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Midsouthyank

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Posted awhile back about input on formulating a rank list. Looks like I jinxed myself because I managed to not match to any program.

I was hoping to get some advice on how to improve my application for the next match cycle. I had to SOAP for a TY spot and will be reapplying.

Step scores were 24x and 25x. US M.D. Middle of the pack grade wise. Good dean's letter, good rec letters. 2 publications as primary author in an unrelated field. A couple leadership positions and decent extracurriculars. 10 interviews and 10 ranks.

I've been trying to get anesthesia research but have been whiffing so far. No research at home school, TY, or another health system where I know faculty. With only a week left until graduation, doubt I can get any even surgical research at my home program, though I did reach out.

I would like to attend ASA, but don't think I could take time off due to intern year responsibilities and the fact that it's in the middle of interview season and I'll probably have to use vacation days for interviews.

Basically, I'm at a loss right now for how to show continued resume development concerning the field of anesthesia. When I reapply, I'd like to at least have a few new things on my CV. Been told to make sure I get good rec letters from Anesthesiologists but that's about the only goal that it seems I'll be able to accomplish.

I've started studying for Step 3 already and plan to take it in September, so it'll be visible to programs when I reapply. I've been told that's a good move.

Is there anything else I can do kind of on my own that would make me a more attractive candidate? It seems like my interviews need to improve since that's the one unknown variable, but I promise I'm a normal person with an active social life. Will definitely do some self-reflection on my interviews though.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks y'all.
 
What field were your “two publications in an unrelated field”?

Is there any possibility programs thought Anesthesia could be your backup specialty?

FWIW I also consider myself a normal person with friends and a spouse but have personally bombed an interview or two in hindsight that I did not realize at the time. I doubt you would’ve bombed all 10 though (nor did I).
 
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A field far less competitive than anesthesia so I'm hoping it didn't come across that way.
 
nimbus said:
Surprised you did not match. I would think you had a 99% chance of matching. It must be getting harder. Sorry.
Click to expand...

It may be getting harder, but this is still extremely uncommon even in recent history. Between match years 2016-2020 there were 505 US MD applicants with 24X and 25X step scores that applied to anesthesia. 504/505 matched. The one that did not match had less than 3 programs on their rank list.

I'm not saying this to make OP feel any certain way, but I think it should say there may be something you are missing. You could just be extremely unlucky, but I would definitely take a deep dive into how you could potentially improve interviews and any potential red flags you may have missed.

Sorry to hear about all this, it seems like you have a solid plan in place though.
 
Agree with above. There’s something that you are missing. You need a mentor who is comfortable getting to know you and being honest with you. I would bet something in the interview process caused concern for people. Rarely are people introspective enough to be self reflective and actually try to understand how they are perceived.
I’m the same way. It’s human nature. But someone out there will be willing to give you the straight scoop. Just seek out someone who can be honest with you.
Years ago, I had someone do the same for me and I learned a lot about myself that I would have never otherwise known. Now, I am acutely aware. I can’t always “fix” it, but I can sometimes mitigate the impact. It’s a lot like preparing for oral boards and eliminating stammering or other annoying tendencies. They are still there, but you can mask them to some degree.
I suspect that the virtual process worked against you as well. Some manage it fine while others don’t.
Good luck!
 
The real reason why anesthesia and rads are getting more competitive is that they are opening med schools left and right without increasing the number of residency slots.

ACGME must tell the osteopathic accreditation boards that standards have to become stricter so that 10 new schools aren’t opening each year

LCME standards are already strict in that clinical sites must actually be set up before matriculating classes and such.

We need a new flexner report
 
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Agree with @Gilakend. With your stats and 10 ranked, shouldn’t have any problems. But here we are.

Go back to your medical school, especially if they have any anesthesia programs.
Go to your TY institution, especially they have an anesthesia program.
ASA isn’t a bad idea, seeing some programs face/face may be helpful.

Have someone do a mock interview and maybe get some feedback.

Looking from your list a few months ago, I didn’t think they were all reach program/safety school. The most logical conclusion is maybe you aren’t as “normal” as you think you are…..
 
I reached out to programs I applied to for feedback and was able to talk over Zoom to a PD for a long while. I asked about red flags specifically and was told that I didn't have any. They didn't mention problems with my interview either, which I was expecting to be honest since that seems to be the only factor I couldn't account for. I was told that I was ranked but evidently not high enough. Did a mock interview before interview season and the interviewer didn't have any concerns with me. One of the programs I received feedback from said I was a good applicant but a few interviewers had a hard time making a personal connection with me. I imagine this happened during other interviews, but none of them were awkward or uncomfortable. If anything, I'm thinking I didn't talk about my hobbies and/or personal life enough and perhaps gave a workaholic impression?

Both home school and TY don't have anesthesia programs unfortunately. And yeah I'm wondering if there is something up about me that I don't know about. So far the people I've asked for honest advice just say I got really unlucky but that's not really any solace because I would love to have something solid to work on.

I applied to 29 programs. Should have done way more. With the virtual format I learned later in the interview season other people were applying to almost every program in the country.
 
Midsouthyank said:
I reached out to programs I applied to for feedback and was able to talk over Zoom to a PD for a long while. I asked about red flags specifically and was told that I didn't have any. They didn't mention problems with my interview either, which I was expecting to be honest since that seems to be the only factor I couldn't account for. I was told that I was ranked but evidently not high enough. Did a mock interview before interview season and the interviewer didn't have any concerns with me. One of the programs I received feedback from said I was a good applicant but a few interviewers had a hard time making a personal connection with me. I imagine this happened during other interviews, but none of them were awkward or uncomfortable. If anything, I'm thinking I didn't talk about my hobbies and/or personal life enough and perhaps gave a workaholic impression?

