Completely worthless med school activities

[DW]

Lets start listing them...

Micro lab

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[DrMom]

Writing a stupid book report for multicultural health.

 

[Chicago Doc]

I second the micro lab!
and add...
Putting together a 45 min group project for our Clinical Medicine course

 

[Medical123]

The library assignments on how to look up resources, regulations regarding copyright laws, etc. They are so boring and time consuming!

 

[Doctor Octopus]

Writing an Ethics Paper...

 

[kaos]

Mandatory "problem-based learning" sessions where you discuss 3 separate cases, come up with any random ideas on things you think are worth researching, then do "independent research" after which you have to present the info (preferably by Powerpoint) to your group mates.

 

[Resident Alien]

dude, how you been. could you let me know how to get in touch with you (email phone whatever).

 

[s vena cava]

i'd like to second (or third) most of these! micro lab, library resource assignments, and one lecture we had during musculoskeletal that was pretty much all about USC football...although that was somewhat entertaining. we also have professionalism classes where we discuss the touchy-feely side to medicine. (why did we get into medical school in the first place???)

 

[footcramp]

first year

 

[DW]

first year

haha, awesome

 

[debvz]

epidemiology lectures

 

[tofurious]

1. PBL with other similarly clueless people
2. Bioethics discussion with people you would never agree with
3. AMA
4. AMSA
5. SNMA
6. (state initial)MA
7. Any futile attempt to "teach" cultural sensitivity - this is something you either have or don't. Nothing that can be taught within 3 hours can undo a lifetime of prejudices.

 

[SDNer2004]

we also have professionalism classes where we discuss the touchy-feely side to medicine. (why did we get into medical school in the first place???)

You don't think learning the skill of professionalism and the art of medicine, not just the science is important?

 

[SaltySqueegee]

7. Any futile attempt to "teach" cultural sensitivity - this is something you either have or don't. Nothing that can be taught within 3 hours can undo a lifetime of prejudices.

Funny you should mention that. A heard a statistic some where [?] that stated it takes X number of years of training and deprogramming to break a mind set that has been set X number of years. ...Scarey...

 

[s vena cava]

I think it's important, SDNer, but I sometimes think the way it was being "taught" and not discussed is not very effective. this largely depends on the dynamic of the group discussing these topics, and what topics, specifically, were being addressed. I hope that next year our dynamic will be different... (our groups are rearranged, with different mentors). I think professionalism is something that can't be taught, but must be felt and dealt with more in a problem-based format. we'll see how it goes next year. do you have similar classes at your med school? (or are you at USC also? )

 

[idq1i]

Introduction to primary care. Paternalism bad....paternalism bad....CAM good

 

[pikachu]

Any lecture esp. by a PhD who has no clue how their material is connected to actual clinical practice

 

[BigBopper]

PBL- biggest waste of time. I know some people think is a great way to learn, but I think it is incredibly inefficient and fragmented in the knowledge gained from such an exercise.

 

[Adcadet]

a lecture on "frontiers of neuroscience" that isn't on the exam given by a PhD who knows jack about clinical medicine. You knew it was going to suck when he started with "this disease is rare - unless you're a neurologist and specialize in this disease, you'll almost certainly never see it." And then to seal the deal he explained how it was untreatable. Ug!

 

[Kev (UK)]

Lets start listing them...

White Coat Ceremonies....we don't have them here in the UK but the whole concept sound quite ridiculous to me. Sorry if they are your "thing" but whats the big deal?

 

[Medical123]

PBL- biggest waste of time. I know some people think is a great way to learn, but I think it is incredibly inefficient and fragmented in the knowledge gained from such an exercise.

I have to agree with this statement. PBL may be great, depending on your group and mentor, but I have not had a good experience with my PBL course in general. We waste countless hours in the library, looking up obscure little details about the case we are working on that has nothing to do with the objectives related to the case! Seriously, our case may involve an 80 year old man with heart disease and someone asks a question about whether getting pregnant with heart disease causes a risk to the fetus. Instead of just simply answering the question, our mentor says "Let's turn that question into a learning objective." We are so busy researching stuff like this that we barely touch upon the learning objectives that we were supposed to be working on and the course directors wonder why our class as a whole does poorly on the PBL exams. My mentor is not at all enthusiatic about the course and only does it because she has to. It really shows. There is a lot of busy work involved with the class which includes library assignments and quizzes, competencies on Powerpoint and Excel, presentations, and papers. I wish we spent more time in Physical Diagnosis and less in PBL!

