What is the point of applying to t20s if its close to impossible without x factor?

[carnitasburrito]

When i think about it, out of 100-115 seats, 30 will have those national scholarships/awards, 10 athletes, 10 miltary probably, 10 skills in arts at national/intl level, 10 research whizzes, 10 large company/nonprofit/other x factor, so that leaves only about 20-30 seats for normal people? All the while expecting everyone to have high stats and check all the boxes? So whats the point of even applying if you dont have an x factor ? you have a higher chance of winning the lottery.

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[LizzyM]

Only you can decide which schools are a good fit for you and where you are likely to garner an interview and an offer of admission. It is likely that you made a similar calculus as a HS student applying for undergrad admission.

That said, some will say, like the lottery, that you've got to be in it to win it and they will apply to one or two dream schools just to maybe have the chance of pulling the golden ticket. It's your money, your time, and your dream. You do you and let everyone else worry about themselves.

 

[Mr. Macrophage]

When i think about it, out of 100-115 seats, 30 will have those national scholarships/awards, 10 athletes, 10 miltary probably, 10 skills in arts at national/intl level, 10 research whizzes, 10 large company/nonprofit/other x factor, so that leaves only about 20-30 seats for normal people? All the while expecting everyone to have high stats and check all the boxes? So whats the point of even applying if you dont have an x factor ? you have a higher chance of winning the lottery.

You’re vastly overestimating the number of X factors. There are 30 or so T20s, so we’re talking 2,000-3,000 seats, not 100-115.

The majority of those seats go to people who are “normal”.

 

[Z_C]

I think my best advice I can give you right now is to put on sunscreen (because aging beautifully is important) and take a 45 minute-2 hour walk outside. Bring a water bottle (because aging beautifully is important). Use that time to focus on how wonderful it is to be alive and how you have a bright future and how doing some semi-strenuous muscle activity makes you just feel better for the rest of the day.

I think that being on a website like this can breed anxiety, and an unrealistic standard of comparison. Regular people attend all universities, if you think you are competitive and the financial strain is bearable, then put yourself out there, if you think you are truly not competitive then there's no reason to. Everyone is going to make that decision for themselves and the healthiest thing you can do is make your decision and let go of stress for others (because aging beautifully is important).

 

[carnitasburrito]

I think my best advice I can give you right now is to put on sunscreen (because aging beautifully is important) and take a 45 minute-2 hour walk outside. Bring a water bottle (because aging beautifully is important). Use that time to focus on how wonderful it is to be alive and how you have a bright future and how doing some semi-strenuous muscle activity makes you just feel better for the rest of the day.

I think that being on a website like this can breed anxiety, and an unrealistic standard of comparison. Regular people attend all universities, if you think you are competitive and the financial strain is bearable, then put yourself out there, if you think you are truly not competitive then there's no reason to. Everyone is going to make that decision for themselves and the healthiest thing you can do is make your decision and let go of stress for others (because aging beautifully is important).

true it doent matter

 

[carnitasburrito]

You’re vastly overestimating the number of X factors. There are 30 or so T20s, so we’re talking 2,000-3,000 seats, not 100-115.

The majority of those seats go to people who are “normal”.

i guess not for t5s proly

 

[Hollow Knight]

I honestly think for the majority of people it's actually unneccessary. The caveat there being now that Step 1 is P/F I truly do think going to those schools helps you match competitive specialties.

I had a 100th % MCAT and I didn't even bother with a place like Harvard. Harvard (for example) wouldn't do a good job of preparing me to do rural primary care.

If you want to cure cancer, yeah, shoot for the top schools. But I'm not sure how many people are actually interested in that or are just pretending they are so it's easier for them to match. And so Gma is proud at Christmas dinner......

Edit: to be clear, I'm not crapping on academic subspecialists. We need those people to move medicine forward. I'm just saying most med students I meet don't want to go be that kind of doctor, they want to be community derm or ortho or MOHS and make bank and go party. Which is OK too, and Harvard will help you do that, but you're not using that school's resources to its full potential.

 

[carnitasburrito]

I honestly think for the majority of people it's actually unneccessary. The caveat there being now that Step 1 is P/F I truly do think going to those schools helps you match competitive specialties.

I had a 100th % MCAT and I didn't even bother with a place like Harvard. Harvard (for example) wouldn't do a good job of preparing me to do rural primary care.

