Anybody not hate medical school?

[mongoose]

Originally posted by KyGrlDr2B
That doesn't surprise me. You can easily go ask what your class rank is, but I was told by several people to not go do it WHATSOEVER. They were apparently pretty surprised by how low they were.

seriously? 3.4 overall in the bottom quartile? from the test scores that get posted, i just don't see how this is possible. there just ain't that many A's being handed out on our tests. anyway, like i said in my previous post i don't really care enough to confirm this through the proper channels but i just can't see how this is so. that means that 3/4 of our class would be getting an A for every B. and you know as well as i do from the scores that get posted that no where near that many A's are scored on our tests. i smell something fishy here, i am afraid.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[KyGrlDr2B]

Well, I would go check, but I'm too scared. I doubt that there are that many people in the class with that many A's, but you never know. I know that after 1st yr there were supposed to be about 6 people with 4.0 and a several with only one B. Damn study butts.

 

[Auricae]

Originally posted by DW
After initially stressing about it for the first two months, I've settled in and towards the end started to love med school:

my view on med school, some points have been said already but whatever.....

-I try to be judicious with my lecture attendance, as at least I have never been much for learning in lecture. If i can learn the material at home with the notes, why waste me time? I'll either study or get chores done during the day.

-the material first year has been suprisingly uninteresting, downright boring, but none of it is complex or more intellectually challenging than my hardest chemistry courses in college. Just lots of material. I budget a few hours of my day towards school right after class to keep it fresh in my mind, and the rest of my day is free to do whatever.

-going to a P/F or H/P/F school rocks. basically, when the grades are posted, i'm looking to see if my grade has two digits and the first digit is greater than or equal to 7.

-while some of my classmates are fun people, I make sure to have friends and interests outside of med school. Seeing the same ~100 people everyday can get a tad repetitive at times. I run in central park, do volunteer woirk, take in the arts, see the sights, as much as I can handle on a med student budget.

-Making a location where I would be happy with the non med school outlets available to me a priority in picking a school was a great decision in hindsight. Med school has been relatively unexciting insofar, but NYC has been a blast! Of course, where one will be "happy" is completely in the eye of the beholder, but I'm glad I didn't let location play a small part in my decision....had I gone to school in the midwest, I'm sure I would be hating life now (not trying to cut on the midwest, its just not my thing personally).

basically, med school would rock if it weren't for those pesky tests

I feel like you are me a couple years from now. If I could predict how I will handle med school, it is exactly what you say above, minus the part about eventually loving it?

 

[WatchingWaiting]

I'm all of one quarter through med school, but I find it pretty enjoyable and interesting so far. I studied engineering and a humanities field undergrad though, so maybe I'm more energized by the relative freshness of the material, especially relative to someone who followed the standard biology pre-med route.

 

[Street Philosopher]

Originally posted by Buck Strong
Seriously though, you guys are talented if you can pinpoint exactly how much you need to study and how much to slack to get that passing score by 1-2 points. I know there have been a couple of exams that i was prepared for and expecting to honor, and ended up passing by a slim margin, and few exams i felt decently prepared for and ended up aceing. Plus, here, you fail an exam, you fail the block, so I definitely don't want to risk failing by a point.

i'm laughing because i failed by a point.

 

[sunflower79]

My 2 cents:

I am learning to accept how much I don't know, even after I (thought I) learn it at one point in time. On the other hand, the weirdest facts stay with you. Med school is just learning and relearning, and by the 7th time I've learned something then I will probably know it.

I have lots of free time in my 1st year! I make it a point never to study on Friday nights, and do something fun at least a couple times a week. More than I did in college, where my time was sucked up in extracurriculars. The pressure's off--at least for now.

I love the school, the people in it. That helps a lot.

Most importantly, it seems the longer you've been out of school, the more you enjoy med school and don't mind the studying. Except for the MCAT, I've never studied more in my life. But after a while it just becomes a way of life, and you learn to get more efficient at it.

"Med school: We put the FUN in infundibulum!"

peace.

 

[mongoose]

Originally posted by KyGrlDr2B
Well, I would go check, but I'm too scared. I doubt that there are that many people in the class with that many A's, but you never know. I know that after 1st yr there were supposed to be about 6 people with 4.0 and a several with only one B. Damn study butts.

damn, that's incredible. more power to 'em, i guess. i know studying that much wouldn't work for me. i'd go insane in a relatively short time if i tried it.

