comlex 1 scores

[tylerdo]

does anyone know when we can expect our comlex scores?

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[bonefixr]

The unofficial results from KCUMB-COM (formerly UHS) is a 95% pass rate. We had 12 of 222 fail to my knowledge. I am not sure what our class average for this year was but I believe it was in the 550+ range. Have fun with the comparisons!

 

[texdrake]

The 89% is not 'rediculous' without the fact that representatives of about 1/3 of the testing body has already claimed about a 94% cumulative pass rate. There must be a big school with 70% out there somewhere...lets hear it from you guys!!

Idiopathic. Hate to bust your bubble, but 5 (# that have reported on this site) is not 1/3 of 21 (# of DO schools). Furthermore it doesn't include the two largest schools NYCOM and LECOM, nor does it include repeat test takers.

5 schools isn't even a statistically significant sample.

 

[Idiopathic]

I am not attacking you. Dont worry.

5 is about 7, and the scores resported so far account for about 750-800 test takers, wouldnt you agree?

Maybe I should have said about 1/4 of test takers

You didnt burst my bubble, since I wasnt exactly pinning any hopes on my statement, just throwing out there what everyone could already see. So you would think that LECOM and NYCOM have about 80% passing?

(Psstt: and I brought up the fact that the numbers dont include re-testers...I want the data to be true, it just looks dicey)

 

[texdrake]

I will admit that the data looks a little odd considering the number I was given. That said, I believe NYCOM has had some pretty low pass rates the last few years so we will see....

 

[DistantMets]

Rediculous how? That pass rate is fairly close to the USMLE pass rate when you are not factoring in foreign test takers.

Right, but DO students only pass the USMLE about 70 some odd percent of the time. So what does that say to me?...There are already lots of DO students that just get by on the COMLEX, but probably wouldn't pass the USMLE. So its scary to think that 12% of us can't even pass the COMLEX. Is it any wonder so many allopathic residency programs don't look at the COMLEX? Don't you think it would make sense for them to make us take the USMLE instead of the COMLEX and then have us take a bunch of OMM questions on another day to complete our boards? The AOA couldn't risk the embarassment of have a fourth of us fail, so they write a sloppy test called the COMLEX instead.

The point I was trying to make was basically what Idio said, that if numerous schools are well above 90% then there's probably a bottom third or fourth that is closer to 80%. I'm just curious to see if any of these schools are new or have expanded their class sizes recently, etc. I just think that there are some private schools out there that are expanding because they see $$$$, rather than an abundance of quality candidates, and it's going to show up in board scores, then clinical practice, then DO reputation (even more so). The scores should be going up, not down. That's probably a separate thread though, but thanks for letting me vent.

Oh, our Dean emailed us saying that the National Average was 88%. 88 vs 89% might just be how they rounded or something.

 

[DRealDrZ]

I've been gone for a while...but got COMLEX (and U-SMELL) back. I passed COMLEX
USMLE on the otherhand...how the He(ck) do you get a 180/74. Seriously...the sad thing is that I thought of about 6-8 ?'s after the test that I should have got correct...stupid test. Should I retake it? Lets just say I "passed" COMLEX...didn't do as well as I'd thought.

 

[texdrake]

Ah, DistantMets.... I don't think that the two tests are really that comparable. Most MD schools have substantially larger amounts of funds and thus to a ton more research. Because of this, these schools emphasis different areas of the curriculum than DO schools do. So I don't think that DO students are properly prepared for the USMLE. Likewise I think that if you saw MD students take the COMLEX, they would pass on a lower percentage, although I do think that percentage would be higher than the DO percentage on the comlex. Due in part because I feel that some DO schools may let in a few to many students that really shouldn't be in school, but also because the DO schools tend to take a lot more non traditional students than the MD schools do.

 

[Idiopathic]

Likewise I think that if you saw MD students take the COMLEX, they would pass on a lower percentage, although I do think that percentage would be higher than the DO percentage on the comlex.

This doesn't even make sense.

Due in part because I feel that some DO schools may let in a few to many students that really shouldn't be in school, but also because the DO schools tend to take a lot more non traditional students than the MD schools do.

This says that non-trads cant take tests. If you cant take a standardized exam by the end of year 2 in medical school, then either you havent been paying attention or you weren't taught well at all.

 

[texdrake]

I meant the DO percentage on the USMLE....good catch Idio

As for non-traditionals I meant that many struggle at times with the longer tests because it may have been years since they took tests that were longer than an hour, on the other hand, I can see your point.

 

[DrMom]

Do you not have any tests longer than 1 hr at your school? We certainly did. I stand with Idio on this one...if you haven't refined your test-taking skills in the first 2 years of med school you probably only have yourself to blame.

 

[Idiopathic]

I think that allo students would have an equally hard (if not harder) time with the COMLEX, if only for the biomechanics of OMT that is so pervasive within the test. Sure, we dont get super-strong prep in biochem, genetics, cell bio, stats, and behavioral sci, but we at least have those classes. The allo students wouldnt even know how to approach many of the basic OMT questions regarding scoliosis, Ferguson angles, etc. and our functional anatomy knowledge is probably superior as well.