 

[DW]

White Coat Ceremonies....we don't have them here in the UK but the whole concept sound quite ridiculous to me. Sorry if they are your "thing" but whats the big deal?

no argument from me on that one

 

[13538]

White Coat Ceremonies....we don't have them here in the UK but the whole concept sound quite ridiculous to me. Sorry if they are your "thing" but whats the big deal?

Couldn't agree more! We don't have them in Ireland either...but I remember when I started some of the US students in class were disappointed that we weren't going to have one!!! Maybe it's an American thing

 

[Jalby]

Any assigned textbook. The only one that I can really remember being assigned and usefull was first aid that was assigned for our integrated cases.

 

[Joe Joe on da Radio]

histology...it's called a pathology residency.

when am i ever going to see another signet ring cell if i don't become a pathologist?!?

 

[sacrament]

The field of embryology.

 

[ItsGavinC]

The field of embryology.

Your use of the word "field" gives embryology a lot more credit than it deserves. Let's call it a hobby, shall we?

 

[Fermata]

The field of embryology.

Little red corvette......

 

[8744]

White Coat Ceremonies....we don't have them here in the UK but the whole concept sound quite ridiculous to me. Sorry if they are your "thing" but whats the big deal?

A-friggin'-men, buddy. It's ridiculous, especially since medical students traditionally (in our country) wear a short white coat which instantly identifies one as a prole and is a convenient way to tell us apart from the lab techs, the social workers, and everybody and their brother who wears the traditional long white coat.

Not to mention that the white coat ceremony is held early in first year when you know absolutely nothing about medicine and feel like a complete fraud every time you are required to put it on.

 

[8744]

I have to agree with this statement. PBL may be great, depending on your group and mentor, but I have not had a good experience with my PBL course in general. We waste countless hours in the library, looking up obscure little details about the case we are working on that has nothing to do with the objectives related to the case! Seriously, our case may involve an 80 year old man with heart disease and someone asks a question about whether getting pregnant with heart disease causes a risk to the fetus. Instead of just simply answering the question, our mentor says "Let's turn that question into a learning objective." We are so busy researching stuff like this that we barely touch upon the learning objectives that we were supposed to be working on and the course directors wonder why our class as a whole does poorly on the PBL exams. My mentor is not at all enthusiatic about the course and only does it because she has to. It really shows. There is a lot of busy work involved with the class which includes library assignments and quizzes, competencies on Powerpoint and Excel, presentations, and papers. I wish we spent more time in Physical Diagnosis and less in PBL!

Sweet mother of Abraham Lincoln! I had no idea it was so bad. Our curriculum fooled around a little with PBL but the bulk of it was thankfully lecture based. I don't ask much from a medical school to which I am paying thousands of dollars per year. One thing, a little thing, is that they tell me what I'm supposed to learn and then test me on it. They present. I learn. They test. Simple and effective. A great way to learn the basics of medical science before third and fourth year which are all "Problem Based Learning."

If medical school is goingto be self study why go to the first two years at all? Maybe they could have made it a correspondence course which one could take at their own pace.

 

[daisygirl]

If medical school is goingto be self study why go to the first two years at all? Maybe they could have made it a correspondence course which one could take at their own pace.

Since I went to very few lectures (but all mandatory labs, small group, etc...), I actually often felt like I was taking "correspondence" classes.

 

[Medical123]

If medical school is goingto be self study why go to the first two years at all? Maybe they could have made it a correspondence course which one could take at their own pace.

Not all of our program is PBL based. PBL is part of the Practice of Medicine Course that we have. This course consists of three components, the PBL cases and projects, our preceptorships, and the Doctor/Patient Society sessions (DPS). I think that I would go insane if all of our courses were PBL based!

