apply without the prereq's, would it work?

[thecleaner]

Hello everyone, this is my first post on SDN.

I have a bachelors degree. I currently do not have any of the prereqs for med school ( 8 bio, 8 chem, 8 org chem, 8 phys). However, i know i can have them complete by next summer.

I was planning to take the mcat in september and score really high (I've worked in healthcare for quite some time). I was then going to send out an application for the 2009 school year.

Would med schools even consider me without any of the prereqs even if they knew i would have them completed before matriculation? Would they be likely to consider me if i had a really high mcat score? Has this ever been done before? I have a 3.8 undergrad gpa.

Any help would be appreciated.

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[DoctorDreamer]

A few things... If you don't have gen chem, it'll take you two years, since you have to take gen chem before ochem. I shoved them all together, and it still took two years total, doing nothing but science, post-bacc.

Also, working in healthcare has nothing to do with the MCAT. The MCAT is all science knowledge and critical thinking skills, so you're not likely to score decently without any science courses.

And do you have plenty of medical experience? If not, it doesn't matter what your scores are, you need to get some before applying.

And finally, I doubt adcoms would care about your high GPA if you don't have a BCPM. They may assume that your GPA will plumnmet after taking classes like OChem and Physics, and want to see your GPA after those to verify you can handle the coursework.

I think it'll be a waste of your time and money (and I considered it, too), and I'd suggest finishing the courses, then taking the MCAT, THEN apply.

 

[MossPoh]

1 or 2 prereqs not being done is usually not a problem..... usually. It is just kind of a part of the contract before you go in. Now, planning to "score really high" on the mcat and actually doing so are two different things. Working in the healthcare field has nothing to do with the mcat. My dad has been a physician for nearly 40 years now and he looked at my practice mcat and simply said "Jesus, I have no idea about any of this." Get your prereqs out of the way, do well in them, then take the mcat and then apply. Don't rush too much. It'll kick your a$$.

 

[thecleaner]

I've actually found a local college that will allow me to finish all the prereqs in one year. I've looked at a lot of the MCAT review books (EK, Kaplan) and most of the stuff in there looks familiar to me (I teach science). Plus, if there is one thing i'm good at it's taking tests. I also worked in the medical field for 5 years. If i scored 35+ on the MCAT, would that give me a fighting chance? I know it's improbable but i just want to know if it's possible.

 

[DoctorDreamer]

Also, taking the MCAT in Sept. would have you applying really late, which would also hurt your apps.

 

[DoctorDreamer]

I've actually found a local college that will allow me to finish all the prereqs in one year. I've looked at a lot of the MCAT review books (EK, Kaplan) and most of the stuff in there looks familiar to me (I teach science). Plus, if there is one thing i'm good at it's taking tests. I also worked in the medical field for 5 years. If i scored 35+ on the MCAT, would that give me a fighting chance? I know it's improbable but i just want to know if it's possible.

It depends. I'm not an adcom, but I wouldn't accept you no matter what your MCAT is until I've seen your prereq grades. Also, I scored above a 35, and have a 4.0 WITH the prereqs, applied a little earlier than you would be, and STILL only have one acceptance. There are no guarantees.

Why rush it? Enjoy life and this time, get your stuff together and apply.

 

[dd128]

I've actually found a local college that will allow me to finish all the prereqs in one year. I've looked at a lot of the MCAT review books (EK, Kaplan) and most of the stuff in there looks familiar to me (I teach science). Plus, if there is one thing i'm good at it's taking tests. I also worked in the medical field for 5 years. If i scored 35+ on the MCAT, would that give me a fighting chance? I know it's improbable but i just want to know if it's possible.

I'm not adcom member, but I'd be impressed as hell if you could get a 35+ on the mcat without taking a single pre-req

Test taking aside, the mcat is a different beast than any test you've probably taken. A lot of it is test taking skills, and maybe you could do awesome on VR and the WS, but I'm not sure how one would do well on bio or chem without the classes?

