Bernie Sanders says he will cancel all student loan debt if he’s president, can he do it?

[Gunter]

Seems like a jump to blame homelessness on higher minimum wage. We all know correlation doesn't mean causation

Sent from my HD1925 using SDN mobile

Looking at cali’s economy right now, it certainly is a contribution. I shouldn’t have to explain cause its only common sense lol

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[owlegrad]

Yeah, I am sure a bunch of people making 8/hr would be able to affording housing in SF. It’s that high minimum wage that is responsible for all the homelessness!

 

[redfish955]

Yeah, I am sure a bunch of people making 8/hr would be able to affording housing in SF. It’s that high minimum wage that is responsible for all the homelessness!

Most of these people are drug dependent or have a serious mental health problem. Trump wants to gift states five billion to house people with mental health needs and treat them.

 

[PharmtoCS]

For the people that paid off their loans that is a sunk cost. You shouldn’t consider sunk costs when determining future actions. Other people getting their loans forgiven is good fortune for the ones with loans, not misfortune for the loan payers. You can’t go back in time so all you can do is focus on what you can do moving forward.

It's more the taxpayers that get screwed since they're the ones that have to pay for the forgiven loans.

Those who paid it off early are still screwed since they get nothing from loan forgiveness yet still have to pay higher taxes.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Didn’t people say that about Trump? hahaha





But I agree, if it’s Bernie on the ballot, Trump goes to a 2nd term.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN

Bernie polls the best against Trump of the remaining Democratic candidates and regularly beats him in head to head polls.

RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Sanders

RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Sanders

www.realclearpolitics.com

There is a very real possibility he will be elected.

 

[awval999]

Do we still believe polls?

Look, there's a reason why Trump tweets about the Dems stealing the election from Bernie. It's because he wants to him to be nominated.

Sanders has not been hit with $1 billion dollars in negative attack ads yet. And he won't be until he's the nominee.

Good article from 2016.

Give a little thought to what a GOP campaign against Bernie Sanders might look like

Vox is a general interest news site for the 21st century. Its mission: to help everyone understand our complicated world, so that we can all help shape it. In text, video and audio, our reporters explain politics, policy, world affairs, technology, culture, science, the climate crisis, money...

www.vox.com

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Do we still believe polls?

The polls that pretty much got the 2016 election on the dot with Clinton getting about 2% more of the popular vote?

Look, there's a reason why Trump tweets about the Dems stealing the election from Bernie. It's because he wants to him to be nominated.

Sanders has not been hit with $1 billion dollars in negative attack ads yet. And he won't be until he's the nominee.

Good article from 2016.

Give a little thought to what a GOP campaign against Bernie Sanders might look like

Vox is a general interest news site for the 21st century. Its mission: to help everyone understand our complicated world, so that we can all help shape it. In text, video and audio, our reporters explain politics, policy, world affairs, technology, culture, science, the climate crisis, money...

www.vox.com

People already know about Bernie. Attack ads won't work against him as well as they would a Mayor Pete or Warren. Plus, Bernie comes with a cult similar to Trump. Bernie could rape a donkey outside of the Ben and Jerry's factory and they'd still vote for him. It's going to be Cult v. Cult in 2020. The choice is basically between a far left socialist or a flat out fascist autocrat.

Should be interesting/frightening.

 

[wagrxm2000]

Polls so far combined have been within percentage points of the actual result.

Biden wins South Carolina and Bernie wins Nevada. Huge blows to Buttigieg and Klobucher. Warren will drop after Super Tuesday which greatly helps Bernie.

Once Warren is gone, Bernie approaches 40% of the vote

Trump absolutely wants to go against Bernie. The Dems need everyone to drop but Bloomberg if they want to stop Bernie. Unless Biden can somehow convince the South to vote Buttigieg.

