Are doctors public servants?

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ChrisMack390

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I want to use a phrase like "commitment to public service" in my personal statement. Many of my ECs are directed at underserved urban communities, and my PS is mostly about wanting to work with such communities. Is this OK to refer to as public service, or does that imply that I don't understand the American medical system?

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I was asking this in part because I had used community service like 2 sentences before this one. I see that my concerns about the phrase public are warranted though, so I'll think of something else.
 
I'm going to say yes. When was the last time you saw a doctor's strike?

Haha. I guess not ALL doctors are public servants, but some are? So then it is OK to refer to an interest in public service as a reason for wanting to be a doctor? This would fit nicely with my app as I come from a long line of military/police officers and plan to use 1st gen college status for my diversity essays. I would also love to do NHSC or similar for at least 4 years after residency.
 
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Sure!

Haha. I guess not ALL doctors are public servants, but some are? So then it is OK to refer to an interest in public service as a reason for wanting to be a doctor? This would fit nicely with my app as I come from a long line of military/police officers and plan to use 1st gen college status for my diversity essays.
 
Some people seem to think physicians are public servants and that our work should be free to all.
That is most definitely not the case.


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Il Destriero
Someone is dying and I have the knowledge to help that person? No money? Not my problem haha :nod:
 
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even when it snows or something, people like doctors need to be there at the hospital and not just doctors but many other professions likewise. It is a heavy responsibility but made less heavy when you love doing it and consider it your duty. Just like people protecting this country.
 
Someone is dying and I have to knowledge to help that person. No money? Not my problem haha :nod:
The US infrastructure is falling apart and we are 17 trillion dollars in debt, I have a construction company and 30 years experience building roads and bridges. Donate my team, time and experience for cost? **** no. Your problem.
150% and a 30% contingency is my starting offer, maybe then we can talk.


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Il Destriero
 
The US infrastructure is falling apart and we are 17 trillion dollars in debt, I have a construction company and 30 years experience building roads and bridges. Donate my team, time and experience for cost? **** no. Your problem.
150% and a 30% contingency is my starting offer, maybe then we can talk.


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Il Destriero

You are about to be seated at an entertainment venue when a fellow audience member goes into cardiac arrest. What do you do? Is a wallet biopsy necessary before offering assistance? I do think that there is a moral obligation to help those in mortal danger, particularly when the cost to yourself if very low.
 
The US infrastructure is falling apart and we are 17 trillion dollars in debt, I have a construction company and 30 years experience building roads and bridges. Donate my team, time and experience for cost? **** no. Your problem.
150% and a 30% contingency is my starting offer, maybe then we can talk.


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Il Destriero
If the government were to pay you a reasonable amount, it'd be a win-win because infrastructure would improve and your workers would have more $$ to contribute to the economy, thereby reducing the deficit. How does your analogy relate to uncompensated physicians? Would compensating physicians more have a multiplier effect on the healthcare system?
 
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If the government were to pay you a reasonable amount, it'd be a win-win because infrastructure would improve and your workers would have more $$ to contribute to the economy, thereby reducing the deficit. How does your analogy relate to uncompensated physicians? Would compensating physicians more have a multiplier effect on the healthcare system?

And where is that money going to come from? It has to come from somewhere. Answer: higher taxes. And likely on high earners, so even though you'd be making a high wage, it would be negated by your higher taxes.
 
"Public service" means being in the employ of the government - that is, working in the public sector as opposed to the private sector.

As pointed out, some physicians are public servants but most are not.
 
I'm going to say yes. When was the last time you saw a doctor's strike?
I think that's more because physicians are professionals, not necessarily public servants. Lawyers don't strike, either.
 
That's the reality for a lot of physicians btw. You have medicaid, sorry we don't take that. You're welcome to bring cash.


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Il Destriero
I'd rather live a comfortable life than save yours. That's called poor morals.

Also, the "a lot of people do it" type of justification tells us a lot about your personality, not in terms of how you act, but in terms of how you think.
 
I'd rather live a comfortable life than save yours. That's called poor morals.