 

[MossPoh]

Now I'm confused as hell, because you said you teach science but haven't had a single prereq? Once again, medical field has NOTHING to do with mcat. Once in a while they throw in something medical related to appease the premeds, but it isn't much. You can easily figure out where you are by taking a diagnostic. Set aside around 3 hours and sit down and take it. Be honest with yourself. We are all "familiar" with the stuff. I've only encountered two or three questions I haven't seen in some form my entire life. Sitting there sipping coffee and scanning over it is really different than taking it. Also, realize that a 35+ isn't as easy as you make it seem. I'm not saying this to be a jerk, but we are ALL science geeks to some capacity here. I've been prepping for the mcat for a couple months and consistently get 32-34s now. That is after a course and training. I'm not the greatest test taker, but still, I'm not an idiot by any means. I think you need to take things one step at a time. Forgive me if I sound rude, but you aren't the first person I've spoken to that assumed they'd get a 35+ on the mcat....many times they end up with a 28-30. Seriously, no rush, just take your prereqs, then the mcat. Take the extra year. It'll only help your chances.

 

[bioteach]

I currently do not have any of the prereqs for med school

I was planning to take the mcat in september and score really high

These two statements do not fit together. You will not score high on the MCAT if you have never had chem, ochem, physics or bio. The MCAT has nothing whatsoever to do with "healthcare". It tests your knowledge of chem, ochem, physics and bio. Even if you did phenomenally on the verbal and writing parts, a 15,0,0 T isn't going to get you very far.

 

[NAVYLABTECH08]

Hello everyone, this is my first post on SDN.

I have a bachelors degree. I currently do not have any of the prereqs for med school ( 8 bio, 8 chem, 8 org chem, 8 phys). However, i know i can have them complete by next summer.

I was planning to take the mcat in september and score really high (I've worked in healthcare for quite some time). I was then going to send out an application for the 2009 school year.

Would med schools even consider me without any of the prereqs even if they knew i would have them completed before matriculation? Would they be likely to consider me if i had a really high mcat score? Has this ever been done before? I have a 3.8 undergrad gpa.

Any help would be appreciated.

Does anyone smell a ton of rejection letters with a large side of a overall 3-4 on the mcat! Just curious science teacher that moonlights in the medical field for 5 years, what was you original degree in. The way college works, there are these things called core classes. I don't know any degree where you can escape at least a bio or gen chm. Now, you actually teach science? Science of what....biology is a must before AP,micro,etc. You need chm to teach some chemistry/physical sciences. Even astronomy and geolgy sciences may require at least gen chm. I think you have a strong fighting change to score a 1-10 overall on the mcat. As far as I've read, med schools have 3 piles at adcom:

Stack 1: the for sure applicants (already a lock before interview)
Stack #2: the in-betweeners (make decision after secondaries adn interviews)
Stack #3: The definite non-acceptances/incomplete (No chance)(Which you are-incomplete)

My advice:
Sounds like you are very smart and I have no doubt that you can ace those prereqes.However, O.CHm is a heavy amount of info. Best case scenario, you should take CHM I,Bio I in the fall, CHM II,BIO II in spring, physics I(Summer), O. CHM I, physics II (Fall), O. CHm II (Spring), Kaplan course +MCAT(Summer) = apply

 

[DoctorDreamer]

I've actually found a local college that will allow me to finish all the prereqs in one year. I've looked at a lot of the MCAT review books (EK, Kaplan) and most of the stuff in there looks familiar to me (I teach science). Plus, if there is one thing i'm good at it's taking tests. I also worked in the medical field for 5 years. If i scored 35+ on the MCAT, would that give me a fighting chance? I know it's improbable but i just want to know if it's possible.

Is this a community college? Adcoms tend to look down on people completing all their prereqs at a CC.

 

[thecleaner]

thank you for your replies. I appreciate all the honest responses. The truth is that i have taken some science courses (chem, bio) and did REALLY well in them, but i never got credit for the courses (because i was not present at the end of the courses for personal reasons).

I know it's not the traditional route and i know it's unlikely to sit well with many. I just wanted to know if it was possible to pull this off. If i did pull it off it would make one helluva story wouldn't it, though. oh boy...

 

[primadonna22274]

This is so funny. I've worked in healthcare for a really long time too (well, compared to some, PA for 7.5 years and laboratory medicine for 6 years prior) but gee, my MCAT score kinda sucked. And I had all the prereqs...more than a decade ago though.
No, it won't work. But thanks for the laugh.

