Are you doing the virtual conferences?

[DynamicDidactic]

I have been very unmotivated to participate in virtual conferences. A major reason why I like conferences is to travel and run into colleagues. The idea of recording a talk is also very unrewarding. Since it seems that the next round of my typical conferences are going virtual, I have to start thinking about my CV and work reviews.

So, have you been doing the virtual conferences? If yes, how have they been? If no, will your employer care?

Any information that may change my point of view on this?

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[PsychPhDone]

I'm not, at least not for now. My mentors advised me to focus on putting that time into publications. I'm staying active in listservs and stuff to keep networking going.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

I haven't to this point, but will probably sign up for INS in February. Like you, the travel and time with colleagues I haven't seen in a year or more was a major "selling point" for conference attendance. But the virtual format should at least make it easier to knock out a significant number of CEs.

 

[bookwormpsych]

The hospital I work at hosts an annual forensic conference (to knock out 90% of reqs for forensic psychologist lol). This year (in October is when it is held, btw), it was this weird virtual/in-person hybrid format. All but one presenter was "present" through Teams and presented that way. But, people who work at the hospitals had to actually attend in person. So we were in the auditorium listening to people present via Teams... it was soooooo bad. People who don't work at the hospitals were not allowed to attend in person and we had "remote sites" at the various hospitals across my state that people would connect to via Teams in their respective conference rooms. It was a weird experience. The experience was just weird. When presenting, we just listened to a disembodied voice for 3+ hours. Part of the joy or me comes from seeing the person who is presenting. We only saw their presentation slides and their voice. It was also not ran smoothly (typical of this hospital lol) and was just not worth the 3 days off work.

 

[Doctor Koala]

nah

 

[MCParent]

I'm not. It just doesn't feel as fun. I loved running into everyone I know, and it's not really possible for me to network my students like I typically do at conferences. I'm also using the time for pubs and other work, and advised by students to do the same. Sad things is my APA fellows award and division address has been bumped for three years now -_-

 

[WisNeuro]

This past year I've pretty much just been doing virtual CEs through my state association. As others mentioned, the fun of conferences is networking and such. So, if I can't do that, I may as well funnel that money back into my state association.

 

[MiniLop]

I guess I'm in the minority here, but I'm all about virtual conferences (I also hate networking and schmoozing). I "attended" one last fall and really enjoyed the experience. All the talks were made available on demand for a few weeks after, so instead of having to be selective about which talks I attended due to overlapping scheduling and making time to see people/be a tourist etc., I could watch everything I was interested in at my leisure. I ended getting more out of that conference (learning-wise) than any that I've attended IRL.

 

[Ollie123]

Did two just because I had committed to them pre-COVID.

Awful. In general, I find the only real value of conferences is networking. I rarely learn anything there where I couldn't learn more by reading the eventual papers and I never quite bought the whole "see new ideas before they get published to be on the cutting edge" - this isn't tech and given the time it takes to get anything meaningful done we just don't work at a pace where that seems helpful. Plus about 80-90% of what gets presented is trash not worth hearing about anyways. So the only reason to go is for the other activities that just can't happen via zoom.

 

[MCParent]

This past year I've pretty much just been doing virtual CEs through my state association. As others mentioned, the fun of conferences is networking and such. So, if I can't do that, I may as well funnel that money back into my state association.

I've never had a lower opinion of other psychologists than when I attended one of the APA ethics "hot topics" seminars. (The audience evaluations of the ethical dilemmas, not the presenters, but the ethical dilemmas were some softballs too)

 

[neuronstudies]

I'm curious what you think about virtual conferences for students planning to apply to grad school? I did a poster presentation at one virtual conference and have another upcoming. While it was good experience putting together a poster and I watched some interesting talks, it all felt very disconnected. Not sure what students can do to get the most out of these virtual conferences, especially if many profs aren't participating in them.