 

[deleted898085]

Man, I just want Bernie to win because I dislike the media so much just like Trump does. The media treat Yang so badly.
I'm not a Bernie's fan. I don't like Trump at all. I like Bloomberg. But I can't stand the media.
So I'm starting to root for Bernie! Americans don't need socialism yet but...
If Trump wins over Bernie, that's fine with me. He, of course not him alone, has pushed stock market to sky and I like that!

 

[deleted898085]

It's more the taxpayers that get screwed since they're the ones that have to pay for the forgiven loans.

Those who paid it off early are still screwed since they get nothing from loan forgiveness yet still have to pay higher taxes.

It's already said here

It doesn’t make them actively worse off then they are now, unless they have to pay extra taxes for the people who get their loans forgiven.

So if you complain you have to pay more tax, so you're against forgiveness, that's understandable.
But if you say you already pay off loans while others get forgiven, so you're against forgiveness, that's not understandable.

 

[Gunter]

So I'm starting to root for Bernie! Americans don't need socialism yet but...

You just contradicted yourself. So it comes down to either voting for Bernie and probably see Venezuela #2 or continue with Trump's' economy, your choice.

The answer is pretty clear to me when I think about my kids' future lol

 

[deleted898085]

You just contradicted yourself. So it comes down to either voting for Bernie and probably see Venezuela #2 or continue with Trump's' economy, your choice.

The answer is pretty clear to me when I think about my kids' future lol

How about Scandinavian socialism?

 

[Gunter]

How about Scandinavian socialism?

Bottom line is, are you willing to take that risk?

 

[deleted898085]

Bottom line is, are you willing to take that risk?

Yes.
if America doesn't have free college when my kids are 18, I'm moving to Europe

 

[Gunter]

Yes.
if America doesn't have free college when my kids are 18, I'm moving to Europe

lol, hate to break it to you, nothing is free

 

[deleted898085]

lol, hate to break it to you, nothing is free

I know, tax is 54% for lower middle class but I prefer it.

 

[Gunter]

I know, tax is 54% for lower middle class but I prefer it.

ouch, so if you were to go there, wouldn't pharmacist salary put you at upper middle class instead? Therefore you're being tax more than 54%?

 

[deleted898085]

ouch, so if you were to go there, wouldn't pharmacist salary put you at upper middle class instead? Therefore you're being tax more than 54%?

I guess so. But the rich pay more there than they do here. That's all I care.
I now can live with tech salary, $12/h. I guess I won't mind paying more than half of my income to tax if I make pharmacist salary, $45/h and have free healthcare and no loans?
I know the more you make, the more you hate socialism
That's why billionaires, corporations, Wall Street ppl are going crazy with Bernie now. They buy mainstream Dems and media. They can't buy Bernie. They even call him communist now, lol.
Ppl say he lies but I see he is authentic and does care for the ppl. I agree that they say he has no power. The rich and ultra-rich do.

 

[BMBiology]

I guess so. But the rich pay more there than they do here. That's all I care.
I now can live with tech salary, $12/h. I guess I won't mind paying more than half of my income to tax if I make pharmacist salary, $45/h and have free healthcare and no loans?.

I don’t get it. You can do that now if you make $15/hr. Get on Obamacare (free for you). Don’t go to college (no student loan). Since you have a couple of kids, you also get the earned income credit. Not only would you not pay any taxes but the government would actually give you money just to work. You would also get food stamps, probably housing too.

 

[deleted898085]

I don’t get it. You can do that now if you make $15/hr. Get on Obamacare (free for you). Don’t go to college (no student loan). Since you have a couple of kids, you also get the earned income credit. Not only would you not pay any taxes but the government would actually give you money just to work. You would also get food stamps, probably housing too.

I want to be a pharmacist more than a tech.
I bet on this pharmacy industry 3 years ago. I thought I'd had 50% chance to have a job. But now I see that I'm going to lose. Class of 2019 has a chance of 38% to have a job. 10% of my class (2020) already has job offers from CVS. But I'm not one of them. Will see...
I may have to admit I've made big mistake. The biggest regret is I can't go back to my tech job.

