Are DO schools "easier" to get into?

[UniBoy5]

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I've heard that 1 in 5 applicants get into DO schools, whereas 1 in 4 get into MD schools, yet the GPA and MCAT averages for matriculants are lower for DO schools. So is that a lower percentage of applicants get into DO schools because many more apply and many of them have weak credentials?

 

[wr8487]

Yeah, i think that stat is due to fact that more people with weaker stats apply to DO schools. I dont think most people would even bother applying to a MD school unless they have a 3.5+ GPA or a 28 ob the MCAT. Thats just my guess though.

 

[elektroshok]

I've heard that 1 in 5 applicants get into DO schools, whereas 1 in 4 get into MD schools, yet the GPA and MCAT averages for matriculants are lower for DO schools. So is that a lower percentage of applicants get into DO schools because many more apply and many of them have weak credentials?

 

[J ROD]

I've heard that 1 in 5 applicants get into DO schools, whereas 1 in 4 get into MD schools, yet the GPA and MCAT averages for matriculants are lower for DO schools. So is that a lower percentage of applicants get into DO schools because many more apply and many of them have weak credentials?

interesting.....

 

[tndoc12]

I would say that these stats vary from region to region. However, if they are indeed an average it makes sense to formulate that more applicants with a weaker and sub-par academic record apply to DO schools than do MD schools because Osteopathic schools place more of an emphasis on the "whole applicant" and not merely grades. Hope this helps.

 

[Everglide]

This thread is going to end up in a flame war but here goes anyway:

The acceptance rate for MD schools is not 1 in 4, it's more like 1 in 2 (46.1% to be exact) of 114,712 applicants.

and yes, DO averages are lower than MD MCAT/GPA averages. Take it for whatever it's worth to you.

 

[Col Kurtz]

This thread is going to end up in a flame war but here goes anyway:

The acceptance rate for MD schools is not 1 in 4, it's more like 1 in 2 (46.1% to be exact) of 114,712 applicants.

and yes, DO averages are lower than MD MCAT/GPA averages. Take it for whatever it's worth to you.

I was just about to post the aggregate data from the AAMC website that says what you said.
http://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/table24-mcatgpa-grid-3yrs-app-accpt.htm
My guess is that part of the reason for the difference in acceptance rates is that there are more Allopathic schools than there are Osteopathic schools. As more Osteopathic schools come online, the acceptance rate will go up as long as the number of applications doesn't increase at a faster rate.

 

[EMS5]

Of course there is the occasional person who is genuinely interested in the osteopathic philosophy (myself), regardless of their ability to get into an allopathic school

 

[halekulani]

they're easier if you have decent stats.

 

[DocMcCoy]

Yeah, i think that stat is due to fact that more people with weaker stats apply to DO schools. I dont think most people would even bother applying to a MD school unless they have a 3.5+ GPA or a 28 ob the MCAT. Thats just my guess though.

Oh dear, here we go...

Yes, DO schools have slightly lower MCAT and GPA averages overall than MD schools, but only slightly with the gap narrowing each application year. Obviously there are some exceptions to the rule (most notably Carrib MD) and it may be easier for a particular applicant to get into their state MD school than a top out of state DO school, or vice-versa.

From my experience, DO schools tend to be more non-traditional applicant friendly than your average MD school.

Bottom line is each program regardless of MD or DO is looking for something in particular. You can receive a quality education regardless of the letters that wind up at the end of your name. If you are able to get into multiple DO schools you are good enough to to apply to, and probably get accepted to, multiple MD schools as well.

 

[JaggerPlate]

Oh dear, here we go...

Yes, DO schools have slightly lower MCAT and GPA averages overall than MD schools, but only slightly with the gap narrowing each application year. Obviously there are some exceptions to the rule (most notably Carrib MD) and it may be easier for a particular applicant to get into their state MD school than a top out of state DO school, or vice-versa.

From my experience, DO schools tend to be more non-traditional applicant friendly than your average MD school.

Bottom line is each program regardless of MD or DO is looking for something in particular. You can receive a quality education regardless of the letters that wind up at the end of your name. If you are able to get into multiple DO schools you are good enough to to apply to, and probably get accepted to, multiple MD schools as well.

Wow ... nice response. Nothing much I can think to add.

