chain as a pharmd most starting salaries are greating than 110,000, regular staff hospital job 100,000, if you have a specialty and go to work for big pharma and you have some experience 140,000+. As someone said above a chain pharmacist really has no room to move up except district manager, or upper chain management. Hospital pharmacists are now becomeing CEO level of hospitals and hospital systems. Many PharmDs would change jobs just as many DPMs would. I actually read about a dpm yesterday who did a surgery residency and worked for 2 years and quit. She now is the health person for a TV channel. Who woulda thought...
 
PharmD/DPM said:
True but there in NY. Pods aren't allowed to do sx on rearfoot to proximally up the body. Unless you work with orthopods. The laws in NY suck for pods, so residents must learn a lot from ortho, which personally, is like a slap in the face. They (ortho) will then develop superior-minded ego's over pods. And this is very unfortunate. This does not happen at Penn or Temple. Later.

Mike
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I understand the situation but I know that pods do rearfoot cases in NY (triples, achilles tendon lengthening, etc). The guy I shadow is a recent residency graduate and has been doing these procedures. They just cannot touch the ankle - maleoli surgically.
 
PharmD/DPM said:
True but there in NY. Pods aren't allowed to do sx on rearfoot to proximally up the body. Unless you work with orthopods. The laws in NY suck for pods, so residents must learn a lot from ortho, which personally, is like a slap in the face. They (ortho) will then develop superior-minded ego's over pods. And this is very unfortunate. This does not happen at Penn or Temple. Later.

Mike
Click to expand...

Scope sucks in NY but it's nothing personal. Medicine is highly regulated in the state of NY. It is pretty much insanely difficult for anyone to do anything there on the account that it is an extremely popular place to live and everyone is trying to keep everyone else down or out. I have met multiple specialists who have told horror stories about trying to get privileges at hospitals there.
 
Feli said:
In lengthy grad programs, I think almost everyone probably quesitons their career decision at some point. IMO, the best way to be sure you made the right choice is to do plenty of shadowing beforehand and are dedicated to work hard in your studies.

We had a couple people from my school who left and went into various other allied health programs (dent, Carib med, PT, etc). While some may have been by choice, it was usually for academic reasons (failed course, dismissed etc).
Click to expand...

Yes, I totally agree that almost everyone starts questioning their career decisions at some point (especially when stressing out during exam time :laugh:). But make sure you think things through carefully, and do tons of research and shadowing before you make your choice to change.

I know people who change professions and withdrew from their schools with very good reasons, and find themselves more capable working as a surgeon/physician in podiatry than their previous profession (ie. pharmacy, dental) and I know some going into dental after being in optometry school. While it is true to some extent that the admissions requirements for podiatry schools are considered low, it is still a long program and you have to stay committed to it, or else you're just going in circles and constantly changing careers and wasting money.

If you're changing careers based on academic failures, and what not (not sure how this works with admissions), but I know admissions committees do check, request for your transcripts, and a letter of intent or something from your school's dean proving that you weren't dismissed from the school. Something to keep in mind. It's more important that you find the right fit for you and commit to the program and get through it. 👍 ...Because you can't escape the hard work, studying and exams. 😛

Everyone's going to regret or have doubts at some point in their lives, but make sure it's a profession you are capable in and can see yourself in. I know it took me firsthand experience to realize something wasn't for me anymore. Like everyone's saying, shadow, shadow, shadow.

I do not believe I have made a wrong switch in professions for myself, but I could always have doubts later on in the podiatry program when I am upset or stressed out. This will happen regardless of profession, job, education, etc. but podiatry is a good profession and growing, and it's what we make of it in the future. Good luck! 😎
 
jonwill said:
Scope sucks in NY but it's nothing personal. Medicine is highly regulated in the state of NY. It is pretty much insanely difficult for anyone to do anything there on the account that it is an extremely popular place to live and everyone is trying to keep everyone else down or out. I have met multiple specialists who have told horror stories about trying to get privileges at hospitals there.
Click to expand...


Hmmm...so, can I do residency out of NY state, come back to NY after the program and perform surgeries on certain parts of the ankle/feet without an ortho dude?
 
StaphRx said:
Hmmm...so, can I do residency out of NY state, come back to NY after the program and perform surgeries on certain parts of the ankle/feet without an ortho dude?
Click to expand...

You cannot perform any ankle surgery (cannot cut the maleoli) even if you did a PM/S-36 in NY or elsewhere. A 4 year residency or fellowship doesn't change anything either. In New York state, the scope does not include soft tissue of the leg so you cannot treat lower leg ulcers above the ankle. You CAN do rearfoot cases (ie involving the calcaneus) though.

The scope sucks, and legislators have been trying for years to change it. The most recent bill is to include ankle surgery and soft tissue of the leg (also to change the name of podiatrists to podiatric physicians). This is the first time in many years the NYS senate is controlled by democrats so maybe things will change for the better. We shall see.
 
Bahaa said:
DPM, RPh, (soon to be) JD. This guy loves the alphabet. How can someone enjoy spending that much time in school? :laugh:
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yeah whats next PA, NP, DVM

Every prof. school should ban this guy
 
hey dan manuel... if your willing to explain i would love to hear why you are not satisfied with pharm.
i was working out a couple of nights ago and came across two guys who were about to graduate pharm. When i started to congratulate them for almost being done, i was met with alot of negativity.
both students seemed very unhappy with what they had in store for them in pharm, and both seemed very interested in pod school as well. This seems odd to me.
whats going on with pharm?
just curious
 
kelus said:
hey dan manuel... if your willing to explain i would love to hear why you are not satisfied with pharm.
i was working out a couple of nights ago and came across two guys who were about to graduate pharm. When i started to congratulate them for almost being done, i was met with alot of negativity.
both students seemed very unhappy with what they had in store for them in pharm, and both seemed very interested in pod school as well. This seems odd to me.
whats going on with pharm?
just curious
Click to expand...