If you want to cure cancer, yeah, shoot for the top schools. But I'm not sure how many people are actually interested in that or are just pretending they are so it's easier for them to match. And so Gma is proud at Christmas dinner......

Edit: to be clear, I'm not crapping on academic subspecialists. We need those people to move medicine forward. I'm just saying most med students I meet don't want to go be that kind of doctor, they want to be community derm or ortho or MOHS and make bank and go party. Which is OK too, and Harvard will help you do that, but you're not using that school's resources to its full potential.

i agree most academic subspecialists are just interested w getting their names on papers, which all say the same thing. they are useless and ruin everything including medicine!

 

[AJS59]

Advice here also applies in other situations (the lottery, finding a partner, etc): "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky (Michael Scott).

So, if you have the stats (and some money to burn), give them a shot. But T20 is not the end all be all - going to one can help one's career, but not going to one will not hurt you or the arc of your career.

 

[carnitasburrito]

Advice here also applies in other situations (the lottery, finding a partner, etc): "You miss 100% of the shots you don't take" - Wayne Gretzky (Michael Scott).

So, if you have the stats (and some money to burn), give them a shot. But T20 is not the end all be all - going to one can help one's career, but not going to one will not hurt you or the arc of your career.

yuh fasho

 

[pablo213]

yuh fasho

Honestly bro apply broadly but don't be afraid to yolo at a few T20s if your stats are within range. I certainly never expected to get IIs at some of the places I did. Better to spend a few extra hundred bucks (if you have em) than live with the regret of not doing so and seeing where it could have gone IMO

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

With something like a 3.9 and 520, a thousand hours each of clinical and nonclinical volunteering, and decent LORs and essays...you're pack fodder at top 20s. The Olympic medalists, combat veterans, and professional athletes move out of the pack-fodder category and are strong contenders, but pack-fodder applicants get selected all the time and probably comprise the bulk of a class.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

When i think about it, out of 100-115 seats, 30 will have those national scholarships/awards, 10 athletes, 10 miltary probably, 10 skills in arts at national/intl level, 10 research whizzes, 10 large company/nonprofit/other x factor, so that leaves only about 20-30 seats for normal people? All the while expecting everyone to have high stats and check all the boxes? So whats the point of even applying if you dont have an x factor ? you have a higher chance of winning the lottery.

Have you talked with students at those schools to confirm this conjecture? I think you are overestimating and talking yourself into imposter syndrome which will put your chances in peril. Medical school is not an award for the accomplished; it's a calling to those committed to serve in that capacity. Believe us... we like "normal people" too.

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

Have you talked with students at those schools to confirm this conjecture? I think you are overestimating and talking yourself into imposter syndrome which will put your chances in peril. Medical school is not an award for the accomplished; it's a calling to those committed to serve in that capacity. Believe us... we like "normal people" too.

Yeah - if you didn't have business applying to top 20s, @Goro, @LizzyM, and @Moko would tell you. LM is an adcom at a top-20 school on the West Coast; she'll tell you that you don't need an Olympic medal or a Silver Star to stand a chance at her school. Most of the people she interviews - who stand a real chance at being accepted - don't even have a single first-author publication.

You need solid ECs and grades, but you don't need to be an Olympic athlete Navy SEAL combat medic just to have a shot. If you're that guy, Stanford may call YOU.

 

[differentiating]

Yeah, I was a med student at a top-20 school, and I don't think I had any "x factor". Granted, I was a waitlist admit, but still. A lot of my friends at school were in similar boats.

If you have the stats and you think a given school is a good fit for you (and vice versa), I don't think it's unreasonable to shoot your shot.

 

[ophthoaspirant]

When i think about it, out of 100-115 seats, 30 will have those national scholarships/awards, 10 athletes, 10 miltary probably, 10 skills in arts at national/intl level, 10 research whizzes, 10 large company/nonprofit/other x factor, so that leaves only about 20-30 seats for normal people? All the while expecting everyone to have high stats and check all the boxes? So whats the point of even applying if you dont have an x factor ? you have a higher chance of winning the lottery.

First of all, there are 2000+ seats in the Tier 1 (based on the latest USNWR rankings) schools. But if you are a regular white or ORM applicant, then you are competing for a smaller number of seats and it is stiff competition. Beyond sizing up your admission chances to T20 schools, you also have to be ready to deal with a very competitive environment. If you are not mentally tough, it is better to go to a Tier 2 (based on the latest USNWR rankings) medical school (small fish in a big pond vs big fish in a small pond analogy).

