Contract questions

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Medicalfm

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Hi everyone,
Long time lurker, haven't posted much. I'm finishing up my third year of family medicine residency and received my first job offer. I've heard of the typical base and wRVU style reimbursement and am relatively familiar with that. However, this is a private/group practice. They do not offer partnership track, but the offer is approximately this.

Base salary: 225,000

then salary is "adjusted" to match estimated annual receipts on a quarterly basis (i'm trying to figure out what exactly that means).

you get 35% of the first 0- 425,000 EAR, 37% of 425000-525000, 39% of 525000-625000, and 40% of 625000-725000. Above that you get 85%.

I just wanted to see if anyone can talk me through this. I want to get a contract lawyer to review the rest if I'm interested. But i'm trying to understand the broad strokes of the contract first.

Thanks for any help!

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Hi everyone,
Long time lurker, haven't posted much. I'm finishing up my third year of family medicine residency and received my first job offer. I've heard of the typical base and wRVU style reimbursement and am relatively familiar with that. However, this is a private/group practice. They do not offer partnership track, but the offer is approximately this.

Base salary: 225,000

then salary is "adjusted" to match estimated annual receipts on a quarterly basis (i'm trying to figure out what exactly that means).

you get 35% of the first 0- 425,000 EAR, 37% of 425000-525000, 39% of 525000-625000, and 40% of 625000-725000. Above that you get 85%.

I just wanted to see if anyone can talk me through this. I want to get a contract lawyer to review the rest if I'm interested. But i'm trying to understand the broad strokes of the contract first.

Thanks for any help!

So you are an employee and your compensation will be determined by collections which your bosses will solely have control of.

As an employee, you will most likely not have any access to the "books"/ financial records.

You are at risk of unscrupulous business owners taking advantage of you and cheating you out of your pay and you will have no way to prove it.

What is the payor mix? PPOs will typically pay more than some of the medicare/medicaid rates and some of the HMOs. Who is determining who gets what patients.

As the new person, are you getting stuck with the crappy insurance patients?

Private groups try to do this shady stuff.

Also, are you a W2 or 1099? If they want an employee, they need to pay up and give you a guaranteed salary. This adjusting stuff is garbage if they want you to be employed. You get all of the negatives of being a partner (volatile income) without the benefit.

Importantly, who is paying your malpractice?

If you leave, who pays your tail? That can be tens of thousands depending on your situation.
 
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short answer no without partner track

long answer
lets say you get collections up to the 725000 mark. you would get 166250+37000+39000+40000 =282,250
they get 442,750

what do you think? I would say h-e double hockey sticks NO. I loose more than that running for the bus.
 
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So you are an employee and your compensation will be determined by collections which your bosses will solely have control of.

As an employee, you will most likely not have any access to the "books"/ financial records.

You are at risk of unscrupulous business owners taking advantage of you and cheating you out of your pay and you will have no way to prove it.

What is the payor mix? PPOs will typically pay more than some of the medicare/medicaid rates and some of the HMOs. Who is determining who gets what patients.

As the new person, are you getting stuck with the crappy insurance patients?

Private groups try to do this shady stuff.

Also, are you a W2 or 1099? If they want an employee, they need to pay up and give you a guaranteed salary. This adjusting stuff is garbage if they want you to be employed. You get all of the negatives of being a partner (volatile income) without the benefit.

Importantly, who is paying your malpractice?

If you leave, who pays your tail? That can be tens of thousands depending on your situation.
This is obviously spoken by a person who has direct experience with the situation. This is the life I lived for WAAAAAAAY too long.

I was SEVERLY underpaid for the work I was doing and could never claw enough. Now you work your ass off even more and your numbers improve yet again, and you tell yourself ok, this next year will be the year that I finally break through, only to have a modest, but discouraging improvement over the last. Wash, rinse, repeat.

After the attractive (maybe) guarantee expires, your base goes down substantially. The income you are generating gets held in hostage for no less than 5 months at a time while they "close out the quarter" and you are entitled to a percentage of what you have earned. Your base will probably barely cover your monthly expenses if you have a family, mortgage and big loan payments to make. You will probably use your hostage money to catch up, especially if you made any significant outlays (few thousand on home improvements or a vacation with family) up to that point. As a result, you have a hard time gaining ground.

You will have to have completely trust the accounting (in any system, really). You will never see the upper tiers of the salary they are broadcasting. That carrot will always be out of reach.

This system is the worst of the worst. even if my production was consistent, no 2 month's financials would ever make any sense. It's seriously demoralizing. With your new base, it never feels like you're making a physician's salary.

I went an embarrassing amount of time like this, always working harder, always thinking this next year is it, but it never was. It's depressing really. I should be a lot farther ahead than I am. What you make is one thing, when you get it and how it's doled out is another. You can keep someone pretty broke (not poor) this way.

