Anyone ever went to a uni or college and felt like you did not learn much?

[bottlecap1990]

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but you were able to do well in PCAT? What was your strategy? Do you just study hard from the practice books and tests?

 

[phathead]

I felt a learned a TON from my 4 years of classes and hardly studied at all for the PCAT.

If you're not learning anything, you're doin' something wrong.

 

[bottlecap1990]

I feel like I learned how to solve the problems but I did not FULLY understand the material (especially chemistry, I feel like this subject is hard to visualize). I was able to pass with an A for every class though. Biology was a different story, I definitely learned tons of things because everything was so easy to understand.

 

[UNMorBUST]

I feel that way in my psych classes. I feel like we get of topic and head into completely different and interesting avenues. Some how when exam time comes i fare very well.

 

[phathead]

I feel like I learned how to solve the problems but I did not FULLY understand the material (especially chemistry, I feel like this subject is hard to visualize). I was able to pass with an A for every class though. Biology was a different story, I definitely learned tons of things because everything was so easy to understand.

Then you're really gonna need to study for the PCAT.

Learning in college is not about regurgitating topics for tests. Sure you can do that and pass the class, but generally you have to be able to retain some things. One of the things I learned early on is not to solve for the answer to a problem, but learn how to derive the solution to a problem.

That proved pivotal in O Chem and Biochem.

If you have a hard time visualizing chemistry, you're gonna have a hard time in pharmacy school unless you nail down the concepts. I'm not saying you have to know exactly how a Diels-Alder reaction works, but you should be able to understand WHY it works.

 

[diastole]

I think you can do just fine in pharmacy school without knowing the whys behind Diels-Alder reactions. I'm sure there are some schools that put heavy emphasis on the chemistry but apparently not all do. There is not nearly as much chemistry in pharmacy school as I imagined but again but my school uses the body system approach and not individual courses. You have to understand the basics of how a drug works but that isn't terribly complex. Drug X blocks this and in turn causes this and it may cause these adverse effects. Not hard. Or Drug X is metabolized in the liver by this enzyme. Drug Y is also metabolized in the liver by the same enzyme, therefore you get an interaction. Easy peasy. The concepts aren't hard but there is just a lot of material.

That said, you are going to need to know the material for the PCAT. I'd take a Pearson practice test, figure out your weaknesses and then get out your textbook and practice the problems. It may turn out that you know more than you think you do.

 

[MiataMike]

Learning involves self motivation. If you're not interested in what you're learning, you ain't gonna learn it. That said, I took a lot of forgettable classes during undergrad.

The PCAT was pretty doable. I just hated the rushed nature of it.

 

[bottlecap1990]

I think you can do just fine in pharmacy school without knowing the whys behind Diels-Alder reactions. I'm sure there are some schools that put heavy emphasis on the chemistry but apparently not all do. There is not nearly as much chemistry in pharmacy school as I imagined but again but my school uses the body system approach and not individual courses. You have to understand the basics of how a drug works but that isn't terribly complex. Drug X blocks this and in turn causes this and it may cause these adverse effects. Not hard. Or Drug X is metabolized in the liver by this enzyme. Drug Y is also metabolized in the liver by the same enzyme, therefore you get an interaction. Easy peasy. The concepts aren't hard but there is just a lot of material.

That said, you are going to need to know the material for the PCAT. I'd take a Pearson practice test, figure out your weaknesses and then get out your textbook and practice the problems. It may turn out that you know more than you think you do.

your explanations about the drugs and how they affect the human body is easy. I am sure I will not have a problem understanding that. They are like biology and are really practical. But When you are talking about for example london dispersion forces, or dipole dipole I don't think it is possible to FULLY understand the concept and visualize at the same time. I feel like I can learn things better when it applies to real life situations.

I mean I have only taken chem 101, 102, and bio 10 and trig. I looked at the dr collins practice test and I have to say that I forgot a lot of strategies on how to do them. However, I definitely have some ideas about them.

