Autism Spectrum Disorder on application?

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xnfs93hy

xnfs93hy

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I was diagnosed with ADHD and Asperger's Syndrome back in high school. Having these mental disabilities has made it challenging for me to get through school, but with reasonable accommodations made, I was able to excel. My cumulative GPA is above a 3.8 and my science GPA is a 3.74. I hope to bump these figures up a little bit during my last year of college (I start up again in the fall of this year.) I'm an active volunteer in the community (I help younger kids with mental disabilities) and an autism advocate. This is definitely a big part of my life and I'd like to be able to show the admissions committee how I overcame struggles in college and am using the free time I have to make a positive impact in the lives of others. Furthermore, I am part of a lab on campus (been there for a few years now) that does neuroscience research with a focus on autism spectrum disorders. I have published a few papers with my PI.

How do you think I should word this on my application? Do the members of the admissions committee take life challenges/experiences into account when they review your application? I don't want a mental disability to hold me back from pursuing this fantastic field of study. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! 🙂
 
How can you be certain you have those disorders? You would need to be tested at least 50 times to draw any kind of reliable conclusion--it's psychology.
 
Showing how you became an advocate for others with these disabilities shows that they didn't hold you back enough to make you unproductive. Being able to illustrate that you've overcome challenges is a big plus for adcoms, but I'm not sure which part of the app you'd include this in besides if schools ask about a significant challenge in their secondary app.

Isn't Asperger's now removed from the DSM as an actual disorder?
 
Styrene said:
How can you be certain you have those disorders? You would need to be tested at least 50 times to draw any kind of reliable conclusion--it's psychology.
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I went through a battery of tests during my high school years and the conclusion that my small team of physicians came to was a combination of mild Asperger's and ADHD. I saw two pediatric neurologists and a psychiatrist at that time and they all came up with the same conclusion. I really don't understand what you're trying to say. It's not like I just made up a couple of disorders out of thin air and labeled myself with them.
 
UNMedGa said:
Showing how you became an advocate for others with these disabilities shows that they didn't hold you back enough to make you unproductive. Being able to illustrate that you've overcome challenges is a big plus for adcoms, but I'm not sure which part of the app you'd include this in besides if schools ask about a significant challenge in their secondary app.

Isn't Asperger's now removed from the DSM as an actual disorder?
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Thank you for the helpful advice. And yes, Asperger's Syndrome is not included in the DSM-V. It now all falls under Autism Spectrum Disorder or ASD.
 
xnfs93hy said:
I was diagnosed with ADHD and Asperger's Syndrome back in high school. Having these mental disabilities has made it challenging for me to get through school, but with reasonable accommodations made, I was able to excel. My cumulative GPA is above a 3.8 and my science GPA is a 3.74. I hope to bump these figures up a little bit during my last year of college (I start up again in the fall of this year.) I'm an active volunteer in the community (I help younger kids with mental disabilities) and an autism advocate. This is definitely a big part of my life and I'd like to be able to show the admissions committee how I overcame struggles in college and am using the free time I have to make a positive impact in the lives of others. Furthermore, I am part of a lab on campus (been there for a few years now) that does neuroscience research with a focus on autism spectrum disorders. I have published a few papers with my PI.

How do you think I should word this on my application? Do the members of the admissions committee take life challenges/experiences into account when they review your application? I don't want a mental disability to hold me back from pursuing this fantastic field of study. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! 🙂
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Sort of a tough one. I have a different disability, but have been advised to keep it out of my PS. I will talk about it in a secondary on overcoming challenges, but I'm not bringing it up otherwise, even with some of my tutoring of others with disabilities. Others I have been in communication with test and classroom accommodations who have been successful in getting into medical school have not mentioned their issues in their PS. Adcoms want assurances you will be able to successfully complete med school and Step exams. With 20-30 applications for every medical school spot, I've been advised not to give them any hesitation in reviewing my app. Unfortunately, not a lot of folks with disabilities make it this far to be a competitive candidate, so we don't have numbers to overcome adcom concerns. Good luck to you.
 
