Applying after PhD

[Creightonite]

Well, my college AMCAS GPA (which is lower than my college GPA by 0.2 points because AMCAS does not care about B+, only A, B, C) So I was wondering how much my non-science GPA will matter after being thru grad school for 4-5 years? I would really h8 to take any additional classes especially since they wont raise my GPA that much. Any advice on this?

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[DCDAWG]

Well, my college AMCAS GPA (which is lower than my college GPA by 0.2 points because AMCAS does not care about B+, only A, B, C) is 3.1 in non-science and 3.2. I am close to being done with MY PhD in science field with a gpa of 3.60, still have to take the MCAT. So I was wondering how much my non-science GPA will matter after being thru grad school for 4-5 years? I would really h8 to take any additional classes especially since they wont raise my GPA that much. Any advice on this?

I thought AMCAS coutned B+.

 

[Creightonite]

Yeah, but in my school B is 3.0, B+ is 3.5 and A is 4.0.... In AMCAS it is different so my grade comes out to be lower.

 

[Scottish Chap]

Well, my college AMCAS GPA (which is lower than my college GPA by 0.2 points because AMCAS does not care about B+, only A, B, C) is 3.1 in non-science and 3.2. I am close to being done with MY PhD in science field with a gpa of 3.60, still have to take the MCAT. So I was wondering how much my non-science GPA will matter after being thru grad school for 4-5 years? I would really h8 to take any additional classes especially since they wont raise my GPA that much. Any advice on this?

As a general rule, most medical schools are going to care more about your undergraduate degree grades than graduate school. I've seen this many times. Now, that said, they will see your graduate school GPA and it's good. More than anything, your Ph.D. plus publications will get the interest of research-focused schools, so apply widely. You can't change your past, but you can choose what institutions you want to target your application to and how you pitch your application. Good luck!

 

[dr.z]

As a general rule, most medical schools are going to care more about your undergraduate degree grades than graduate school. I've seen this many times. Now, that said, they will see your graduate school GPA and it's good. More than anything, your Ph.D. plus publications will get the interest of research-focused schools, so apply widely. You can't change your past, but you can choose what institutions you want to target your application to and how you pitch your application. Good luck!

It's true. When it comes to numbers they focus more on your undergrad record. You can overcome this by preparing really well for the MCAT.

 

[Creightonite]

well, I might take MCAT this winter and be ready to apply for 2008. Not sure if i get done with school to be ready to apply for 2007.

 

[MasonPrehealth]

Responding to Creightonite

I'll have to check (as I step into my position), but suffice to say, if it were me, I'd pay attention to your undergraduate GPA for the purposes of calculating your science GPA. That said, because you are getting a Ph.D. in the sciences, you have shown your ability to take on more complex scientific concepts in your field. Now I don't know what science field you're in: it has been a while since you took organic, and I'm sure that if you were in a molecular biology program that your recognition of physics or chemistry concepts may need some brushing up for the MCAT.

The other thing to remember is that you really should go to your undergraduate institution's premedical advisor for advice. (You could use your graduate institution's premed advisor for their undergrads for advice, but most advisors I know work with undergraduate alumni.) Really plan out what you think it will take to successfully target and apply to the schools you want (meaning, read the AAMC MSAR book).

 

[chef_NU]

Dude you need to rock the MCAT. 35+ to really have a decent shot at US allo schools

 

[PhDtoDO]

I did apply DO and MD....also took the August MCAT.

Although I got a 28 a few years ago, I needed to retake it and didn't do as well.

I do recommend applying to a lot of schools...25+ just so you don't have to apply again.

I know many PhDs who've gone on to med school, state or top 5.

You should do fine. Just do your best on the MCAT and take it early so you get early interviews.

I also don't know any PhDs who didn't get in (although one colleague started applying in December and had to reapply the next year).

By the way, 5 interviews... 2 offers and one waitlist.

But you only need one!

-s

 

[QofQuimica]

Dude you need to rock the MCAT. 35+ to really have a decent shot at US allo schools

Not necessarily. OP, it depends on what your goals are as far as med schools. Your AMCAS GPA is above 3.0, so you should be ok at schools that automatically screen. (People get in trouble if they have UG GPAs below 3.0 at some of the screening schools b/c they get automatically cut.) If you want to go to your state school, you should really contact the admissions office there and talk to them. Bring a copy of your CV, your transcripts, etc. If you haven't been doing this already, you also need to start doing something like shadowing that you can use to "prove" that you know about medicine and what is required for you to change careers. I think that it is also helpful if you volunteer for a cause you believe in, but don't do it just to pad your CV, because they'll smell your fakeness a mile away.

If you want to go to a top research school, you may have difficulty, because the problem is that you are competing with lots of other people who have much higher stats than yours AND who have done significant amounts of research and other incredible things. Don't delude yourself into thinking that just because the trads are in their early twenties that they won't have done as much research as you have; they may not have PhDs, but I met kids who were a year or two out of college and had published half a dozen papers. I think if you want to compete with them then you will need a superior MCAT score like chef_nu said, and you will also need excellent LORs, ECs, and essays. My opinion only; take it for what you think it's worth, and good luck.