 

[lacrossegirl420]

The vast majority of the people at T20’s don’t really have any X factors, they were probably just well-rounded applicants. Even at a place like Harvard I highly doubt everyone who got in had some super unique X factor

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

Yeah, I was a med student at a top-20 school, and I don't think I had any "x factor". Granted, I was a waitlist admit, but still. A lot of my friends at school were in similar boats.

If you have the stats and you think a given school is a good fit for you (and vice versa), I don't think it's unreasonable to shoot your shot.

You were pack fodder. Whether you were waitlisted, admitted, or rejected honestly might depend on what the dean had for breakfast that day.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

First of all, there are 2000+ seats in the Tier 1 (based on the latest USNWR rankings) schools. But if you are a regular white or ORM applicant, then you are competing for a smaller number of seats and it is stiff competition. Beyond sizing up your admission chances to T20 schools, you also have to be ready to deal with a very competitive environment. If you are not mentally tough, it is better to go to a Tier 2 (based on the latest USNWR rankings) medical school (small fish in a big pond vs big fish in a small pond analogy).

Wait...

 

[FlowRate]

Having attended a top 3, the point is that you might still get in. I didn't have any of those "national/international" tier X factors. I did have a very strong, overall very well rounded application. There are also other "X" factors. Like a lot of top schools place some weight on having geographic diversity and accepting at least a few students NOT from ivy/ivy-equivalent undergrads. So your X factor could be that you're one of the very most competitive (app-wise) students to apply out of a smaller state in a few years.

Thinking about my classmates, I'd say maybe 50%, at most, were legit at that tier of "X factor" that you're imagining. And I think it was actually way less. More like lots of other people with very strong, very well-rounded applications.

There is actually something to be said for the "pond" analogy. Some of these top-tier academic environments include both a mix of the most amazing/wonderful people you'll ever meet and a much smaller, but notable, mix of brilliant, sociopathic sharks.

 

[carnitasburrito]

Having attended a top 3, the point is that you might still get in. I didn't have any of those "national/international" tier X factors. I did have a very strong, overall very well rounded application. There are also other "X" factors. Like a lot of top schools place some weight on having geographic diversity and accepting at least a few students NOT from ivy/ivy-equivalent undergrads. So your X factor could be that you're one of the very most competitive (app-wise) students to apply out of a smaller state in a few years.

Thinking about my classmates, I'd say maybe 50%, at most, were legit at that tier of "X factor" that you're imagining. And I think it was actually way less. More like lots of other people with very strong, very well-rounded applications.

There is actually something to be said for the "pond" analogy. Some of these top-tier academic environments include both a mix of the most amazing/wonderful people you'll ever meet and a much smaller, but notable, mix of brilliant, sociopathic sharks.

do u think having intl level recognition in my field(nonprofit) is enough to be considered good enough? i know i shouldnt compare but its my brain tendency

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

do u think having intl level recognition in my field(nonprofit) is enough to be considered good enough? i know i shouldnt compare but its my brain tendency

Yeah, that's pretty solid. At worst, you're still pack fodder; at best, you move out of pack fodder (which again, is the bulk of applicants and most of a class) and into the realm of strong contenders.

 

[carnitasburrito]

Yeah, that's pretty solid. At worst, you're still pack fodder; at best, you move out of pack fodder (which again, is the bulk of applicants and most of a class) and into the realm of strong contenders.

 

[carnitasburrito]

Yeah, that's pretty solid. At worst, you're still pack fodder; at best, you move out of pack fodder (which again, is the bulk of applicants and most of a class) and into the realm of strong contenders.

im screwed if thats average, sigh, i need to get NIH post bac and more research hopefully bumping research wil help

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

im screwed if thats average, sigh, i need to get NIH post bac and more research hopefully bumping research wil help

Stop being so neurotic. An internationally recognized nonprofit is pretty good and top tier volunteering. If you have a 3.8+, 520+, and 500+ hours of clinical experience (paid or unpaid) you should shoot your shot at top 20s. While it's hard to be in the top ten percent of competitive applicants at top-20 schools, most of a class at, say, Yale isn't Olympic medalists and military veterans and professional ballet dancers, it's pack fodder. Shoot your shot at enough top 20s, you've got a good chance of being accepted there. Good luck. With enough clinical experience and some research, your ECs will not keep you out of any school in the country.

