Controlling Parents Have Left Me Stuck

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w0lf137,

i agree with you in that there are two sides to every story, however...i think its a bit too much to imply that im making my parents out to be monsters. not a day goes by without me understanding that i wouldnt have the health and life that i have today had it not been for my parents' willingness to provide for me for everything that i needed...food, home, most of my tuition, etc.

if you want my parents' side of the story, here is what they would tell you: we provided for our son for more than 20 years and therefore, he must listen to us and agree to be a doctor because that is the only career which can provide the stability that we need. other sons and daughters in our community have become amazing doctors, why cant our son do it? whats wrong with him? and why would he want to be an english professor or a writer? low people do those kinds of jobs. i would rather him be a janitor than a writer. janitors make more money than writers! who will want to marry him? we are in our 50s now and he has to provide for us as we have provided for him when he was young and dependent.

nothing in that above quote is an exaggeration...each one of those statements have been made. the only variation may be the exact wording. also, i mean no disrespect to janitors as i do not agree with my parents' class-based worldview.

you tell me what im supposed to do with parents who literally (and no exaggeration here) believe that the only career that can bring the bread home is medicine. while diverting me away from my original aspirations to be a writer may not make them monsters, the act itself is a monstrosity.
 
chessknt87 said:
A lot of us understand that certain styles of parenting can have long-lasting negative effects on their children too. Even if he is omitting facts, the truth in their behavior at his graduation and rejection of his area of study is enough evidence to determine they have no interest in his happiness with life, which is why he needs to move out.
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That is not nearly enough evidence to show that they have no interest in his happiness with life. Maybe they care so much about him, they are just precocious and dont want to see him on the streets with an English degree even though I doubt it. They maybe believe that being a doctor is a safe (easy) path to have money in your pocket as is evident from his parents' examples. No one knows if they really care for him or are sadistic just looking for a way to exploit their son without giving a damn about him. I just don't feel confortable telling him to move out without looking at all points of view.
 
You have about the lowest self-confidence i have ever seen. If I were you I would get admitted to med school somewhere (it's not that hard) then tear up the acceptance letter in front of your parent's faces and move far away and begin your own life that they've kept you from. You might also want to seek professional help to deal with these issues. There are professionals who are very good at what they do and what they do is help people like you who have been emotionally abused by your parents. Your family sounds like shallow, greedy, materialistic, insecure jerks and you should get far away from them.

Don't be a doctor unless it's what you want to do (you already said it's not). You'll hate yourself every day for the rest of your life. Tell your parents to piss off and go be successful in some other walk of life.

By the way, this doesn't just happen with medicine and 'south asians.'

I have seen it in plenty of other career paths among white people, especially in military careers and professional sports.
 
Precocious? I don't think that's the word you're looking for. Anyway, it really doesn't matter what his parents think they're doing. Rather, we're concerned with what they are doing which is stifling their son and forcing him into an extremely demanding career he is marginally interested in at best.
 
i, as the OP, will be the first one to say that my parents arent sadistic or twisted in their control. i definitely do agree that they want to wish me well. HOWEVER, HOWEVER, the goal that they think i must achieve in order to be successful is very narrow, and the method through which they want me to achieve that goal is extreme. there is NO flexibility whatsoever as far as career choice is concerned...but apparently, working towards that career choice isnt proving to be making them any happier.

for the good part of my life, ive been a people-pleaser. i am arriving at the point in my life where i realize that people-pleasers just get nowhere. ive been a people-pleaser to my own detriment, and every time i tried to please someone else, i would always get screwed over and the people i tried to please would just back away and say, "hey...it ain't my fault."

my mistake was in thinking that the perpetual dilemma of the typical people-pleaser would not apply to parents. it does...im proof.
 
oilrig25 said:
w0lf137,

i agree with you in that there are two sides to every story, however...i think its a bit too much to imply that im making my parents out to be monsters. not a day goes by without me understanding that i wouldnt have the health and life that i have today had it not been for my parents' willingness to provide for me for everything that i needed...food, home, most of my tuition, etc.

