Blatant Honesty - Words of Advice?

[Teefs]

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OK so here goes my dilemma:

I've already taken the DAT and got a 21-20-23 (T,S,P). My undergrad GPA was 3.5 sci (3.3 overall :[ ) ... using the formula calculator found elsewhere in this forum, this places me as a fairly competitive applicant to dental schools (esp. in state in Texas). 93rd percentile or something...

Now the bad news: Valentines '09 I was arrested on fairly bogus charges. I spent three months clearing up my name (and ultimately received no convictions thanks to the first amendment), but this stigma still appears on my current criminal history as 'DISMISSED' (not drug, woman, or violence-related). More damningly, the medical school I was attending at the time told me I should take some time off, which I've been doing (mostly freelance work, traveling, deep contemplation, etc.).

Early on during this time off I [re]discovered that I no longer wanted to be a physician. I began to contemplate how in eight months of 60hr/wk during med school, I managed to run off my girlfriend (of many years), become best friends with a cat, and become temporarily unhappy - simply because I was always so stressed out with tests, deadlines, etc. I couldn't even contemplate working 80+ hours a week for the rest of my agile life (especially residency... SINGLE HANDEDLY THE BIGGEST FEAR).

I've been shadowing local dentists (about 25 hours total, now) and have really enjoyed seeing them work adroitly (they may be one of the few dremel-handlers better than me), explain why they didn't choose the physician route, and in general be happy with their own small productions. I've heard that getting expelled is a deathwish as far as reapplying goes, but fortunately I was not expelled (special leave of absence). So in a way, I'm looking at this event as an eye-opener to re-evaluating my life's direction . . .

I'm currently planning on attending a 3 year long Masters Program, beginning this fall, so here is my question:

In answering the question " how have I improved my application since I last applied to a professional graduate program, " what is my BEST strategy. I have already filled out the TMDSAS, but am thinking about applying to other US schools either this late in the game (late August) or next year. For Texas, I basically just wrote about how I used a bad event (my quarter life crisis) to discover a possibly better profession in the health care world.

Any advice? Where do I draw the line between honesty and stupidity (have I already crossed the latter?). Will attending a 3 year masters program be a bad thing, overall, if I want to put that on hold if/when I get accepted to dental school? I'd ultimately end up completely the masters program (you get eight years to finish three years of material), but ... ?

 

[doc toothache]

I've already taken the DAT and got a 21-20-23 (T,S,P). My undergrad GPA was 3.5 sci (3.3 overall :[ ) .. More damningly, the medical school I was attending at the time told me I should take some time off, which I've been doing (mostly freelance work, traveling, deep contemplation, etc.).

Early on during this time off I discovered I no longer wanted to be a physician. I began to contemplate how in eight months of 60hr/wk during med school, I managed to run off my girlfriend (of many years), become best friends with a cat, and become temporarily unhappy - simply because I was always so stressed out with tests, deadlines, etc. I couldn't even contemplate working 80+ hours a week for the rest of my agile life (especially residency...).
I'm currently planning on attending a 3 year long Masters Program, beginning this fall, so here is my question:

In answering the question " how have I improved my application since I last applied to a professional graduate program, " what is my BEST strategy. I have already filled out the TMDSAS, but am thinking about applying to other US schools either this late in the game (late August) or next year. For Texas, I basically just wrote about how I used a bad event (my quarter life crisis) to discover a possibly better profession in the health care world.

Any advice? Where do I draw the line between honesty and stupidity (have I already crossed the latter?). Will attending a 3 year masters program be a bad thing, overall, if I want to put that on hold if/when I get accepted to dental school? I'd ultimately end up completely the masters program (you get eight years to finish three years of material), but ... ?