My hospital system was recently bought and I'm now under an RVU system. My new salary is based off my last year's overall production numbers. My monthly income has doubled and I finally feel like I can breathe. I'm on track to make 20% more than last year and my salary is doled out in a much more equitable fashion.

The non-compete and loyalty to my patients were the biggest influencing factor as to why I never left. I honestly love every one of them and it hurt me to think about dissolving the relationship. I do a metric ton of responsible mental health, many of my patients are kind of hard to handle. I'm in a small town. If I leave, they go elsewhere, and likely end up on a daily benzo or worse. That's a lot of guilt to try and fade.

I get 15-20 new patient requests a week. I take everybody. I no longer sweat payor source, but my practice is currently very favorable in this regard. I'm still pushed to produce but I finally feel like I can gain some ground.

It seems good for now but the relationship is still in the honeymoon phase so we'll see.
 
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This is obviously spoken by a person who has direct experience with the situation. This is the life I lived for WAAAAAAAY too long.

I was SEVERLY underpaid for the work I was doing and could never claw enough. Now you work your ass off even more and your numbers improve yet again, and you tell yourself ok, this next year will be the year that I finally break through, only to have a modest, but discouraging improvement over the last. Wash, rinse, repeat.

After the attractive (maybe) guarantee expires, your base goes down substantially. The income you are generating gets held in hostage for no less than 5 months at a time while they "close out the quarter" and you are entitled to a percentage of what you have earned. Your base will probably barely cover your monthly expenses if you have a family, mortgage and big loan payments to make. You will probably use your hostage money to catch up, especially if you made any significant outlays (few thousand on home improvements or a vacation with family) up to that point. As a result, you have a hard time gaining ground.

You will have to have completely trust the accounting (in any system, really). You will never see the upper tiers of the salary they are broadcasting. That carrot will always be out of reach.

This system is the worst of the worst. even if my production was consistent, no 2 month's financials would ever make any sense. It's seriously demoralizing. With your new base, it never feels like you're making a physician's salary.

I went an embarrassing amount of time like this, always working harder, always thinking this next year is it, but it never was. It's depressing really. I should be a lot farther ahead than I am. What you make is one thing, when you get it and how it's doled out is another. You can keep someone pretty broke (not poor) this way.

My hospital system was recently bought and I'm now under an RVU system. My new salary is based off my last year's overall production numbers. My monthly income has doubled and I finally feel like I can breathe. I'm on track to make 20% more than last year and my salary is doled out in a much more equitable fashion.

The non-compete and loyalty to my patients were the biggest influencing factor as to why I never left. I honestly love every one of them and it hurt me to think about dissolving the relationship. I do a metric ton of responsible mental health, many of my patients are kind of hard to handle. I'm in a small town. If I leave, they go elsewhere, and likely end up on a daily benzo or worse. That's a lot of guilt to try and fade.

I get 15-20 new patient requests a week. I take everybody. I no longer sweat payor source, but my practice is currently very favorable in this regard. I'm still pushed to produce but I finally feel like I can gain some ground.

It seems good for now but the relationship is still in the honeymoon phase so we'll see.
Take care of yourself. Depending on your non-compete distance/clause ... some of your patients would still follow you.

We care about our patients. Sometimes that's how employers get us to stay and work us to the bone. All in the name of doing what's best for the patient. It's funny how that only applies to us, and not typically them.
 
For what it's worth, I'm in my 3rd year post residency, I recently joined a Health system that has a pay structure similar to this however your % are lower than mine.

Location in south, medium sized city, $240k guarantee x 2 year. If your within your first 2 years of employment and are outproducing base pay, you will auto enroll into the Professional Services Collections model with my keeps below
- 45% up through $440k
- 50% from $440k-600k
- 60% anything beyond $600k

The company guarantees 97.5% collection rate of expected net revenues and does not accept forms of medical assistance. They also do quarterly reviews with you from day one to give you a better understanding on how you would be compensated on this model based on your quarterly volumes.

Of the groups in the area I moved to, the health system I chose felt like the best FIT for me which made giving this payment model a chance easier for me to try. They allow you to use your entire admin time on Friday afternoons and shift around a portion of your lunch time to end of day (I don't like 1hr lunches and would rather have 30 min of that shifted to end of day to get stuff done and get out early). Overall, it's a have it your way, schedule flexibility wise which is a pleasant surprise.

Prior to this, I have been on a wRVU model. The worst case scenario for this choice is my payments are projected to be less than I expected and I see what else is out there for myself.

I would recommend if you choose this position to ask for an increase on what you keep and ask about the current payor mix for the location you would be considering.
 
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