if you want my parents' side of the story, here is what they would tell you: we provided for our son for more than 20 years and therefore, he must listen to us and agree to be a doctor because that is the only career which can provide the stability that we need. other sons and daughters in our community have become amazing doctors, why cant our son do it? whats wrong with him? and why would he want to be an english professor or a writer? low people do those kinds of jobs. i would rather him be a janitor than a writer. janitors make more money than writers! who will want to marry him? we are in our 50s now and he has to provide for us as we have provided for him when he was young and dependent.

nothing in that above quote is an exaggeration...each one of those statements have been made. the only variation may be the exact wording. also, i mean no disrespect to janitors as i do not agree with my parents' class-based worldview.

you tell me what im supposed to do with parents who literally (and no exaggeration here) believe that the only career that can bring the bread home is medicine. while diverting me away from my original aspirations to be a writer may not make them monsters, the act itself is a monstrosity.
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I don't think you should persue a career in medicine because your heart isn't into it. But if you do move out, do you have a job to support yourself or can you move in with a friend. I think when you will move out, your parents will feel this is the final step it took to lose you and they will be devastated. Even you will feel depressed. Can you handle the feeling of letting down your parents and get back into writing? Maybe you can write a book about that.
 
w0lf137,

okay, i was taking every word you were writing with just as much consideration as all of the other kind people that have been offering suggestions to me, even the ones that were brutally honest about the situation.

i think you've crossed the line with that last sentence in your last post. i was reading your last post, taking every word just with as much weight as I have been reading everyone else's word. But when i got to that last sentence, i wish i had not read your post at all. you know that was a snide remark and that is a total low-blow.
 
Your story is def not uncommon among asians, especially ones whose parents have come here from china, india, korea, japan etc... I've seen common themes with all of these families.

1) Why did we come here if you're gonna have some crap job? You could've had some crap job in X country.
2) What else can you do with your life? You're not suited for anything else. Mention any other career and prepare for a barrage of lecturing. What? You want to write? How are you gonna make a living off that? What? You want to work for a magazine? You're gonna be making X amount of money a year.

Pretty much....asian parents care about one thing. MONEY. They couldn't give a crap about "helping people"....when I was applying to med school, my mom was like why are you volunteering and wasting your time...kicker is..she is a doctor and doesn't believe in helping people.

Having a lot of these discussions with my asians friends, pretty much we've traded free will for money. Most of us don't have to work, pay back loans, cover the application process, pay for kaplan, etc...because our parents will do anything to ensure our success in life. In return, we promise to do whatever they want.

As for happiness...my parents say.."You gonna be happy when you're poor and homeless?"

One of my friends was pre-med, she had a nervous breakdown in college and had to go to therapy. You know what her parents did? No sympathy. "Whaa?? You know you can't have this mental health issue your record when you apply to med school!? Don't go get help."

At the same time, my white friend has to pay for college herself, constantly worries about covering fees, books, couldn't apply to as many schools because of money. That sucks too.

Pretty much, life will suck unless you somehow take what your parents want and find something you love in it. Keep digging.
 
oilrig25 said:
w0lf137,

i agree with you in that there are two sides to every story, however...i think its a bit too much to imply that im making my parents out to be monsters. not a day goes by without me understanding that i wouldnt have the health and life that i have today had it not been for my parents' willingness to provide for me for everything that i needed...food, home, most of my tuition, etc.

if you want my parents' side of the story, here is what they would tell you: we provided for our son for more than 20 years and therefore, he must listen to us and agree to be a doctor because that is the only career which can provide the stability that we need. other sons and daughters in our community have become amazing doctors, why cant our son do it? whats wrong with him? and why would he want to be an english professor or a writer? low people do those kinds of jobs. i would rather him be a janitor than a writer. janitors make more money than writers! who will want to marry him? we are in our 50s now and he has to provide for us as we have provided for him when he was young and dependent.