Also, the "a lot of people do it" type of justification tells us a lot about your personality, not in terms of how you act, but in terms of how you think.
I don't know what your profession is, but if a physician in my area decided to open up his private practice to every person who needed healthcare but did not want pay for it, he would be working around the clock 365 days per year for free.

Charity care is fine, but it is not reasonable to demand it, nor is it reasonable accuse anyone who does not open that can of worms of having poor morals. Physicians, as with any other profession, should not be expected to work without compensation. And a physician-patient relationship should be the product of a mutual agreement between the physician and the patient, with some exceptions for basic emergency care for physicians who work in certain settings like an ER and physicians who have voluntarily signed a contract to work with a specific population for an agreed-upon level of compensation.
 
I think that's more because physicians are professionals, not necessarily public servants. Lawyers don't strike, either.

Lawyers aren't forced to take whatever pay someone wants to give them. They give you a price and either you pay or you get a different lawyer. Doctors are coerced to take whatever the gov't and insurance companies say are the prices they will pay.
 
You are about to be seated at an entertainment venue when a fellow audience member goes into cardiac arrest. What do you do? Is a wallet biopsy necessary before offering assistance? I do think that there is a moral obligation to help those in mortal danger, particularly when the cost to yourself if very low.

It couldn't be a moral obligation if you must couch it in the terms that the cost to you is very low. Does it not become a moral obligation if if the cost is just low? Or moderate? Or high?

Is it the right thing to do? Fine.
Should it be an obligation? No
 
I'd rather live a comfortable life than save yours. That's called poor morals.

Also, the "a lot of people do it" type of justification tells us a lot about your personality, not in terms of how you act, but in terms of how you think.
What are you talking about? I work at a large children's hospital. I do more than my share of no pay charity care, deadbeat trauma, Medicaid, chip, etc. High risk, no reward. I did one case the other day, sick, challenging, long, I made 1/3 of what I could have earned in another room. Actually 1/6 as I could have had 2 rooms, if she wasn't such a wreck. But that's the nature of the job. Feast or famine. The only reason we do so well is efficiency, lean staffing, and the benefits that come from being the 800 lb. gorilla.
Many physicians don't accept Medicaid, etc. Why should they be forced to? Why do you think they can't accept whatever patients they want? I can't, but they sure can, until the socialists outlaw it. I know a couple psychiatrists that are cash only. Nothing wrong with that either, and they say their patients love them because you get much better service and availability when you pay $300 an hour vs a $20 copayment for a rushed 20 minute appointment. Next time I see my buddy, I'll let him know you think he should take some Medicaid and charity care patients. We'll have a good laugh and then have some single malt that costs more than he'd get paid for that Medicaid appointment.


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Il Destriero
 
What are you talking about? I work at a large children's hospital. I do more than my share of no pay charity care, deadbeat trauma, Medicaid, chip, etc. High risk, no reward. I did one case the other day, sick, challenging, long, I made 1/3 of what I could have earned in another room. Actually 1/6 as I could have had 2 rooms, if she wasn't such a wreck. But that's the nature of the job. Feast or famine. The only reason we do so well is efficiency, lean staffing, and the benefits that come from being the 800 lb. gorilla.
Many physicians don't accept Medicaid, etc. Why should they be forced to? Why do you think they can't accept whatever patients they want? I can't, but they sure can, until the socialists outlaw it. I know a couple psychiatrists that are cash only. Nothing wrong with that either, and they say their patients love them because you get much better service and availability when you pay $300 an hour vs a $20 copayment for a rushed 20 minute appointment. Next time I see my buddy, I'll let him know you think he should take some Medicaid and charity care patients. We'll have a good laugh and then have some single malt that costs more than he'd get paid for that Medicaid appointment.


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Il Destriero
You portray yourself as a physician that cares more about finances than an individual's health and then you try to prove you're not immoral. I can imagine the conversation with your friend. "I couldn't care less about patients that can't afford care no matter how much they're mentally suffering! Haha life is good, cheers mate! :zip:"
 
I don't know what your profession is, but if a physician in my area decided to open up his private practice to every person who needed healthcare but did not want pay for it, he would be working around the clock 365 days per year for free.