 

[LadyWolverine]

However, if they are indeed an average it makes sense to formulate that more applicants with a weaker and sub-par academic record apply to DO schools than do MD schools because Osteopathic schools place more of an emphasis on the "whole applicant" and not merely grades. Hope this helps.

Oh, please. This argument makes me want to throw up as much as CAM practicioners who claim to treat the "whole patient" and not just the disease. MD schools emphasize the "whole applicant" just as much as any school.

Also, I think it's funny that people will defend DO schools' reasons for having lower matriculating student stats tooth and nail, yet when an applicant with a sub-par application/stats posts a "What are my chances?" thread in pre-allo, everyone advises them to "consider adding DO schools" - I always took that to mean that it was because it would boost their chances of a successful admission...?

 

[scapermoya]

Oh, please. This argument makes me want to throw up as much as CAM practicioners who claim to treat the "whole patient" and not just the disease. MD schools emphasize the "whole applicant" just as much as any school.

Also, I think it's funny that people will defend DO schools' reasons for having lower matriculating student stats tooth and nail, yet when an applicant with a sub-par application/stats posts a "What are my chances?" thread in pre-allo, everyone advises them to "consider adding DO schools" - I always took that to mean that it was because it would boost their chances of a successful admission...?

👍

 

[JaggerPlate]

Oh, please. This argument makes me want to throw up as much as CAM practicioners who claim to treat the "whole patient" and not just the disease. MD schools emphasize the "whole applicant" just as much as any school.

Also, I think it's funny that people will defend DO schools' reasons for having lower matriculating student stats tooth and nail, yet when an applicant with a sub-par application/stats posts a "What are my chances?" thread in pre-allo, everyone advises them to "consider adding DO schools" - I always took that to mean that it was because it would boost their chances of a successful admission...?

1. I do agree that it is silly to act like MD + 1 because DOs 'treat the whole patient,' etc, when many MD schools subscribe to a very similar philosophy, and of course, want the best patient care. This attitude alienates people.

2. I don't think citing what people do in pre-med anything hold much water. Pre-meds on these boards are nuts and many times wildly misinformed.

3. DO school stats should be reviewed on a case by case basis. In my opinion, due to newer DO schools, quick expansion, etc, there is really a tiered system, which leads to a wide variety of matriculating stats. DMU has a 2012 average of 3.7/ (near) 28 MCAT, Western University boasts a 3.6/28+, and UMDNJ (the DO school) supposedly had a 29 average last year (I can pull up proof for this, but realllly don't want to at 1:30am). Now, this is 'cherry picking' I suppose, but the point is that it is pretty close to the 3.5-3.6/30-31 AAMC avg.

Personally, I'm attending a DO school next year with a 30++ MCAT, and met many others on the interview trail doing the same. I think the gaps will continue to close (though maybe not as fast as could be due to MD class size increase and more DO schools opening), and that both MD and DO schools will start to see a lot of cross over in the applicants they interview. However, stats wise it may seem 'easier' to get into a DO program, but getting into medical school anywhere is far, far from easy.

 

[Narmerguy]

Eh, not everything being said here is necessarily true but I'll leave it at that.

 

[DocMcCoy]

1. I do agree that it is silly to act like MD + 1 because DOs 'treat the whole patient,' etc, when many MD schools subscribe to a very similar philosophy, and of course, want the best patient care. This attitude alienates people.

2. I don't think citing what people do in pre-med anything hold much water. Pre-meds on these boards are nuts and many times wildly misinformed.

3. DO school stats should be reviewed on a case by case basis. In my opinion, due to newer DO schools, quick expansion, etc, there is really a tiered system, which leads to a wide variety of matriculating stats. DMU has a 2012 average of 3.7/ (near) 28 MCAT, Western University boasts a 3.6/28+, and UMDNJ (the DO school) supposedly had a 29 average last year (I can pull up proof for this, but realllly don't want to at 1:30am). Now, this is 'cherry picking' I suppose, but the point is that it is pretty close to the 3.5-3.6/30-31 AAMC avg.