 

[Mr.Tweed]

I think that working after college gives you added motivation and a useful perspective on med school. I've been out of college for almost four years. Work can be a real challenge no matter what field you're in, and I honestly believe that waiters, writers, fast food clerks, contruction workers etc. can work just as hard as doctors. If you're going to work hard and be stressed no matter what you do, then you might as well do something that is rewarding and stable as well as challenging (medicine). Having worked in the real world makes me appreciate the luxury of being a med student. I will remember this as often as possible when I'm an M-1 next year.

 

[Auricae]

Originally posted by Mr.Tweed
I think that working after college gives you added motivation and a useful perspective on med school. I've been out of college for almost four years. Work can be a real challenge no matter what field you're in, and I honestly believe that waiters, writers, fast food clerks, contruction workers etc. can work just as hard as doctors. If you're going to work hard and be stressed no matter what you do, then you might as well do something that is rewarding and stable as well as challenging (medicine). Having worked in the real world makes me appreciate the luxury of being a med student. I will remember this as often as possible when I'm an M-1 next year.

So as a student who is worried about how interested/motivated he will be by the medical curriculum, would you recommend that I defer a year for sure? I am hoping that by deferring a year, I will get tired of regular work/life and actually want to study.

 

[::Seabass::]

Originally posted by Mr.Tweed
Having worked in the real world makes me appreciate the luxury of being a med student. I will remember this as often as possible when I'm an M-1 next year.

This is how I thought I would be, but you'll probably be surprised just like I was, somedays you'll miss your old job and being a normal adult.

Originally posted by Auricae
So as a student who is worried about how interested/motivated he will be by the medical curriculum, would you recommend that I defer a year for sure? I am hoping that by deferring a year, I will get tired of regular work/life and actually want to study.

this is your chance to be a 'real' adult, I highly recommend taking a break

 

[8744]

Originally posted by Buck Strong
Seriously though, you guys are talented if you can pinpoint exactly how much you need to study and how much to slack to get that passing score by 1-2 points. I know there have been a couple of exams that i was prepared for and expecting to honor, and ended up passing by a slim margin, and few exams i felt decently prepared for and ended up aceing. Plus, here, you fail an exam, you fail the block, so I definitely don't want to risk failing by a point.

No talent involved. You just have to realize where you stand in the order of things and "feel the curve." The tests, including the MCAT, Step 1, and most shelf exams have evolved to only weed out those who fall below two standard deviations from the mean. This is usually only a couple-or-three people in a class of, say, 100.

As long as you're not "that guy" you will pass everything. Now I'm not saying that I don't study, because I do. But there is a huge difference in the amount of studying required for an "A" compared to the studying required for a "C." The law of decreasing marginal returns kicks in with a vengeance. If it takes 15 hours of studying per week for a "C," a "B" will require 30 hours and an "A" will require 60 hours. I firmly believe that after learning general concepts the rest of your time is spent meomorizing interesting trivia which you will never remember after the test anyways.

And I adjust my studying in relation to the importance of the test. If a course has three tests I might go pretty hard for the first one, see what happens, and slack off for the next two if applicable. I am having a much harder time with my third year shelf exams because we only have one test which is a "must-pass" and I really have almost no time to study. I've passed everything so far but, in all candor, I am not feeling good about the Medicine shelf exam I took at the end of the last block. (of course, I never "feel good" about any NBME test.)

I don't want to come across as a slacker because I'm not. I just have a lot of things competing for my time (wife, young children, dogs, church) that most medical students don't have to contend with. I am also not complaining. If I don't get into my first choice residency then I have no one to blame but myself.

Another thing: Can somebody explain how, except for the names, Honors, High Pass, and Pass is different from the traditional "A," "B," and "C." Seems to me that they are identical in concept and weight towards class standing.

 

[buglady]

Originally posted by Joe Joe on da Radio
med school is not about learning...it's about enduring. =)

Enduring your classmates, eh, Joe Joe? Gold stars for you for "enduring" some of the members of your anatomy group...

 

[mongoose]

Originally posted by buglady
Enduring your classmates, eh, Joe Joe? Gold stars for you for "enduring" some of the members of your anatomy group...