Rainbow Zebra said:
Sort of a tough one. I have a different disability, but have been advised to keep it out of my PS. I will talk about it in a secondary on overcoming challenges, but I'm not bringing it up otherwise, even with some of my tutoring of others with disabilities. Others I have been in communication with test and classroom accommodations who have been successful in getting into medical school have not mentioned their issues in their PS. Adcoms want assurances you will be able to successfully complete med school and Step exams. With 20-30 applications for every medical school spot, I've been advised not to give them any hesitation in reviewing my app. Unfortunately, not a lot of folks with disabilities make it this far to be a competitive candidate, so we don't have numbers to overcome adcom concerns. Good luck to you.
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Thank you for the thoughtful response. I know that my current GPA is competitive enough for medical school. I never failed a class in undergrad, but I have had to work harder to keep up with my peers. The thing with me is that I take longer than other students to solve problems, but I nearly always come up with the correct solution. It simply takes me longer to arrive at the solution. I'm very careful and methodical, and that can sometimes be a disadvantage. It sort of worries me a bit that I might not make it into medical school because of my disability. Medicine has been something that I've wanted to pursue for a while now and it would be really heartbreaking to be screened out of medical school due to learning disabilities. I know that I am intelligent and hardworking enough to become a physician. I understand that admission committee members want to be assured that all of their students will complete medical school and pass the boards. They are, after all, making an investment by accepting you into the class.

What's worrying me now is how medical school adcoms will view someone like me. It sounds like they may see me as a liability.
 
eternelle said:
I think that you're an interesting applicant in that your disorder drove you to do multiple things that will be in your application. Because of what you've said, I perceive you to be very driven directly because of your disorder. For that reason, I think that it might be OK to include it in your app as long as you continue to portray yourself that way. Maybe you could slip it into the activities section or something if you decide you want your whole school list to know that about you. I wouldn't linger on it too much though and definitely don't talk about learning disabilities.
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I'm guessing I shouldn't speak about learning disabilities because that may send off a red flag. Would that be a fair assumption?
 
eternelle said:
Yeah, I think it's dangerous territory. Some people might read it as you overcoming a lot, but others might read it as a major weakness. Whatever you decide to do, consider having multiple friends, advisors, etc. read your app to make sure that everyone thinks you're portraying yourself in the best light. This is a very subjective process.
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Thanks for the advice. I just find it kind of sad that some might see this as a major weakness. I don't see it that way. Yes, these disorders can make it difficult to learn sometimes, there's no doubt about it; however, my different way of thinking has served me well in my study of engineering and the undergraduate research that I have performed. I would think that medical schools would appreciate someone in their class who thinks differently and can offer alternative solutions to problems. I will certainly have multiple people (friends, colleagues, etc.) read over my application.

Some of the recent previous posts are leading me to believe that, regardless of overcoming personal struggles and all that I have achieved in spite of these conditions, I will be fighting an uphill battle when I apply for admission to programs.
 
xnfs93hy said:
Thanks for the advice. I just find it kind of sad that some might see this as a major weakness. I don't see it that way. Yes, these disorders can make it difficult to learn sometimes, there's no doubt about it; however, my different way of thinking has served me well in my study of engineering and the undergraduate research that I have performed. I would think that medical schools would appreciate someone in their class who thinks differently and can offer alternative solutions to problems. I will certainly have multiple people (friends, colleagues, etc.) read over my application.

Some of the recent previous posts are leading me to believe that, regardless of overcoming personal struggles and all that I have achieved in spite of these conditions, I will be fighting an uphill battle when I apply for admission to programs.
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Yes, this is the sad reality that ADA is law, but you still need to keep your disability quiet until you are accepted, then high tail it over to the learning resource people to get your accommodations verified and approved. However, most med schools have a few students every class who get some type of accommodation, and the folks that administer this are different than the admissions and faculty. PM if you have any other questions, as I have a couple of years of conversations with other folks with accommodations on MCAT, Medical School classes, etc.
 
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Thanks for all of the responses, guys. I truly appreciate it. You've all provided me with invaluable information going forward. I will continue to push forward and hopefully knock out the MCAT this fall. Again, thanks for everything.
 
You haven't taken your MCAT yet but your GPA is definitely in a solid range. There's no reason to bring up any disorders you have; you've done very well for yourself despite them and if you don't list them no one is going to look at a 3.8/3.74 and think this student isn't capable of handling med school based on your GPA alone. Nothing good will come up from you bringing it up; at worst it won't be a factor.

If someone's thought process here was "oh well I have a disorder so that kind of shows them that I've been able to accomplish all I can in spite of it and I'll get judged by less harsh standards because I have it.....hey URMS are able to get in with lower stats because they've had to deal with unique obstacles in their life" well.......that's not how admission works. I know someone who has argued exactly that in a similar position to you which is why I brought up that mindset and let's just say it is full of flaws.
 