 

[b1234]

your explanations about the drugs and how they affect the human body is easy. I am sure I will not have a problem understanding that. They are like biology and are really practical. But When you are talking about for example london dispersion forces, or dipole dipole I don't think it is possible to FULLY understand the concept and visualize at the same time. I feel like I can learn things better when it applies to real life situations.

How the **** did you make it through chemistry without understanding what dipole - dipole interactions are...

 

[bottlecap1990]

Then you're really gonna need to study for the PCAT.

Learning in college is not about regurgitating topics for tests. Sure you can do that and pass the class, but generally you have to be able to retain some things. One of the things I learned early on is not to solve for the answer to a problem, but learn how to derive the solution to a problem.

That proved pivotal in O Chem and Biochem.

If you have a hard time visualizing chemistry, you're gonna have a hard time in pharmacy school unless you nail down the concepts. I'm not saying you have to know exactly how a Diels-Alder reaction works, but you should be able to understand WHY it works.

I don't think you can really compare topics in pharmacy school and college. I believe that once you are in pharmacy school, you will learn more about drugs and how they affect the body. And I think understanding that is much easier than understanding bonding, hybridization, SN reaction, and all that stuff which are really tough to visualize.

 

[bottlecap1990]

How the **** did you make it through chemistry without understanding what dipole - dipole interactions are...

I was just required to know which one is the strongest among dipole dipole, london dispersion forces, Ion-Ion, and H-bonding and how they affect MP and BP, and intermolecular forces.
I go to a community college so I guess teachers just don't go as deep.

 

[b1234]

I don't think you can really compare topics in pharmacy school and college. I believe that once you are in pharmacy school, you will learn more about drugs and how they affect the body. And I think understanding that is much easier than understanding bonding, hybridization, SN reaction, and all that stuff which are really tough to visualize.

And how exactly do you think enzymes work? How do you think drugs affect the body?

If you look at the curriculum at some pharmacy schools you'll notice that p1 year most include (undergraduate level) biochem, micro, immunology, etc.

 

[bottlecap1990]

You guys SERIOUSLY think that it is possible that I did not learn anything but I got all A's? LOL

 

[bottlecap1990]

And how exactly do you think enzymes work? How do you think drugs affect the body?

If you look at the curriculum at some pharmacy schools you'll notice that p1 year most include (undergraduate level) biochem, micro, immunology, etc.

I know that enzymes are very substrate specific and they work in lock and key mechanism (i learned this from bio). I don't know the answer to the 2nd question because I just finished taking chem 101, 102, and bio 101.

 

[bottlecap1990]

I think you can do just fine in pharmacy school without knowing the whys behind Diels-Alder reactions. I'm sure there are some schools that put heavy emphasis on the chemistry but apparently not all do. There is not nearly as much chemistry in pharmacy school as I imagined but again but my school uses the body system approach and not individual courses. You have to understand the basics of how a drug works but that isn't terribly complex. Drug X blocks this and in turn causes this and it may cause these adverse effects. Not hard. Or Drug X is metabolized in the liver by this enzyme. Drug Y is also metabolized in the liver by the same enzyme, therefore you get an interaction. Easy peasy. The concepts aren't hard but there is just a lot of material.

That said, you are going to need to know the material for the PCAT. I'd take a Pearson practice test, figure out your weaknesses and then get out your textbook and practice the problems. It may turn out that you know more than you think you do.

You are the only person here that is helping me. thank you

 

[b1234]

You guys SERIOUSLY think that it is possible that I did not learn anything but I got all A's? LOL

YES... Not saying you didn't learn anything, but getting A's often does not require learning; getting A's requires you regurgitating what your teacher and/or textbook say or do and sometimes requires learning.

 

[bottlecap1990]

YES... Not saying you didn't learn anything, but getting A's often does not require learning; getting A's requires you regurgitating what your teacher and/or textbook say or do and sometimes requires learning.

I do have to admit that I memorize a lot of the stuff that I needed to ace the test without sometimes understanding the concepts completely. However I feel like in order to do well in chemistry, it is not possible to just memorize. You must understand the materials. How can you say that regurgitating materials can help you do well on tests? I don't think that is possible.

