ASA Boston

[jthedestroyr]

who is here this year ?

A good set of my program is here and will be at the meet and great today!

blade did you come or anyone else?

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Members don't see this ad.

 

[repititionition]

bummed. this is my first miss in medical school (and in my application year...). but I made the last 3!

 

[deleted171991]

Too expensive. Typical ivory tower shortsightedness. Instead of putting the conference in cheap areas/hotels, they think it's still 2000, and most anesthesiologists still have $5000/year for CME. Of course, we all know who gets the time off to be able to go to the ASA meeting in the first place.

Btw, it's good mostly for networking only. I was at the one in San Diego, 2 years ago, and it was not worth the money, from an educational standpoint. So I didn't spend $500/conference plus $300/hotel/day this year, even if it was in the Northeast. For that money (times the huge number of attendees), they should have much better speakers.

No. I am not an ASA member either (for the first time in years). It's not worth the money, especially when I add the state society tax, too.

These organizations have grown to cancerous levels. Reminds me of SCCM harassing me with unsolicited calls for weeks, to renew my member****. Or the royal waste called the ASA headquarters, as if they are Ewing Oil:

 

[Lecithin5]

Too expensive. Typical ivory tower shortsightedness. Instead of putting the conference in cheap areas/hotels, they think it's still 2000, and most anesthesiologists still have $5000/year for CME. Of course, we all know who gets the time off to be able to go to the ASA meeting in the first place.

Btw, it's good mostly for networking only. I was at the one in San Diego, 2 years ago, and it was not worth the money, from an educational standpoint. So I didn't spend $500/conference plus $300/hotel/day this year, even if it was in the Northeast. For that money (times the huge number of attendees), they should have much better speakers.

No. I am not an ASA member either (for the first time in years). It's not worth the money, especially when I add the state society tax, too.

These organizations have grown to cancerous levels. Reminds me of SCCM harassing me with unsolicited calls for weeks, to renew my member****. Or the royal waste called the ASA headquarters, as if they are Ewing Oil:

I agree about how pricey these conferences can be. I was talking to my buddy who is an independent contractor, and although his daily rate is reasonable, after taxes, paying for health insurance and malpractice, and putting some away for retirement, there isn't much left over. So these events can be yet another burden for those who don't get cme perks a la academics. Even if you are in a private practice or in an employed position where you have some CME monies, the stipends aren't what they used to be.

 

[jthedestroyr]

I agree about how pricey these conferences can be. I was talking to my buddy who is an independent contractor, and although his daily rate is reasonable, after taxes, paying for health insurance and malpractice, and putting some away for retirement, there isn't much left over. So these events can be yet another burden for those who don't get cme perks a la academics. Even if you are in a private practice or in an employed position where you have some CME monies, the stipends aren't what they used to be.

well when its free its a great trip as a resident

 

[AdmiralChz]

It’s a great way to get quick and easy CME and meet up with collleagues. It’s a gigantic conference attended by thousands if not tens of thousands so clearly not everyone out there thinks it’s a total waste.

Depending on where it is, it can be a good time. San Diego and New Orleans were fantastic and in solid parts of town. Not much of a Boston or Chicago fan, personally. Many attendees roll in a vacation before/after as a result.

For me, I prefer a smaller more manageable conference. I’ve heard great things about IARS in terms of content and it tends to be in better areas (Hawaii recently) if you are looking for a general conference. I’m biased towards individual subspecialty (SCA, SPA, ASRA, etc...) conferences myself - I’ve been to the last few SCA’s which have been excellent and much easier to maneuver effectively. They are great networking conferences for residents interested in the fields as well.

Regardless, it’s a great (usually free-ish) experience for residents so I usually encourage them to submit posters accordingly. Just check with your programs about their meeting guidelines as I ran into a lot of issues at mine (still got to go, but had to crack some heads).

 

[deleted171991]

Respectfully. clearly not everyone keeps up with the literature during the year, or spends at least a couple of hours weekly to learn something new. For those, a conference is possibly the only way to stay educated. This is the 21st century; there are tons of information sources on the Internet, and, for critical care, blogs that beat the heck out of anything I have seen at a conference.