While your crisis may be understandable, your story has the making of deciding to switch professions for all the wrong reasons. It is not clear why you are considering an MS program unless that is your ultimate goal. Since you were accepted in ms and finished one year, that should establish your credentials for being able to handle graduate/professional school courses. In your case, notwithstanding the legal issues, you would be better off continuing in med school, provided the institution in question is willing to take you back. That in itself would dispel whatever reservations ds might have regarding the details on why you left ms and it would certainly give you a nicer feather in your cap than any master's program you can conjure. If you found ms as being stressful, you mind find yourself back to square one because 1st and 2nd year in ds is not exactly a walk in the park.

 

[oae]

I definitely agree with above... STICK to Medical School...

Dentistry has the highest rate of suicide among all professions. Based on what your telling me, your agile mental state would be better off doing medical school.

Besides, you seem to choose dentistry for all the wrong reasons....

 

[Teefs]

You would be better off continuing in med school, provided the institution in question is willing to take you back.

Part of the discovery process for me included pro/con'ing the school I was at. For many, many, MANY reasons, I REALLY do NOT wish to continue there. I know this looks bad for me in the eyes of dental school, especially since I was a med student prior, but returning is out of the question (even though the dean personally invited me into the next class).

One of my main reasons for the interest in dentistry is that I want to be more than just an almanac of prescriptions - the manual dexterity of creating with the hands is really what interests me most, and the ADDED stress of doing this as an MD requires you to be a surgeon - OUT OF THE QUESTION (e.g. practically have to be top 5% of graduating class at the school I was at). On top of that, I've had many dentists tell me reasons for choosing dentistry: is the lifestyle not an important factor to consider (e.g. no 3+ year residency, operating your own private/semi business)?

I really do appreciate all the support / comments. I even got a great PM from iceman telling reiterating some of the points brought up above (maybe a little bit sharper, but I need to hear this...). Are there any personal statement editors out there that might want to take a stab at mine?

 

[Teefs]

If you found ms as being stressful, you mind find yourself back to square one because 1st and 2nd year in ds is not exactly a walk in the park.

I'm certainly not implying this... sorry for the misunderstanding. For me, however, having residency loom over me like the plague, I questioned over and over again whether or not it would be worth jumping through hoop after hoop (first year, second year ...) just to get somewhere even MORE miserable (and further in debt). I'm not going to lie, the ms I ended up attending was a primary care mill (something like 75% went into gen. prac.)... that's probably the reason most why I don't want to re-attend the same school (that, and the entirely multiple choice curriculum).

Grrr. . . maybe I need to take some YEARS off. Frustrating.

 

[longhornpride]

This is just my opinion, but I think you need to sit down and really think about what you want. From what I'm reading, I get this feeling that you're running away from MS and looking at DS because you think it's going to be easier and less stressful.

Also, would you have left med school this year had you not been arrested?

 

[uncbestyet]

Hello Teefs,

Without knowing more of your situation, I would suggest taking a break and deciding what you really want to do.

I can understand your reasons for DS vs Med. , but I hear DS is no cake walk (esp. 1st and second year for the studying -then 3rd and fourth year if you're not good with your hands). I do think the hours will be better after school though.

I am purely speculating here, but since. I would not change to DS thinking you might have more time to spend with her (at least the next four years anyway).

PURE SPECULATION, but thats the stigma I'm getting.

 

[Teefs]

Would you have left med school this year had you not been arrested?

Yes, I was already considering taking time off before this happened. But I wanted to finish it out strong because I hate leaving things totally ****** / interrupted. The reasons then had to do with the ENORMOUS stress of having to 'anticipate' residency, after 3.5 more years of medical school.

 

[Teefs]

Without knowing more of your situation, I would suggest taking a break and deciding what you really want to do.

I've been contemplating dentistry since the fifth month of medical school. The major reasons:
1) most physicians do not get to carve with their hands... as all dentists do. Adroit is the numero uno adjective I'd use to describe myself. I carve wood, solder regularly, and have always loved taking everything apart. To do this at the same capacity as a physician, who basically have to work super-duper hard to become a surgeon. Most of the others (esp. at my school) become rubber stamps, based on extensive first year observations :-|
2) Private practice - I've run my own company for the past decade and don't really know why I was going in to a career that virtually assured I'd be stuck in somebody else's medical mess
3) American medicine is EFFED big time.
4) 75% of physicians I have had deep conversations with have basically told me to RUN! Insurance, malpractice, crappy patients, crappy hours.

