California Northstate CNU (MD) vs. Western Pomona (DO)

[controller212]

CNU
Pros

• Close to home and aging parents (something very important in my prioritization)
• MD
• Decent match list, interest in anesthesia and EM but obviously that's most likely going to change during school
• H/P/F grading
• Final and full LCME accreditation expected in early June 2021

Cons

• The highly-discussed negatives about this school
• Total COA: $392K to $412K in private loans, pre capitalization
• My family is not well-off. I'm wary about taking out private loans due to the possibility of being denied further loans in M3/M4 year leaving me stuck with the loans and no way to finish my education (this might be an unlikely scenario but it's still a risk that shouldn't even exist/won't exist at any other school)

Western Pomona
Pros

• In California
• Established program
• Total COA: $155K to $180K in federal loans (due to a unique government aid situation I have)
• Ideally, if it wasn't for my parents in NorCal, I would love to remain in Southern California during school, residency, and for my career

Cons

• Have a deferred acceptance so for now, so I'll be starting Fall 2022 (Although a high likelihood that I might start this year given that they pull deeply from their deferred list come late-spring/early summer)
• Hours away from my parents (although I could make a commitment to myself to visit during all breaks)
• It's a DO program, and I understand the repercussions of that when it comes to matching

Summary: Expensive for-profit program but MD and close to home, or way-cheaper and established-DO program in an area I like living in.

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[ihaveagf]

MD >>>>>>>>>>>>> DO unless you are set on primary care.

 

[drstranger]

I usually agree md> DO but this is the one school I have heard to be weary of. I know they had been talking about a hospital in Elk Grove for years and it just got denied. Another thing I know is they don’t allow their students to use federal loans. Others who are more familiar with the school could weigh in. @Goro would love to hear you $.02

 

[Goro]

I usually agree md> DO but this is the one school I have heard to be weary of. I know they had been talking about a hospital in Elk Grove for years and it just got denied. Another thing I know is they don’t allow their students to use federal loans. Others who are more familiar with the school could weigh in. @Goro would love to hear you $.02

Western >>>>>>CNU any day.

If the choice were between CNU and one of the DO schools on my bad boy list? I will tell you to dump those accept and reapply with a better application the following cycle

 

[controller212]

Western >>>>>>CNU any day.

If the choice were between CNU and one of the DO schools on my bad boy list? I will tell you to dump those accept and reapply with a better application the following cycle

Thanks for your input. I've been reading through all the posts about CNU, especially your thoughts on it. I think I'm leaning towards Western.

Do you still think it's worth waiting a year to start at Western if I don't get pulled from the deferred list this year? Also, will matching into gas be difficult as a DO from Western? I don't want to regret giving up an MD if it's going to have a significant impact on matching (I know the impact will always be there but I'm okay if it's not seriously detrimental).

 

[Banco]

I would usually say MD > DO. Here it is a really tough decision. That cost difference is massive, and the MD school is new and doesn't accept federal loans...

Have you looked at both of their match lists? Do they have Gas matches?

 

[LondonVibes]

Western >>>>>>CNU any day.

If the choice were between CNU and one of the DO schools on my bad boy list? I will tell you to dump those accept and reapply with a better application the following cycle

Wouldn’t this put you on the medical school blacklist?

 

[m1redsox]

CNU has crappy administrators, but their match this year was better than any DO school’s match because they do well on board exams. I would choose CNU and avoid having to delay med school a full year. Also, being close to family is a big plus. On top of that, if you are approved your first year with Sallie Mae, they will almost always approve you all 4 years. Then you could always refinance once you have an income for a better interest rate.

SDNers hate CNU, but in all reality, their students do just fine—better than DO schools in most cases. They just have some questionable people in their office.

In the end though, $150k-$180k full COA is CHEAP, and Western is a solid school. Either choice is fine.

Match list: News | College of Medicine

 

[Goro]

Wouldn’t this put you on the medical school blacklist?

Not really

Thanks for your input. I've been reading through all the posts about CNU, especially your thoughts on it. I think I'm leaning towards Western.

Do you still think it's worth waiting a year to start at Western if I don't get pulled from the deferred list this year? Also, will matching into gas be difficult as a DO from Western? I don't want to regret giving up an MD if it's going to have a significant impact on matching (I know the impact will always be there but I'm okay if it's not seriously detrimental).

No and no

 

[student doc34]

Western >>>>>>CNU any day.

If the choice were between CNU and one of the DO schools on my bad boy list? I will tell you to dump those accept and reapply with a better application the following cycle

wait western is on your bad boy list? since when

 

[Goro]

wait western is on your bad boy list? since when

No, Western is a fine school.

 

[deleted1066189]

pick Western. cost difference is absolutely massive here. Western is also very established for a DO program

 

[Putkernerinthehall]

Western is pretty well respected in Southern California. Probably elsewhere too, but I hear nothing but good things about it here. I'd choose Western.

 

[MDMechEngr]

In four years, the match will be even uglier for gas, especially for DOs. The match list for gas at CNU this year is better than all the DO schools. CNU all the way, especailly if you have to wait one year to attend Western. One year of attending salary make CNU cheaper.