I don't go to national conferences for tourism. Hence, I don't care whether they are in Hawaii or Boston. But spending $3K on a conference is ridiculous, in this day and age. And that doesn't cover the better courses. For that money, one can get 200 hours of audio-digest, or 8 years of ptemasters (if bought in July), or access to many-many question banks, or 3 entire board review courses etc., with a much-much better educational value, on demand and at one's fingertips. The ASA meeting and even the membership are becoming a very bad value for anybody who pays out of pocket for them. $1K/year just to be an ASA and state society member? Seriously? For a $120/year journal that has more advertising and academic fluff than practical stuff that's pertinent to my practice? Because the advocacy is not there for the little guy, so why would this little guy bother financing them? They are just burning and wasting money, obviously; just look at those $25MM headquarters and $12MM in "equipment". Plus $3.5MM/year just for "executive compensation" of a non-profit, with some chief officers making $300K, and the CEO making $685K (see page 51)??? Plus another $11MM for the non-executive employees? Plus spending at least $4MM, i.e. 10% of the annual budget, on grants to its foundations and pets (FAER, AQI etc.), including at least $400K spent annually on a museum? (Take pictures, put them on the Internet with pertinent explanations, put the items in storage, and save $390K.)

Even when about networking, due to the sheer size of the conference, there is much less opportunity than one would think. I missed the meet and greet at San Diego and, as a consequence, I saw exactly 4 people from my former program during the ASA. Now subspecialty conferences may be a different thing, depending on the society. But I am not going to any of the megaconferences again, except maybe as part of a group.

I do encourage residents and fellows to go, at least once or twice, especially if it's in their neck of the woods. But, as an attending, anything more frequent than once in 5-10 years is probably a waste of time and money. Unless one has the CME money to spend anyway. I don't.

 

[psychbender]

2011 was the only time that I attended the ASA conference, and it was free to me, as I had posters for the medically challenging case presentations. The only lecture that I went to that year that proved to be of any value to me was the one on periop management of pacemakers and ICDs. My program, basically, just paid for me to drink in Chicago and sleep with my then-girlfriend in a nice hotel (she was there for a heart valve summit at the same time).

SOCCA and IARS were cheaper, and provided better educational opportunities when I went last year, and I plan to go to either SCA or SOCCA this year. Unfortunately, SCA's case submission rules look like only residents and CT fellows can submit trainee cases, so I will have to pay out of pocket for that one (with my poor fellow income), and have my program foot the bill for SOCCA, if I can find something interesting to write up.

 

[deleted171991]

2011 was the only time that I attended the ASA conference, and it was free to me, as I had posters for the medically challenging case presentations. The only lecture that I went to that year that proved to be of any value to me was the one on periop management of pacemakers and ICDs. My program, basically, just paid for me to drink in Chicago and sleep with my then-girlfriend in a nice hotel (she was there for a heart valve summit at the same time).

SOCCA and IARS were cheaper, and provided better educational opportunities when I went last year, and I plan to go to either SCA or SOCCA this year. Unfortunately, SCA's case submission rules look like only residents and CT fellows can submit trainee cases, so I will have to pay out of pocket for that one (with my poor fellow income), and have my program foot the bill for SOCCA, if I can find something interesting to write up.

I went to the SOCCA meeting this year. It was cheap, but also pretty unimpressive. However, that's a small "startup" society that is worth supporting just because it's much closer to its members and the idea of a non-profit.

 

[aneftp]

What’s everyone best guess who attends the ASA conference? My best guess is at least 80% who attend are those who get free or heavily subsidized travel voucher plus paid time off from work that doesn’t count against their real vacation days.

 

[deleted126335]

What’s everyone best guess who attends the ASA conference? My best guess is at least 80% who attend are those who get free or heavily subsidized travel voucher plus paid time off from work that doesn’t count against their real vacation days.

I have been to about six ASA meetings post residency. It does count against my total time off. I used to get it heavily subsidized, now I don't. I Still find it worth doing every few years. As a generalist, I find a decent amount of the educational offerings meaningful. If I were a sub specialist, I would feel differently. I like exploring other cities. I like reconnecting with people that I haven't seen in years. I do think that the organization is somewhat bloated.

 

[pjl]

I spent my vacation time, and my own money on the ASA conference last year. This also cost me a weeks wages which is the real expense when you are in private practice. The conference fees and lodging are minimal compared to that.
At a minimum, it was a pretax trip for my family (at least lodging) and a time when I can see a large amount of friends in an marginally interesting city (for me) that I otherwise wouldn't have travelled to. I made it a 10 day trip though and hung out before and after.

I went to a number of lectures that were good reviews on topics, but from an educational standpoint would be better off buying on demand. There are so many great lectures and you are frequently choosing between two good options. Many of the lectures are given by people who are reasonable behind the times though. Others are fantastic, and offer pearls to further practice.

I have actually enjoyed the PBLDs more than lectures as a way to hear about how various people/practices handle common challenges. To me that is interesting, but they are very group and leader dependent. Many time the foreign anesthesiologists are the most interesting due to their vastly different resources and cultural norms.