Personally, I'm attending a DO school next year with a 30++ MCAT, and met many others on the interview trail doing the same. I think the gaps will continue to close (though maybe not as fast as could be due to MD class size increase and more DO schools opening), and that both MD and DO schools will start to see a lot of cross over in the applicants they interview. However, stats wise it may seem 'easier' to get into a DO program, but getting into medical school anywhere is far, far from easy.

👍

 

[faith2]

DO schools are easier to get in because of what they want in a applicant. This trend is changing because as more people apply the stats are increasing.At the end of the day you are still a dr the only reason i choose md after both acceptances is one OMM seems difficult and you have to pass it on the DO boards but as an ER or IM physician in a hospital i dont see me using it (i could use it on my man after he worked hard all day) and two my ego wants to see MD beside my name

 

[faith2]

I aplogize... I meant in order to recieve a high score on the COMLEX, and I would want to pass the PE.

You don't have to pass OMM on your boards. However, it is representative of approximately 20% of the COMLEX score meaning if you want to do extremely well on COMLEX you better know your OMM. You need to know it for your PE exam, however.

 

[DRMRL]

DO is more non-traditional applicant friendly than MD. Also, I know a guy who has a 3.73 and 25 and got an interview at three D.O. schools and two M.D. schools. You never know. 😳😳

 

[jphwki82]

D.O. schools have a lower acceptance rate compared to M.D. schools due to the fact that there are fewer Osteopathic programs.

 

[Hoody]

D.O. schools have a lower acceptance rate compared to M.D. schools due to the fact that there are fewer Osteopathic programs.

this.


its funny how virtually every other response in this thread failed to address the OPs question.


Pre meds just like to argue. Or hear themselves speak (post). Probably both.

 

[Old Grunt]

Yes.

The numbers don't lie and there is quantitative data to compare here.

That's not to take away from the degree and the people that are DOs, but it is just a simple fact.

There are some exceptions. I would argue that Michigan State's DO program is harder to get into than several MD schools. However, those are the exception and not the rule.

 

[penguin24]

Also, DO schools let you repeat a course and only include the higher grade, while MD schools include both grades for GPA calculation. This would tend to muddy the waters comparing GPA's.

 

[filhodeinferno]

I don't really see how this always ends up being an argument. It is a FACT that it is easier to get into DO. My friends with lesser GPAs and MCAT scores 10 points lower than mine had interviewed at and been accepted to several DO schools before I had even interviewed at the MD schools I applied to. It is a FACT that many DO applicants only apply DO because their stats are too low for MD. Sure, there is the occasional person who actually prefers the osteopathic route, but those are far and few in between.
I don't know why we debate about these obvious disparities.

 

[Hoody]

I don't really see how this always ends up being an argument. It is a FACT that it is easier to get into DO. My friends with lesser GPAs and MCAT scores 10 points lower than mine had interviewed at and been accepted to several DO schools before I had even interviewed at the MD schools I applied to. It is a FACT that many DO applicants only apply DO because their stats are too low for MD. Sure, there is the occasional person who actually prefers the osteopathic route, but those are far and few in between.
I don't know why we debate about these obvious disparities.

you should be banned from ALL medical schools permanently based on this response alone....

in other words, WHOOSH!!!!!!

 

[filhodeinferno]

Also, DO schools let you repeat a course and only include the higher grade, while MD schools include both grades for GPA calculation. This would tend to muddy the waters comparing GPA's.

you should be banned from ALL medical schools permanently based on this response alone....

in other words, WHOOSH!!!!!!

Care to explain why? These are just the facts as I see them in my world. I have nothing against DO schools or DO physicians. I would have gone that route had my test scores been lower.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

Bottom line is each program regardless of MD or DO is looking for something in particular. You can receive a quality education regardless of the letters that wind up at the end of your name. If you are able to get into multiple DO schools you are good enough to to apply to, and probably get accepted to, multiple MD schools as well.

I disagree. I believe a 28/3.6 could get into numerous DO schools, while being very lucky to get into even one MD school. There is a significant gap between MD and DO standards and that's why we've all heard on this board (at least 1 billion times) "just apply DO because you have no real chance at an allopathic school" when somebody with less than stellar stats asks.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

Also, I think it's funny that people will defend DO schools' reasons for having lower matriculating student stats tooth and nail, yet when an applicant with a sub-par application/stats posts a "What are my chances?" thread in pre-allo, everyone advises them to "consider adding DO schools" - I always took that to mean that it was because it would boost their chances of a successful admission...?