I can understand your reasons for DS vs Med. , but I hear DS is no cake walk (esp. 1st and second year for the studying -then 3rd and fourth year if you're not good with your hands). I do think the hours will be better after school though.

5) Better hours after grad school. I am VERY MUCH looking forward to applying my talents to 3rd and 4th year. It seems like my 3rd and 4th year peers in med school just despised everything. Can't wait to be creative! My favorite dentist so far was a sculptor before applying to dental school - and I'm VERY MUCH right brained.

I am purely speculating here, but since you were arrested on valentine's day, I assume it had something to do with your ex-girlfriend (restraining order possibly).

Pure speculation, indeed. I was arrested for insulting an officer's pride. But I am not above the fact that my stress levels might have made me a bit of a smart ass... but I never should have been arrested, which the prosecutor agreed with when she dismissed everything. The ex and I are friends, now.

Of course it is sad that med school pulled us apart, but that happened during the first few months. Studying FTMFL : )

PS I never seem to come off genuine on paper... that's why I'm asking all of ya'll for help! I honestly am a sincere, ENFP ("The Inspirer"). Actually, the scary part is that everybody sees me as this happy-go-lucky do-gooder that never has to try, when really I'm a shakey introvert inside.

I'm very good at writing (S on the MCAT section, if it matters to you), but obviously this is an awkward topic.

I stayed up all night reading over my college papers, trying to pinpoint the event that made me so bitter toward physicianhood. Couldn't find it, but afterwards I'm definitely more open to taking an extended break from school. The masters program is being considered for three simple reasons:

1) To explore a part of the health care world that I've never really believed in until recently.
2) To get back in to school so my mind doesn't turn in to mush.
3) To assist in my decision of whether or not becoming a doctor (DDS, MD, whatever) is the best decision for me.

 

[alanan84]

The masters program is being considered for three simple reasons:

1) To explore a part of the health care world that I've never really believed in until recently.
2) To get back in to school so my mind doesn't turn in to mush.
3) To assist in my decision of whether or not becoming a doctor (DDS, MD, whatever) is the best decision for me.

Shouldn't this already be decided before applying to dental school?

If I'm looking at your app, I'm seeing an applicant that's already abandoned medical school, claims interest in dentistry, but still is considering a masters program b/c he's not sure what he wants to do. What reassurance besides your words do I have that you won't take off during dental school?

 

[Teefs]

Shouldn't this already be decided before applying to dental school?

I mean, ideally, yes. Touché.

If I'm looking at your app, I'm seeing an applicant that's already abandoned medical school,

Yes, it was NOT the place for me.

claims interest in dentistry,

Certainly there can be some overlap? When I shadowed doctors in college, it was MDs, DOs, and DDSs (sorry, never had a DMD). Just thought medicine might be the better fit when I was deciding between MCAT and DAT years ago.

but still is considering a masters program b/c he's not sure what he wants to do.

Or more aptly, wants to have something to focus on during this time off if/when dental schools reject my application. If I DID get in to dental school, I could certainly attempt to use the pain management techniques learned in the masters program (sandwiched before and after dental school). Honestly, I ultimately wish to finish both programs... just want to do dental school first : )

What reassurance besides your words do I have that you won't take off during dental school?

Well, hopefully I've learned something about my actions. I did NOT want to abruptly leave school when the arrest happened. It was no longer in my control. But yes, I was pretty sure I was going to end medical school when the semester was over. How might that application scenario presented me differently?
Besides the words sent by these application services (and during my interviews :fingerscrossed🙂, what more can I present?* This is the entire reason for posting for help. I appreciate every comment... please don't take this as being naggy- I'm devils advocating myself here because I need to. Pick this discussion apart - The US apps have to be as realistic as possible.