My suggestion would be to actually offer "ask the experts" sections on topics like the ASRA anticoagulant guidelines, or all the PSH nonsense. We can all read the papers ahead of time, but to hear the why behind the guidelines would be really interesting. I don't need someone to flash 30 slides on a topic and tell me what I already know. I want to know what was a failure that wasn't worth reporting in a journal.

I did not see a single industry exhibit that was innovative or will transform my practice, which was sad for me. I had hoped for more innovation.

I talked with quite a few residents, and since we are hiring, it was actually a reasonably cost effective opportunity to meet a bunch of possible future partners. Otherwise we blow hours on the phone, plane tickets, hotels, dinner, and time interviewing people that you can rule in or out with a 10 minute conversation.

All said, it would was worth it for me, and I will attend again, but not more than once every few years.

If you are worried about the 1000 bucks that being an ASA member costs you, you need to find a better job. Just consider it an extension of your MOCA fees/a job tax and never count the money as yours. For many, you can pay that, and be a chairman level ASAPAC donor for less than a days work. To me, failure to pay that tax for the small chance that the society has a project that does some good is irresponsible.

 

[IlDestriero]

You guys complain about everything.
You’re banking PP $$, profit sharing, more vacation, maxing retirement accounts that academic folks can only dream about, and complain that you can’t afford a meeting every couple years because you don’t get a $5k/yr or so expense account.
It’s ridiculous.
There probably is more value in the smaller specialty society meetings, BUT you don’t get exposure to some of the other fields that you’re maybe not keeping up with. That’s why I go every few years.
They have an on demand meeting now where you can review the content on your own. I’m trying that this year, though I am going to some of the lectures, I spent a good amount of time enjoying Boston and catching up with old friends.
I like to see what the vendors are showing off, what’s new or updated. I don’t really keep up with that tech stuff, so the dog and pony show can be educational. The meeting can be a great recruiting too as well.


--
Il Destriero

 

[pjl]

To be clear, I think it is worth it every few years, especially so if your group is hiring.

 

[dmk5n]

These organizations have grown to cancerous levels. Reminds me of SCCM harassing me with unsolicited calls for weeks, to renew my member****. Or the royal waste called the ASA headquarters, as if they are Ewing Oil:

...Paid for with MOCA dollars, LOL

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

Too expensive. Typical ivory tower shortsightedness. Instead of putting the conference in cheap areas/hotels, they think it's still 2000, and most anesthesiologists still have $5000/year for CME. Of course, we all know who gets the time off to be able to go to the ASA meeting in the first place.

Btw, it's good mostly for networking only. I was at the one in San Diego, 2 years ago, and it was not worth the money, from an educational standpoint. So I didn't spend $500/conference plus $300/hotel/day this year, even if it was in the Northeast. For that money (times the huge number of attendees), they should have much better speakers.

No. I am not an ASA member either (for the first time in years). It's not worth the money, especially when I add the state society tax, too.

These organizations have grown to cancerous levels. Reminds me of SCCM harassing me with unsolicited calls for weeks, to renew my member****. Or the royal waste called the ASA headquarters, as if they are Ewing Oil:

WOW. So accurate, its like you read my mind several months ago. I was considering going to this conference until I started adding up the cost. Hotels are EXPENSIVE on top of the outrageous costs for everything, I'm surprised Boston doesn't charge people an oxygen consumption fee and carbon dioxide disposal tax. This should be held in a more affordable area so students and residents can afford to go.

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

$1K/year just to be an ASA and state society member? Seriously? For a $120/year journal that has more advertising and academic fluff than practical stuff that's pertinent to my practice? Because the advocacy is not there for the little guy, so why would this little guy bother financing them? They are just burning and wasting money, obviously; just look at those $25MM headquarters and $12MM in "equipment". Plus $3.5MM/year just for "executive compensation" of a non-profit, with some chief officers making $300K, and the CEO making $685K (see page 51)??? Plus another $11MM for the non-executive employees? Plus spending at least $4MM, i.e. 10% of the annual budget, on grants to its foundations and pets (FAER, AQI etc.), including at least $400K spent annually on a museum? (Take pictures, put them on the Internet with pertinent explanations, put the items in storage, and save $390K.)

Worth repeating, especially the bold part. Why do we tolerate this kind of activity? This occurs in nearly all medical organizations. They are greedy fake non-profits designed to enrich themselves. Is there anyone who holds them accountable? Who approves these ridiculous salaries?

Hell, I'll take a chief officer position where I make $50,000 to attend a few meetings per year.

 

[deleted126335]

Given the size of the conference, (15,000 attendees and 300 exhibitors per the ASA website) the number of cities and convention centers that could accommodate is limited. That is why the same list of cities gets cycled.