Also I find it interesting to see the differences in registration fees for virtual conferences (how can some conferences be free whereas others are charging substantial registration costs, even though they're basically offering the same thing)

 

[WisNeuro]

I'm curious what you think about virtual conferences for students planning to apply to grad school? I did a poster presentation at one virtual conference and have another upcoming. While it was good experience putting together a poster and I watched some interesting talks, it all felt very disconnected. Not sure what students can do to get the most out of these virtual conferences, especially if many profs aren't participating in them.

Also I find it interesting to see the differences in registration fees for virtual conferences (how can some conferences be free whereas others are charging substantial registration costs, even though they're basically offering the same thing)

If they are offering registration for free, they are either recouping the costs somewhere else, or writing off a significant amount of funds, anything substantial (few hundred participants) costs a good deal of money to run. We're currently getting quotes and negotiating for our conference for next year.

 

[Divinest Sense]

I attended one that I have attended in person every year for the past several years (because I had something already accepted). I did not enjoy it. I also didn't think it was as well organized as it usually is. It's a conference I really value, especially for the in-person networking and for catching up with old friends/mentors/colleagues. I hope next time we can meet in person.

I withdrew my presentation from another organization that went online earlier in the pandemic. They were very slow to decide to even go online, and I have become less interested in that conference over time for a variety of reasons. I thought they handled the situation poorly (even in comparison to other organizations), and I might not attend in the future. The pandemic has made some problems within certain organizations more obvious (e.g., lack of timely decision-making, in-fighting, inconsistency in messaging), and I think there may be fallout as a result.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

The pandemic has made some problems within certain organizations more obvious (e.g., lack of timely decision-making, in-fighting, inconsistency in messaging), and I think there may be fallout as a result.

Im curious which conferences you are talking about. But I’ve had an inside view on one organization and some of these difficulties are understandable. A lot has to do with legality of canceling a booked venue. Also, smaller organizations that are entirely staffed by volunteers are going to have a lot of difficulty reaching consensus quickly.

 

[WisNeuro]

Im curious which conferences you are talking about. But I’ve had an inside view on one organization and some of these difficulties are understandable. A lot has to do with legality of canceling a booked venue. Also, smaller organizations that are entirely staffed by volunteers are going to have a lot of difficulty reaching consensus quickly.

Exactly, last year, in March/April especially, many of us had to wait until emergency declarations/gathering restrictions were made in our states to get out of very expensive venue contracts. We made the call as early as pragmatically able in our specific instance.

 

[Divinest Sense]

Exactly, last year, in March/April especially, many of us had to wait until emergency declarations/gathering restrictions were made in our states to get out of very expensive venue contracts. We made the call as early as pragmatically able in our specific instance.

Makes sense. The smaller one I mentioned has had a lot of issues in the past few years (not just related to the pandemic) where things seem to be all over the place. I just thought it was strange that they were even considering having the conference in person for as long as they were. It is one thing to not be able to move it online, but there would have been no way to keep that conference in person at that time. By then, many (probably most) universities (including mine) were prohibiting travel and so many other conferences had canceled. Plus it just seemed potentially irresponsible when COVID wasnknown to have spread at other conferences (most notoriously, the Biogen conference) by that time. My annoyed response may have been colored by my pre-existing annoyed state 😉

Another smaller organization with a conference only a few weeks earlier was much better about updating and figuring things out. So kudos to them!

I don't want to publicly call the one organization out though, because it seems like poor form in this context, and I don't know all their inner workings. Plus, I don't wish them ill. I have just been less and less impressed with them over the past few years.

The big one didn't seem great to me, because most of what I get from it cannot be replicated online. I know there were some people who had a very hard time getting in touch with people to deal with tech glitches (on the program's side, not the presenters) that could impact their posters/presentations. Also emails were sent sort of last minute for different online events and it was tough with planning. They had more time than other organizations and have some full time staff, so that was frustrating. Overall, they probably did a pretty good job, I just didn't like doing it online. After so much time seeing patients and having meetings online, some of us felt like "Oh great - another videoconference Powerpoint presentation!"

Fingers crossed for next year!

 

[futureapppsy2]

Any thoughts on when we’ll be returning to in-person conferences?

 

[WisNeuro]

Any thoughts on when we’ll be returning to in-person conferences?