nothing in that above quote is an exaggeration...each one of those statements have been made. the only variation may be the exact wording. also, i mean no disrespect to janitors as i do not agree with my parents' class-based worldview.

you tell me what im supposed to do with parents who literally (and no exaggeration here) believe that the only career that can bring the bread home is medicine. while diverting me away from my original aspirations to be a writer may not make them monsters, the act itself is a monstrosity.
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i don't like the idea of changing your own worldview that others suggested, since i believe that what you believe makes you who you are, and if other people don't like it then tough.

what i would do is change your parents worldview. i know that you said this is hard, but in reality, doctors don't make that much money. honestly, when i was going through doing all the pre-med stuff, i questioned myself a lot whether i really wanted to be a doctor. financial stability isn't really something that's guaranteed. as a resident you are overworked and get paid very little. even when you're all done with medical training, a lot of your money goes into malpractice insurance and all this other junk. you don't really get much spending money (unless you do derm, radiology, anesthesiology, etc... i think those are considered the money makers). but i know a few engineers who get paid as much as doctors... and i know a few tenured profs who make a lot more than the average doctor (well those profs are kind of well established and have big teaching positions i guess).

the idea is, there are TONS of other jobs out there that pay a lot more than being a physician. when my parents found that out, they were really shocked and pushed me to become an engineer instead (lol). but, ultimately, you have to go into an occupation for your own reasons, and not just because of money and stuff.

Edit:
Just wanted to add that I don't think moving out is a good decision. For me, that's kind of like running away from your problems. If you have a problem, you stand up and deal with it, you don't run away (well that's my mentality anyway).

In Asian cultures, respect and familial love is a very BIG BIG thing. Let's say you move out... what would happen? Well, your parents COULD feel devastated... but who knows what if they really don't care and they're like "our son is so dumb he moved out, now he's going to die on the streets, lets see how long it will take before he comes running back to us mwuhaha".

But, look into the future... if you severed your family ties and disowned everyone... how would you feel? Think about when you get married, your spouse will have their family there at the wedding supporting you, and who would you have? What about when you have kids... your kid will be like "do i have grandparents? where are they?" then how will you respond? How will your kids react when they find out that you ran away from home? They might think that running away is something that's good or OK to do, and they might run away from you sometime.

For me, family is very important. They're like your support. In life, you can lose a lot of things... your money, your friends, your wife/gf, anything is possible. But, your family are your family, and they are always there for you.

Think about it.
 
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Nobuo said:
. but i know a few engineers who get paid as much as doctors... and i know a few tenured profs who make a lot more than the average doctor (well those profs are kind of well established and have big teaching positions i guess).
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'Few' and 'average' are the key words in this sentence.

Nobuo said:
the idea is, there are TONS of other jobs out there that pay a lot more than being a physician. when my parents found that out, they were really shocked and pushed me to become an engineer instead (lol).
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Very rarely will you find an engineer with a salary more than $100k. Very rarely will you find a doctor who makes less than $100k. Most professionals who earn more than this in other fields do so either by ladder-climbing or extrasalary incentives like stock options. Most 'jobs' that pay more than this require a certain skill or talent. For example, runway model, or basketball player, or movie star. And nearly all of these 'jobs' are on a contract basis.

Doctors have the highest 'salary' of any degreed profession. Accept it and deal with it.

Nobuo said:
Just wanted to add that I don't think moving out is a good decision. For me, that's kind of like running away from your problems.
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False. You 'run away' when you're 15, not 26.
 
hey oilrig

you are prolly from iselin, nj right? anyway. listen. take it from a guy who got through medical school and residency and boards.. all while hating what he did.. dont do it dont go to medical school. I can tell just by your post you are gonna off yourself after 2 years. Not because i dont think you can do it, but you dont wanna do it. and I can say its a terrible sentence. Go to the website medschoolhell.com and check out what others say.. good luck in your endeavors. If you wanna send me a pm ill be perfectly happy to give you my phone number and we can talk

maceo
 
three words
william carlos williams
 
enjoydrywax said:
Ah, the "durr bill gates didn't go to college" argument--one of these days the people who spout this bull**** will realize that this is the extremely rare exception to the rule (in this case the starving, struggling writer).
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First of all bill gates went to college, Harvard actually. He just didn't graduate. But that's besides the point. That's why i wrote "anecdotal post script" because it is just that; anecdotal. Will it happen, probably not. But could it? Yes.