OMFG, let me tell you about my anatomy group. talk about "enduring" an anatomy lab partner. this one guy was so out there that about halfway through the class i started to make fun of him within the group. he seemed to not notice so i started to make fun of him to others, and eventually to the professors all while he was standing right there. the funny thing was that a couple of the professors joined in with my ripping on him. it was too funny considering the person. he must have been a bit annoying even to the professors.

 

[::Seabass::]

Originally posted by Panda Bear
No talent involved. You just have to realize where you stand in the order of things and "feel the curve."

Another thing: Can somebody explain how, except for the names, Honors, High Pass, and Pass is different from the traditional "A," "B," and "C." Seems to me that they are identical in concept and weight towards class standing.

none of our tests are curved in the first 2 years. I usually try to make it through the material twice and then one more time the night before the test and that gets me right underneath high passing. I think if I studied less I'd be really sweating it out on the border of passing.

P, HP, and H mean different things at different schools. I have a friend at JHU and he said for one class HP=99 and H=100 At my school HP is about 85-90 and honor 90 and up during our first year. The numbers go up to 90-93 is HP and 94 up as H during second year. Since I seem to be golden at getting 83ish with 'minimal' med school work, I would probably prefer the A, B, C system. Not quite exactly the same as A, B, and C.

 

[8744]

They may not be formally curved but there is a "natural" curve which has evolved over the years as the faculty adjust their tests to ensure that most people pass.

If, for example, a professor consitently gives a test which fails three-quarters of his class, his test is too hard and he will be pressured to make the test easier.

As to pass/fail grading systems, I still don't understand how the three levels are different then A, B, or C when it comes to figuring class rank. Do some medical schools not have class rank for the first two years? If that's the case, why not just have either "pass" or "fail?" What's the point of "High Pass" or "Honors" unless it is strictly for personal gratification?

 

[uclacrewdude]

i love medical school. how often do people really get to live out their dream?

 

[Neuronix]

Originally posted by uclacrewdude
i love medical school. how often do people really get to live out their dream?

I dunno man, med school ain't my dream. My dream is to cut people, legally. I seem to be a long way from that goal...

 

[Buck Strong]

I'm only sticking it out because i need to hook my friends up with the viagra, vicodin, valium, assorted painkillers, morphine, marijuana if it ever becomes legalized...etc, that i promised them when i forst got into med school, it's either that or they break my kneecaps

 

[Jalby]

Originally posted by Panda Bear

As to pass/fail grading systems, I still don't understand how the three levels are different then A, B, or C when it comes to figuring class rank. Do some medical schools not have class rank for the first two years? If that's the case, why not just have either "pass" or "fail?" What's the point of "High Pass" or "Honors" unless it is strictly for personal gratification?

It always oisses me off when other people say" We are a pass/fail school, it's just we also have honors" This is not a pass/fail school. This is called GRADES.

As for your question, there are three different answers that I know of. You have UCSF, which to date is the only school I know of that doesn't really count the grades your first two years, but say their third year grades are used as a basis and everything else is taken into account for making class rankings.

You have schools like UCLA, who say they are pass fail but still use the grades to rank the students (Majority of pass/fail schools) Most students don't find out until they are at the school.

You have schools like mine, which use the grades for 0 to 10% of you first two year grade rankings, and 2 year end tests for the other 90% of your class rankings.

 

[Carbon]

I love medical school. I love what I do. There are days that suck, and individual exams and classes that suck, but in general I would not want to be anywhere else, doing anything else. This is what I love.

 

[Street Philosopher]

Originally posted by Carbon
I love medical school. I love what I do. There are days that suck, and individual exams and classes that suck, but in general I would not want to be anywhere else, doing anything else. This is what I love.

you are clearly insane!

 

[thewebthsp]

I'm unhappy since January.

It might be because I'm in a weird mood, or whatever, antisocial, etc.

I like the stuff we're doing. It's a little time consuming.

I really like some of my classmates.

Others have really disappointed me. I feel awful at times when I'm around some of them -- maybe unreasonably so, but I never say how I feel. I don't know why I feel so awfully.

I want to do to more than med school. I'm not succeeding.

Well that's happiness in a nutshell.

I think things will get better. Maybe through outside avenues like philosophy.

you are clearly insane!

 

[Jeff05]

might be cause i'm 4th year finishing in a couple of months, but this year has been one of the happiest in my life.

1st year is challenging cause you have to get your bearings. second year you just have to crank out the grades and the boards. third year is fine, no big deal, and 4th year is like any senior year - frontloaded.

i don't know any well-adjusted people that have not been ok in medical school, or hated it.

overall, i've met great people, some of which i hope to be friends with for a long time to come, learned a lot about myself, and did something productive/stimulating.