GrapesofRath said:
You haven't taken your MCAT yet but your GPA is definitely in a solid range. There's no reason to bring up any disorders you have; you've done very well for yourself despite them and if you don't list them no one is going to look at a 3.8/3.74 and think this student isn't capable of handling med school based on your GPA alone. Nothing good will come up from you bringing it up; at worst it won't be a factor.

If someone's thought process here was "oh well I have a disorder so that kind of shows them that I've been able to accomplish all I can in spite of it and I'll get judged by less harsh standards because I have it.....hey URMS are able to get in with lower stats because they've had to deal with unique obstacles in their life" well.......that's not how admission works. I know someone who has argued exactly that in a similar position to you which is why I brought up that mindset and let's just say it is full of flaws.
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I don't expect to be judged by less harsh standards. I expect to be treated like everyone else. I just mentioned earlier that I find it a bit sad that some would see these disorders as a liability or they might raise red flags if I work them into my essay when I speak about community involvement. If it's better to not mention them at all, then I will refrain from doing so.
 
xnfs93hy said:
I don't expect to be judged by less harsh standards. I expect to be treated like everyone else. I just mentioned earlier that I find it a bit sad that some would see these disorders as a liability or they might raise red flags if I work them into my essay when I speak about community involvement. If it's better to not mention them at all, then I will refrain from doing so.
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I definitely wasn't saying that was YOUR mindset, I was simply making a mention of it because a good friend of mine in a similar spot as yours and is also extremely bright and yet had this thought process. I brought it up to show how flawed it is in case anybody else had similar thought, and it certainly is possible someone could.

I agree, it is rather sad that the first thought an ADCOM could have seeing someone with a 3.8/3.75 who mentions having disorders is "this kid won't be able to hack it in med school he is a liability if we take him". Unfortunately, I have a really good family friend involved with med school admission for a school in my city and I am in a situation that kind of is relateable to yours(had issues with seizures, consciousness and other neurological issues and had to take a year off from school and graduate in 5 years) and have had several long extensive enlightening conversations with her about it. She has said repeatedly it's in your and my best interest not to mention them. PM me and I can gladly give you more details but long story short there are some ADCOMs paranoid about issues such as these and who are stuck on the idea that if you've have issues, even if your doing well now, they can come back and haunt you and cause problems. In their mind, why take a chance on someone who has issues that could possibly cause them problems in such a stressful environment such as med school when we have so many other qualified applicants? She called it "pure stubbornness" on these ADCOMs part but it does exist and we've talked so much about it and I know her so well I have no doubt in my mind she's correct about this. It's very possible one of the good folks involved with admissions on here will come on and say this is not how they approach such cases at all, but regardless it's just in your best intention refraining from listing this. There is nothing positive that can come from listing it let's put it that way. There are many other ways of talking about/showing you made a positive impact on others than to mention your own struggles with these conditions. Best of luck mate.
 
No. It sucks, because like other people said it would fit in nicely, but what about someone that was depressed, tried to end their life, and then overcame that depression and now helps others? Inspirational? Yes. But the only thing going through the adcom's head is "liability liability liability". With ASD it's not as intense, but mentioning any mental issue at all is a terrible idea. Every year medical schools easily have ~50-100 people (minimum) that are just as qualified to be a part of the class. Med schools are risk averse. It is what it is. Hope this helps!
 
I think that what you've mentioned above is good, not just because it is "overcoming adversity" to have ADHD and Asperger's and maintain a high GPA, but because it has actually motivated you to get involved in the ASD community. It is clearly a big part of what makes you unique and I would imagine would easily tie into the "why medicine question." I would caution you to be careful about how you talk about it, though. Your goal should not be to convince the readers how tough it has been for you or how sad your life is, but instead to show them what makes you an awesome person and why you'd be a great doctor. I'm not convinced that Asperger's syndrome or ADHD will have as much stigma as some people here are saying, but I could see it being an issue for some adcomms.
 
GrapesofRath said:
I definitely wasn't saying that was YOUR mindset, I was simply making a mention of it because a good friend of mine in a similar spot as yours and is also extremely bright and yet had this thought process. I brought it up to show how flawed it is in case anybody else had similar thought, and it certainly is possible someone could.