 

[PharFromNormal]

ouch, so if you were to go there, wouldn't pharmacist salary put you at upper middle class instead? Therefore you're being tax more than 54%?

Pharmacist salaries are much lower in other countries so it’s likely it wouldn’t put them in upper middle class.

The high cost of healthcare in the US is partially due to the high wages of ALL healthcare workers not just the few execs.

You can probably find an article that has pharmacist annual salary converted to USD for several countries somewhere out there. I’ve seen it but too lazy now to link you.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Bernie polls the best against Trump of the remaining Democratic candidates and regularly beats him in head to head polls.

RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Sanders

RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Sanders

www.realclearpolitics.com

There is a very real possibility he will be elected.

LOL, Hillary would be the president if those polls are remotely reflecting the reality~

 

[WVUPharm2007]

LOL, Hillary would be the president if those polls are remotely reflecting the reality~

The national polls were very accurate in 2016. But national polls can't predict swing states. Trump winning was a small miracle given the raw national numbers.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

The national polls were very accurate in 2016. But national polls can't predict swing states. Trump winning was a small miracle given the raw national numbers.

I would't call it a miracle, and polls hardly takes into account of actual turnout. Whoever supports a candidate on a poll doesn't mean they will actually vote for that candidate. And since the mainstream media smeared Trump so much in 2016, a lot of Trump supporters were afraid to public say they support him. Then you saw the landslide in so many swing states.

Under-reporting + some data massaging = "shocking" political landslide, but is it really a surprise? Many actual voters just didn't voice their opinion lol

 

[BMBiology]

Bernie polls the best against Trump of the remaining Democratic candidates and regularly beats him in head to head polls.

RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Sanders

RealClearPolitics - Election 2020 - General Election: Trump vs. Sanders

www.realclearpolitics.com

There is a very real possibility he will be elected.

Bernie is polling better because Democrats do not want to push back on Bernie social programs.

Trump would make a clear contrast between himself and Bernie:

- stock market would clash under Bernie because he wants to tax businesses, stocks (majority of Americans own stocks)
- taxes for the middle class would go up
- government run healthcare
- open borders

Bernie is a career politician just like Hillary which is an easy target for Trump. Bernie has been in politics for 30 years without much accomplishment. More importantly, most Americans want capitalism to be fixed. They don’t want to change the entire system. They don’t want socialism.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

I would't call it a miracle, and polls hardly takes into account of actual turnout. Whoever supports a candidate on a poll doesn't mean they will actually vote for that candidate. And since the mainstream media smeared Trump so much in 2016, a lot of Trump supporters were afraid to public say they support him. Then you saw the landslide in so many swing states.

Oh, it was most certainly a statistical oddity. Clinton won the popular vote by 2.1%, but lost crucial swing stats by a razor thin margin. Not sure where you are getting "landslide" from. Those swing states were very close. And Trump had to win all of them to get the victory. He probably had about a 25% chance to win.

Also, Trump supporters should be afraid to say in public that they support him. He is a fascist and overall despicable human being. It amazes and frightens me that ~35% of this country will gleefully slide into fascism as long as it is their political party doing it.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Oh, it was most certainly a statistical oddity. Clinton won the popular vote by 2.1%, but lost crucial swing stats by a razor thin margin. Not sure where you are getting "landslide" from. Those swing states were very close. And Trump had to win all of them to get the victory. He probably had about a 25% chance to win.

Also, Trump supporters should be afraid to say in public that they support him. He is a fascist and overall despicable human being. It amazes and frightens me that ~35% of this country will gleefully slide into fascism as long as it is their political party doing it.