And for some reason, when I start writing about myself, I choke up and turn in to N material.

*I also will have completed over 200 hours of dental observations before allowing myself to enter this course of study. I didn't observe nearly enough physicians before entering medical school - all the ones I did were family friends, too... no dentists in my family.

High suicide rate

Postal Courier is DEFINITELY out of the question. : )

 

[sfrice80]

You're not the "Dont Tase Me Bro" guy are you?!

 

[alanan84]

Well, the leaving medical school/getting arrested combo doesn't look great but I honestly think if you articulated everything well in your PS and have a good interview, you've got a great shot. Your DAT and GPA are pretty darn good. Good luck to you. Keep us posted.

 

[Teefs]

You're not the "Dont Tase Me Bro" guy are you?!

No, more like the "Don't harass innocent people and think you can get away with it when the streets are watching, PoPo."

But f***, I feel for Andrew Meyer... they didn't physically abuse me like they did him, but they sure did leave a scar on both of us. In my case, they literally invented a crime to justify sending me to jail. I am legitimately fearful of police encounters to this day, especially when cops are just trying to take control of a situation they are clearly in the wrong of (I was a spectator to cops harassing a minority family, watching in my scrubs, (observing from my property, no less) before I went to jail, for verbalizing that all people have rights. No threats to the police, no intimidation - just a statement. BAM Resisting Arrest. As an added bonus the arresting officer fabricated more evidence against me (which thank god I was able to demonstrate to be false because he was such a dumb***).

So what did I learn from this incident, specifically:
1) Choose your battles careful; you can only win fair fights... blue uniforms sure do look damn good to juries...
2) Internal Review boards are worthless. Sharks swim together...
3) Most people will lie through their teeth until they absolutely cannot go on any longer. Even 'peace' officers.
4) Life is too short to remain bitter. Keep your distance, build that façade, and never lose your temper - you could really find yourself in a dark place
5) Depression is never permanent... but it still hurts so damn much

/end rant. Back to on topic discussions : )

 

[Munchy]

just wondering.. how did u get int med school with 3.3 cGPA?
Did u have some crazy EC?

 

[icedspice]

icedwoman to be more precise

As I read more and more of your posts, I saw what you went through and that is exactly what you would need to convey to the Dschools as well 🙂
They just want to know you are not a slacker (hell, if you are planning on taking 2 more years of the same classes, i wouldnt call you a slacker 🙂 ) and that you wont leave Dschools in the middle (which you wont because it seems like you really do enjoy the profession).
So kudos, I guess the good writing skills did pay off =D


Also, even though the whole MS degree confused me, I realized why you are thinking about it now.
When I moved to the U.S, I had a gap of 6 months before starting school again and HOLY CRAP did I feel stupid when I started classes again. COMPLETE mush. So, staying academically involved is DEFINITELY a good idea.


Oh, and hehe, we all tend to give harsh advice -- but please do know, in online communications, many ideas get misconstrued. Hence my insane use of smilies. So, we all want you to succeed. Just want you to be careful on how you explain yourself to d-schools (compare your first posts with later. 1st post: what am i supposed to dooo, I dumped med school, grass looks greener on the other side type of mentality vs. last few posts: THIS is why I want to do dentistry)

 

[Teefs]

how did u get int med school with 3.3 cGPA?

It's the smile (and maybe the school I went to, a Top 20er). Got munchies?

 

[Teefs]

As I read more and more of your posts, I saw what you went through and that is exactly what you would need to convey to the Dschools as well ... compare your first posts with later: what am i supposed to dooo, I dumped med school, grass looks greener on the other side vs. last few posts: THIS is why I want to do dentistry)

Well, thank you ma'am for helping me formulate my thoughts. Thanks to all of ya'll! I now have piles of notes here that were all provoked from your comments alone... I even have a new, completely-unrelated book idea (I'm sort of a prolific writer).

I'm so pumped right now that after 36 hours of wakeness (and going to work), I'm back on the computer ready to hammer out a more-final copy of this statement of mine... 😍