Look at it like this: a 520 MCAT is average for Harvard...but you're not out of the running with a 519, even if you need an almost-unheard-of 526 in order to stand out there.

 

[carnitasburrito]

Stop being so neurotic. An internationally recognized nonprofit is pretty good and top tier volunteering. If you have a 3.8+, 520+, and 500+ hours of clinical experience (paid or unpaid) you should shoot your shot at top 20s. While it's hard to be in the top ten percent of competitive applicants at top-20 schools, most of a class at, say, Yale isn't Olympic medalists and military veterans and professional ballet dancers, it's pack fodder. Shoot your shot at enough top 20s, you've got a good chance of being accepted there. Good luck. With enough clinical experience and some research, your ECs will not keep you out of any school in the country.

Look at it like this: a 520 MCAT is average for Harvard...but you're not out of the running with a 519, even if you need an almost-unheard-of 526 in order to stand out there.

ok cool, to clarify, im director of one thats internationally recognized, and i created one that expanded to 7-8 cities in my home country

 

[carnitasburrito]

Having attended a top 3, the point is that you might still get in. I didn't have any of those "national/international" tier X factors. I did have a very strong, overall very well rounded application. There are also other "X" factors. Like a lot of top schools place some weight on having geographic diversity and accepting at least a few students NOT from ivy/ivy-equivalent undergrads. So your X factor could be that you're one of the very most competitive (app-wise) students to apply out of a smaller state in a few years.

Thinking about my classmates, I'd say maybe 50%, at most, were legit at that tier of "X factor" that you're imagining. And I think it was actually way less. More like lots of other people with very strong, very well-rounded applications.

There is actually something to be said for the "pond" analogy. Some of these top-tier academic environments include both a mix of the most amazing/wonderful people you'll ever meet and a much smaller, but notable, mix of brilliant, sociopathic sharks.

what things did ur classmates do to stand out?

 

[carnitasburrito]

Have you talked with students at those schools to confirm this conjecture? I think you are overestimating and talking yourself into imposter syndrome which will put your chances in peril. Medical school is not an award for the accomplished; it's a calling to those committed to serve in that capacity. Believe us... we like "normal people" too.

i just saw https://med.stanford.edu/content/da...-Faculty-Roles-2020-21-with-Class-Profile.pdf
for stanford

 

[Mr. Macrophage]

i just saw https://med.stanford.edu/content/da...-Faculty-Roles-2020-21-with-Class-Profile.pdf
for stanford

Stanford is the most research-heavy institution in the nation and even then, only half of students have a peer-reviewed publication of any authorship! This just shows how uncommon X-factors are. You will be fine! Just take a deep breath and do your best

 

[carnitasburrito]

Stanford is the most research-heavy institution in the nation and even then, only half of students have a peer-reviewed publication of any authorship! This just shows how uncommon X-factors are. You will be fine! Just take a deep breath and do your best

ok 😌

 

[carnitasburrito]

Stanford is the most research-heavy institution in the nation and even then, only half of students have a peer-reviewed publication of any authorship! This just shows how uncommon X-factors are. You will be fine! Just take a deep breath and do your best

lol most prolly arent even good authorship/journal/ manuscripts. they are tryna **** with us and faking their numbers

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

ok cool, to clarify, im director of one thats internationally recognized, and i created one that expanded to 7-8 cities in my home country

That is a genuinely good EC and something that is top tier for nonclinical volunteering and very good for leadership.
Put up a WAMC post; if you check the other boxes you might get several interviews at places like Harvard or Hopkins.

 

[carnitasburrito]

That is a genuinely good EC and something that is top tier for nonclinical volunteering and very good for leadership.
Put up a WAMC post; if you check the other boxes you might get several interviews at places like Harvard or Hopkins.

i made one easrlier but this is the details
3.8/520
Leadership:
Founder of nationally recognized nonprofit(1000+ served, featured in magazine, won international award)
Director of an intl nonprofits(1000+ served in rural areas in an african countries, got featured 10 times in news in 3 countries)
Founder of intl literary publication, published 80+ writers from 10+ countries around world

Research
4k hours over 3 years, NIH post bac and research at lab of famous bench scientist , both related to same topic(helped lead project with PI, 2 posts/intl conferences)

Nonclinical/teaching: lead teacher for immigrants, refugees, etc, for 2-3 yrs

Clinical volunteering:500 hrs over 3 years - Helped start new program with hospital director

 