All of my usual ones through June decided on virtual long ago. State-wise, we're hoping to explore returning to some in-person CE events sometime mid summer.

 

[Ollie123]

I'll be surprised if we see full-scale conferences in-person any time in 2021. In part just because planning for them has to happen far enough in advance that organizations will have to commit before we can really know how things will progress. Looks like we won't know the state of things until mid-summer at the earliest (i.e. whenever vaccines are readily available to the general population) and a decision on major conferences will have to be made long before that, even for December conferences. I see some transition back to normalcy later this year, but I think large events like conferences are further out.

Q1 2022 is my guess. Barring new variants emerging that are not addressed by the vaccine, etc.

 

[WisNeuro]

I'll be surprised if we see full-scale conferences in-person any time in 2021. In part just because planning for them has to happen far enough in advance that organizations will have to commit before we can really know how things will progress. We won't know the state of things until mid-summer and a decision on major conferences will have to be made long before that. I see some transition back to normalcy later this year, but I think large events like conferences are further out.

Q1 2022 is my guess. Barring new variants emerging that are not addressed by the vaccine, etc.

Yeah, big issue is contracts with hotels for larger events. I think they'd have availability later this year as so many events are virtual. But, if you book that event and something happens after the back out window, you could be on the hook for 5 figures as an organization. We had to make a call on our hotel booking about 6 months out, which at the time was a pretty easy call to cancel. Our smaller events are easy to transition between in-person and virtual so we can be more agile when the time comes there.

 

[Ollie123]

That's my guess. Smaller, in-person events late this year (possibly/probably still masked). Think CEU seminars, grand rounds, maybe some really tiny local "conferences" most of us wouldn't even think to call conferences, things like that. Transitioning to larger events in 2022.

 

[PsyDr]

Any thoughts on when we’ll be returning to in-person conferences?

The profits are higher for online stuff. I imagine a bunch of organizations are going to try to record the lectures, have the speakers sign over rights to them, and then sell the talks in perpetuity

 

[WisNeuro]

The profits are higher for online stuff. I imagine a bunch of organizations are going to try to record the lectures, have the speakers sign over rights to them, and then sell the talks in perpetuity

We are recording ours when presenters consent. But our contracts do not ask for exclusive rights to the presentation, and we've time limited how long we have them up. I'd rather keep our talks higher quality, don't want a bunch of outdated/inaccurate information up, otherwise we'll start looking like PESI.

 

[ClinicalABA]

The profits are higher for online stuff. I imagine a bunch of organizations are going to try to record the lectures, have the speakers sign over rights to them, and then sell the talks in perpetuity

Certainly at the individual level, but I don't know that they would get the numbers to make up for the loss of live conference/CEU revenue. There's a substantial group of us who just go to conferences for the social/networking/get the heck out of town experiences- made all the better when your company/institution foot the bill. I get enough CEUs from teaching and cheaper local sources that I have no need to large sums of money on virtual conference registration fees (in some cases identical to live conference fees!). While it is nice to hear about new research, I'm patient enough to wait for the journal article. I'd guess that people who need the CEU might find some cheaper local or more targeted option (e.g., 3 hour online training where you pay for 3 CEUs, vs. a 2 day conference with multiple presentations where you pay a fee for the whole conferences, as well as a CEU charge). Just my anecdotal perspective, but my agency will typically send ~30 folks to the big national conference. Numbers were much less for last years virtual conference. Even though it would've been cheaper for the company, with no airfare, lodging, per diem, hospitality suites, etc,- and the company was willing to pay still- the interest just wasn't there beyond those who were actually presenting their work.

 

[PsyDr]

Certainly at the individual level, but I don't know that they would get the numbers to make up for the loss of live conference/CEU revenue. There's a substantial group of us who just go to conferences for the social/networking/get the heck out of town experiences- made all the better when your company/institution foot the bill. I get enough CEUs from teaching and cheaper local sources that I have no need to large sums of money on virtual conference registration fees (in some cases identical to live conference fees!). While it is nice to hear about new research, I'm patient enough to wait for the journal article. I'd guess that people who need the CEU might find some cheaper local or more targeted option (e.g., 3 hour online training where you pay for 3 CEUs, vs. a 2 day conference with multiple presentations where you pay a fee for the whole conferences, as well as a CEU charge). Just my anecdotal perspective, but my agency will typically send ~30 folks to the big national conference. Numbers were much less for last years virtual conference. Even though it would've been cheaper for the company, with no airfare, lodging, per diem, hospitality suites, etc,- and the company was willing to pay still- the interest just wasn't there beyond those who were actually presenting their work.