Can't you just give a guy hope that maybe what he enjoys doing MAYBE will some day pay off?
 
yeah the thing is that even if you DO become a doctor, they'll find an excuse to be pissed off...they'll just say that you are behind compared to xx patel and no amount of effort can reverse time.

so if you become a journalist, maybe they will be pissed at that too. so your parents will probably have the exact same mood if you become a journalist or a doctor, the only difference being that you will be more happier in one. so just choose the field you like.

also i remember reading an interview of m. night shymalan's ('sixth sense') and he said his parents were really upset at him becoming a filmmaker but now they see his success and they have changed their mind 🙂

anyway i am south asian too...so this is what you do..stay busy outside the house all the time working towards your goal. if you are applying to places, don't let them know until it's in your hand. cuz they will probably offer an opinion on everything and make you lose heart. in my fam we share cars so we can't work far from the home...anyway my sister decided to apply like 10 miles north somewhere. Selfish? yes. but hey, in the end, she is the one earning money, while i sit home. So sometimes being 'assertive' or whatever is rewarded...so do what you like.
 
You need to quit worrying about your parents, who cares about what they feel, it's about what you feel. Go get your PhD in English and be happy -_- Your too old for this bullsh*t. Don't blame your parents for making you feel guilty. If you'er going to act like a child your parents are going to treat you like a child.

oilrig25 said:
from the suggestions that have been given, i feel like i know what should be done...all it is right now is a matter of be just being a man and doing what i need to do. however, everything in my life has been a catch-22, and this is no different at all. i should move out and away from my parents, but i dont know how my parents were able to do this, but they somehow hardwired me to be overcome with an overwhelming feeling of guilt and disgust even when i disobey them. im wondering if i will be at peace if i move away.

as far as being a doctor is concerned, its not that i am vehemently opposed to the idea. i mean, i would prefer to become a professor or a writer, but i feel like i owe it to that one period of time where i tried to prove myself by taking the pre-med classes. im gonna be honest, despite my love for the liberal arts, i was really proud of what i had done by doing well in those classes. however, like every other achievement in my life, i never feel too good about it...and i always second-guess myself, thinking "oh...it may have been luck."

if i do end up becoming a doctor, it still wont be to the satisfaction of my parents because i want to be a doctor that engages in humanitarian work...aka reduced pay. my parents will have a fit with that!
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Hi, OP, I can empathize. I dealt with a similar situation up through high school and most of college. Then when I graduated, I decided not to get a job. As you might guess, that went over well. 😉

Though the circumstances aren't exactly the same, I know where your (our) parents are coming from. They struggled in their home country, then they struggled in America to provide their family with a comfortable, secure future. They just don't want to see you struggle the way they did (and they certainly don't want to have to struggle again as they get older). What they don't seem to realize is that they also came to America to give you choices. You can survive in this country doing something you love. You may have to have a day job to pay the bills, but you won't be looked down upon or go hungry. Thanks to them, you don't have to constantly fret about where your next meal will come from. Your parents may not be prepared to realize that; they're survivors after all, and that's the only way they've ever lived.

That's why I feel the need to reiterate the suggestion to leave home -- not because "you're 26 and it's lame to still be living at home," as some people have implied, but rather because it's clear that you and your parents need some space. You need some time to yourself to figure out what you want (distinct from what they want), to repair your ego, and to prove to yourself as much as to them that you are your own person. They need to see that you are capable of surviving on your own, and maybe they will also realize that they could drive you away if they keep pressuring you the way they do.