 

[deleted171991]

Given the size of the conference, (15,000 attendees and 300 exhibitors per the ASA website) the number of cities and convention centers that could accommodate is limited. That is why the same list of cities gets cycled.

I am pretty sure there are much cheaper cities than Boston or San Diego on that list. Las Vegas come to mind, for example. I would do all the meetings there. The hotels are dirt cheap.

But, as I said, this conference is not about or for the average anesthesiologist. That's been sold out to the corporate interests running the ASA.

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

Given the size of the conference, (15,000 attendees and 300 exhibitors per the ASA website) the number of cities and convention centers that could accommodate is limited. That is why the same list of cities gets cycled.

I can assure you there are much cheaper cities that could easily accommodate this conference. Totally invalid argument. You would think the CEO making 685k could figure something better out, but he has plenty of money so why bother?

 

[Crabbygas]

I went for a couple of days. Boston was a horrible choice. There were few hotels near the convention center and they were hideously expensive. It's almost like the folks at the ASA are trying to drive us away. No surprise I bet few of the folks who pick the location pay out of their own pocket.

 

[deleted126335]

I am pretty sure there are much cheaper cities than Boston or San Diego on that list. Las Vegas come to mind, for example. I would do all the meetings there. The hotels are dirt cheap.

But, as I said, this conference is not about or for the average anesthesiologist. That's been sold out to the corporate interests running the ASA.

Many years ago I had a conversation with a past ASA officer. He said they used to go to Las Vegas. But attendance was so poor at the meetings that they decided to exclude the destination.

 

[flightnurse2MD]

WOW. So accurate, its like you read my mind several months ago. I was considering going to this conference until I started adding up the cost. Hotels are EXPENSIVE on top of the outrageous costs for everything, I'm surprised Boston doesn't charge people an oxygen consumption fee and carbon dioxide disposal tax. This should be held in a more affordable area so students and residents can afford to go.

I stayed in an Airbnb for 2 nights during the conference. $104.

 

[pgg]

Many years ago I had a conversation with a past ASA officer. He said they used to go to Las Vegas. But attendance was so poor at the meetings that they decided to exclude the destination.

That tells me they’re selling a vacation, not an academic meeting. Maybe the meeting should do a better job attracting people on its own merits. Instead of making 15,000 “vacationers” the benchmark for success, maybe they should aim for 8,000 “meeting goers”. Of course, that would hurt revenue.

I last went to the ASA when it was in San Francisco a few years ago. I was underwhelmed by the actual meeting. Mostly I went to lectures and panels. Maybe I’d have had a better experience if I’d done PBLDs and workshops (more $) instead. Not sure I’ll ever go back to see.


On a related note, I was looking at MOCA part 4 options today. There’s an online sim option now. 5 points per module (25 needed). The first one, trauma, is now available. $350. WTF.


At least the ABA gives me board certification in return for my money and time. I’m just not perceiving any real value from the ASA of late. ASAPAC ... maybe. But I’d have to rejoin the ASA to donate to them again.

 

[Twiggidy]

That tells me they’re selling a vacation, not an academic meeting. Maybe the meeting should do a better job attracting people on its own merits. Instead of making 15,000 “vacationers” the benchmark for success, maybe they should aim for 8,000 “meeting goers”. Of course, that would hurt revenue.

I last went to the ASA when it was in San Francisco a few years ago. I was underwhelmed by the actual meeting. Mostly I went to lectures and panels. Maybe I’d have had a better experience if I’d done PBLDs and workshops (more $) instead. Not sure I’ll ever go back to see.


On a related note, I was looking at MOCA part 4 options today. There’s an online sim option now. 5 points per module (25 needed). The first one, trauma, is now available. $350. WTF.


At least the ABA gives me board certification in return for my money and time. I’m just not perceiving any real value from the ASA of late. ASAPAC ... maybe. But I’d have to rejoin the ASA to donate to them again.

Going to a simulator actually wasnt that bad and the experience was way better than expected. Knocked out all 20 pts, did the 5 pt busy work after, and work reimbursed.

 

[deleted126335]

That tells me they’re selling a vacation, not an academic meeting. Maybe the meeting should do a better job attracting people on its own merits. Instead of making 15,000 “vacationers” the benchmark for success, maybe they should aim for 8,000 “meeting goers”. Of course, that would hurt revenue.
.

I wasn't clear on my post. People would still register for the meeting, but they would go to Vegas and then not show up so much at the lectures and workshops at the meeting. This occurs to some extent at all meetings but Vegas was apparently an outlier. Or so I was told about 25 years ago.