I love Trump, who made stocks skyrocket and all investors rich. When my anti-Trump friends say they don't like Trump this or that, blah blah blah, I just laughed at them. Fascist or no Fascist, who cares really? We need a president who can make this country prosper and bring jobs back, not some politically correct saint who can't get **** done. Europe is already destroyed by political correctness, and they will face gloomy economic prospects and stagnant growth. I love money more, way more than having a politically correct snowflake president LOL

 

[WVUPharm2007]

I love Trump, who made stocks skyrocket and all investors rich. When my anti-Trump friends say they don't like Trump this or that, blah blah blah, I just laughed at them. Fascist or no Fascist, who cares really? We need a president who can make this country prosper and bring jobs back, not some politically correct saint who can't get **** done. Europe is already destroyed by political correctness, and they will face gloomy economic prospects and stagnant growth. I love money more, way more than having a politically correct snowflake president LOL

Trump really hasn't done anything remarkable. Literally every recent president other than Bush II made the stock market rise at a rate similar to or greater than Trump.

Stock Market Performance by President

This interactive chart shows the running percentage gain in the Dow Jones Industrial Average by Presidential term. Each series begins with the closing value of the month of inauguration and runs to the closing value of the last month of the term. The y-axis shows the total percentage increase...

www.macrotrends.net

It's the United States. The biggest, strongest capitalist country that has its claws into the entire world. You should make a lot of money with stocks just on complete cruise control.

And you should probably care whether or not a president has fascist tendencies. Good lord. Disliking the over the top politically correct tendencies of liberals is one thing. Fascism is a few miles worse than that.

 

[sfachine]

Political threads are just too polarizing.I avoid them with friends and especially avoid politics(and religion)with patients. You are not going to change anybodys mind and they are not going to change yours.People take it way to personal.
Eat drink and be happy.

 

[deleted898085]

Political threads are just too polarizing.I avoid them with friends and especially avoid politics(and religion)with patients. You are not going to change anybodys mind and they are not going to change yours.People take it way to personal.
Eat drink and be happy.

Some people like to express themselves. I personally like to hear what people think and know who to avoid.
I like to see more people get involved in politics, esp. the poor, and the only way I know is to hear them discuss.
I was shocked when Trump won, thought that more ppl were like me, that I wouldn't vote for him so more ppl wouldn't either. Then later I had to realize I didn't know much about Americans. I thought Americans were nice, open-minded, not racist, not hateful, not rude, not vulgar... But after Trump win, people speak up more and more. And I know more.

 

[redfish955]

I think they should push to make the first year of college tuition free. Then increase the cost the further along you go. Most student loan defaulters only have attempted like 30 credit hours.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

I think they should push to make the first year of college tuition free. Then increase the cost the further along you go. Most student loan defaulters only have attempted like 30 credit hours.

Just go to community college or online degrees. Both are very affordable by American public, and We may never have to deal with student loan again.

 

[redfish955]

Just go to community college or online degrees. Both are very affordable by American public, and We may never have to deal with student loan again.

Most online schools don't offer the high earning stem degrees. Most community colleges don't prepare you for the rigor of stem degrees.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Most online schools don't offer the high earning stem degrees.

Not true at all. Even premier schools like Stanford is offering Computer Science MS degree online.

Computer Science MS Degree | Stanford Online

The M.S. degree in Computer Science is intended as a terminal professional degree and does not lead to the Ph.D. degree. Most students planning to obtain the Ph.D. degree should apply directly for admission to the Ph.D. program. Some students, however, may wish to complete the master’s program...

online.stanford.edu

 

[redfish955]

Not true at all. Even premier schools like Stanford is offering Computer Science MS degree online.

Computer Science MS Degree | Stanford Online

The M.S. degree in Computer Science is intended as a terminal professional degree and does not lead to the Ph.D. degree. Most students planning to obtain the Ph.D. degree should apply directly for admission to the Ph.D. program. Some students, however, may wish to complete the master’s program...

online.stanford.edu

Not at the undergraduate level.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Most online schools don't offer the high earning stem degrees. Most community colleges don't prepare you for the rigor of stem degrees.

Don't you know that many community colleges are feeders to local universities? Vast majority of students at community colleges in California later transferred to UCs and CSUs.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Not at the undergraduate level.