Can i regurgitate for the PCAT then? LOL

 

[b1234]

I was just required to know which one is the strongest among dipole dipole, london dispersion forces, Ion-Ion, and H-bonding and how they affect MP and BP, and intermolecular forces.
I go to a community college so I guess teachers just don't go as deep.

You should at least know what a dipole is and that dipole-dipole interactions are based on attractions between opposite charges (or repulsions between like charges).

I know that enzymes are very substrate specific and they work in lock and key mechanism (i learned this from bio). I don't know the answer to the 2nd question because I just finished taking chem 101, 102, and bio 101.

I meant a bit more in depth than that - but if you've only had gen chem and one sem of intro bio then that's probably about all you really have learned so far.

If you've only had gen chem and one semester of bio, then why are you taking the PCAT so soon? Unless you've had more bio and chem than that the classes you have taken have probably covered less than half of the topics covered in the chem and bio sections.

 

[b1234]

I do have to admit that I memorize a lot of the stuff that I needed to ace the test without sometimes understanding the concepts completely. However I feel like in order to do well in chemistry, it is not possible to just memorize. You must understand the materials. How can you say that regurgitating materials can help you do well on tests? I don't think that is possible.

Can i regurgitate for the PCAT then? LOL

One major problem with memorizing what you need for tests without understanding the concepts is that you do not learn the things you need be able to understand more advanced concepts. You also tend to forget things because the information only goes into short term memory and not long term memory.

With chem - yes is much better to understand than to memorize but (with most teachers) it is possible to get good grades in chemistry just by memorizing.

For the PCAT because there is so much information covered - probably not. My (educated) guess is that if you try to just memorize information for the PCAT without learning it you will get at best in the low 70's on the chem and bio sections - probably (much) lower.

 

[bottlecap1990]

You should at least know what a dipole is and that dipole-dipole interactions are based on attractions between opposite charges (or repulsions between like charges).



I meant a bit more in depth than that - but if you've only had gen chem and one sem of intro bio then that's probably about all you really have learned so far.

If you've only had gen chem and one semester of bio, then why are you taking the PCAT so soon? Unless you've had more bio and chem than that the classes you have taken have probably covered less than half of the topics covered in the chem and bio sections.

I am planning on taking PCAT in june 2011 after taking orgo I and II, A&P I, and BIO 102, and Calculus I then apply for fall 2012 after taking the PCAT. I just bought the dr collins study guide and I admit I was a bit overwhelmed by the materials. Please consider the fact that I go to a community college. There are not many good professors here. I try as hard as I can to achieve good grades ( I have all A's so far). And Sometimes I just get frustrated when I don't understand something in the dr collins test and I want to blame my teachers for not going as deep as he should have.

my first day in my gen chem I class, we had the worst professor in the world. He was new to the school and all he did was read off power points. He was also arrogant and laughed at students questions. But we all complained and got a new teacher. The new teacher was better but he doesn't really go really deep into the material. Like he would explains some materials and go on to how to solve them so we can do well on tests

 

[b1234]

I am planning on taking PCAT in june 2011 after taking orgo I and II, A&P I, and BIO 102, and Calculus I then apply for fall 2012 after taking the PCAT. I just bought the dr collins study guide and I admit I was a bit overwhelmed by the materials. Please consider the fact that I go to a community college. There are not many good professors here. I try as hard as I can to achieve good grades ( I have all A's so far). And Sometimes I just get frustrated when I don't understand something in the dr collins test and I want to blame my teachers for not going as deep as he should have.

I'd wait until after you've had ochem I and another bio class before worrying about the PCAT then. I didn't use Dr. Collins but heard that its meant as more of a review - mostly just practice/example questions.

Without knowing more, I'd suggest using textbooks more and asking your teachers questions more often when you feel like you aren't understanding something. That being said, now that I know how much chem and bio you have had - I would expect that for about half of the sample bio and chem PCAT questions you look at them and don't understand what the question is about. If you can try to take a class that covers at least some biochem and/or basic cellular level bio before taking the PCAT. I remember quite a few questions about metabolism.