I agree, it is rather sad that the first thought an ADCOM could have seeing someone with a 3.8/3.75 who mentions having disorders is "this kid won't be able to hack it in med school he is a liability if we take him". Unfortunately, I have a really good family friend involved with med school admission for a school in my city and I am in a situation that kind of is relateable to yours(had issues with seizures, consciousness and other neurological issues and had to take a year off from school and graduate in 5 years) and have had several long extensive enlightening conversations with her about it. She has said repeatedly it's in your and my best interest not to mention them. PM me and I can gladly give you more details but long story short there are some ADCOMs paranoid about issues such as these and who are stuck on the idea that if you've have issues, even if your doing well now, they can come back and haunt you and cause problems. In their mind, why take a chance on someone who has issues that could possibly cause them problems in such a stressful environment such as med school when we have so many other qualified applicants? She called it "pure stubbornness" on these ADCOMs part but it does exist and we've talked so much about it and I know her so well I have no doubt in my mind she's correct about this. It's very possible one of the good folks involved with admissions on here will come on and say this is not how they approach such cases at all, but regardless it's just in your best intention refraining from listing this. There is nothing positive that can come from listing it let's put it that way. There are many other ways of talking about/showing you made a positive impact on others than to mention your own struggles with these conditions. Best of luck mate.
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I apologize for getting upset with you. The way I read the post, it sounded like you were implying that is was my mindset. As you may be able to tell, it was difficult for me to distinguish.
 
xnfs93hy said:
I was diagnosed with ADHD and Asperger's Syndrome back in high school. Having these mental disabilities has made it challenging for me to get through school, but with reasonable accommodations made, I was able to excel. My cumulative GPA is above a 3.8 and my science GPA is a 3.74. I hope to bump these figures up a little bit during my last year of college (I start up again in the fall of this year.) I'm an active volunteer in the community (I help younger kids with mental disabilities) and an autism advocate. This is definitely a big part of my life and I'd like to be able to show the admissions committee how I overcame struggles in college and am using the free time I have to make a positive impact in the lives of others. Furthermore, I am part of a lab on campus (been there for a few years now) that does neuroscience research with a focus on autism spectrum disorders. I have published a few papers with my PI.

How do you think I should word this on my application? Do the members of the admissions committee take life challenges/experiences into account when they review your application? I don't want a mental disability to hold me back from pursuing this fantastic field of study. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! 🙂
Click to expand...

Times change quickly and I was an applicant two years ago. At that time, the conventional wisdom was to not mention anything from a mild form of ADHD to a serious diagnosis like APD/Schizophrenia/ASD/etc. The reasoning behind this was, assuming that you're taking steps to manage your mental health and it is under control, bringing attention to it has more of a potential to bring doubt to your application than count as overcoming adversity. Also, you are not obligated to let admissions know about your mental health. I've personally seen mental health services offered at orientation which are both free and confidential for students. If you speak to your school counselor, I'd imagine more in depth options are available for those who need them and you can pursue all this once you are admitted. Unless times have changed, I still don't think the time is right to open up about mental health issues especially in the field of medicine.

Your GPA is high enough to negate an concerns about ADHD. As for Asperger's, as I advised in an earlier thread, I've seen classmates with the condition and feel like they definitely belong in medicine. I say don't mention it even though it fits with your area of research and brings together your story which is exactly what adcoms want to see in a PS.
 
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Donald Juan said:
I think that what you've mentioned above is good, not just because it is "overcoming adversity" to have ADHD and Asperger's and maintain a high GPA, but because it has actually motivated you to get involved in the ASD community. It is clearly a big part of what makes you unique and I would imagine would easily tie into the "why medicine question." I would caution you to be careful about how you talk about it, though. Your goal should not be to convince the readers how tough it has been for you or how sad your life is, but instead to show them what makes you an awesome person and why you'd be a great doctor. I'm not convinced that Asperger's syndrome or ADHD will have as much stigma as some people here are saying, but I could see it being an issue for some adcomms.
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Wholeheartedly agree with you here, Donald. I intend to mold my answer to that prompt with what I have been able to accomplish and how that would make me a good candidate.
 
Ugh, this is so hard.

I feel like a story like yours is so intertwined with why medicine that it's hard for you to ignore writing about it and be true to yourself right? Do you think you can write as strong a personal statement by talking about the connections you've had with patients?

@Goro @gyngyn @Catalystik @gonnif , what are your thoughts? I feel like a PS with such a personal experience in the face of clearly having overcome things could be so powerful if done right!
 