Both home school and TY don't have anesthesia programs unfortunately. And yeah I'm wondering if there is something up about me that I don't know about. So far the people I've asked for honest advice just say I got really unlucky but that's not really any solace because I would love to have something solid to work on.

I applied to 29 programs. Should have done way more. With the virtual format I learned later in the interview season other people were applying to almost every program in the country.
Click to expand...
Keep in mind that a lot of people who aren’t close to you personally are often reluctant to give honest feedback in these cases. Why? It puts them in a very awkward position and could also put your letter writers In a tough spot if they say “the letters were a problem”

That’s why the consensus is generally to talk with home PD (who in this case is nonexistent). However, a mentor could serve a similar role in this case

Despite all this, I think that the main problem was app volume. Average anesthesiology applicant submitted 54 applications according to medscape
 
Midsouthyank said:
One of the programs I received feedback from said I was a good applicant but a few interviewers had a hard time making a personal connection with me. I imagine this happened during other interviews, but none of them were awkward or uncomfortable. If anything, I'm thinking I didn't talk about my hobbies and/or personal life enough and perhaps gave a workaholic impression?
Click to expand...

I find it weird if not creepy that interviewers want to find a "personal connection" with applicants. I think as a field physicians are poorly trained when it comes to the HR world. No interviewer has any need to know anything about your personal life - and many questions about your personal life would in fact be illegal. Yet, you still get interviewers asking such questions and judging applicants based on them.

All that said you seem to have been unlucky this year. If I had to guess there's a surge of applicants scattershot applying and interviewing at far more programs than before. So for next time maybe you need to apply to more and interview at more.

You should definitely speak with a mentor or coach who can give you an honest assessment of your application and there certainly is a question about how you interviewed. With so many applicants the interview itself can have a big impact.
 
Yep will certainly not make the same mistake and will be applying all over the place next cycle.

Hoping I can get some good feedback on my personality during my TY. I always though the evals from my home program were a bit lacking in depth. Read a thread on here about someone in a similar situation a while back with good stats who didn't match and people were bringing up that he could have an undiagnosed personality disorder or something. Maybe that's not the case with me, but who knows?

Figured overly talking about myself would be kind of odd, seems like most interviews asked the generic questions:

Tell me about yourself?
Why anesthesiology?
Why this school?
Why do you want your career to look like?
Do you have any questions for me?

Wondering if I botched the "tell me about yourself" questions by not talking a lot about stuff other than school.
 
GassYous said:
Yeah I applied to 20 and that was because I was shooting for the stars
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I applied to 33 programs 5 years ago, but I am a DO. Despite good board scores I was still concerned about potentially getting passed over due to the degree. Ended up invited to 17 interviews and attended 12.
 
Wow, with those scores and military background, I would have thought you would be highly sought after. The "personal connection" feedback sounds like BS to me, or in today's language, "unconscious bias." Some people don't look as good on Zoom than in person. If you are truly worried about the interviews, get a better webcam, hire some consultant/coach and do some mock interviews. But I would also reach out to all the programs that you had interviewed/ranked, be honest about your situation, and keep yourself on their radar in case a advanced spot opens up. They know they are going to get one grateful resident that has a chip on their shoulder. Good luck.
 
I am sorry to hear that. You are doing all the right things though.

Midsouthyank said:
a few interviewers had a hard time making a personal connection with me.
Click to expand...

This was the problem.

When we talk about applicants at the end of the interview day, a lot of it comes down to "I really enjoyed talking to this applicant" or "This applicant felt little awkward, and I could not get a conversation going."

I would also recommend doing multiple mock interviews and see if there is something you are doing or saying subconsciously that throws people off. It could be your demeanor too.

Lastly, apply more broadly next time, and be active about reaching out to programs that you don't hear from within a reasonable period of time and let them know that you are serious about being a resident at the program. Some of the lower tier programs also may not have extended an interview thinking you won't consider them highly - in the age of virtual interviews, programs do not want to waste an interview slot on applicant that has no interest in coming to the program, but only applied because of shear accessibility. Showing serious interest will help them think otherwise.
 
JiPo said:
I am sorry to hear that. You are doing all the right things though.



This was the problem.

When we talk about applicants at the end of the interview day, a lot of it comes down to "I really enjoyed talking to this applicant" or "This applicant felt little awkward, and I could not get a conversation going."

I would also recommend doing multiple mock interviews and see if there is something you are doing or saying subconsciously that throws people off. It could be your demeanor too.

Lastly, apply more broadly next time, and be active about reaching out to programs that you don't hear from within a reasonable period of time and let them know that you are serious about being a resident at the program. Some of the lower tier programs also may not have extended an interview thinking you won't consider them highly - in the age of virtual interviews, programs do not want to waste an interview slot on applicant that has no interest in coming to the program, but only applied because of shear accessibility. Showing serious interest will help them think otherwise.
Click to expand...

Seems stupid to me. You will spend little time with the guy you just need someone reliable who is teachable. You're not doing sales
 
GassYous said:
Seems stupid to me. You will spend little time with the guy you just need someone reliable who is teachable. You're not doing sales
Click to expand...
If you have the luxury of only interviewing applicants that appear reliable and teachable on paper and interview, wouldnt you want to work with people that are fun and pleasant to be around as a bonus? 😉

Obviously, what you mentioned is very important and is prioritized, but all things being equal, people that had more pleasant impression will be ranked higher.
 
JiPo said:
If you have the luxury of only interviewing applicants that appear reliable and teachable on paper and interview, wouldnt you want to work with people that are fun and pleasant to be around as a bonus? 😉

Obviously, what you mentioned is very important and is prioritized, but all things being equal, people that had more pleasant impression will be ranked higher.
Click to expand...

hire me im great
 
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