 

[bottlecap1990]

One major problem with memorizing what you need for tests without understanding the concepts is that you do not learn the things you need be able to understand more advanced concepts. You also tend to forget things because the information only goes into short term memory and not long term memory.

With chem - yes is much better to understand than to memorize but (with most teachers) it is possible to get good grades in chemistry just by memorizing.

For the PCAT because there is so much information covered - probably not. My (educated) guess is that if you try to just memorize information for the PCAT without learning it you will get at best in the low 70's on the chem and bio sections - probably (much) lower.

I understand that memorizing isn't a good idea to understand things but when I had Biology 101, we had a quiz every week that was fill in the blank. How can you ace the quiz if you just understand the material without memorizing it. I feel that classes like biology, anatomy phisiology, microbiology are all about memorization. I know that you must understand things like how to do dihybrid cross in punnett squares (even that you can memorize i believe) The only way to show that you understand the materials is to know the words or terms and that can only be done through memorizing.

 

[bottlecap1990]

I'd wait until after you've had ochem I and another bio class before worrying about the PCAT then. I didn't use Dr. Collins but heard that its meant as more of a review - mostly just practice/example questions.

Without knowing more, I'd suggest using textbooks more and asking your teachers questions more often when you feel like you aren't understanding something. That being said, now that I know how much chem and bio you have had - I would expect that for about half of the sample bio and chem PCAT questions you look at them and don't understand what the question is about. If you can try to take a class that covers at least some biochem and/or basic cellular level bio before taking the PCAT. I remember quite a few questions about metabolism.

I will be taking Orgo I and bio 102, and precalculus this fall, so do you think I should just go ahead and take the January 2011 PCAT?

 

[b1234]

I understand that memorizing isn't a good idea to understand things but when I had Biology 101, we had a quiz every week that was fill in the blank. How can you ace the quiz if you just understand the material without memorizing it. I feel that classes like biology, anatomy phisiology, microbiology are all about memorization. I know that you must understand things like how to do dihybrid cross in punnett squares (even that you can memorize i believe) The only way to show that you understand the materials is to know the words or terms and that can only be done through memorizing.

Well of course you have to memorize some things, and yeah anat is mostly pure memorization and so are a few other things, like taxonomy for example, but usually understanding more and memorizing less is good.

 

[phathead]

I will be taking Orgo I and bio 102, and precalculus this fall, so do you think I should just go ahead and take the January 2011 PCAT?

so wait, you're taking Orgo I, first year Bio and precalc next year?

That mean's your asking if anyone has gone to college and felt like you didn't learn anything after your first year?

Take a deep breath bud, you're gonna be in for a rude awakening with some of your classes in the next few years. I'm pretty sure I could still spit out all of steps in the Krebs Cycle

 

[b1234]

I will be taking Orgo I and bio 102, and precalculus this fall, so do you think I should just go ahead and take the January 2011 PCAT?

NO. I think you should take those two classes before you even worry about trying to study for the PCAT.

 

[owlegrad]

... Please consider the fact that I go to a community college. There are not many good professors here. I try as hard as I can to achieve good grades ( I have all A's so far). And Sometimes I just get frustrated when I don't understand something in the dr collins test and I want to blame my teachers for not going as deep as he should have.

my first day in my gen chem I class, we had the worst professor in the world. He was new to the school and all he did was read off power points. He was also arrogant and laughed at students questions. But we all complained and got a new teacher. The new teacher was better but he doesn't really go really deep into the material. Like he would explains some materials and go on to how to solve them so we can do well on tests

No. You could have the same experience at a university. You can also have great professors at CC. Quality of instructors vary widely even within a particular college. Doesn't matter, it is up to you to learn/understand the material. Plenty of people come out of CC's well prepared for pharmacy school, so IMO you are at no disadvantage there. As far as I am concerned you are making excuses. Stop. The PCAT won't care who your instructor was, nor will your future professors who expect you to come prepared for your more advanced classes. I really am not trying to be mean here but you need to know that posts like these paint you in a negative light. You are not happy with your level of understanding so you blame the professor/your CC? I guess I might be over-reacting a bit (you are probably just venting, nothing wrong with that) but please keep in mind that you are responsible for your level of understanding. This attitude of "I only went to a CC" needs to go. I guess you can tell I went to a CC so I might be over-reacting a tad to this commit.