I would just mention your work with ASD populations and leave out your own personal experiences. I don't really see your own diagnosis as relevant to your interest in medicine as I do the work and research (though they obviously stemmed from your own experiences). You will very likely be asked why you got involved in that work to begin with, and perhaps that would be the opportunity to discuss that aspect of your life experience.
 
Backtothebasics8 said:
Times change quickly and I was an applicant two years ago. At that time, the conventional wisdom was to not mention anything from a mild form of ADHD to a serious diagnosis like APD/Schizophrenia/ASD/etc. The reasoning behind this was, assuming that you're taking steps to manage your mental health and it is under control, bringing attention to it has more of a potential to bring doubt to your application than count as overcoming adversity. Also, you are not obligated to let admissions know about your mental health. I've personally seen mental health services offered at orientation which are both free and confidential for students. If you speak to your school counselor, I'd imagine more in depth options are available for those who need them and you can pursue all this once you are admitted. Unless times have changed, I still don't think the time is right to open up about mental health issues especially in the field of medicine.

Your GPA is high enough to negate an concerns about ADHD. As for Asperger's, as I advised in an earlier thread, I've seen classmates with the condition and feel like they definitely belong in medicine. I say don't mention it even though it fits with your area of research and brings together your story which is exactly what adcoms want to see in a PS.
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Makes sense to me. I'll focus on what I have done in spite of my learning disabilities. I will avoid mentioning that I have any disabilities in my personal statement, even though it would tie in with my story. I don't want to inadvertently raise any red flags.
 
ridethecliche said:
Ugh, this is so hard.

I feel like a story like yours is so intertwined with why medicine that it's hard for you to ignore writing about it and be true to yourself right? Do you think you can write as strong a personal statement by talking about the connections you've had with patients?

@Goro @gyngyn @Catalystik @gonnif , what are your thoughts? I feel like a PS with such a personal experience in the face of clearly having overcome things could be so powerful if done right!
Click to expand...

Well, the general consensus here seems to be to avoid saying outright that I have learning disabilities, as that could potentially raise a red flag in the eyes of an adcom. With that being said, it appears as though mentioning all the autism-related work that I've done and how that ties into medicine would be a safer route to take.
 
ridethecliche said:
Ugh, this is so hard.

I feel like a story like yours is so intertwined with why medicine that it's hard for you to ignore writing about it and be true to yourself right? Do you think you can write as strong a personal statement by talking about the connections you've had with patients?

@Goro @gyngyn @Catalystik @gonnif , what are your thoughts? I feel like a PS with such a personal experience in the face of clearly having overcome things could be so powerful if done right!
Click to expand...


There are several ways of avoiding the formal statement that I have Condition ABC and say something along the lines of you were a slow learner (ADHD) but out of it, you developed patience and see your weakness as a net positive as you feel you will now be able to exhibit patience with patients. For Asperger's it's harder and I just get the vibe that medical schools aren't ready to hear about the hardships. At one interview I had, the interviewer straight up asked me if I felt like I was old enough to be in medicine. In addition, I was asked if I was forced into it by a parent. I was also asked why I seemed so serious and if I was really happy my life. I don't know what prompted this line of questioning...maybe my answer to why medicine was to rehearsed (I'd repeated it at least 5 times already)...and this was me applying as a traditional student just out of college. Needless to say, the climate for admissions is definitely not completely openminded.
 
Yeah, I figured it was going to end up like that. Which is why I talked about bringing out how working with the population has really helped motivate your desire to practice medicine. I agree with Nick as well. I think that's the best tie in to do the most good for your case.
 
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This is OK for a PS. How you word it is key.

. This is definitely a big part of my life and I'd like to be able to show the admissions committee how I overcame struggles in college and am using the free time I have to make a positive impact in the lives of others.
 
Goro said:
This is OK for a PS. How you word it is key.

. This is definitely a big part of my life and I'd like to be able to show the admissions committee how I overcame struggles in college and am using the free time I have to make a positive impact in the lives of others.
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@Goro : Did you use a red highlight to indicate that the way I currently have it worded is not the best way to go about saying it? I just want to know if the way the above sentence is worded is well enough to base a personal statement on. Thanks.
 
xnfs93hy said:
@Goro : Did you use a red highlight to indicate that the way I currently have it worded is not the best way to go about saying it? I just want to know if the way the above sentence is worded is well enough to base a personal statement on. Thanks.
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Goro just always highlights quotes in red and puts them after his response.
 
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