Charity care is fine, but it is not reasonable to demand it, nor is it reasonable accuse anyone who does not open that can of worms of having poor morals. Physicians, as with any other profession, should not be expected to work without compensation. And a physician-patient relationship should be the product of a mutual agreement between the physician and the patient, with some exceptions for basic emergency care for physicians who work in certain settings like an ER and physicians who have voluntarily signed a contract to work with a specific population for an agreed-upon level of compensation.
Provide care to as many people as possible based on priority of their health as long as you can financially survive.

The reason why medicine doesn't deserve the same compensation than other professions is because people's lives are on the line.
 
Provide care to as many people as possible based on priority of their health as long as you can financially survive.

The reason why medicine doesn't deserve the same compensation than other professions is because people's lives are on the line.
So a doctor is selfish just for wanting to earn more than it takes to survive?
Come on now.
 
You portray yourself as a physician that cares more about finances than an individual's health and then you try to prove you're not immoral. I can imagine the conversation with your friend. "I couldn't care less about patients that can't afford care no matter how much they're mentally suffering! Haha life is good, cheers mate! :zip:"
A physician generally does not have an obligation to serve someone who isn't his patient. And the mere fact that someone exists and could benefit from medical care does not make that person a physician's patient.
 
So a doctor is selfish just for wanting to earn more than it takes to survive?
Come on now.
Alright, then move the threshold of finance to survive with a few luxuries.
A physician generally does not have an obligation to serve someone who isn't his patient. And the mere fact that someone exists and could benefit from medical care does not make that person a physician's patient.
And what's the point of being so literal? Is your argument so dead that you have to pick on my writing capabilities?
 
And what's the point of being so literal? Is your argument so dead that you have to pick on my writing capabilities?
No; I am not criticizing your writing abilities. Just pointing out that the physician-patient relationship must be established before a person becomes a physician's patient. This is important because a physician's obligation is generally to serve his patients, not necessarily the entire community, and he is certainly not obligated to sacrifice his own needs and goals to serve people who aren't his patients.
 
Someone is dying and I have the knowledge to help that person? No money? Not my problem haha :nod:
The problem is nothing is free. You act like the physician is some mythical God born with special powers that were obtained through no efforts at all and with only the slight point of a finger one can be healed.
If someone wants to benefit from the "knowledge" a physician has they can either:
a) obtain a bachelors degree, take the MCAT exam, be accepted to medical school, pass medical school and all boards, place into a residency, become a certified physician at the local hospital
or b) pay whatever fee deemed appropriate by someone else who completed option (a)
 
You are about to be seated at an entertainment venue when a fellow audience member goes into cardiac arrest. What do you do? Is a wallet biopsy necessary before offering assistance? I do think that there is a moral obligation to help those in mortal danger, particularly when the cost to yourself if very low.
There is a big difference between choosing to be charitable vs being forced to provide a charity.

Guy in the car in front of you stalls and overheats in an intersection, but luckily you're a mechanic so you get out and take him some fluids you have with you and get him back on his way. Do you expect to be paid? No... that is charity. The next day you are at your shop and someone comes in who's car is overheating and they demand you fix it for free. You charge $50 for the service on the car because that's the price for the necessary parts and labor. The same as any other person who exchanges goods or services for tender with which they can then purchase goods and services for themselves ... why should you as a mechanic work for free?
 
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I like to think of myself more like the dollar menu at McDonalds. I just let people choose whatever crap they want in any combination and in the end I make a few dollars.
 
You are about to be seated at an entertainment venue when a fellow audience member goes into cardiac arrest. What do you do? Is a wallet biopsy necessary before offering assistance? I do think that there is a moral obligation to help those in mortal danger, particularly when the cost to yourself if very low.

Then they sue you for battery as you broke their ribs and demand a million dollars due to the emotional trauma
 
There is a big difference between choosing to be charitable vs being forced to provide a charity.

Guy in the car in front of you stalls and overheats in an intersection, but luckily you're a mechanic so you get out and take him some fluids you have with you and get him back on his way. Do you expect to be paid? No... that is charity. The next day you are at your shop and someone comes in who's car is overheating and they demand you fix it for free. You charge $50 for the service on the car because that's the price for the necessary parts and labor. The same as any other person who exchanges goods or services for tender with which they can then purchase goods and services for themselves ... why should you as a mechanic work for free?