 

[Neuronix]

Everything politically correct that my med school loves to shove down our throats. They're always trying to find ways to require something new. I like how they sell it to the applicants. I guess we're just the med school that cares...

Poorly done classes about culture that teach us nothing but to be sensitive and give us nothing useful about dealing with other cultures.

A whole boatload of other courses and "patient centered experiences" that are just a giant waste of my time. I think they're trying to build up our ability to empathize now before internship blows that away. Hey, I have a brilliant idea, why don't you change the internship system?

Anything about nutrition. The entire damn thing. Eat less + do something = lose weight! I don't need a nutritionist to tell me when someone is eating too much junk food they need to stop. Especially entire sections on "Metabolic Syndrome"... If you're a lardo for awhile, of course you're going to have hyperlipidemia, pre-diabetes (if not frank diabetes), hypertension, and elevated triglycerides. You call that a syndrome?!

 

[13538]

Anything about nutrition. The entire damn thing. Eat less + do something = lose weight! I don't need a nutritionist to tell me when someone is eating too much junk food they need to stop. Especially entire sections on "Metabolic Syndrome"... If you're a lardo for awhile, of course you're going to have hyperlipidemia, pre-diabetes (if not frank diabetes), hypertension, and elevated triglycerides. You call that a syndrome?!

Nutrition is actually very important...especially in the surgical patient. It's relevance will become more apparent when you get into the clinical years..for example, if you try to abruptly start parenteral nutritional support on a severly malnourished patient...the patient will end up with "refeeding syndrome" characterised by hypophosphataemia, malaise, lethargy and eventually coma and death!

Pay attention to stuff about nutrition...many of the patients you will see will be malnourished...

 

[Neuronix]

Okay, I should modify what I said earlier. I agree that there are actually important points regarding things like refeeding, malnutrition, etc... Let's go with "Anything regarding fat people!"

Edit: At my med school all the important issues in nutrition are covered in GI or Endocrine. The "nutrition" classes seem like repeats over and over again that your patients need to lose weight.

 

[13538]

Okay, I should modify what I said earlier. I agree that there are actually important points regarding things like refeeding, malnutrition, etc... Let's go with "Anything regarding fat people!"

Many of your patients will be "fat people" too

I know what you mean about nutrition...I used to think the same until a [surgical] resident told me its actually very important to know about nutrition and it's frightening how many residents don't know anything about nutrition or even "refeeding syndrome"...

 

[Doctor Octopus]

dude, how you been. could you let me know how to get in touch with you (email phone whatever).

Check your PMs dude!

 

[lindyloohoo]

I have to agree with this statement. PBL may be great, depending on your group and mentor, but I have not had a good experience with my PBL course in general. We waste countless hours in the library, looking up obscure little details about the case we are working on that has nothing to do with the objectives related to the case! Seriously, our case may involve an 80 year old man with heart disease and someone asks a question about whether getting pregnant with heart disease causes a risk to the fetus. Instead of just simply answering the question, our mentor says "Let's turn that question into a learning objective." We are so busy researching stuff like this that we barely touch upon the learning objectives that we were supposed to be working on and the course directors wonder why our class as a whole does poorly on the PBL exams. My mentor is not at all enthusiatic about the course and only does it because she has to. It really shows. There is a lot of busy work involved with the class which includes library assignments and quizzes, competencies on Powerpoint and Excel, presentations, and papers. I wish we spent more time in Physical Diagnosis and less in PBL!

you all apparently figured out how to screw PBL and get your own education yet then have you. If you've got a cool group, make the statement to not comment on anything small or ridiculous, otherwise we'll have to look it up. If you've got that self-rightous, "well common now guys. this is medical school aren't we here to learn everything we can about everything?" tell him to can it, immediately. Nicely say, I think a more important objective is to understand the physiology/pathology/biochem of the situation, then we can work on those secondary issues. hopefully, it will be swept under the rug. Also, just don't do the work. If you don't feel like looking up if aspirin should be taken full strength, half strength, with water, with a cookie, before crapping, after a shower, then don't do it. When you need to know it, you'll learn it. Just say you didn't have time to get to it because you were focusing on some larger issues you didn't understand well. Our mentors have caught on to our methods and some have even encouraged them. They really don't feel like listening to me rattle off an entire paragraph of robbins that I memorized 5 minutes before group. They'd rather be in clinic, in the lab, sleeping, whatever.