With that said, 70% passing for the USMLE seems about right for the osteo students, especially considering we prep for so much stuff that isnt on that test, and then have to cram in the extra stuff. I cant imagine, even with a month or so of OMT prep, that allo students would do much better on our exam.

 

[DireWolf]

Not to mention the fact that you can't "prepare" for the COMLEX. The entire test is a crapshoot. USMLE, on the other hand, is more reasonable.

 

[smgilles]

The 89% is not 'rediculous' without the fact that representatives of about 1/3 of the testing body has already claimed about a 94% cumulative pass rate. There must be a big school with 70% out there somewhere...lets hear it from you guys!!

That's a good question...I have heard a few numbers quoted at LECOM, but who knows if they are rumors or there is some truth to them. God knows the administration would never tell us the truth. I have heard 76% and 85% passing for the class of 2006. If it is actually 76% all I can say is shame on LECOM.

 

[InductionAgent]

You make some good points, but it is not particularly scary that ~12% of COMLEX-takers fail, because of how the test is set up. That is, the raw scores for the COMLEX I are converted such that the mean is 500 and the standard deviation is 79. Any score falling below 400, or more than 1.27 standard deviations below the mean, automatically fails. On a normally distributed curve, this is slightly more than 10%.

You can calculate this figure on this website FYI:
http://people.hofstra.edu/faculty/Stefan_Waner/RealWorld/stats/normaldist.html
(Remember to multiply the p-value times 100%)

 

[Idiopathic]

Yes, 10% is about right, but if everyone is clustered around the mean, then nobody would fail. There has to be a pretty significant outlier effect for 12% to fail, I would think.

 

[texdrake]

well considering LECOM is the 2nd biggest school and with those low % points listed above.....

Still the number I gave you guys was 88.8% I believe or 89% if you will, not much difference between "slightly more than 10 percent" and 11 percent in my book.

Oh and yes I will agree with Dr. Mom and Idio on the argument above, the reasoning makes sense to me.

 

[InductionAgent]

From Idiopathic:

Yes, 10% is about right, but if everyone is clustered around the mean, then nobody would fail.


Not so. The closer the scores are clustered around the mean, the smaller the standard deviation becomes. As a result that makes the raw cutoff score for failing higher, so if a z-score of -1.27 is the threshold for failure, you still get a failure rate of 10% on a normally distributed curve.

What would actually help decrease the failure rate is if a select few bomb the test horribly, negatively skewing the distribution. This would decrease the mean, while increasing the standard deviation, both of which would push the threshold score for failure lower.

 

[Idiopathic]

This is not necessarily true, because the passing, mean and SD are all arbitrarily set by the NBME. In other words, they set the mean and SD, and people fall into the range, rather than the testees setting the statistical values with their scores.

 

[BrooklynDO]

i have this theory about the relationship between the comlex and usmle grading system ... let me know if this makes sense ok?
it seems to me that the comlex uses a standard deviations curve when reporting your two digit scores...because you can "pass" with a percentile in the teens. while the usmle has a min passing two digit score of what looks like 75 (according to the FA book I have). So , if you do say one SD above the mean on the comlex, you get a 34%tile. while, if you do the same (comparatively on the usmle, youre basically in the 90's

therefore , we have a conversion of scores (im not saying the tests are the same, but i got the feeling most people do pretty much the same in comparison to the mean on both exams... this is not a statistical double blind study here, just my observation)
so this yea the usmle mean was 217 and SD 23 ((if im off, its not much i think)) therefore if the same person did 1 sd above the mean, his/her three digit usmle score is about 240... which i guess puts you over a 90 or so...
and besides, this theory makes me feel better

 

[DrMom]

One SD above the mean is waaay above 34%ile on the COMLEX. It's more like 80th-ish. I'm sure someone around here scored right at 1 SD over the mean & can verify...I'm extrapolating off of my score.



Since you can compute a percentile for a USMLE score, it seems more reasonable to compare them that way.

 

[Idiopathic]

i have this theory about the relationship between the comlex and usmle grading system ... let me know if this makes sense ok?

Well, it isnt exactly a theory. Statistically, one SD above and below the mean comprises ~67% of test takers, right? 33% below and 33% above. At a score of 580, you would be 50% + 33% above the 0 percentile, and would, therefore, be roughly 83 percentile. So, it is fair to say that 83% of all test takers are below 1 SD above the mean. This holds exactly true for the USMLE as well, but they dont report their score as a 'percentile' of sorts, but rather as an arbitrary two-digit number. The NBOME does convert your score to a two-digit USMLE score upon request.

So its like comparing apples and oranges, really.

 

[Nauramian]

How does one contact the NBOME about converting your score to a 2-digit USMLE score?

Thanks,
John

 

[Idiopathic]

Go to the website, www.nbome.org

On one of the links, there is info on this.