Exactly. Everyone knows it, everyone believes it, I think most people are just afraid to be so blunt.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

Care to explain why? These are just the facts as I see them in my world. I have nothing against DO schools or DO physicians. I would have gone that route had my test scores been lower.

Those are the facts in everyone's world, some people are just in denial.

 

[Hoody]

I disagree. I believe a 28/3.6 could get into numerous DO schools, while being very lucky to get into even one MD school. There is a significant gap between MD and DO standards and that's why we've all heard on this board (at least 1 billion times) "just apply DO because you have no real chance at an allopathic school" when somebody with less than stellar stats asks.

You hear it a billion times because posters on SDN have an uncanny ability to regurgitate anything they've read on here before..even if its not necessarily the truth. The OPs question had been correctly addressed (tho it took 20 some responses) yet you all keep posting the same BS. Good job. Reading skills are substandard too? or you just like to hear yourself post?

Med students, accepted med students, pre meds, posters on SDN =/= smart. or truth.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

Have to agree. I had a 3.5 and 29 and heard nothing from any Allo schools I applied to except Jefferson (very, very, very late in the cycle).

Yeah i've got a lot of "borderline" friends like that and they all found instant success after submitting their AACOMAS.

Instant success being interview invites.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

You hear it a billion times because posters on SDN have an uncanny ability to regurgitate anything they've read on here before..even if its not necessarily the truth. The OPs question had been correctly addressed (tho it took 20 some responses) yet you all keep posting the same BS. Good job. Reading skills are substandard too? or you just like to hear yourself post?

Med students, accepted med students, pre meds, posters on SDN =/= smart. or truth.

Yeah, because once a thread starts there are no arguments that take off besides EXACTLY what the OP asked. Have you ever been on a message board? Arguments usually take off in every direction, let it go.

As for what i said and what i quoted everyone else as saying: it's said because it's true. If you're blind to the fact that DO schools have significantly lower admissions standards (GPA/MCAT wise), then you shouldn't even be responding to my post. You lack the most basic of information.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

Yes. I was done with the osteopathic process the same day allopathic students were finding out their 1st acceptances. My interview/acceptance window lasted approximately 3-4 weeks. I'm happy, so that's all that matters.

Exactly 👍

 

[Hoody]

Yeah, because once a thread starts there are no arguments that take off besides EXACTLY what the OP asked.

only if you let it....good job. go hijack some other threads while your at it.

Have you ever been on a message board?

No. Never.

Arguments usually take off in every direction, let it go.

I'll let it go if you try to focus.

As for what i said and what i quoted everyone else as saying: it's said because it's true. If you're blind to the fact that DO schools have significantly lower admissions standards (GPA/MCAT wise), then you shouldn't even be responding to my post. You lack the most basic of information.

its not really about admissions standards. its more about acceptance rates. The OP brushed on standards after initially asking about acceptance rates and like clockwork, it turned into a bitch fest about MD vs. DO regarding GPA/MCAT. You lack the most basic insight.....common sense too. And?

 

[JaggerPlate]

I disagree. I believe a 28/3.6 could get into numerous DO schools, while being very lucky to get into even one MD school. There is a significant gap between MD and DO standards and that's why we've all heard on this board (at least 1 billion times) "just apply DO because you have no real chance at an allopathic school" when somebody with less than stellar stats asks.

The reason why there is so much argument on SDN is because it's really not as cut and dry as people would like it to be. The 2.8/3.6 may leave you SOL for private MD schools, but this could definitely not be the case for state MD schools. I know a guy in Ohio who has an MD interview with a 3.3/28. I also know a guy in CA who was waitlisted at his top choice UC with a 4.0/39, but had interviews and acceptances at Harvard and Yale. This tells me that there is a difference between private and public MD stats, and also that people in certain states get bigger slack due to state schools than others. If my first friend with the 3.3/28 was from CA, I can only assume he'd be SOL for state schools, but could have some luck with DOs, opposed to living in a different state and snagging the public MD interview. It's not a formulaic issue, and if you look over the entire spectrum, there is probably a lot of stat overlap. However, I don't think it's an issue either side needs to get enraged over, nor do I think people repeating SDN catch phrases adds much validity to an argument.