IMO/IME, the entire benefits of conferences are:

1) Tax write off for a trip to somewhere usually fun.
2) Socializing and networking.
3) Going out to nice dinners and drinks with colleagues, which can be written off on taxes.
4) Occasionally being paid to go somewhere to talk.

Virtual conferences don't get that. But conference centers charge like $300 per carafe of coffee, so leadership is psyched that their profits are up, despite lower attendance.

 

[thebalmofhurtminds]

I do have a July international conference that hasn't decided to go online yet. I'll be interested to see what they do.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

Any thoughts on when we’ll be returning to in-person conferences?

ABCT is currently planning an in-person conference in NOLA in November. We will see if that happen.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

so leadership is psyched that their profits are up, despite lower attendance.

Anecdotal: I have an inside peek on a smaller APA division conference. It attracted a similar amount of people with greater participation in different aspects of the conference. Some more international folks as well.

Though, I have no desire for online conferences. I'm guessing there is some personality traits associated with interest in online conferences.

 

[Ollie123]

Just had to share my recent virtual conference experience as a panel member on a Q&A:

- Log in to room early to get "set up". Ask to make sure I am in the right place because it is the "pre-clinical" room and our Q&A is about policy/public health and not pre-clinical work. Yes I am - one of the public health sessions is taking place in the pre-clinical "virtual room" because of overflow.

- Eavesdrop as technicians discuss how there are too many people in this session, have no idea how they are going to move everyone over and aren't really sure if this will work

- 5 minutes before the session I express concern that neither our session chair, nor our first speaker appear to be present and no one has noticed or come up with a plan.

- Individual in another session agrees to lead our Q&A instead. Has not seen any of the presentations that Q&A is supposed to be about, but speakers cannot easily monitor questions coming in so what the heck why not.

- Session begins. Saturday AM sessions are usually poorly attended even at the in-person conference. A virtual conference where most people are at home on a weekend with better things to do, its a Q&A so attendees are expected to have already reviewed the material and many would-be-attendees are international in areas where they likely should be sleeping? Attendance = 25 people. The majority are fellow panel members and AV techs.

- Not surprisingly, no one asks questions during the Q&A. Last-minute-fill-in-moderator asks our first speaker to describe their work. First speaker is still absent. I mention we don't know where they are during the live recording. I am next and give a 2-minute version of my talk.

- Still no questions. Move on to presenter #2.

- Midway through OH WAIT HERE COME THE QUESTIONS. We're broadcasting on about a minute delay, so questions can't really be posed in real time. Probably something to consider before creating an audience-driven Q&A.

- We circle back to my talk and I answer the question. It was a good one. Maybe some hope?

- Actual moderator arrives about 15 minutes into our 30 minute session. She was in the public health session because why would she be moderating a pre-clinical session? This was not figured out until the first person went to speak and she realized it wasn't us.

- Actual moderator (obviously) has no idea where are at in session and last-minute-fill-in-moderator has been removed from the live room by AV techs. Repeats introductions. Awkwardly shuffles papers. Asks again for questions (nope).

- Asks other speakers to comment on my findings. No one really knows because we're there to answer questions about our own work, this isn't a panel discussion on a topic. More awkwardness

- One other person starts to give a brief synopsis of the work. She gets about halfway through before we're cut off because the session is ending and there wasn't really a plan for how we handle the timing of this.


Not exactly the highlight of my professional career. Posting in part just in case we have students or other junior folks here who have experienced similar catastrophes this past year. Know its not just you, its not your fault and it will be OK.

So anyways....I will definitely not be going to virtual conferences anymore. If I had paid registration fees myself instead of off one of my grants, I would be requesting a refund but its just not worth the fight.