Side note: Congrats on getting all A's so far! Keep up the good work!

 

[bottlecap1990]

No. You could have the same experience at a university. You can also have great professors at CC. Quality of instructors vary widely even within a particular college. Doesn't matter, it is up to you to learn/understand the material. Plenty of people come out of CC's well prepared for pharmacy school, so IMO you are at no disadvantage there. As far as I am concerned you are making excuses. Stop. The PCAT won't care who your instructor was, nor will your future professors who expect you to come prepared for your more advanced classes. I really am not trying to be mean here but you need to know that posts like these paint you in a negative light. You are not happy with your level of understanding so you blame the professor/your CC? I guess I might be over-reacting a bit (you are probably just venting, nothing wrong with that) but please keep in mind that you are responsible for your level of understanding. This attitude of "I only went to a CC" needs to go. I guess you can tell I went to a CC so I might be over-reacting a tad to this commit.

Side note: Congrats on getting all A's so far! Keep up the good work!

Thank you and you were not being mean at all. I am going to try my best to do the PCAT

 

[owlegrad]

Thank you and you were not being mean at all. I am going to try my best to do the PCAT

I am glad you reacted to my post so well. Good luck on the PCAT, I suspect you will do fine. Since you are wondering when to take the PCAT I will give you the same advice a pharmacy student gave me when it was "my time". Take it late enough that you have covered most of the material in class (in order to do well) but soon enough that if you don't do well you can retake it (hopefully this precaution won't be necessary, but better to take this precaution and not need it than to need it and not have it). Personally I recommend taking it as soon as possible after you have taken ORGO 1.

 

[diastole]

so wait, you're taking Orgo I, first year Bio and precalc next year?

That mean's your asking if anyone has gone to college and felt like you didn't learn anything after your first year?

Take a deep breath bud, you're gonna be in for a rude awakening with some of your classes in the next few years. I'm pretty sure I could still spit out all of steps in the Krebs Cycle

You are scaring this poor person unnecessarily. I bet half my pharmacy class can't spit out all the steps in the Krebs cycle. I'm not sure I can but that isn't a big deal. If you need it, you learn it again. If you've learned it before, it gets easier to learn again. Some people don't have to learn it again because they already know it. It means that they will not have to work as hard but it doesn't mean that the person who has to learn something over again is doomed. They just need a few extra steps. No big deal unless they are already on the verge of a breakdown. The OP got all As so far so I wouldn't be so quick to predict a rude awakening.

To the OP, some of the concepts you think you haven't learned are in your head and it will move to your long term memory through repetition in your classes. You will see some things again and again. I wouldn't let people freak you out. Just ask questions and try to understand the concepts. Some things you do have to straight up memorize but others you can start to predict based on your understanding of concepts. For example, if you understand osmosis, you don't really have to think about why too much sodium in your blood leads to hypertension and why you would use a diuretic to remove sodium. You could memorize the details but it is easier if you have an understanding of the concepts. It all comes down to how much work you are going to have to put in later.

 

[Tinkerbell22]

How the **** did you make it through chemistry without understanding what dipole - dipole interactions are...

lol...

I was just required to know which one is the strongest among dipole dipole, london dispersion forces, Ion-Ion, and H-bonding and how they affect MP and BP, and intermolecular forces.
I go to a community college so I guess teachers just don't go as deep.

You guys SERIOUSLY think that it is possible that I did not learn anything but I got all A's? LOL

It seems like some CC's teach a lot of 'material', but the professors teach to the exam... they don't really go into minute details or require critical thinking problems as much. At least in my experience anyway.