 

[Hoody]

A few posts addressed the first part, many posts addressed the second part.

yeah, got it. those with any common sense realize that acceptance rates to DO schools has nothing to do with lower stats but rather the amount of people applying for X number of seats to a very limited number of programs. Guess the majority couldn't figure/filter that out? 😕

SDN. We's so smart's.

 

[SenseiDoc19]

Yeah i've got a lot of "borderline" friends like that and they all found instant success after submitting their AACOMAS.

Instant success being interview invites.

Yea I had a 3.6 and a 28. Three DO acceptances (top tier) and no MD. Sure I would have liked some love form the MD side but because my state has high admission standards (in TX I feel like those sats would gain acceptance) and because I was not a disadvantaged student, I did not. Does that mean I am not as smart as those that are currently attending those very schools with similar stats to mine? I'd like to think not. I consider the school i will be attending next year (PCOM) to be one of the top osteopathic schools and on par (both education and rotations) with a lot of middle to lower tier MD schools. As a general question to the SDN community, would I be wrong to assume this? This does not really address the OP except to say that yes osteopathic schools do have slightly lower admission standards but does not mean they will be any less sucessfull as future docs. Just giving my experiance in this whole process.

 

[filhodeinferno]

yeah, got it. those with any common sense realize that acceptance rates to DO schools has nothing to do with lower stats but rather the amount of people applying for X number of seats to a very limited number of programs. Guess the majority couldn't figure/filter that out? 😕

SDN. We's so smart's.

Lighten up.

 

[Hoody]

Lighten up.

wise up.

 

[filhodeinferno]

wise up.

🙂 My posts are soley based on the things I've seen. Lets just agree to disagree without insulting each other, eh?

 

[Hoody]

🙂 My posts are soley based on the things I've seen.

which must mean they are true and/or applicable to everyone. bingo. more common sense posting...where were we again? oh yeah, arguing that low stats are the reason for current DO acceptance rates.

 

[filhodeinferno]

which must mean they are true and/or applicable to everyone. bingo. more common sense posting...where were we again? oh yeah, arguing that low stats are the reason for current DO acceptance rates.

I'm sorry for taking this thread off track but I'm just so amused by your hostility.

 

[Hoody]

I'm sorry for taking this thread off track but I'm just so amused by your hostility.

yes. common sense/truth = hostility.

you're on quite a role today....hopefully the U adcom isn't reading this thread eh?

 

[JaggerPlate]

Countdown to lock ...

10

 

[filhodeinferno]

yes. common sense/truth = hostility.

you're on quite a role today....hopefully the U adcom isn't reading this thread eh?

Yeah I don't think I've said anything too incriminating...have we met over on that board?

 

[insane]

+1

Flamesuit on!

 

[elektroshok]

Wait,

I thought it was pretty common knowledge it was easier to get in to chiropractor school than medical school??

 

[YouNeverKnow22]

yes they are.

 

[Old Grunt]

yeah, got it. those with any common sense realize that acceptance rates to DO schools has nothing to do with lower stats but rather the amount of people applying for X number of seats to a very limited number of programs. Guess the majority couldn't figure/filter that out? 😕

SDN. We's so smart's.

I am not trying to incite this issue, but I am not following your logic. How would a limited number of seats not correlate to stats? If anything the lower the number of seats, the higher the stats should be.

The whole supply and demand thing.

At any rate, the OP didn't ask about acceptance rates. He asked if it was easier to get into a DO school.

All things being equal, you can't really argue that, with average lower stats, DO programs are as tough to get into as MD programs. My personal stats weren't the greatest, and I am not a "stat Nazi" that believes those are the only things that predict who will and will not be a good Medical Student. However, as it stands, they are the only quantitative measure of performance to answer this question.

Everyone has anecdotes about this person with stellar numbers who got wait-listed at a bunch of prestigious schools or that person with less than stellar numbers who got in. However, on the whole, you can really only consider the numbers.

Again, I am just talking about the admissions process here, not the quality of the degree.

 

[Narmerguy]

yes. common sense/truth = hostility.

you're on quite a role today....hopefully the U adcom isn't reading this thread eh?

Calm the **** down. You've been whining and complaining this entire thread.