 

[PsychPhDone]

Any thoughts on when we’ll be returning to in-person conferences?

My "home" conference is in late November and is being planned for in person. I can't bring myself to consider going at this point. I know we may be fairly back to normal then, and while I can imagine doing everyday stuff, the idea of being in the same room as hundreds of people is unfathomable to me. also I have a small child who won't be vaccinated by then.

 

[ClinicalABA]

Maybe a timely follow up to Meehl's classic is in order: "Why I Don't Go to Virtual Conferences"

 

[WisNeuro]

My "home" conference is in late November and is being planned for in person. I can't bring myself to consider going at this point. I know we may be fairly back to normal then, and while I can imagine doing everyday stuff, the idea of being in the same room as hundreds of people is unfathomable to me. also I have a small child who won't be vaccinated by then.

Based on the numbers, I'd have to imagine that anyone who wants a vaccine will have one by fall. Heck, we should have the boosters ready by then. We're tentatively planning on hybrid in-person/streaming offerings by late summer.

 

[PsychPhDone]

Based on the numbers, I'd have to imagine that anyone who wants a vaccine will have one by fall. Heck, we should have the boosters ready by then. We're tentatively planning on hybrid in-person/streaming offerings by late summer.

I certainly hope so. I'm also really hoping it's enough for herd immunity.

I think I have a concurrent existential issue that I'm exhausted and burnt out. Conference doesn't sound fun. I need a real vacation first.

 

[WisNeuro]

I certainly hope so. I'm also really hoping it's enough for herd immunity.

I think I have a concurrent existential issue that I'm exhausted and burnt out. Conference doesn't sound fun. I need a real vacation first.

With the approval of J&J we honestly should have enough to vaccinate all adults by sometime in summer, given a certain percentage of people will be anti-vaxxers of some sort, everyone who wants one will occur before that. That also assumes we do not approve any other vaccines, which is unlikely. The peds studies seem to be on track to have kids vaccinated prior to school starting in the fall. So, barring any major catastrophes or setbacks, should be more than good for November.

As far as in-person conferences, I miss my tax deductible vacations.

 

[beantownpsych]

ABCT is currently planning an in-person conference in NOLA in November. We will see if that happen.

It will be hybrid.

 

[WisNeuro]

APA PLC this weekend. Networking and socializing events are much less fun virtually.

 

[chicandtoughness]

I haven’t, for sheer reason that I haaaate sitting on Zoom and watching presentations that will be made available afterwards anyways. I virtually attended one last November (that I’ve been attending for the past 4 years) and it sucked. I miss the networking.

Also, I’m curious how poster presentations are working out virtually lol

 

[Ollie123]

Also, I’m curious how poster presentations are working out virtually lol

It mostly means sitting alone in a zoom channel for 1-2 hours.

 

[just_a_cigar]

Also, I’m curious how poster presentations are working out virtually lol

So I'm still trying to get into a PhD program and adding posters to my CV is important which is why I've still been attending conferences. I had posters at two virtual conferences and for both I recorded a short presentation. People could leave comments on the poster, but I felt like there was little to no chance anyone looked at my stuff. I definitely miss standing in front of my poster! It lead to much more conversation even if it was awkward at times! Better than just putting your poster into the ether and hoping someone looked at it lol

 

[hopefulclinicalpsych]

I was accepted to a hybrid conference and they accepted my 2 presentations as in-person talks. When I told them that I couldn’t do in person due to travel restrictions, they rescheduled one of my talks but said that I could do the other as a poster. Has anyone else had this issue? When I asked if the other presenter or a volunteer could help facilitate the talk, I was told the session is no longer happening because of cancellations. Do you all think I should say talks on my CV (since that’s what they were accepted as) or 1 talk and 1 poster.

 

[Ollie123]

Weird that they would have a hybrid conference but schedule things as in-person or virtual without giving people an opportunity to request. Many universities still have travel restrictions in place so even if someone is willing to do in-person...they may not be able to do so. Seems poorly thought out.