 

[keyy200tx]

you cant memorize how to do dihybrid cross in punnett squares or any crossing. You must understand it and how it works. like the PCAT they will ask you for percentages. so if you memorize them you will not know how to apply it in multiple choice questions...... In bio 2, i finished my first test in 30 minutes because i understood all this crossing things and still ace the test. . I have the doctor collins study guide and i can answer most of the bio questions....

 

[phathead]

You are scaring this poor person unnecessarily. I bet half my pharmacy class can't spit out all the steps in the Krebs cycle. I'm not sure I can but that isn't a big deal. If you need it, you learn it again. If you've learned it before, it gets easier to learn again. Some people don't have to learn it again because they already know it. It means that they will not have to work as hard but it doesn't mean that the person who has to learn something over again is doomed. They just need a few extra steps. No big deal unless they are already on the verge of a breakdown. The OP got all As so far so I wouldn't be so quick to predict a rude awakening.

To the OP, some of the concepts you think you haven't learned are in your head and it will move to your long term memory through repetition in your classes. You will see some things again and again. I wouldn't let people freak you out. Just ask questions and try to understand the concepts. Some things you do have to straight up memorize but others you can start to predict based on your understanding of concepts. For example, if you understand osmosis, you don't really have to think about why too much sodium in your blood leads to hypertension and why you would use a diuretic to remove sodium. You could memorize the details but it is easier if you have an understanding of the concepts. It all comes down to how much work you are going to have to put in later.

I'm not trying to scare them, I was merely providing an example. My point is that you will not survive in college by simply remembering material just for a test. Sure you can get As, but that will not work.

I'm not saying you should be able to remember everything you are taught right off the bat... or even remember most of what you were taught right off the bat... but you should be able to glance over something again and have the basics come back to you.

 

[bottlecap1990]

you cant memorize how to do dihybrid cross in punnett squares or any crossing. You must understand it and how it works. like the PCAT they will ask you for percentages. so if you memorize them you will not know how to apply it in multiple choice questions...... In bio 2, i finished my first test in 30 minutes because i understood all this crossing things and still ace the test. . I have the doctor collins study guide and i can answer most of the bio questions....

I know how to do them . I got a 98 on my last bio 101 test (highest in class). It was a 85 multiple choice question. I didn't say i could not answer the bio 101 question on the dr collins.

Man this forum is filled with jealous and mean people LOL.

 

[bottlecap1990]

so wait, you're taking Orgo I, first year Bio and precalc next year?

That mean's your asking if anyone has gone to college and felt like you didn't learn anything after your first year?

Take a deep breath bud, you're gonna be in for a rude awakening with some of your classes in the next few years. I'm pretty sure I could still spit out all of steps in the Krebs Cycle

I can tell you all the exact products and raw materials of krebs cycle, photophosporylation/ Electron tranport chain, Bridge reaction, and Glycolisis if you'd like

 

[bottlecap1990]

Why do so many pharm students (or students who are done completing their prereqs) like to scare students who just started doing their prereqs LOL. You are supposed to give constructive criticism, not intimidate them

 

[pcproduct]

Kreb's what?

I learned a whole lot in all my prereq classes, but I tend to brain dump stuff after the finals. What I learned back then made it much less difficult for me to relearn stuff for the PCAT.

 

[phathead]

Why do so many pharm students (or students who are done completing their prereqs) like to scare students who just started doing their prereqs LOL. You are supposed to give constructive criticism, not intimidate them

I'm not trying to scare you, you have to realize that of the majority of people who started out on this process, most do not complete it. They either don't take it seriously or don't put in the effort. I speak the truth, there's no reason to sugarcoat anything.

And if this truly is you second year, you're taking the PCAT too early IMO. Don't rush it, you want to make sure you have your bases fully covered before you take it.

 

[dtran01]

I kind of identify with the sentiment a little bit. I aced Anatomy with the highest grade in the class but I have only retained a tiny bit of it. There is a lot to learn that is either theoretical, difficult to visualize, and/or glossed over due to the material being too dense. Examples of this include many of the "given" ochem reactions involving alkynes or enolates, DNA microarrays, and Green's theorem for calculus.