I've practically taught myself medicine, and I did a pretty good job of it if I do say so. Do the "required" stuff half way. just pass that garbage. focus on learning medicine. if that's what you want to do, then that's what you should do. group is a waste of time. cut the dog and pony show, learn on your own. You better learn now because no one's gonna come to you when you're practicing and say: here are the new studies that just came out. You need to understand X, Y, and Z for the test on Wednesday. If you do not pass, we'll hold your hand and make sure you do get it. But really, I do love the amount of free time you get to study. It certainly comes in handy for boards.

 

[8744]

The biggest problem I have with PBL is that I hate studying in a group. Small group sessions drive me bonkers. On the wards, I am a team player but when it comes to studying I am "every man for himself and devil take the hindmost." In three years of medical school I have never, except for mandatory PBL type sessions, studied in a group and I don't think I have suffered.

 

[skiz knot]

I don't ask much from a medical school to which I am paying thousands of dollars per year. One thing, a little thing, is that they tell me what I'm supposed to learn and then test me on it. They present. I learn. They test.
If medical school is goingto be self study why go to the first two years at all? Maybe they could have made it a correspondence course which one could take at their own pace.

Your whole life as a doc is going to be "self study." You are going to have to be able to gather and assimilate information on your own, without being force fed everything.

PBL trains you to do this.

 

[jennyboo]

White Coat Ceremonies....we don't have them here in the UK but the whole concept sound quite ridiculous to me. Sorry if they are your "thing" but whats the big deal?

Agreed! Dumbest waste of 2 hours and a grand in plane tickets and hotel for my parents, too.

And the other "ceremony" I haven't done but don't want to attend, is the Match Day event. Hopefully I'll be doing an overseas away elective right around that time.

 

[Leforte]

As a person who went through one of the early matches this year - it was completely anti-climatic. At 9 am I just went into the student services offices and was handed an envelope - was alone and could open it up anywhere I liked. Still it would have been nice to get the news with the rest of my classmates. But I'm digressing from the topic.

We had medical humanities electives that we had to take, including literature in medicine, writing (we even had to write poems!), etc - don't get me wrong, I appreciate good reading like everyone else, but after being in classes all day long, the last thing I want to do is read a novel about medicine or write prose about medical problems and situations I haven't yet seen. Whatever.

Just get through it, and try to keep a positive attitude during the whole process. It's far to easy to get on the 'ole "this sucks - how is this related to being a REAL doctor" path... Remember 3rd & 4th years are all about attitude as much as knowledge.

 

[SaltySqueegee]

And the other "ceremony" I haven't done but don't want to attend, is the Match Day event. Hopefully I'll be doing an overseas away elective right around that time.

LOL!

That's when for some strange reason, you end up not matching, and end up getting lost in the scramble.

Sorry, don't want to jinx you, but that sounds dangerous.

 

[mooklyster]

histology...it's called a pathology residency.

when am i ever going to see another signet ring cell if i don't become a pathologist?!?

Cmon, where else would you see the happy skier, or the happy Klansman hahahaha?
My vote is split...Ethics in medicine and cultural dynamics in medicine

 

[KyGrlDr2B]

I always studied by myself. I find that if I'm studying with people, too much time gets spent on the things I already understand and not enough time on the things I have trouble with. Not to mention you start talking about so-and-so and it all goes downhill. However, sometimes it is beneficial to study at the same table as someone from your class so you can ask them questions if you need to. What you could do is find someone else with a family just like you and the two of you set aside saturday mornings to study together, but spend the rest of the time by yourself. If it doesn't work, you can always stop doing it.