Edit: for profit schools suck elephant ass, but good students succeed despite the school. This applies to MD and DO schools.

 

[holdthemayo]

Thanks for your input. I've been reading through all the posts about CNU, especially your thoughts on it. I think I'm leaning towards Western.

Do you still think it's worth waiting a year to start at Western if I don't get pulled from the deferred list this year? Also, will matching into gas be difficult as a DO from Western? I don't want to regret giving up an MD if it's going to have a significant impact on matching (I know the impact will always be there but I'm okay if it's not seriously detrimental).

I hate for profit medical education (MD or DO). I think it is bad for the profession.

But...

If you really want gas it might be worth it. Gas has gotten more competitive over the past few years. I have DO colleagues who should have matched better than me that didn't. Some didn't match at all. Look at the https://mk0nrmp3oyqui6wqfm.kinstacdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Advance-Data-Tables-2021_Final.pdf for this year. Only about 50% of DO applicants matched gas. It's not fair, but it was the reality this year.

That said, Western is a good school and the difference in CoA is huge. If you really want gas though, you might have to bite the bullet and go CNU.

 

[nemayaya]

CNU
Pros

• Close to home and aging parents (something very important in my prioritization)
• MD
• Decent match list, interest in anesthesia and EM but obviously that's most likely going to change during school
• H/P/F grading
• Final and full LCME accreditation expected in early June 2021

Cons

• The highly-discussed negatives about this school
• Total COA: $392K to $412K in private loans, pre capitalization
• My family is not well-off. I'm wary about taking out private loans due to the possibility of being denied further loans in M3/M4 year leaving me stuck with the loans and no way to finish my education (this might be an unlikely scenario but it's still a risk that shouldn't even exist/won't exist at any other school)

Western Pomona
Pros

• In California
• Established program
• Total COA: $155K to $180K in federal loans (due to a unique government aid situation I have)
• Ideally, if it wasn't for my parents in NorCal, I would love to remain in Southern California during school, residency, and for my career

Cons

• Have a deferred acceptance so for now, so I'll be starting Fall 2022 (Although a high likelihood that I might start this year given that they pull deeply from their deferred list come late-spring/early summer)
• Hours away from my parents (although I could make a commitment to myself to visit during all breaks)
• It's a DO program, and I understand the repercussions of that when it comes to matching

Summary: Expensive for-profit program but MD and close to home, or way-cheaper and established-DO program in an area I like living in.

Not sure if you've committed or still looking for advice, but the negatives of CNU seem to be counterbalanced over the years by the positives. The match lists are only getting better, they're pending full accreditation (as you mentioned), and they are for-sure building a teaching hospital now thanks to the Sacramento Kings. Sacramento Kings, City of Sacramento and California Northstate University Announce Natomas Redevelopment Plans | Sacramento Kings (nba.com)

Provided that this school gets full LCME accreditation, and is now on-route to get its hospital, and the match lists are only getting better, I feel like all the concerns should be gone. Private loans are apparently more competitive than federal loans too.

 

[drstranger]

Private loans are apparently more competitive than federal loans too.

This is a line repeated for a lot of schools that do not offer federal loans. It is true that some students may qualify for lower rate loans but you have to consider a few things.
1 some students will have higher rates since it's due to credit scores and co-signers.
2 as far as cosigners for loans some students will be harder for them to get a cosigner especially disadvantaged students who may not have any close family to cosign with them, for different reasons I know my parents would not be able to cosign for my student loans.
3 private loans do you disperse on death, if some freak accident happens and you die your family will still be on the line for paying back your loans.
I know people love to defend their schools because they feel it is an attack on them, however, any school that refuses to offer federal aid (only CNU) does not have the best interest of their students in mind.

 

[gyngyn]

This is a line repeated for a lot of schools that do not offer federal loans. It is true that some students may qualify for lower rate loans but you have to consider a few things.
1 some students will have higher rates since it's due to credit scores and co-signers.
2 as far as cosigners for loans some students will be harder for them to get a cosigner especially disadvantaged students who may not have any close family to cosign with them, for different reasons I know my parents would not be able to cosign for my student loans.
3 private loans do you disperse on death, if some freak accident happens and you die your family will still be on the line for paying back your loans.
I know people love to defend their schools because they feel it is an attack on them, however, any school that refuses to offer federal aid (only CNU) does not have the best interest of their students in mind.

In additional to all the excellent points you've made.
CNU has chosen to deny their students eligibility for federal payback mechanisms, not just loans.

 

[nemayaya]

In additional to all the excellent points you've made.
CNU has chosen to deny their students eligibility for federal payback mechanisms, not just loans.

Yeah after conducting more investigation this is the one thing that I wish they would change one day. They chose not to. I just can't imagine why they would try to limit the students' payment options. Maybe the LCME can provide pressure to allow federal loans before providing full accreditation?

 

[gyngyn]

Yeah after conducting more investigation this is the one thing that I wish they would change one day. They chose not to. I just can't imagine why they would try to limit the students' payment options. Maybe the LCME can provide pressure to allow federal loans before providing full accreditation?

If they would do this in plain sight, what else might they be doing that is hidden from view.
Sadly, the LCME cannot make them care for their students more than their shareholders.