 

[Monterosso]

Overall had a good experience at ASA in Boston. Had been to a number of ASAs before, found this one well run. Weather was oddly fantastic. Attended a hands-on workshop or two which were great.

 

[deleted171991]

Overall had a good experience at ASA in Boston. Had been to a number of ASAs before, found this one well run. Weather was oddly fantastic. Attended a hands-on workshop or two which were great.

Total cost (to you or your employer)?

 

[chocomorsel]

I went for a couple of days. Boston was a horrible choice. There were few hotels near the convention center and they were hideously expensive. It's almost like the folks at the ASA are trying to drive us away. No surprise I bet few of the folks who pick the location pay out of their own pocket.

How much were the hotel?

 

[Monterosso]

Total cost (to you or your employer)?

Around 1000 (ASA affiliated hotel + flight, please note I presented there).

 

[GravelRider]

Some of the complaining on this thread is an exaggeration. The complaints about the value of the ASA and the meeting itself are worthwhile. However, the choice of cities seems like a silly point of discussion to me. First of all, Boston is an important city historically, culturally, and economically. There is certainly value in exposing more people to different cities around the country. The point about the cost of hotels and such is lost on me as well. Yes, Boston is going to have higher priced hotels, but you can easily find accommodations for $100-150 per night (especially given the abundance of AirBNB). There is a pretty decent public transit system in Boston making the need to stay within walking distance from the conference completely unnecessary. There are also a large number of anesthesiologists who benefit from being within driving distance when the meeting cycles back to a city nearby. When you factor in the blackjack, strippers, and dose of Ceftriaxone, Las Vegas ends up costing a heck of a lot more than Boston.

Plus, September and October in the northeast almost makes putting up with the weather in the remainder of the year worthwhile.

 

[chocomorsel]

Its currently warmer in Boston than it is in Dallas right now. However, doesn't it sometimes snow in October in the NE?

 

[WhiteCoatWonder]

WOW. So accurate, its like you read my mind several months ago. I was considering going to this conference until I started adding up the cost. Hotels are EXPENSIVE on top of the outrageous costs for everything, I'm surprised Boston doesn't charge people an oxygen consumption fee and carbon dioxide disposal tax. This should be held in a more affordable area so students and residents can afford to go.

agree with this! boston seems crazy expensive (in general) but our state society actually offered a pretty generous stipend to cover trip costs for student reps. no fringe bennies. no free food. no coffee after 10am but appreciative, nonetheless!

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

Some of the complaining on this thread is an exaggeration. The complaints about the value of the ASA and the meeting itself are worthwhile. However, the choice of cities seems like a silly point of discussion to me. First of all, Boston is an important city historically, culturally, and economically. There is certainly value in exposing more people to different cities around the country. The point about the cost of hotels and such is lost on me as well. Yes, Boston is going to have higher priced hotels, but you can easily find accommodations for $100-150 per night (especially given the abundance of AirBNB). There is a pretty decent public transit system in Boston making the need to stay within walking distance from the conference completely unnecessary. There are also a large number of anesthesiologists who benefit from being within driving distance when the meeting cycles back to a city nearby. When you factor in the blackjack, strippers, and dose of Ceftriaxone, Las Vegas ends up costing a heck of a lot more than Boston.

Plus, September and October in the northeast almost makes putting up with the weather in the remainder of the year worthwhile.

Says someone out of touch with reality. No matter how you slice it, Boston is expensive, everything is expensive. Choice of cities is not a silly point, I personally know a few people who didn't go because of the cost. I don't care about history, culture, and economy; that isn't what the conference is about, it isn't a vacation. Everything must be lost on you, it is actually really simple, Boston is expensive and prohibitive for many.

 

[nimbus]

Says someone out of touch with reality. No matter how you slice it, Boston is expensive, everything is expensive. Choice of cities is not a silly point, I personally know a few people who didn't go because of the cost. I don't care about history, culture, and economy; that isn't what the conference is about, it isn't a vacation. Everything must be lost on you, it is actually really simple, Boston is expensive and prohibitive for many.

Who’s really out of touch?

Boston is the birthplace of modern anesthesia. We should have a meeting there every once in awhile don’t you think?

And what other cities do you propose? Should they try Des Moines next year and see what kind of turnout they get? People will have an awesome time at the Hampton Inn and TGIF’s. It IS valuable vacation time for most of the attendees. Good luck.

I personally prefer smaller conferences in Hawaii or the mountains but that’s just me.

Everyone has there own reality but I’m probably a more typical conference attendee than you. And if your concern is for residents, I’m sure Boston is within the top 5 cities in terms of sheer number of anesthesia residents. They can all attend with minimal expense.