 

[thecleaner]

Is this a community college? Adcoms tend to look down on people completing all their prereqs at a CC.

I've heard that as long as you can back up your grades with the MCAT it shouldn't really matter where you took the course. I wouldn't want to attend a school that would scowl at me because i took my prereqs at a CC even after scoring 35+ on the MCAT.

If someone who went to yale scored 27 on the mcat and a guy went to CC and scored 35+, who would get more consideration? All GPA's being equal i would think the guy with the higher mcat score would be considered as he has proven greater mastery of fundamental knowledge.

 

[husky10501]

just to throw in my own question, is it okay to apply without ochem II and physics II? I have tons of biology/genetics/g-chem but haven't taking general physics II or Ochem II. I'm planning to do those over the summer.

 

[DoctorDreamer]

I went to universities, but they are small and unknown. My MCAT score is above 35, and I was still repeatedly asked about my school at interviews, and some even commented on my not going to a "competitive school." OF course, some schools knew of my undergrad, and they spoke very highly of it.

It's not an easy route for the perfect applicant, and it's just going to be even less likely the way you have it lined out. It may not be impossible, but I wouldn't risk it.

 

[NAVYLABTECH08]

I went to universities, but they are small and unknown. My MCAT score is above 35, and I was still repeatedly asked about my school at interviews, and some even commented on my not going to a "competitive school." OF course, some schools knew of my undergrad, and they spoke very highly of it.

It's not an easy route for the perfect applicant, and it's just going to be even less likely the way you have it lined out. It may not be impossible, but I wouldn't risk it.

What are you talking about. Look man, last time i checked, you need a BS to get into most med schools. CC don't offer BS degrees. Also, I took Ap I at a CC and AP II at a university. Both professors were PHDs and the CC class was more challenging. Not saying all CC classes are hard, but the op is not going to get slammed for taking pre-reqs at a CC becasue adcom has reality and understands that CC classes are cheaper that state/university classes and if a working man/woman is given areal choice, they will choose the cheaper route. Relax man, everyone was not spit into state school straight out of high school with mommy and daddy footing the bill. Some poeple have to actually consider finances and when going to college!

 

[RySerr21]

this has been bugging me the crap out of me, and I cant find the answer.

what is the difference between "biology" and "biology/zoology." Some schools require a year of "biology" while some require a year of "biology/zoology"

which courses fit into which category?? will Human Anatomy and Human Physiology (with lab) count for a "biology" requirement.


figuing out which classes will work pretty much will determine both semesters of my senior year. I have only taken "intro to cellular/molecular" but i have taken two semesters of human anatomy and one semster of human physiology.... i plan on taking biochemistry in the fall, but do i need another general bio course liek Zoology or Marine Biology or something???

 

[DoctorDreamer]

What are you talking about. Look man, last time i checked, you need a BS to get into most med schools. CC don't offer BS degrees. Also, I took Ap I at a CC and AP II at a university. Both professors were PHDs and the CC class was more challenging. Not saying all CC classes are hard, but the op is not going to get slammed for taking pre-reqs at a CC becasue adcom has reality and understands that CC classes are cheaper that state/university classes and if a working man/woman is given areal choice, they will choose the cheaper route. Relax man, everyone was not spit into state school straight out of high school with mommy and daddy footing the bill. Some poeple have to actually consider finances and when going to college!

I never said the OP won't get into med school with CC classes, and I certainly understand the financial thing, as I paid for school myself.

The OP has been asking about their chances, and I am simply using my experience to point out different hurdles. I don't make up the criteria schools use, and I think it's a little ridiculous for the name of a school to play a big role in admissions, but it still sometimes does.

I'm simply trying to help the OP by pointing out things to consider, especially since he's already pursuing a less than ideal path.