It is not charity if you have an obligation. LizzyM was talking about an obligation to intervene when another is in mortal danger and you are able to intervene. That's not "forced charity", which is an oxymoron by the way, it is fulfilling your duty.

If you want to argue that no such duty exists, then you may but the question is not about forced vs. freely-given charity.
 
No; I am not criticizing your writing abilities. Just pointing out that the physician-patient relationship must be established before a person becomes a physician's patient. This is important because a physician's obligation is generally to serve his patients, not necessarily the entire community, and he is certainly not obligated to sacrifice his own needs and goals to serve people who aren't his patients.

This is changing in the current understanding of bioethics and the winning argument currently is that the scope of physician responsibility - I.e that they should be beholden to more than just their clients - ought to be expanded to whole communities and, in the case of providing patient data for clinical research, the entire human population.

This is a departure from medicine's origins as a "profession". It used to be that the two professions, law and medicine, were beholden only to their client and all of the ethical groundwork for the profession was built up from that original assumption about the foundational relationship which defined any and all professional activities.

Today, medicine is responsible for an incredible amount of socially provided resources and many who believe (rightfully in my opinion) that the current trajectory of resource expenditure is unsustainable believe that the responsibilities of the profession should shift to accommodate for the responsibility they have for society's resources. The most serious ethical problem people contend with, even in this thread if not explicitly, is where the balance lies between the responsibility of the profession to the country's people, to society's resources, to themselves, and to individual patients. Second, our data sharing capabilities which are not being put to good use in medicine have some potential to dramatically increase the quality and scope of clinical research questions we can ask not only to generate new knowledge but to perform QA and QI and greater standardize practices across the nation. You cannot achieve those two goals without first rethinking about the scope and depth of the physician's responsibility to her patient and the community.

Ideally, I think all physicians ought to consider themselves public servants, with an emphasis on the "servant" and no qualifications on the "public". A physician ought to be someone who, like a priest, craves the role of the steward but faith unpermitting cannot take up the cloth. I understand this is a radical claim which is not at all reflective of the profession or of the desires of most likely the majority of the professionals, but I cannot imagine a better way.
 
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Guys, "public servant" means "government employee." I know you keep trying to use it colloquially, but that's not how it is in the real world. When you have a job, you're either in the public sector or private sector. Public servant means you're in the public sector. It's a very important distinction, as the laws and regulations covering public and private sector employment are markedly different. I was a "public servant" working as a network administrator in a cubicle, and I will not be a "public servant" when I work as a physician for a hospital (or whatever).

Civil service, public service, public servant, public sector. These all refer specifically to government workers.
 
This is changing in the current understanding of bioethics and the winning argument currently is that the scope of physician responsibility - I.e that they should be beholden to more than just their clients - ought to be expanded to whole communities and, in the case of providing patient data for clinical research, the entire human population.

This is a departure from medicine's origins as a "profession". It used to be that the two professions, law and medicine, were beholden only to their client and all of the ethical groundwork for the profession was built up from that original assumption about the foundational relationship which defined any and all professional activities.

Today, medicine is responsible for an incredible amount of socially provided resources and many who believe (rightfully in my opinion) that the current trajectory of resource expenditure is unsustainable believe that the responsibilities of the profession should shift to accommodate for the responsibility they have for society's resources. The most serious ethical problem people contend with, even in this thread if not explicitly, is where the balance lies between the responsibility of the profession to the country's people, to society's resources, to themselves, and to individual patients. Second, our data sharing capabilities which are not being put to good use in medicine have some potential to dramatically increase the quality and scope of clinical research questions we can ask not only to generate new knowledge but to perform QA and QI and greater standardize practices across the nation. You cannot achieve those two goals without first rethinking about the scope and depth of the physician's responsibility to her patient and the community.

Ideally, I think all physicians ought to consider themselves public servants, with an emphasis on the "servant" and no qualifications on the "public". A physician ought to be someone who, like a priest, craves the role of the steward but faith unpermitting cannot take up the cloth. I understand this is a radical claim which is not at all reflective of the profession or of the desires of most likely the majority of the professionals, but I cannot imagine a better way.