I speak from personal experience. I spent a year in Japan after graduating, about as far from my family as I could ever get, pursuing something they thought was completely useless, and it did wonders for me. Our relationship is better than ever now. After a year, I concluded that medicine was right for me, without any input from my parents. When I returned, they were just happy to have me back in the same country, and they have stayed, for the most part, out of my business.

Now, I'm certainly not saying your parents will do a complete 180. There could be years of guilt and struggle ahead of you, but the physical space will help clear some mental and emotional space. And that should (hopefully) help you move forward with your life and whichever career you ultimately choose.

Good luck.
 
Druzie said:
That's why I feel the need to reiterate the suggestion to leave home -- not because "you're 26 and it's lame to still be living at home," as some people have implied, but rather because it's clear that you and your parents need some space. You need some time to yourself to figure out what you want (distinct from what they want), to repair your ego, and to prove to yourself as much as to them that you are your own person. They need to see that you are capable of surviving on your own, and maybe they will also realize that they could drive you away if they keep pressuring you the way they do.
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I agree. I don't think moving out is "wrong", but I think that you have to have the right reason to do it. You can't just be like "to hell with you guys" and then move out, which would be the wrong attitude to have. You need to be able to be like "I'm 26, I need to be independent".

Also, if you need some proof that doctors can be "underpaid" look here:

http://medinnovationblog.blogspot.com/2008/08/are-doctors-paid-enough.html

http://www.merritthawkins.com/Candidates/BlogPostDetail.aspx?PostId=6224

I'm not saying that ALL doctors are underpaid. It's just that salary depends on your specialty and largely on the way or manner that you practice and do your business. I just think that you shouldn't go into medicine because of the pay. You have to do it for your own reasons. Your parents need to understand that, which is why I am bringing this "underpaid" topic up.
 
oilrig25 said:
you tell me what im supposed to do with parents who literally (and no exaggeration here) believe that the only career that can bring the bread home is medicine. while diverting me away from my original aspirations to be a writer may not make them monsters, the act itself is a monstrosity.
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This is tiresome.

You can do the following:

A) Stop listening to them. Grow up. Live your own life.
B) Continue to listen to them. Be miserable. Commit suicide at 32.

Seriously. Every post you make is one excuse after the other. Change is scary, no ****. Everyone is afraid of leaving the comfortable. But everything in your posts suggest that you are absolutely miserable. If the last few years of your life have been horrific, why would continuing down the same path make your life *better*? Being comfortable and unhappy is surely worse than taking a chance and hopefully profiting.

The only time, by your admission, that you were happy was during your undergrad, doing English. So why are you perseverating in your decisions endlessly, doing something that you know will not make you happy, knowing exactly what the end result will be - more depression.

For the love of Christ, change is scary, but grow a spine already. This has nothing to do with your culture and everything to do with you. I had a Jewish friend who was exactly like you and, five years down the line, he's as miserable as he was in high school due to his controlling parents treating him like he's still 15. Grow up, man. You are 26, act like a ****ing adult. Stop blaming your parents for your dependence. Move out already. Doing that alone, living by yourself, will help build your self-esteem and self-confidence more than any other single action could.
 
Move out. Living at home is making you miserable and is impacting your health. If your parents are not supportive about you starting to take the track they want, they will never, ever be satisfied. Someone else mentioned "that neurosurgery residency isn't that prestigious..." That's exactly what will happen.

Figure out what your goals are. If the most important thing is to please your parents, get into medical school (the one they want you to get into) and be prepared to wait a LONG time for their approval. If your goal is anything else, pursue that. If you have the means, move out on your own (if you don't, getting those means should be goal number 1).

And while w0lf137 has for the most part been astoundingly and embarrassingly unhelpful, the idea of using this whole thing as inspiration for your writing is a pretty good one. There's certainly a lot of conflict and you sure as hell know the characters inside and out.
 
atomi said:
Very rarely will you find an engineer with a salary more than $100k.
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I grew up in an engineering family with many engineering friends, and I can say that this is not true. Engineering is actually a pretty high-paying job...its only problem is that once you get into your 40's and 50's, you often start costing more than you're worth to the company, what with the constant experience-based raises and such (hence the common notion that engineers need a second career midway through their lives). Before that, though, engineers can and do easily make six figures for quite a while.