Standardized CV formatting seems to have exited the door throughout this process. Everyone I know now has citations that look like " Joe Smith (2020, August). Psychological distress and moral conflicts related to proper citation. Paper scheduled for presentation at XYZ but that was cancelled so now its a kinda-sorta webinar taking place after the conference but its still actually a part of the conference and there was a poster during the actual conference but I felt weird listing that separately because what they call posters was actually still a pre-recorded talk that was basically the same as the webinar but abbreviated and not an actual poster and no one could even access the audio because of technical reasons or something."

Until the APA Pub Manual releases a special COVID edition, this is what you'll see for a bit. We all get it, so I wouldn't worry about. I'd probably write in that it was accepted as a paper but converted to a poster due to COVID-19 restrictions. If you split them out, I'd probably put it under the poster subheading though. Reasonable people can disagree on these things right now and something like this isn't going to make or break anything so don't stress too much.

 

[hopefulclinicalpsych]

Weird that they would have a hybrid conference but schedule things as in-person or virtual without giving people an opportunity to request. Many universities still have travel restrictions in place so even if someone is willing to do in-person...they may not be able to do so. Seems poorly thought out.

Standardized CV formatting seems to have exited the door throughout this process. Everyone I know now has citations that look like " Joe Smith (2020, August). Psychological distress and moral conflicts related to proper citation. Paper scheduled for presentation at XYZ but that was cancelled so now its a kinda-sorta webinar taking place after the conference but its still actually a part of the conference and there was a poster during the actual conference but I felt weird listing that separately because what they call posters was actually still a pre-recorded talk that was basically the same as the webinar but abbreviated and not an actual poster and no one could even access the audio because of technical reasons or something."

Until the APA Pub Manual releases a special COVID edition, this is what you'll see for a bit. We all get it, so I wouldn't worry about. I'd probably write in that it was accepted as a paper but converted to a poster due to COVID-19 restrictions. If you split them out, I'd probably put it under the poster subheading though. Reasonable people can disagree on these things right now and something like this isn't going to make or break anything so don't stress too much.

Thanks! That’s helpful to know

 

[calimich]

Anyone else attending the Western Psychological Association conference today-Fri? Last year's conference was quickly changed to asynchronous/on-demand and my students already had work accepted. We put up our posters and not sure if anyone actually saw them. This year's a hybrid format and they gave huge discounts to anyone who attended last year. We have a couple posters/presentations uploaded with live "office hours" scheduled, we'll see...

 

[MCParent]

Also, I’m curious how poster presentations are working out virtually lol

One year when I was chair of convention for my APA division (this was far pre-COVID), we had huge success with doing the student poster session pre-conference and via twitter. People made their posters early and I put them on the div twitter, hashtagged. Many of the students got media interviews out of it.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

At this point, it seems the hotels wont let another year of conferences be dropped. I am expecting most, if not all, major conferences after the summer to be online or hybrid. Though, the hybrid component adds costs and is more likely to get dropped going forward.

 

[theSteppenwolf]

I’m doing APA at least. Largely because it’s a requirement for my comps portfolio.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

I’m doing APA at least. Largely because it’s a requirement for my comps portfolio.

Can you elaborate? Does your program require you to go to the annual APA conference (as opposed to any conference)? Or are you simply required to present at some national conference?

 

[theSteppenwolf]

Can you elaborate? Does your program require you to go to the annual APA conference (as opposed to any conference)? Or are you simply required to present at some national conference?

I just have to present as first author at a national conference. Apparently, I'm presenting at APS as well I found out today.

 

[WisNeuro]

Can you elaborate? Does your program require you to go to the annual APA conference (as opposed to any conference)? Or are you simply required to present at some national conference?

My program changed our comps a couple years after I graduated. Used to be a full day essay exam, now you can choose the exam or do a combo of publish in a peer reviewed journal and presentation at national conference.

 

[calimich]

Despite some awkwardness of the online platform, I'm glad I attended WPA. I thought is was well organized and I enjoyed seeing a wide variety of research. I also completed 7 CE hours and 11 people watched my talk! The students also had a nice time and we're planning on attending virtual APA in August.