 

[AdmiralChz]

Says someone out of touch with reality. No matter how you slice it, Boston is expensive, everything is expensive. Choice of cities is not a silly point, I personally know a few people who didn't go because of the cost. I don't care about history, culture, and economy; that isn't what the conference is about, it isn't a vacation. Everything must be lost on you, it is actually really simple, Boston is expensive and prohibitive for many.

There are only so many places with the conference space/capacity that can host ASA. I went to New Orleans a couple of years ago - very reasonable rates and affordable to attend (compared to Boston this year, also next year it's in San Fran so no improvement). You are basically limited to the largest cities in America (plus Las Vegas) for options, and they hop all over the country (off the top of my head - NOLA, San Diego, Chicago, San Fran, Boston in recent years). Houston, Orlando and maybe Seattle would be cheaper alternatives, but maybe not as attractive as a destination spot.

 

[IlDestriero]

I think the people out of touch with reality are the ones that think an anesthesiologist can’t afford to spend $2-3k to go away for a meeting for four days every few years. Pediatricians can afford that. My plumber can afford that. Get a poster in there and many (?most) residency/fellowship programs will pay for at least part of your trip, meeting fees, etc. Mine had an annual professional expense account for things like a meeting, board review, etc. You didn’t even have to present anything.
The big meeting has value because it’s so broad, you can network, even get involved, and all the vendors come for show and tell.
The city definitely plays a role. It’s part of the package. Yes the host cities are expensive, but they’re a desirable location. If you stay at the Hampton Inn instead of the Four Seasons or some boutique hotel across the street you’ll save 2/3, double up as a resident and you could be under $100 a night. I don’t go to meetings in flyover country, Orlando in the summer, etc. Why would I? I don’t even accept invited lectures there.
I think over the years I’ve had better lectures at the IARS meetings than the ASA. They seem to have better lecturers and less political choices. For example, there’s someone I know that lectured at the ASA this year and had a workshop as well. Ok, however he doesn’t currently practice the thing that he’s talking about and he hasn’t for years. I don’t think he ever published about that either. Politics at work, who you know not what you know.
The problem with the smaller meetings of course is they’re much more limited in scope and have fewer options. You either want to hear what they’re offering at that block or not.
The one day peds meeting was like that this year. AM good, PM worthless. (To me anyway)
That’s where the ASA shines. Many, many choices and it’s easy to fill up a day with at least potentially interesting content.

--
Il Destriero

 

[GravelRider]

Says someone out of touch with reality. No matter how you slice it, Boston is expensive, everything is expensive. Choice of cities is not a silly point, I personally know a few people who didn't go because of the cost. I don't care about history, culture, and economy; that isn't what the conference is about, it isn't a vacation. Everything must be lost on you, it is actually really simple, Boston is expensive and prohibitive for many.

Relax. I'm not out of touch with reality. If you can't figure out how to budget a few day trip to NYC, Boston, or San Francisco then maybe you need to use your reality and figure out some basic financial management...even on a resident's salary. Plenty of people live in those cities on a resident's salary. If you can't find accommodations for around $100 a night in those cities then I don't know what to tell you.

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

Who’s really out of touch?

Boston is the birthplace of modern anesthesia. We should have a meeting there every once in awhile don’t you think?

And what other cities do you propose? Should they try Des Moines next year and see what kind of turnout they get? People will have an awesome time at the Hampton Inn and TGIF’s. It IS valuable vacation time for most of the attendees. Good luck.

I personally prefer smaller conferences in Hawaii or the mountains but that’s just me.

Everyone has there own reality but I’m probably a more typical conference attendee than you. And if your concern is for residents, I’m sure Boston is within the top 5 cities in terms of sheer number of anesthesia residents. They can all attend with minimal expense.

No, I don't think we should have a meeting there every once in a while. Doesn't matter if it is the birth place.

You are more of a conference attendee than me, because I didn't go to this year specifically because of the cost.