[AJS59]

i made one easrlier but this is the details
3.8/520
Leadership:
Founder of nationally recognized nonprofit(1000+ served, featured in magazine, won international award)
Director of an intl nonprofits(1000+ served in rural areas in an african countries, got featured 10 times in news in 3 countries)
Founder of intl literary publication, published 80+ writers from 10+ countries around world

Research
4k hours over 3 years, NIH post bac and research at lab of famous bench scientist , both related to same topic(helped lead project with PI, 2 posts/intl conferences)

Nonclinical/teaching: lead teacher for immigrants, refugees, etc, for 2-3 yrs

Clinical volunteering:500 hrs over 3 years - Helped start new program with hospital director

I mean we'd need to know a bit more about what you've done (i.e. what does your non-profit do, what did you do for clinical volunteering), but with a background like this you'll likely have several solid shots at high tier schools.

 

[carnitasburrito]

I mean we'd need to know a bit more about what you've done (i.e. what does your non-profit do, what did you do for clinical volunteering), but with a background like this you'll likely have several solid shots at high tier schools.

A variety of things, mostly literacy and healthacre education (Served around thousand children/women), and scholarships for children in villages in country we serve, clinical is hospice volunteering

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

i made one easrlier but this is the details
3.8/520
Leadership:
Founder of nationally recognized nonprofit(1000+ served, featured in magazine, won international award)
Director of an intl nonprofits(1000+ served in rural areas in an african countries, got featured 10 times in news in 3 countries)
Founder of intl literary publication, published 80+ writers from 10+ countries around world

Research
4k hours over 3 years, NIH post bac and research at lab of famous bench scientist , both related to same topic(helped lead project with PI, 2 posts/intl conferences)

Nonclinical/teaching: lead teacher for immigrants, refugees, etc, for 2-3 yrs

Clinical volunteering:500 hrs over 3 years - Helped start new program with hospital director

You're a rock star! Very solid applicant for any school in the country, and I mean it. More than half of your list should be top 20 schools...15 top 20s and another 10 midtiers/state schools. You should get several interviews; after that, it's about the interview. You are towards the top of the pack even by Harvard's stratospheric standards. You do NOT need anything else on your application. Good luck...and hopefully, next year you'll be sitting on a Stanford acceptance. It's a definite possibility.

 

[carnitasburrito]

You're a rock star! Very solid applicant for any school in the country, and I mean it. More than half of your list should be top 20 schools...15 top 20s and another 10 midtiers/state schools. You should get several interviews; after that, it's about the interview. You are towards the top of the pack even by Harvard's stratospheric standards. You do NOT need anything else on your application. Good luck...and hopefully, next year you'll be sitting on a Stanford acceptance. It's a definite possibility.

I hope, i dont think research is strong enough for stanford honestly but still gonna apply cuz hoping nonprofit work carries me

 

[voxveritatisetlucis]

It’s possible from any Ivy League undergrad school with a medicocre GPA, MCAT, ECs as long as everything is at least slightly above average. I’ve seen it countless numbers of time

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

I hope, i dont think research is strong enough for stanford honestly but still gonna apply cuz hoping nonprofit work carries me

Most Stanford students do not have a single publication. And you do have a national/international tier X factor. DO NOT squander this by being neurotic AF in the interviews. You're a goddamn rock star; start acting like one and have some confidence. On paper? You're Harvard material. Not even kidding here.

 

[ophthoaspirant]

Stop being so neurotic. An internationally recognized nonprofit is pretty good and top tier volunteering. If you have a 3.8+, 520+, and 500+ hours of clinical experience (paid or unpaid) you should shoot your shot at top 20s. While it's hard to be in the top ten percent of competitive applicants at top-20 schools, most of a class at, say, Yale isn't Olympic medalists and military veterans and professional ballet dancers, it's pack fodder. Shoot your shot at enough top 20s, you've got a good chance of being accepted there. Good luck. With enough clinical experience and some research, your ECs will not keep you out of any school in the country.

Look at it like this: a 520 MCAT is average for Harvard...but you're not out of the running with a 519, even if you need an almost-unheard-of 526 in order to stand out there.

If average is 520, admitted ORMs probably have 525+ and admitted white students also have scores close to that.

 

[AJS59]

If average is 520, admitted ORMs probably have 525+ and admitted white students also have scores close to that.

Applicants are more than their MCAT scores. Also it is wildly presumptuous to assume that to get an average score of 520 that all ORMs score above 520 and URMs are scoring below 520

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

If average is 520, admitted ORMs probably have 525+ and admitted white students also have scores close to that.

