argosy vs. Pacific Graduate School of Psychology

[flybunny]

Hello everyone- I am need of help! I just got accapted to Argosy's Psy.d program and Pacific Graduate School of Psychology distance learning program. I am so confused about what to do (but I need to make my decision quickly). I am worried about the disertation if I continue into the Ph.d program- as well as I am worried about graduating before I am 200 years old. I know Argosy's prestige is not as abundant but will I still be able to get a job and be a sucess if I graduate from there? Your help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

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[flybunny]

Hello everyone- I am need of help! I just got accapted to Argosy's Psy.d program and Pacific Graduate School of Psychology distance learning program. I am so confused about what to do (but I need to make my decision quickly). I am worried about the disertation if I continue into the Ph.d program- as well as I am worried about graduating before I am 200 years old. I know Argosy's prestige is not as abundant but will I still be able to get a job and be a sucess if I graduate from there? Your help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

can someone please give me advice? thanks

 

[Psyclops]

Ok FB, how old are you know? The sdissertation process at which school? What is theis distant ed program?

Look in the past threads to see what people thinka bout argos, i know they are back there.

 

[flybunny]

I am a 28 year old female (mother of one)- the distance learning program is at Pacific Graduate School of Psychology (in Palo Alto) and if I do well I would move into the Ph.d program in two years- from there I am worried about how 'do-able' the disertation is. I am not lazy I just want to be realistic.
The argosy program is four years and is the Psy.d program.
Thanks

 

[JatPenn]

What is your ultimate career goal, flybunny? If its providing mental health services, get an MSW. No dissertation, lots of job opportunities.

 

[flybunny]

What is your ultimate career goal, flybunny? If its providing mental health services, get an MSW. No dissertation, lots of job opportunities.

I agree that a masters would be alright- but I do love to learn and I would like to have a doctrate. do you have any opinion on pacific? It seems to be a good school but very expensive

 

[Psyclops]

FB, think long and hard before taking on all that debt. Please search some fo the past posts that discuss the debt situaiton of going to schools similar to the ones you have mentioned.

 

[50960]

There is a huge difference between and MSW and doctorate (PhD, PsyD). Remember how dangerous a little knowledge can be. If you want to counsel go with the MSW/MA route; if you want to treat psychological disorders go the doctoral route. PGS is a good program, so is Argosy.

 

[flybunny]

There is a huge difference between and MSW and doctorate (PhD, PsyD). Remember how dangerous a little knowledge can be. If you want to counsel go with the MSW/MA route; if you want to treat psychological disorders go the doctoral route. PGS is a good program, so is Argosy.

thank you so much for your advice. The truth- I liked ARgosy but the whole debate about its reputation. When I visited the school it went above my expectations. The students seemed knowledgable- etc. doubts began when my current professor told me not to go- she says that I am too smart for a school like that etc. but it seems to meet my needs (being a mother and all)- I only am straying away from the Ph.d b/c of the time it may take. Many of the students at Pacific take at least 8 years to finish- yikes. I am motivated but I don't feel that I would be one to beat the odds.
I just wish I could get a straight answer regarding Argosy. I don't want to go to a school where people won't take me seriously.

 

[50960]

Both will take you seriously...learn!! Most of what you need will happen after you are licensed anyhow.

 

[flybunny]

Both will take you seriously...learn!! Most of what you need will happen after you are licensed anyhow.

thank you so much- I should just follow my dreams...I am motivated to contribute to the end of the psy.d bias- I really care about the profession and not the crap that comes with the whole snobbery etc.
thank you- this forum is really helpful

 

[Dagny52]

I agree that a masters would be alright- but I do love to learn and I would like to have a doctrate. do you have any opinion on pacific? It seems to be a good school but very expensive

I got accepted at PGSP's PhD program and from what I've seen it is one of the very best freestanding schools. They appear to be more research oriented than most freestanding schools and definitely more oriented towards evidence based practice and giving the students a good scientific grounding. They have some really top notch faculty there and they're probably as good or even better than some of the University based programs. The main problem is, as you say, that it is very expensive. Tuition is around $30,000 per year and Palo Alto and the surrounding area is a very expensive place to live. The most financial aid they give is $5,000 per year and not everyone even gets that. So -- if some kind of unexpected financial windfall happens for me, I'd love to go there but as things stand right now, I'm probably going to have to pass on the offer. It's far more than I can afford.

Also, like most of the university-based PhD clin psych programs, it has an extensive practicum requirement (around 1800 hours, IIRC), plus a full year full time predoctoral internship, done after the dissertation (in some cases can be done in 2 years part time). Unlike most university based programs, they also have a 15 hour personal therapy requirement. The program is very time consuming and so it would be pretty much impossible to hold down a full-time job and go to school. Even a part time job would be tough. Many of the university based programs offer stipends plus full tuition so people can go to school without having to hold down a job but not so with PGSP. It would be a great program for people who are either independently wealthy or have someone such as a spouse or parents to support them while going to school.

 

[Dagny52]

Hmm, is it snobbery to hold expectations for how training should be handled in the field?

Psisci mentions that social workers are undertrained ("Remember how dangerous a little knowledge can be."). The same issues hold for standalone programs. There's no psy.d. bias, there's a professional school bias. The business models of these standalone schools are basically the University of Phoenix, DeVry, and so on. Many people don't consider these to be "real" universities. Why would professionals consider graduate degrees from similar institutions to be any better?

No, it's not snobbery and I wholeheartedly support you in having those expectations and high standards. I would agree with you that some of the freestanding schools are of inferior quality, but not all. It really does depend on the school. I carefully looked into PGSP and even asked faculty I know at top Boulder model University based programs what they thought of it and the ones familiar with it agreed that it is an excellent program and the Ph.D. program at PGSP is fully APA accredited.

In fact, one faculty member at a major University-based Psychology program told me that some of the people in the freestanding programs were beating his own students out for pre-doctoral internships because they had more clinical hours from their practica than his program did. The main problem with it is the high tuition. Because they give very little funding, they can accept more applicants, but the downside to this is that many of us cannot afford it. If I could afford it, I would be honored to go to PGSP. It may be true that many people don't consider these programs "real" but how many of those "many people" have really taken the trouble to actually look at specific programs and get the facts?

Let's face it, given the statistics, a high percentage of people who are qualified get rejected from University based programs because they can only accept a very small percentage of applicants. Those who are left out have to look at other options or look to other professions. Freestanding programs might be the only option for such people if they want a PhD. I share your concerns about some of these programs, but just looking at the statistics, given that they accept a much higher percentage of applicants, in the future, the majority of psychologists will very likely come from these programs if the small percentage acceptance rates at the University based programs continue. Wouldn't it be better to try to improve and support those programs? Like it or not, they're apparently here to stay. The only other alternative I can think of would be to find a way to accept more people into the University-based programs but that doesn't look like it's likely to happen in the near future when every year, things get more and more exclusive.

 

[Psyclops]

The only thing that still needs to be considered is that these programs are possibly creating more psychologists than the market can support. Which causes a whole host of problems, not the least fo which is a decline in salaries. It could be argued that with the advent of the mid-level providers, there is less of a need for a practicing psychologist, especially oone who plans on only doing therapy.