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

I think the people out of touch with reality are the ones that think an anesthesiologist can’t afford to spend $2-3k to go away for a meeting for four days every few years. Pediatricians can afford that. My plumber can afford that. Get a poster in there and many (?most) residency/fellowship programs will pay for at least part of your trip, meeting fees, etc. Mine had an annual professional expense account for things like a meeting, board review, etc. You didn’t even have to present anything.
The big meeting has value because it’s so broad, you can network, even get involved, and all the vendors come for show and tell.
The city definitely plays a role. It’s part of the package. Yes the host cities are expensive, but they’re a desirable location. If you stay at the Hampton Inn instead of the Four Seasons or some boutique hotel across the street you’ll save 2/3, double up as a resident and you could be under $100 a night. I don’t go to meetings in flyover country, Orlando in the summer, etc. Why would I? I don’t even accept invited lectures there.
I think over the years I’ve had better lectures at the IARS meetings than the ASA. They seem to have better lecturers and less political choices. For example, there’s someone I know that lectured at the ASA this year and had a workshop as well. Ok, however he doesn’t currently practice the thing that he’s talking about and he hasn’t for years. I don’t think he ever published about that either. Politics at work, who you know not what you know.
The problem with the smaller meetings of course is they’re much more limited in scope and have fewer options. You either want to hear what they’re offering at that block or not.
The one day peds meeting was like that this year. AM good, PM worthless. (To me anyway)
That’s where the ASA shines. Many, many choices and it’s easy to fill up a day with at least potentially interesting content.

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Il Destriero

It isn't just anesthesiologists, there are also medical students, fellows, and residents. Some programs pay or subsidize the trip, many do not or only help pay for one conference.

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

Relax. I'm not out of touch with reality. If you can't figure out how to budget a few day trip to NYC, Boston, or San Francisco then maybe you need to use your reality and figure out some basic financial management...even on a resident's salary. Plenty of people live in those cities on a resident's salary. If you can't find accommodations for around $100 a night in those cities then I don't know what to tell you.

This post shows how out of touch with reality you really are. It isn't about budgeting. In my current position, I'm not going to take out more student loans to pay for this expensive conference. I have excellent financial management skills, avoiding money pitfalls like this conference is a perfect example. It isn't just the cost of the hotel, in these larger cities many times the hotels charge for parking, internet, breakfast...etc. I'm not going to spend a whole year saving up to go to a conference like this, one would be much better using the money for something else. Sure, you could get a cheaper hotel further away from the conference and then you have the hassle and expensive of getting to the conference each day. Plane tickets, transportation, parking, hotel, meals, cost of conference, and miscellaneous expenses; add all those together and it is easy to see how this type of conference can quickly become very expensive.

 

[AdmiralChz]

This post shows how out of touch with reality you really are. It isn't about budgeting. In my current position, I'm not going to take out more student loans to pay for this expensive conference. I have excellent financial management skills, avoiding money pitfalls like this conference is a perfect example. It isn't just the cost of the hotel, in these larger cities many times the hotels charge for parking, internet, breakfast...etc. I'm not going to spend a whole year saving up to go to a conference like this, one would be much better using the money for something else. Sure, you could get a cheaper hotel further away from the conference and then you have the hassle and expensive of getting to the conference each day. Plane tickets, transportation, parking, hotel, meals, cost of conference, and miscellaneous expenses; add all those together and it is easy to see how this type of conference can quickly become very expensive.

Precedexed Out, is that you? Dude relax, no one cares if you don’t go to the conference. I didn’t go (fellowship is sorta busy) but I’m sure they didn’t have a crying session over my absence. Once you’re a resident present a poster and your department will pay for you to go.

Regardless you’re a medical student so I’ll take all your financial management knowledge with a gigantic grain of Precedex salt.

 

[IlDestriero]

No, I don't think we should have a meeting there every once in a while. Doesn't matter if it is the birth place.

You are more of a conference attendee than me, because I didn't go to this year specifically because of the cost.

Sounds like you need to take that up with your residency program. Are they providing you research opportunities? Mentorship to write up and submit interesting cases? Do they include residents in their submissions? Do they lecture, present, do workshops? Etc.
Do they have a fund for residents to attend these meetings? If not, why not. That’s a business decision that they made internally. One of my old program’s goals was to send every resident to one meeting during their training whether they presented or not. Going to a major meeting, seeing what goes on there, the committees, governance, etc. is a part of your education. Obviously if you were presenting something, they supported that as well. Maybe not 5 nights in Boston at the Ritz Carlton, but airfare and a hotel for a night or two, plus the fees and poster, etc.
You can have the meeting in Iowa or somewhere in the middle of nowhere, and it will be cheap, but nobody will come. You can take that to the bank. You’re thinking like a poorly compensated resident. When you’re a highly compensated attending, you’re not going to want to go to DesMoines for a meeting, or ever probably. There’s no appeal. It’s a working vacation. Even if you have 17 Committee meetings and 2 lectures, you’re still catching up with friends, networking, having some nice dinner and drinks, going sailing, a sports game, tacking on a day for a side trip, etc. And if you’re not, you’re doing it wrong.
There are affordable regional resident research meetings, at least there used to be. Maybe look into one of them.


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Il Destriero

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

Precedexed Out, is that you? Dude relax, no one cares if you don’t go to the conference. I didn’t go (fellowship is sorta busy) but I’m sure they didn’t have a crying session over my absence. Once you’re a resident present a poster and your department will pay for you to go.