Still, I have found that the best skill I learned from my undergraduate study is being able to quickly pick out the pertinent info and "study correctly" ...

Even though I felt like I had retained comparably little information compared to the breadth I had covered, my review for the PCAT took only 1 week, and I scored very high.

 

[ShadowRX]

Wait an effin minute... you go to a CC and get A's??? That's it!

 

[bottlecap1990]

Wait an effin minute... you go to a CC and get A's??? That's it!

I can assure you that there are many people that go to cc and score higher in the PCAT than people that go to prestigious universities.

 

[bottlecap1990]

I'm not trying to scare you, you have to realize that of the majority of people who started out on this process, most do not complete it. They either don't take it seriously or don't put in the effort. I speak the truth, there's no reason to sugarcoat anything.

And if this truly is you second year, you're taking the PCAT too early IMO. Don't rush it, you want to make sure you have your bases fully covered before you take it.

I have only finished 2 semesters of college.

 

[rxlea]

The mnemonic I use for the citric acid cycle:

Our City Is Kept Safe And Sound From Malice.

Teehee

 

[bottlecap1990]

The mnemonic I use for the citric acid cycle:

Our City Is Kept Safe And Sound From Malice.

Teehee

isn't that the same as krebs?

 

[MiataMike]

isn't that the same as krebs?

Yes.

 

[keyy200tx]

you can match most of the CC's in texas to most of the universities in texas. some states the cc are just easy.

 

[rxlea]

Then you're really gonna need to study for the PCAT.

Learning in college is not about regurgitating topics for tests. Sure you can do that and pass the class, but generally you have to be able to retain some things. One of the things I learned early on is not to solve for the answer to a problem, but learn how to derive the solution to a problem.

That proved pivotal in O Chem and Biochem.

If you have a hard time visualizing chemistry, you're gonna have a hard time in pharmacy school unless you nail down the concepts. I'm not saying you have to know exactly how a Diels-Alder reaction works, but you should be able to understand WHY it works.

I think you can do just fine in pharmacy school without knowing the whys behind Diels-Alder reactions. I'm sure there are some schools that put heavy emphasis on the chemistry but apparently not all do. There is not nearly as much chemistry in pharmacy school as I imagined but again but my school uses the body system approach and not individual courses. You have to understand the basics of how a drug works but that isn't terribly complex. Drug X blocks this and in turn causes this and it may cause these adverse effects. Not hard. Or Drug X is metabolized in the liver by this enzyme. Drug Y is also metabolized in the liver by the same enzyme, therefore you get an interaction. Easy peasy. The concepts aren't hard but there is just a lot of material.

That said, you are going to need to know the material for the PCAT. I'd take a Pearson practice test, figure out your weaknesses and then get out your textbook and practice the problems. It may turn out that you know more than you think you do.

I think phatty is referring to mastering the ability to truly understand any/all material presented to you...not that you need to know it for pharmacy school. His example was a good one because it is easy to memorize a reagent and what a diels-alder product looks like but it is another to actually know why certain bonds are formed. If you go through undergrad actually understanding material and perfecting your learning style, I think it is safe to say that you are going to have an easier time learning and retaining information presented to you in pharmacy school. This is the same for the PCAT. I only studied for one week for the PCAT but because I actually learned the material in my classes, I was able to recall most of the information, especially biology and ochem topics. I think it comes down to "learning how to learn". Pump and dump is not going to get you through in the real world of pharmacy, at least from what I have seen with the pharmacists I have worked with over the years. In fact, they have pointed out when students on rotations have come from schools where it was possible for them to get through with the pump and dump method. They said those students did not perform nearly as well as other students.

Learning involves self motivation. If you're not interested in what you're learning, you ain't gonna learn it.