 

[The Doctor]

Hey OP, I admire your drive to push forward quickly, but my honest advice would be to wait an extra year. 1) First and foremost, it would seem strange to send in an AMCAS without a single pre-requisite completed. I know you said you had experience with science courses, but I don't think an adcom would take you seriously without having officially completed a single course. They may question your motivations or if you even know what to expect academically. 2) Perhaps most importantly, the stress level would be ridiculously high if you were planning to take all of your pre-req courses, complete your AMCAS and secondary applications and travel for interviews, work to support yourself financially, and study for and ace the MCAT all in one year. I don't see how this could possibly be done effectively; I'm afraid you would be selling yourself short and not opening yourself up to your full potential by applying prematurely. I really think it is beyond unrealistic to think of rocking the MCAT in September without taking most of the pre-reqs. 3) An extra year would help you give you time to get extra-curriculars in line for medical school in addition to your work in the healthcare field: shadowing, organizations, volunteer work, leadership experience, etc. 4) The application process is very expensive and if you weren't accepted, you would have to go through it all over again - and if accelerating the process resulted in poor performance in classes or on the MCAT, this would stick with you in future application cycles. Even the most qualified applicants/students I have known have absolutely no guarantees in the application process - it can be incredibly random. The best advice is just to take the time you need to work through it slowly and get high marks along the way so that, ideally, you don't have to reapply.

Just my opinion, I'm sure it could probably be done, but I would not want to be you for that one year if you tried to tackle everything all at once. Best of luck to you.

 

[scarletgirl777]

just to throw in my own question, is it okay to apply without ochem II and physics II? I have tons of biology/genetics/g-chem but haven't taking general physics II or Ochem II. I'm planning to do those over the summer.

I think this can really put you at a serious disadvantage in some places. I know someone who had a great GPA (or so she said anyway) from a top 3 school and the only think she had not taken was physics 1 and 2 (she was taking them during the application year). She had so many rejections. She had some interviews at great places, but nothing ever materialized from the top schools. She did end up getting into and going to Jefferson, so in that sense it worked out, but I definitely think it's a disadvantage. And her Physics score was somewhat competitive--the lowest of the 3 but still somewhat competitive, but apparently the adcoms didn't care...

 

[scarletgirl777]

I think this can really put you at a serious disadvantage in some places. I know someone who had a great GPA (or so she said anyway) from a top 3 school and the only think she had not taken was physics 1 and 2 (she was taking them during the application year). She had so many rejections. She had some interviews at great places, but nothing ever materialized from the top schools. She did end up getting into and going to Jefferson, so in that sense it worked out, but I definitely think it's a disadvantage. And her Physics score was somewhat competitive--the lowest of the 3 but still somewhat competitive, but apparently the adcoms didn't care...

Oh wait...I should read more carefully. I guess you will still have them done in time for interviews, so hopefully it will be ok.

 

[husky10501]

Oh wait...I should read more carefully. I guess you will still have them done in time for interviews, so hopefully it will be ok.

ok you scared me for a minute there. yes all my prereqs including biochem will be done by my interviews..assuming i'll get any.

 

[luckycharms08]

I've heard that as long as you can back up your grades with the MCAT it shouldn't really matter where you took the course. I wouldn't want to attend a school that would scowl at me because i took my prereqs at a CC even after scoring 35+ on the MCAT.

If someone who went to yale scored 27 on the mcat and a guy went to CC and scored 35+, who would get more consideration? All GPA's being equal i would think the guy with the higher mcat score would be considered as he has proven greater mastery of fundamental knowledge.

not true. it's harder to get a 3.8 at yale than it is to get a 3.8 at a community college. med schools look at GPA first because that's 3+ years of effort, whereas mcat is 1 score that could be a fluke (either positively or negatively)

people are trying to save you from wasting your time and your money. take the classes (AT A REAL COLLEGE), then take the mcat, and get your clinical experience while doing both. you're counting your chickens before they're hatched by assuming you're going to rock the mcat and be able to do all the prereq's in one year. i think you're placing way too much emphasis on the mcat. not everyone with a 35+ gets into medical school. if your science gpa is crap (or in your case, nonexistent), you will not get interviews.

 

[MossPoh]

p.s. I know you said you did "REALLY" well in 2 or 3 of the prereqs, but if it was intro bio then it really doesn't matter much. With regards to the biology section, my only useful classes have been genetics and physiology. (and organic)