A prison doctor takes on a serial murderer as a patient. This patient is violent and has continued to harm others while incarcerated and will likely do so on the outside if he is paroled. The patient now presents with a disease which, if left untreated, will kill him but be beneficial to society. The doctor could either allow the disease to run its natural course or intervene and save a person who will likely go on to cause more harm to others.

An emergency room doctor in a small community hospital sees a patient who is admitted for an acute, life-threatening illness. This patient is a chronic alcoholic and polydrug abuser who presents frequently, has never held a job for his entire life, and lives his life fully on the off of other peoples' charity and tax dollars. During his hospitalization, it is discovered that the patient possibly has a separate, life-threatening disease which requires subspecialist care and is very expensive to treat. The doctor could work the patient up for the other life-threatening disease and refer the patient to an expensive tertiary care center for appropriate treatment, or merely stabilize the patient's acute issue and allow the patient's other condition to kill him, thus likely saving the community several hundreds of thousands of dollars (at least).

An orthopedic surgeon agrees to see a patient with diabetes and gangrene of the right lower extremity. The patient does not work but has stated a preference to be able to keep as much of her leg as possible. The surgeon determines that he can attempt a BKA to retain maximum function for the patient afterwards, but that there is a chance that he will have to follow up with an AKA afterwards if the blood supply does not extend all the way down to the stump after the BKA, which would be much more expensive than just doing the AKA to begin with. He can either proceed with the AKA, which would save society valuable public healthcare resources, or the BKA, which is consistent with the patient's goals but presents the risk of higher costs to society.

An OB/GYN is performing a repeat caesarean section on a 38-y/o single mother who is a unable to support her existing two children without public support. The patient has refused a tubal ligation and expressed a wish to have more children in the future. After the infant is delivered, the uterus continues to bleed at a much higher rate than expected along the incision. The doctor has been trying to stop the bleeding by throwing additional sutures for several minutes without success and the uterus is starting to become atonic; the patient's heart rate is increasing and there is somewhat of a drop in blood pressure. He can either call the blood bank to prepare for possible transfusion, administer more pitocin and continue to try to stop the bleeding for as long as the patient can tolerate it or he can do the best thing for society and perform a hysterectomy, thus ending both the incisional bleeding and the patient's ability to reproduce.

These are not hypothetical; I have observed these exact situations while on rotations. In every case, the physician ended up acting in the patient's best interest. And I believe that they were right to do so.

It is absolutely the physician's duty to put his patient's well-being above that of the rest of society when it comes to making decisions about patient care. This idea is fundamental to developing trust in the physician-patient relationship. If I were a patient myself, I would be much more trusting of a doctor who puts my well-being above the "social good" than one who views taking care of me as his second priority.
 
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A prison doctor takes on a serial murderer as a patient. This patient is violent and has continued to harm others while incarcerated and will likely do so on the outside if he is paroled. The patient now presents with a disease which, if left untreated, will kill him but be beneficial to society. The doctor could either allow the disease to run its natural course or intervene and save a person who will likely go on to cause more harm to others.

An emergency room doctor in a small community hospital sees a patient who is admitted for an acute, life-threatening illness. This patient is a chronic alcoholic and polydrug abuser who presents frequently, has never held a job for his entire life, and lives his life fully on the off of other peoples' charity and tax dollars. During his hospitalization, it is discovered that the patient possibly has a separate, life-threatening disease which requires subspecialist care is very expensive to treat. The doctor could work the patient up for the other life-threatening disease and refer the patient to an expensive tertiary care center for appropriate treatment, or merely stabilize the patient's acute issue and allow the patient's other condition to kill him, thus likely saving the community several hundreds of thousands of dollars (at least).

An orthopedic surgeon agrees to see a patient with diabetes and gangrene of the right lower extremity. The patient does not work but has stated a preference to be able to keep as much of her leg as possible. The surgeon determines that he can attempt a BKA to retain maximum function for the patient afterwards, but that there is a chance that he will have to follow up with an AKA afterwards if the blood supply does not extend all the way down to the stump after the BKA, which would be much more expensive than just doing the AKA to begin with. He can either proceed with the BKA, which would save society valuable public healthcare resources, or the AKA, which is consistent with the patient's goals but presents the risk of higher costs to society.