Arizona State University offers most of its bachelors and masters degrees and curriculum online, including most of STEM degrees you can think of, computer science, electrical engineering, mechanical engineering, etc. Just look it up~

 

[redfish955]

Don't you know that many community colleges are feeders to local universities? Vast majority of students community colleges later transferred to UCs and CSUs.

Rule of thumb is to take your math at the four year you plan on graduating from. Calculus one is a weed out at most schools for a lot of programs.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Rule of thumb is to take your math at the four year you plan on graduating from. Calculus one is a weed out at most schools for a lot of programs.

If anyone does that, that person is not fit for any high paying stem jobs to begin with. But still, cc are way cheaper than 4 year universities, and students can save a ton of money doing so without delaying graduation.

 

[redfish955]

If anyone does that, that person is not fit for any high paying stem jobs to begin with. But still, cc are way cheaper than 4 year universities, and students can save a ton of money doing so without delaying graduation.

So, what's wrong with the first year being free? Georgia tech offers a mscs online for 10k total. They even dumbed down the program because too many were complaining about it's difficulty. A mscs from a top five stem University for 10k. You could even setup a contract if they transferred they owed for the first semester.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

So, what's wrong with the first year being free? Georgia tech offers a mscs online for 10k total. They even dumbed down the program because too many were complaining about it's difficulty. A mscs from a top five stem University for 10k. You could even setup a contract if they transferred they owed for the first semester.

I don't get what you are saying lol.

 

[redfish955]

I don't what you are saying lol.

Community college is a ton of money if you take on 5k in loans and have to stack pallets for $15 an hour the rest of your life. Make the 100 level classes free with the weed out classes. Then charge more for the upper level classes. If students transfer schools within a five year window they have to pay for their free classes.

 

[Lubeckd]

Just go to community college or online degrees. Both are very affordable by American public, and We may never have to deal with student loan again.

I self teach with the internet

 

[Gunter]

I know the more you make, the more you hate socialism

I'm all for socialism if it works. But let's put socialism into perspective for a little bit. Bottom line is in order for socialism to work, majority of the population has to work and chip in their fair share, do you think that will happen? So you want to tax the sh1t out of the rich to balance the playing field and make it fair, then what incentive are there left for them to work in order to continue to provide for the economy? As less and less people want to work because they don't see much fruit of their labor due to government taking that away can lead to less production. Isn't this the reason why companies are moving out of venezuela and makes it hard for people to get something as simple as some toilet papers?

What's Bernie's plan to prevent the same thing from happening?

 

[TheBlaah]

On a side note, it blows my mind when you look at the state/cites like cali, NY, chicago, etc... highest number of homeless rates/crime rates all run by the dems.

... You really think these cities have high homeless rates/crime rates because they're Democrats...?
It's because they're densely populated metropolitan cities. Of course they're going to have higher rates of poverty and crime; that's going to be true anywhere in the world regardless of politics.

Metropolitan cities lean Democrat because they need more government money for infrastructure. Rural areas don't so they lean Republican. Local politics are different from national politics, and you'll find that they'll lean towards whatever represents their constituents. And don't forget NY has elected a Republican before.

 

[deleted898085]

I'm all for socialism if it works. But let's put socialism into perspective for a little bit. Bottom line is in order for socialism to work, majority of the population has to work and chip in their fair share, do you think that will happen? So you want to tax the sh1t out of the rich to balance the playing field and make it fair, then what incentive are there left for them to work in order to continue to provide for the economy? As less and less people want to work because they don't see much fruit of their labor due to government taking that away can lead to less production. Isn't this the reason why companies are moving out of venezuela and makes it hard for people to get something as simple as some toilet papers?