 

[AnnaLee]

To chime in my humble opinion-
I love it. As long as you do your own thing and don't let other people freak you out, it really isn't that bad. I am just over the hump of my third year and have been shocked at how the hype just hasn't come true. Sure, the hours are longer than second year, but you only have to study one subject at a time and PhD's aren't writing your tests anymore (this means no more pharm graphs on your tests woo hoo!). If you are a nice person and interested in learning, third year is not as bad as people make it seem. This is all coming from a very lazy person, and I am very very happy in medical school. You will enjoy yourself if you either 1. love pathophysiology and think disease is really cool, 2. love talking to people and having deep conversations, or 3. love fixing things and can't wait to yank out a bloody spleen. I'm sure there are more than that...The point is, if you truly did have a heartfelt reason for going into medicine, you will enjoy the ride.

Good luck!

 

[AnnaLee]

It always oisses me off when other people say" We are a pass/fail school, it's just we also have honors" This is not a pass/fail school. This is called GRADES.

As for your question, there are three different answers that I know of. You have UCSF, which to date is the only school I know of that doesn't really count the grades your first two years, but say their third year grades are used as a basis and everything else is taken into account for making class rankings.

You have schools like UCLA, who say they are pass fail but still use the grades to rank the students (Majority of pass/fail schools) Most students don't find out until they are at the school.

You have schools like mine, which use the grades for 0 to 10% of you first two year grade rankings, and 2 year end tests for the other 90% of your class rankings.

UC Davis also uses straight-up pass/fail. We are not ranked and as far as I know the only people who can see your number grades are the AOA committee who confirms if we are top 25%. It really takes the pressure off the first two years and reduces the gunner mentality. The only problem I have heard of is when people try to match in really competitive specialies on the other side of the country. Having said this, I know a few of our fourth-years matched in ophtho and ENT at top New England schools (i.e. Boston and Harvard, etc.).

 

[Furrball]

Med school rocks! Just remember That Gomers don't die, Gomers go to ground, and most importantly... the patient has the disease! My favorite rule is that no body cavity can not be reached with a 14 gage needle and a strong arm.

BTW Neuronix I like the avatar, very Stand Alone Complex.

 

[Man In The Box]

Personally I hate it with a passion but it does beat some of the other jobs I've had. Med. school sucks, construction work in the summer sucks worse! If I could over again I'd probably go into pharmacy. Medicine is great, doctors are lousy. I've never met such a group of arrogant, immature, back-stabbing children in my life.

 

[Neuronix]

BTW Neuronix I like the avatar, very Stand Alone Complex.

Thanks Jpaikman's is better tho!

 

[Furrball]

Thanks Jpaikman's is better tho!

I want a tachikoma for an avatar, I haven't figured out how to do this yet.

 

[skypilot]

UC Davis also uses straight-up pass/fail. We are not ranked and as far as I know the only people who can see your number grades are the AOA committee who confirms if we are top 25%. It really takes the pressure off the first two years and reduces the gunner mentality. The only problem I have heard of is when people try to match in really competitive specialies on the other side of the country. Having said this, I know a few of our fourth-years matched in ophtho and ENT at top New England schools (i.e. Boston and Harvard, etc.).

This is funny because all the Boston students are trying to match into California residencies.

 

[dan0909]

I like med school, though I slack like hell and barely pass everything. My roommate is like "wait a second, you NEVER study, how do you pass?!?" Well, I do study some, but never at home Still, this is how I keep my sanity.

I was over the mean once. I studied for the class (Epidemiology) a total of one hour the entire semester. From this I conclude that the more I study the less I know. Oh, and I finished anatomy before break! WHOOP!

PhD part is 180 degree turn-around from the rote memorization of medschool

 

[dan0909]

wow, this thread is old

 

[Neuronix]

Hey, Neuronix...it's nice to hear that there are other MD/PhD slackers out there... PhD part is heaven, 180 degree turn-around from the rote memorization of medschool

I hope so I've decided I can't compete with all the gunners around here, so I don't even bother trying. Hopefully that PhD will be as worth it as they say it is come match time! Still, I'm in clinics now and it's alot better than basic science. At least, if you actually like talking to patients and learning real medicine. It's not for everyone!