You can look at the percentiles for MCAT scores...come on. I don't care whether you're URM or not - a 520 is a solid score for any school in the country. 525 is at or close to the 90th percentile.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

If average is 520, admitted ORMs probably have 525+ and admitted white students also have scores close to that.

Where is this nugget in the AAMC data tables for matriculants?

 

[Mr.Smile12]

This discussion inspired today's SDN article. Thanks everyone!

Finding Your Greatest Common Factors with Successful Students - SDN

The Student Doctor Network provides free tools, resources, and advising services to help students become health professionals.

www.studentdoctor.net

 

[ophthoaspirant]

Applicants are more than their MCAT scores. Also it is wildly presumptuous to assume that to get an average score of 520 that all ORMs score above 520 and URMs are scoring below 520

I know someone that is in the Harvard program and didn’t pull out the data from nowhere.

 

[ophthoaspirant]

Applicants are more than their MCAT scores. Also it is wildly presumptuous to assume that to get an average score of 520 that all ORMs score above 520 and URMs are scoring below 520

When you are talking averages, some score over the average and some under. How did you conclude that I said that URMs are scoring below 520. Some probably are, some are scoring higher.

Nobody is saying that 520 is not a great score. Also, nobody is saying that you have to get your MD from Harvard to obtain great medical education and become an excellent physician.

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

I know someone that is in the Harvard program and didn’t pull out the data from nowhere.

525 seems a little high. Let's assume that you're right - which is a...charitable assumption, but let's roll with it for math's sake.

How much of Harvard's class is URM? Say...25 percent? Let's call it half. That means the median ORM matriculant is at the 75th percentile for MCAT. That is probably 523. Several years ago, a 526 put you in the 90th percentile at every school in the country, and I don't think the distribution has changed that much. WashU still salivates over high MCAT scorers, too.

Buy MSAR and again stop being so freaking neurotic, with a 3.8+, 520+, and your ECs you stand a chance at any school in the country, Harvard, Yale, and Stanford included. LizzyM is an adcom at a school of that caliber and she will wholeheartedly agree with what I am saying. A 3.8/520 won't turn heads but it'll make you pack fodder, and your ECs are decidedly not pack fodder level.

Why are you so dead-set on attending a prestigious school? Resources? To impress people? Because you've wanted nothing more than to be a neurosurgeon, or a researcher-physician, since you were 13? Because you want to do something that a top-20 education can provide you with, like healthcare reform or something like that? Maybe there's some impostor syndrome at play here - get help for that, you are a very strong student with an excellent CV but your neuroticism is likely to sink you in the interviews you are EXTREMELY likely to get.

 

[carnitasburrito]

525 seems a little high. Let's assume that you're right - which is a...charitable assumption, but let's roll with it for math's sake.

How much of Harvard's class is URM? Say...25 percent? Let's call it half. That means the median ORM matriculant is at the 75th percentile for MCAT. That is probably 523. Several years ago, a 526 put you in the 90th percentile at every school in the country, and I don't think the distribution has changed that much. WashU still salivates over high MCAT scorers, too.

Buy MSAR and again stop being so freaking neurotic, with a 3.8+, 520+, and your ECs you stand a chance at any school in the country, Harvard, Yale, and Stanford included. LizzyM is an adcom at a school of that caliber and she will wholeheartedly agree with what I am saying. A 3.8/520 won't turn heads but it'll make you pack fodder, and your ECs are decidedly not pack fodder level.

Why are you so dead-set on attending a prestigious school? Resources? To impress people? Because you've wanted nothing more than to be a neurosurgeon, or a researcher-physician, since you were 13? Because you want to do something that a top-20 education can provide you with, like healthcare reform or something like that? Maybe there's some impostor syndrome at play here - get help for that, you are a very strong student with an excellent CV but your neuroticism is likely to sink you in the interviews you are EXTREMELY likely to get.

lol that wasnt my comment, but yeah i agree. im slowly caring less and less about this

 

[carnitasburrito]

This discussion inspired today's SDN article. Thanks everyone!

Finding Your Greatest Common Factors with Successful Students - SDN

The Student Doctor Network provides free tools, resources, and advising services to help students become health professionals.

www.studentdoctor.net

what category you say getting featured in multiple news outlets falls under?

 

[MrPuff]

Category: Person of interest.