On a side note, it blows my mind when you look at the state/cites like cali, NY, chicago, etc... highest number of homeless rates/crime rates all run by the dems. The evidence is already in front of you, how is it that this hasn't stick yet and you still want them to win. Besides calling trump a fascist which doesn't mean much because that's just childish name calling. What proof do you have that the dems has done so far that will make this country better than the current president can other than endless investigations that waste a lot of time and millions of taxpayer dollars that they don't care about? i need help with this one

I don't know why you want to have Venezuela as an example. It's nothing similar to the US. Had there been a successful capitalism in Venezuela before socialism came in?
Reps label Bernie as a socialist or even a communist. US will never become socialist completely. It's capitalism plus some socialism. Now Bernie wants to add more socialism in it.
So stop mentioning Venezuela! Pick somewhere that's more similar to the US if you really want to compare.
About the homeless issue, it's everywhere including Texas, Republican state. I watch Fox and listen to Trump almost every day so I understand Reps a lot. I'm not going to try to change their minds or anything. Every time ppl say something I can tell where it comes from.

 

[BC_89]

there are some that were too young to understand what was happening (me). so by the time i got to P1 year i realized my parents took out loans for me and i was taking out a ton of loans for myself. i was 17 when i went into pharm school, and 19 when i went into the p1 year. you think i'm dumb now? back then i was waaaaaay off. loans? i was too busy partying and having fun. i had no idea what was happening. i was just pushed through the system. it was only until later when i was able to understand just how much i had ALREADY taken out in loans. this is a serious thing. my first 1-2 years of college i had no idea how it was being paid. most kids have no idea. they are just blissfully unaware cause they are still kids. they just party and act dumb. until later on when they realize what they got themselves into

so no, i didn't know the tuition bill was coming when i first started

higher education is too expensive and is pointless unless you become a lawyer or doctor. if i didn't have as much loans i prob would have dropped out of college and started my own business. i already have my own business now, i ended up doing exactly what i wanted. i guess the difference now is that i have pharmD next to my name and a **** ton of loans

I actually do appreciate this thought process since I find it to ring true and represents the majority of students going straight to college out of high school.

A majority go to school without honestly thinking about how the loans are adding up. Some don't know the difference between unsub / subsidized loans let alone a fed vs private loan. This is something I have always felt was lacking in high schools: A strong basic understanding of what I would call "business math" or even a simple 1 semester seminar of "Hey, you want to go to college? Ever wonder about your options to pay for tuition? Here's what you need to know..."

Its actually very worrying that young teenagers are signing promissory notes without really understanding what they are getting themselves into. We have 17 year olds all the time sign up for the military and many who regretted it when it was too late. What happens to them if they don't hold up their end of the deal? Simple: Dishonorable discharge, possible jail time, and a felony on their record for the remainder of their life. Not saying I agree with this but at face value you owe what you sign up for.

You signed a document to pay back your loans. Sure, the wording was long and tedious and perhaps a bit confusing, but the parameters of the document you signed were in plain sight and readily available to view. You took out the loan, you pay it back. Simple as that. If any person makes a claim that somehow forgives everyone and their grandma of their student loan debt, then pat yourself on the back for not needing to owe up to what you signed for.

For what its worth, I would be for student loan forgiveness if any level of reformity was justified to the individuals using such a clause. I am not however behind the idea of encouraging students to have a "max out loans - pocket the difference - hope for forgiveness - be on my merry way" attitude.

 

[EggplantPharm]

Bernie is no longer saying he is going to forgive student loans to “people who can afford to pay it back” HAHA

He said he will forgive all student debt in that video.

 

[Twentytwelve2]

Student loan interest rates are RIDICULOUS! Federal loans should not be profitable! END OF STORY.
I believe it should be canceled for ALL or REDUCED down to 2% at MOST because is is unethical to try to make money off of students.

 

[BMBiology]

Student loan interest rates are RIDICULOUS! Federal loans should not be profitable! END OF STORY.
I believe it should be canceled for ALL or REDUCED down to 2% at MOST because is is unethical to try to make money off of students.

Do you honestly think the government is making money from student loans? Have you seen the default rate?