Regardless you’re a medical student so I’ll take all your financial management knowledge with a gigantic grain of Precedex salt.

No, but thanks for the compliment.

Are you suggesting that financial management knowledge is somehow correlated with being a medical student, resident, or attending? Foolish thing to say. If one hasn't figured out how to manage money before medical school, they probably won't know how to do it any better after, but nice jab.

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

Sounds like you need to take that up with your residency program. Are they providing you research opportunities? Mentorship to write up and submit interesting cases? Do they include residents in their submissions? Do they lecture, present, do workshops? Etc.
Do they have a fund for residents to attend these meetings? If not, why not. That’s a business decision that they made internally. One of my old program’s goals was to send every resident to one meeting during their training whether they presented or not. Going to a major meeting, seeing what goes on there, the committees, governance, etc. is a part of your education. Obviously if you were presenting something, they supported that as well. Maybe not 5 nights in Boston at the Ritz Carlton, but airfare and a hotel for a night or two, plus the fees and poster, etc.
You can have the meeting in Iowa or somewhere in the middle of nowhere, and it will be cheap, but nobody will come. You can take that to the bank. You’re thinking like a poorly compensated resident. When you’re a highly compensated attending, you’re not going to want to go to DesMoines for a meeting, or ever probably. There’s no appeal. It’s a working vacation. Even if you have 17 Committee meetings and 2 lectures, you’re still catching up with friends, networking, having some nice dinner and drinks, going sailing, a sports game, tacking on a day for a side trip, etc. And if you’re not, you’re doing it wrong.
There are affordable regional resident research meetings, at least there used to be. Maybe look into one of them.


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Il Destriero

The amount (if any) paid towards these conference by residency programs seems to vary.

I'll have to take you at your word about the perspective of an attending. I can appreciate that attendings want to go to cities with other things to do besides the conference.

 

[Tuohy]

Just to give some perspective (I am fairly involved with ASA)-the meeting locations are decided YEARS in advance-for example, the locations for ASA 2031 and 2032 have already been decided. In addition, the last time that ASA was even in Boston was 1972!!!

 

[IlDestriero]

It isn't just anesthesiologists, there are also medical students, fellows, and residents. Some programs pay or subsidize the trip, many do not or only help pay for one conference.

They are welcome to attend of course, but the conference is set up for practicing anesthesiologists. That’s who it’s for, and why it exists. It’s more than just some lectures. They don’t need to cater to the minority of the attendees.
As I said above, the major society meetings have many goals. Education through lectures and posters both review and emerging research, hands on workshops, committee meetings, the business of the society, networking and collaboration opportunities, a job fair, and of course the vendor dog and pony show.
To maximize the number of attendees you need to offer something of value in a place worth going to.


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Il Destriero

 

[GravelRider]

This post shows how out of touch with reality you really are. It isn't about budgeting. In my current position, I'm not going to take out more student loans to pay for this expensive conference. I have excellent financial management skills, avoiding money pitfalls like this conference is a perfect example. It isn't just the cost of the hotel, in these larger cities many times the hotels charge for parking, internet, breakfast...etc. I'm not going to spend a whole year saving up to go to a conference like this, one would be much better using the money for something else. Sure, you could get a cheaper hotel further away from the conference and then you have the hassle and expensive of getting to the conference each day. Plane tickets, transportation, parking, hotel, meals, cost of conference, and miscellaneous expenses; add all those together and it is easy to see how this type of conference can quickly become very expensive.

Taking out loans to go to a conference? And I'm the one out of touch with reality? If you can't afford it, don't go. I just don't see how the location affects cost to such a significant degree that you have to take out loans.

As for myself, a practicing anesthesiologist, I am much more likely to go to a conference located in Boston or San Francisco than I am one in Boise. When I do go to these conferences, I like to spend down time socializing, exploring a city, or having a good meal at a nice restaurant. Maybe I'm out of touch, but I doubt I'm in the minority.

 

[Triple Cheeseburger]

Taking out loans to go to a conference? And I'm the one out of touch with reality? If you can't afford it, don't go. I just don't see how the location affects cost to such a significant degree that you have to take out loans.

As for myself, a practicing anesthesiologist, I am much more likely to go to a conference located in Boston or San Francisco than I am one in Boise. When I do go to these conferences, I like to spend down time socializing, exploring a city, or having a good meal at a nice restaurant. Maybe I'm out of touch, but I doubt I'm in the minority.

If you are a medical student and go to this conference, most likely the funding comes from borrowed money.

 

[nimbus]

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