An OB/GYN is performing a repeat caesarean section on a single mother who is a unable to support her existing two children without public support. The patient has refused a tubal ligation and expressed a wish to have more children in the future. After the infant is delivered, the uterus continues to bleed at a much higher rate than expected along the incision. The doctor has been trying to stop the bleeding by throwing additional sutures for several minutes without success and the uterus is starting to become atonic; the patient's heart rate is increasing and there is somewhat of a drop in blood pressure. He can either call the blood bank and prepare for possible transfusion, administer more pitocin and continue to try to stop the bleeding for as long as the patient can tolerate it or he can do the best thing for society and perform a hysterectomy, thus ending both the incisional bleeding and the patient's ability to reproduce.

These are not hypothetical; I have observed these exact situations while on rotations. In every case, the physician ended up acting in the patient's best interest. And I believe that they were right to do so.

It is absolutely the physician's duty to put his patient's well-being above that of the rest of society when it comes to making decisions about patient care. This idea is fundamental to developing trust in the physician-patient relationship. If I were a patient myself, I would be much more trusting of a doctor who puts my well-being above the "social good" than one who views taking care of me as his second priority.

Obviously, the patient is a priority. The shift is that the good of the community is no longer a non-issue, specifically when it has to do with sharing knowledge and allocation of resources. The second is intrinsically subordinate to the first responsibility, but the days where patient information is the proprietary good of an individual practice or a hospital are probably over, and the drive to reduce costs or change the payment structure will certainly affect the way physicians do their jobs.
 
I come from a country where physicians consider themselves and are considered to be public servants. I do have to say that the public does not hold the same litigious attitude toward them as they do here.
 
Obviously, the patient is a priority. The shift is that the good of the community is no longer a non-issue, specifically when it has to do with sharing knowledge and allocation of resources. The second is intrinsically subordinate to the first responsibility, but the days where patient information is the proprietary good of an individual practice or a hospital are probably over, and the drive to reduce costs or change the payment structure will certainly affect the way physicians do their jobs.
Personally, I see a major disconnect in that our education is privately funded, but then some people want doctors to be public servants.

If the gov't follows through on PSLF, then I would agree that our duty becomes to the community because we are making a fair exhange. But to make us purchase our knowledge and then control who we help with that knowledge is on the same level as forcing people to house the homeless because is for the good of the community and saves resources.

(To be clear, I hope most physicians would make the choice to help the community, but since we are using our own resources to gain our knowledge, I don't think we should be obligated to serve anyone)

And I would have no problem if the gov't is trying to use PSLF to make us public servants, but I do have a problem with the expectation that doctors be public servants while also requiring physicians to use their private resources to fund their knowledge
 
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A prison doctor takes on a serial murderer as a patient. This patient is violent and has continued to harm others while incarcerated and will likely do so on the outside if he is paroled. The patient now presents with a disease which, if left untreated, will kill him but be beneficial to society. The doctor could either allow the disease to run its natural course or intervene and save a person who will likely go on to cause more harm to others.

I suppose you thought this was a smart argument, but as someone who works in correctional medicine I couldn't let this display of ignorance go by. If you choose to work in the prison system, the patients are your patients, full stop. Your job description has not one single allowance for modifying care based on the reason the patient is in the correctional system. You treat the patient and the pathology in front of you to the best of your ability, and leave the (astonishingly juvenile) hypotheticals out of it. In a regular hospital, would you withhold care to someone already out of prison on parole, because you think they "will likely go on to cause more harm to others?"
 
I suppose you thought this was a smart argument, but as someone who works in correctional medicine I couldn't let this display of ignorance go by. If you choose to work in the prison system, the patients are your patients, full stop. Your job description has not one single allowance for modifying care based on the reason the patient is in the correctional system. You treat the patient and the pathology in front of you to the best of your ability, and leave the (astonishingly juvenile) hypotheticals out of it. In a regular hospital, would you withhold care to someone already out of prison on parole, because you think they "will likely go on to cause more harm to others?"
uhh yeah you pretty much just confirmed my point. Thanks
 
Someone is dying and I have the knowledge to help that person? No money? Not my problem haha :nod:
Many physicians have a certain number of pro-bono or sliding scale patients. It is, however, a personal decision. I'm not obligated to help someone that is dying and doesn't have the money to pay me, but I would generally do so because I enjoy sleeping at night. That being said, I expect the large majority of my patients to pay once I'm in practice.
 