 

[relentless11]

Don't delude yourself into thinking that just because the trads are in their early twenties that they won't have done as much research as you have; they may not have PhDs, but I met kids who were a year or two out of college and had published half a dozen papers.

I can vouch for that. As an undergrad I had 13 publications. When I graduated I i had 15 or so. HOWEVER, my GPA sucked (didn't apply to med school), but I can guarantee that there are a few UG superstars out there that have both high GPA and high numbers of pubs, not to mention research experience. Those are the ones that will end up getting into a MD/PhD program or something..haha.

Creightonite,

I'm in the same boat as you are, pretty much as everyone have said, destroy the MCAT. Time permitting, and if your program allows it, you could take undergrad courses as electives. However I think you will get more value out of getting a 35+ on the MCAT since you are nearing completion of your PhD.
I'm only a 1st year PhD student, so trying to take undergrad courses along with my grad requirements. Apparently, according to our med school's director of admissions, taking these UG courses still counts as post-bacc. Anyway good luck with your PhD, and the MCAT

 

[QofQuimica]

I can vouch for that. As an undergrad I had 13 publications. When I graduated I i had 15 or so. HOWEVER, my GPA sucked (didn't apply to med school), but I can guarantee that there are a few UG superstars out there that have both high GPA and high numbers of pubs, not to mention research experience. Those are the ones that will end up getting into a MD/PhD program or something..haha.

That is really impressive, relentless! What were you doing that you published so many papers???

 

[Creightonite]

^^^

probably not all of them are 1st authors, lol. I do not think the number of the papers matter that much. It is not the quantity that matters and I think most people understand that.

 

[Creightonite]

and i gave up on getting any advice from my advisor from my undergrad. Also, I am an out-of-state person no matter where i apply.

 

[relentless11]

That is really impressive, relentless! What were you doing that you published so many papers???

Nah, I'm just really lucky. 100% of my pubs were due to having a PI (now my major professor too) willing to give lowly undergrads the opportunity to take responsibility to run a study and write a manuscript.

The majority of my publications were derived from industry funded clinical evaluation studies. Our lab mainly gets private funding rather than grants, so we probably go through 3-4 studies a year. These studies involved some sort of laboratory or clinical diagnostic instrument that needed to be evaluated against another instrument. Usually got a publication or two from each study I only had about 4 that were first authors back then. While the rest were as 2nd author.

All that work is paying off big time in grad school. But I think the biggest reward is helping out current undergrads who are working in my lab. I don't know, its just fun to teach these guys and gals on the ins and outs of research.

Now if only I had an undergrad GPA >3.0

^^^

I do not think the number of the papers matter that much. It is not the quantity that matters and I think most people understand that.

I definately agree with that. Really I don't think my publications will matter too much when applying to med school due to UG GPA. However those pubs were a deciding factor in getting into grad school. Oh well, that was like 2003. My publication rate has significantly dropped since then. Focusing on some of my pet projects now..haha. Recently got rejected from NEJM too.

 

[dr.z]

^^^

probably not all of them are 1st authors, lol. I do not think the number of the papers matter that much. It is not the quantity that matters and I think most people understand that.

Sometimes quantity can help too.

 

[QofQuimica]

Sometimes quantity can help too.

I agree. Quality and quantity both matter. If I saw a CV from a new college graduate who had 15 total peer-reviewed pubs with 4 first-authors, I'd be way impressed. That's more than many new PhD graduates have. Kudos to you, relentless. How far below a 3.0 are you? Have you thought about doing a post bac and/or talked to med schools about your situation?

Edit: Ok, I see you said earlier that you did talk to the med school and you're taking undergrad coursework already.

 

[Creightonite]

IT really depends on the field you are working in. For example, i work in moleculr biology field so my boss says that the goal should be to get out a paper a year then we are doing realy really well. Just depends on how hard your project is. To say the least most of the clinical stuff is pretty straight forward comparing to what us basic science guys are facing.

 

[relentless11]

Edit: Ok, I see you said earlier that you did talk to the med school and you're taking undergrad coursework already.

Ya know funny thing is. I once asked the people over at UCSF about grad vs. undergrad GPA. I even threw out the idea "should I do post-bacc after a masters or PhD to improve my UG GPA?". The lady replied "ya know, i never heard of anyone doing that..." Hahaha. But yea, lucked out with this program, they are quite flexible. My friend in the Pharm/Tox graduate program is pretty much too busy to take undergrad courses.

But we'll see. I'm trying to figure out how to balance UG classes with thesis research after this quarter. So hopefully it'll be enough to get my UG GPA up to 3.0. If not then they'll just have to settle with a good GPA trend, and understand that I had to do my thesis. We'll see

 

[exigente chica]

where do you find your AMCAS gpa? I just entered all my classes, but don't see a GPA?

Thanx

 

[QofQuimica]

where do you find your AMCAS gpa? I just entered all my classes, but don't see a GPA?

Thanx

You won't see a GPA until after you submit your app. They'll calculate it for you. Sometimes it's different than what your college calculates, depending on what policies they follow.