A friend of mine, a P3, warned me about jumping into Pharmacy because I did not really have much experience in the field, and did not know what to expect. I think I got caught up with all the news I heard with Pharmacist being in such high demand, which is true; the family life, not bringing work home or being on call; and a solid salary, 120,000 coming out of school. Unfortunately, I dreaded going to my rotations in the retail setting, which is where you can make the most money coming out, and could not imagine going through the rigors of school to do something I hate. On top of that you must find 900 hours as an intern Pharmacist to take boards.
Many of my classmates and some upperclassmen have the same frustrations, I know of 2 who are going to tough it out, but plan on applying to MED School, and another who will be taking LAW Classes. Pharmacy does offer so many other options, but none of the other options (outside of teaching) interest me. I can only speak for a retail setting, but it left me wanting more, and does not justify the amount of school we must take to work in a retail setting. My classmate says its a scam "they make school so hard for such an easy job, but they pay you so much so you wont complain" Thats just how we see it.
 
DanManuel said:
A friend of mine, a P3, warned me about jumping into Pharmacy because I did not really have much experience in the field, and did not know what to expect. I think I got caught up with all the news I heard with Pharmacist being in such high demand, which is true; the family life, not bringing work home or being on call; and a solid salary, 120,000 coming out of school. Unfortunately, I dreaded going to my rotations in the retail setting, which is where you can make the most money coming out, and could not imagine going through the rigors of school to do something I hate. On top of that you must find 900 hours as an intern Pharmacist to take boards.
Many of my classmates and some upperclassmen have the same frustrations, I know of 2 who are going to tough it out, but plan on applying to MED School, and another who will be taking LAW Classes. Pharmacy does offer so many other options, but none of the other options (outside of teaching) interest me. I can only speak for a retail setting, but it left me wanting more, and does not justify the amount of school we must take to work in a retail setting. My classmate says its a scam "they make school so hard for such an easy job, but they pay you so much so you wont complain" Thats just how we see it.
Click to expand...

well said at the end.
thanks for the info. i understand your position
if theres any way i can help, just pm me
 
DanManuel said:
A friend of mine, a P3, warned me about jumping into Pharmacy because I did not really have much experience in the field, and did not know what to expect. I think I got caught up with all the news I heard with Pharmacist being in such high demand, which is true; the family life, not bringing work home or being on call; and a solid salary, 120,000 coming out of school. Unfortunately, I dreaded going to my rotations in the retail setting, which is where you can make the most money coming out, and could not imagine going through the rigors of school to do something I hate. On top of that you must find 900 hours as an intern Pharmacist to take boards.
Many of my classmates and some upperclassmen have the same frustrations, I know of 2 who are going to tough it out, but plan on applying to MED School, and another who will be taking LAW Classes. Pharmacy does offer so many other options, but none of the other options (outside of teaching) interest me. I can only speak for a retail setting, but it left me wanting more, and does not justify the amount of school we must take to work in a retail setting. My classmate says its a scam "they make school so hard for such an easy job, but they pay you so much so you wont complain" Thats just how we see it.
Click to expand...

Yeah I am sure these guys cant justify the amount of school and are a part of the scam right. What makes you think being some Joe Shmo DPM is gonna be any better. I guess if you wanna be hands on then yeah. But dont give me the excuse that there are no other options with a pharmd degree that you like. I would make the argument that all professional schools are a scam. They overcharge, give out loans, and promise you the world. You have to be willing to work and make yourself marketable. I think you need to find some mentors.


http://www.stjude.org/stjude/v/inde...nnel=7cc71436e3218010VgnVCM1000000e2015acRCRD

http://www.csmc.edu/12194.html

http://www.mdanderson.org/departmen...ayfull&pn=afadfc5a-36b0-48ea-b11b71824784d641

http://www.healthgrades.com/hospita...-medical-center-hgst34618d46050506/leadership
 
pharmd-Those are some great examples of Pharmacists who have tremendous success. When I was referring to the other options for Pharmacy, I should have clarified the ones which were exposed to me. I am pretty sure the majority of Pharmacy students do not enroll planing on becoming CEO's or directors. Also, these Pharmacists probably LOVE pharmacy, anything is possible, but the motivation has to be there...I'm not sure its there for me.
 
DanManuel said:
pharmd-Those are some great examples of Pharmacists who have tremendous success. When I was referring to the other options for Pharmacy, I should have clarified the ones which were exposed to me. I am pretty sure the majority of Pharmacy students do not enroll planing on becoming CEO's or directors. Also, these Pharmacists probably LOVE pharmacy, anything is possible, but the motivation has to be there...I'm not sure its there for me.
Click to expand...


that is a great clarification....to the dpms out there what are other options for you....besides residency
 
bigpharmD said:
that is a great clarification....to the dpms out there what are other options for you....besides residency
Click to expand...

now i feel responsible for the backlash that dan is receiving for being honest in his view points.

besides, i think the real issue here is not "oppertunites" , but not enjoying the work.
 
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