 

[lindyloohoo]

This has been a concern for me. By having a family I want to give them as much of my time as possible but at the same time I want to avoid alienating myself from fellow students in the event that I may need a little study help from time to time. I don't want them not wanting to help me out because I don't hang out. Have you had this problem? I feel like you as in every man for himself because in 4yrs of undergrad I never ever did a group study. I didn't have the time. I had to get home with the kids and stuff and I see it being the same way in med school. How easy is it to learn this stuff on your own? Is it pretty much like undergrad except for more work in a shorter time span? I just want to know what to expect because at 5pm I plan on hitting the door and going home to play, feed, bathe, and put my children to bed and then hit the books all my my lonesome!!!!!!

With all the board review books out there, it's almost impossible to go wrong in studying. As long as you hit the big points in a good source (ie look what's important in BRS physio and read about it guyton in more detail) you should be fine. This is what I've done, and it's worked well.

As for feeling alienated because you have a family, my classmates and I respect those with families a lot because we understand how difficult it must be to do what you're doing. Whenever they've needed help, we've usually bent over backwards to help them. I can't speak for your classmates, but I've seen PBL be more "help from classmates" friendly because you actually have a reason to be teaching each other, group. Plus, you're interacting on a somewhat daily basis so you have a relationship with these people that you might not have had if you were sitting in lecture all day.

I've found the material a bit easier than undergrad because it's not so in depth, but there's SOOO much of it that you've got to be efficient in studying. Try different things if what you first try doesn't work. Ask for help!! The worst they can do is shoot you down. (and frankly, those are the people you need to avoid in the future )

 

[pikachu]

LOL!

That's when for some strange reason, you end up not matching, and end up getting lost in the scramble.

Sorry, don't want to jinx you, but that sounds dangerous.

Actually if you don't match they notify you by e-mail beforehand, so you can get ready to scramble. (also done mostly by email and phone so not impossible from a distant land). Not to mention knowing not to show up to the ceremony. Going to Match Day (or not) has nothing to do with your ability to scramble. jennyboo, I'm with you on the international rotation in March. It's always nice to hear from someone else who is not falling for the cultivation, through things like the white coat ceremonies/match day, of a false sense of camaraderie and school spirit. Such bullspit!

Now, graduation -- that's a ceremony I'm looking forward to.

 

[8744]

Your whole life as a doc is going to be "self study." You are going to have to be able to gather and assimilate information on your own, without being force fed everything.

PBL trains you to do this.

Aw hell, I learned how to go to the library and research in fifth grade. Additionally, I have been reading since the first grade and I can effortlessly either go online or open a reference book and get up to speed on any subject at any time.

The problem with PBL (at least from what I've read and from my limited experience with it) is the ancilliary bull**** it entails including preparing presentations, endless discussions, and wasted hours of researching trivia. If I don't know something, I research it and read enough on it to satisfy my requirements.

In PBL, you are not gathering and assimilating information on your own. Instead, you are gathering it and assimilating it for your group leader to demonstrate that you have gathered it. Sort of a "verification of gathering."

 

[8744]

Actually if you don't match they notify you by e-mail beforehand, so you can get ready to scramble. (also done mostly by email and phone so not impossible from a distant land). Not to mention knowing not to show up to the ceremony. Going to Match Day (or not) has nothing to do with your ability to scramble. jennyboo, I'm with you on the international rotation in March. It's always nice to hear from someone else who is not falling for the cultivation, through things like the white coat ceremonies/match day, of a false sense of camaraderie and school spirit. Such bullspit!

Now, graduation -- that's a ceremony I'm looking forward to.

Hang on, match day is pretty cool. (But I agree that the White Coat ceremony is lame). It is a big deal finding out where you'll spend the next four years. And we don't have false camaraderie at my school. While it is true that next year I may never see many of my classmates again, I am good friends with many of them.

Let's not be too cool to enjoy some ceremony and tradition. Match day is a fun, harmless tradition. Graduation is traditional and while I'm not expecting a religious experience, it will be a nice ceremony to finish four years of hard work.

 

[SaltySqueegee]

Actually if you don't match they notify you by e-mail beforehand, so you can get ready to scramble. (also done mostly by email and phone so not impossible from a distant land). Not to mention knowing not to show up to the ceremony. Going to Match Day (or not) has nothing to do with your ability to scramble. ...
Now, graduation -- that's a ceremony I'm looking forward to.

Thank you for info. I stand corrected.