I suppose this is true for some, but IMO, one of the measures of intelligence is the ability to learn information that you're not interested in, maybe by relating it somehow to something you already know or that you have experienced in your life. Just because you think something is boring doesn't mean you can't and shouldn't learn it. But, I guess different people view learning differently.

your explanations about the drugs and how they affect the human body is easy. I am sure I will not have a problem understanding that.

I feel like I can learn things better when it applies to real life situations.

Eh, I don't think it is that easy in the pharmacy world in a clinical setting...again, from what I have seen.

I don't think you can really compare topics in pharmacy school and college. I believe that once you are in pharmacy school, you will learn more about drugs and how they affect the body. And I think understanding that is much easier than understanding bonding, hybridization, SN reaction, and all that stuff which are really tough to visualize.

Maybe. But then why do many pharmacy students tell me that we will need to know the information we learned in undergrad in order to perform well in pharmacy school? Maybe some schools spend an enormous amount of time on reviewing but my school doesn't.

YES... Not saying you didn't learn anything, but getting A's often does not require learning; getting A's requires you regurgitating what your teacher and/or textbook say or do and sometimes requires learning.

yes, there are a lot of "BS" classes...I would agree with you on that and some classes are just that- pump and dump. But, I can honestly say that I have taken away something from every class I have ever taken that has proven to be useful in some way....even if it was a bit of history that I could later talk about in a conversation. I think the only exception to this has been calculus except for needing to know it on the PCAT. However, pharmacy students have told me you use SOME calc in pharm school so I guess even that class was somehow important.

One major problem with memorizing what you need for tests without understanding the concepts is that you do not learn the things you need be able to understand more advanced concepts. You also tend to forget things because the information only goes into short term memory and not long term memory.

With chem - yes is much better to understand than to memorize but (with most teachers) it is possible to get good grades in chemistry just by memorizing.

For the PCAT because there is so much information covered - probably not. My (educated) guess is that if you try to just memorize information for the PCAT without learning it you will get at best in the low 70's on the chem and bio sections - probably (much) lower.

I totally agree with this.

 

[MiataMike]

Learning involves self motivation. If you're not interested in what you're learning, you ain't gonna learn it. That said, I took a lot of forgettable classes during undergrad.

I suppose this is true for some, but IMO, one of the measures of intelligence is the ability to learn information that you're not interested in, maybe by relating it somehow to something you already know or that you have experienced in your life. Just because you think something is boring doesn't mean you can't and shouldn't learn it. But, I guess different people view learning differently.

I don't believe that someone can learn something that he/she has no interest in. By the very act of relating a subject to something you know or some life experience, you're attempting to make it interesting or at least worthwhile of your time. If you intend on mastering (and truly learning) some subject, you need to be actively interested in it. Otherwise, you'll just memorize it temporarily and then drop it since it has no value to you. That's the difference between forgettable classes and classes that actually give you information that you can value. Of course, determining which classes are which is entirely subjective.

 

[Dezixn]

I feel like I learned how to solve the problems but I did not FULLY understand the material (especially chemistry, I feel like this subject is hard to visualize). I was able to pass with an A for every class though. Biology was a different story, I definitely learned tons of things because everything was so easy to understand.

While the method of "passing the class" is perfectly fine for >80% of college students... Unfortunately, it isn't for us trying to get into pharmacy, medical, dental ect... Since we are actually tested on the material before acceptance.

You're going to have trouble if you feel you haven't learned anything.

 

[bottlecap1990]

While the method of "passing the class" is perfectly fine for >80% of college students... Unfortunately, it isn't for us trying to get into pharmacy, medical, dental ect... Since we are actually tested on the material before acceptance.

You're going to have trouble if you feel you haven't learned anything.

When you say the method of "passing the class" do you mean passing the class with like a c or a c+? I know that you won't be able to gain acceptance with mediocre grades like that. And how can you explain the 0+6 programs where they don't even require the PCAT? Let say a prestigious university filled with 300+ students in a class. How can you actually learn and truly master the materials under this situation?

I doubt every single student in pharmacy school mastered all the chemistry, biology, and other concepts they learned during their undergraduate years.