Provide care to as many people as possible based on priority of their health as long as you can financially survive.

The reason why medicine doesn't deserve the same compensation than other professions is because people's lives are on the line.
The fact that people's lives are on the line is precisely why we should be compensated more than other professions. If you are paying fast food wages to your physicians, you're going to get fast food levels of care and quality. No way in hell I'd be in this high-liability profession after sacrificing over a decade of my life with a full million dollars in opportunity cost and debt just to "survive" financially.
 
I want to use a phrase like "commitment to public service" in my personal statement. Many of my ECs are directed at underserved urban communities, and my PS is mostly about wanting to work with such communities. Is this OK to refer to as public service, or does that imply that I don't understand the American medical system?

To add one more viewpoint, I would not classify physicians as being public servants. Rather, I think it would be more accurate to describe us as being members of a profession that serves public interests.

Resume brawlin'.
 
no worries it was a very long post haha

I didn't even make it to your c-section example, I was like WHAT IS THIS KID TALKING ABOUT??!! :boom:

I personally consider myself a public servant in the colloquial sense, in addition to truly being one because I'm a government employee. But, that is because of the practice set-up I've chosen for myself. Dealing with the health of others is very different from most other jobs... but medicine is still a job. In a country where obtaining the means to become a physician is a personal responsibility, the choice of what to do with that training must be a personal one. For example I may wish my patients didn't have to either 1) drive 80 miles for their seizure management, or 2) have an underqualified physician (me) do it. But it's the right of the neurologists in this area to make their own practice decisions- they took on no obligations to the general public, only to their own patients.
 
This is changing in the current understanding of bioethics and the winning argument currently is that the scope of physician responsibility - I.e that they should be beholden to more than just their clients - ought to be expanded to whole communities and, in the case of providing patient data for clinical research, the entire human population.

This is a departure from medicine's origins as a "profession". It used to be that the two professions, law and medicine, were beholden only to their client and all of the ethical groundwork for the profession was built up from that original assumption about the foundational relationship which defined any and all professional activities.

Today, medicine is responsible for an incredible amount of socially provided resources and many who believe (rightfully in my opinion) that the current trajectory of resource expenditure is unsustainable believe that the responsibilities of the profession should shift to accommodate for the responsibility they have for society's resources. The most serious ethical problem people contend with, even in this thread if not explicitly, is where the balance lies between the responsibility of the profession to the country's people, to society's resources, to themselves, and to individual patients. Second, our data sharing capabilities which are not being put to good use in medicine have some potential to dramatically increase the quality and scope of clinical research questions we can ask not only to generate new knowledge but to perform QA and QI and greater standardize practices across the nation. You cannot achieve those two goals without first rethinking about the scope and depth of the physician's responsibility to her patient and the community.

Ideally, I think all physicians ought to consider themselves public servants, with an emphasis on the "servant" and no qualifications on the "public". A physician ought to be someone who, like a priest, craves the role of the steward but faith unpermitting cannot take up the cloth. I understand this is a radical claim which is not at all reflective of the profession or of the desires of most likely the majority of the professionals, but I cannot imagine a better way.
Society can keep their resources. I never asked for them. Medicine only has so many societal resources being provided to it specifically because Medicare and Medicaid exist- back in the day, when these weren't a thing, health care was actually very much affordable. Physicians also made substantially less, but the physician-patient relationship was intact and massive government overreach really wasn't a thing. I'd take less money for less government involvement any day- I'm no one's servant, I'm a person who does good because I choose to, which I believe is the better way to approach things, since one cannot be forced to be good by the government, only to act good. The movement on behalf of socialized medicine seeks to usurp the free will of physicians, to force them to do as society wants rather than act as they choose, which I believe to be a gross violation of physician rights and autonomy without any change in our high degree of responsibility and liability.
 
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