Columbia (OOS) vs UCSF (OOS)

[puffinsgopoof]

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*Primary goal is to match into orthodontics. I am heavily weighing matching into orthodontics program over all factors.*

School 1: Columbia
* OOS
Pros:

• Dream school
• Located in NYC, which is a plus for personal preference and lifestyle
• Strong name recognition as an Ivy League institution
• Staying on the East Coast would make it easier for me to build professional connections (I want to practice on the East Coast.)
• Pass/fail

Cons:

• More expensive than UCSF by $100k
• Weaker clinical studies
• Maybe more rigorous with the biomedical studies?

School 2: UCSF
* OOS
Pros:

• Professors and students appear very caring and friendly.
  • Positive personal experiences: the dean and interviewer personally called me and provided resources, which gives impression of strong support for students
• More affordable
• Higher ranked
• Pass/fail
• Good clinical and research

Cons:

• Located on West Coast but I want to practice on East Coast in the future
• Not as much name recognition compared to Columbia

Summary:
I’m torn between UCSF and Columbia because both schools offer similar specialty match rates and have strong research programs. Cost and community seem to favor UCSF: it’s $100k cheaper, and the supportive, caring environment stands out. However, Columbia has always been my dream school, and being in NYC offers personal and professional appeal, especially for networking on the East Coast.

My biggest concern is matching into an Orthodontics specialty program post-graduation, and I want to choose the school that best positions me for this over location. Location doesn't really matter to me.

What are your honest thoughts?

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Welcome to the forums.

Are you talking a $100K difference in cost of living?

You're not going to go wrong at either school IMO. Anyone in dentistry knows both schools' brands.

I would still go to your cheapest option. You can always go to the other school for your specialty training. Also, student support is not a trivial issue.

Columbia (as an Ivy) has a huge endowment, so what financial aid have they thrown at you?

 

[puffinsgopoof]

Welcome to the forums.

Are you talking a $100K difference in cost of living?

You're not going to go wrong at either school IMO. Anyone in dentistry knows both schools' brands.

I would still go to your cheapest option. You can always go to the other school for your specialty training. Also, student support is not a trivial issue.

Columbia (as an Ivy) has a huge endowment, so what financial aid have they thrown at you?

I haven't received the financial aid package yet! But, the total cost difference (tuition and living expenses) is $100,000.

 

[BigMaun]

2020 Dental Match: A Strong Showing for CDM

Class Profile | School of Dentistry

These are the only two articles I found online regarding their match rates with orthodontics. The Columbia one is from 2020 so it may not be entirely accurate, but they noted that they had a 100% placement for their students in orthodontics and they generally try to help their students get into whatever postgrad program they want. I think both options would leave you with the ability to specialize in orthodontics for sure, but Columbia probably offers a higher chance of ensuring an east coast/NYC spot.

 

[JacquesVallee]

Primary goal is to match into orthodontics. I am heavily weighing matching into orthodontics program over all factors.*

All the more reason to go to the cheapest school. Ortho isn't a specialty where you typically make OMFS money, and many residencies require tuition. All the more reason to pick UCSF. UCSF is also an amazing school anyways. If you go to Columbia and end up paying tuition for Ortho residency, you're potentially looking at 800-900k+ of student loan debt.

 

[deleted923283]

You won’t become an orthodontist if you’re broke AF from dental school.

 

[Pablo Sanchez]

Hands down UCSF! You can specialize from there. $100k is SIGNIFICANT. $100k will be accruing interest while you potentially take out more loans for ortho residency.

Give up going to “your dream school” so that you can live your dream life. You’ll be in for quite a surprise if you spend all of this extra money to get where you want to go just to graduate and end up being a slave to your job. There are a lot of orthodontists living a life burdened by debt.

Plus SF is better than NYC. I said what I said.

 

[youdi12]

Also a quick reminder that UCSF (a class of 60) typically likes to take 1-3 of their own students for their ortho residency. UCSF is also one of the very few ortho programs in the nation that provides a generous salary (~75k/year) to their residents.