I mean, the average starting wage for a new engineer starting his first job after graduating from UC Berkeley is around $50k-55k...you can't claim that this wouldn't easily rise above six figures.
 
yay someone agrees with me 😀

Retsage said:
This is tiresome.

You can do the following:

A) Stop listening to them. Grow up. Live your own life.
B) Continue to listen to them. Be miserable. Commit suicide at 32.

Seriously. Every post you make is one excuse after the other. Change is scary, no ****. Everyone is afraid of leaving the comfortable. But everything in your posts suggest that you are absolutely miserable. If the last few years of your life have been horrific, why would continuing down the same path make your life *better*? Being comfortable and unhappy is surely worse than taking a chance and hopefully profiting.

The only time, by your admission, that you were happy was during your undergrad, doing English. So why are you perseverating in your decisions endlessly, doing something that you know will not make you happy, knowing exactly what the end result will be - more depression.

For the love of Christ, change is scary, but grow a spine already. This has nothing to do with your culture and everything to do with you. I had a Jewish friend who was exactly like you and, five years down the line, he's as miserable as he was in high school due to his controlling parents treating him like he's still 15. Grow up, man. You are 26, act like a ****ing adult. Stop blaming your parents for your dependence. Move out already. Doing that alone, living by yourself, will help build your self-esteem and self-confidence more than any other single action could.
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If you aren't planning to go to medical school, then what are you planning to do for a career? It's okay to follow your own dreams and desires, but do you have a solid plan/pathway to follow with a reasonable chance of success? That's the important issue here...if you have a plan and can follow it, then that is infinitely better than just wanting to do it.

If you want to become a writer/English professor, do you have a strong portfolio of your writings or experience with writing for a newspaper or involvement in writing competitions?
 
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oilrig25 said:
man...my parents have really weighed down on me. i have low self-esteem, i think negatively most of the time, and i always assume the worst is going to happen. i'm 26 but i look 35 and i think its because the stress is wearing down on me. i feel bad enough that im at this age and i still have to seek advice by posting my problems up on a public forum...seems like something a crazy teenager would have to do in order to cope.
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grow a pair of balls, please.
 
geenelln said:
Your story is def not uncommon among asians, especially ones whose parents have come here from china, india, korea, japan etc... I've seen common themes with all of these families.

1) Why did we come here if you're gonna have some crap job? You could've had some crap job in X country.
2) What else can you do with your life? You're not suited for anything else. Mention any other career and prepare for a barrage of lecturing. What? You want to write? How are you gonna make a living off that? What? You want to work for a magazine? You're gonna be making X amount of money a year.

Pretty much....asian parents care about one thing. MONEY. They couldn't give a crap about "helping people"....when I was applying to med school, my mom was like why are you volunteering and wasting your time...kicker is..she is a doctor and doesn't believe in helping people.

Having a lot of these discussions with my asians friends, pretty much we've traded free will for money. Most of us don't have to work, pay back loans, cover the application process, pay for kaplan, etc...because our parents will do anything to ensure our success in life. In return, we promise to do whatever they want.

As for happiness...my parents say.."You gonna be happy when you're poor and homeless?"

One of my friends was pre-med, she had a nervous breakdown in college and had to go to therapy. You know what her parents did? No sympathy. "Whaa?? You know you can't have this mental health issue your record when you apply to med school!? Don't go get help."

At the same time, my white friend has to pay for college herself, constantly worries about covering fees, books, couldn't apply to as many schools because of money. That sucks too.

Pretty much, life will suck unless you somehow take what your parents want and find something you love in it. Keep digging.
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Wow. Interesting post...

xdopaminex said:
yeah the thing is that even if you DO become a doctor, they'll find an excuse to be pissed off...they'll just say that you are behind compared to xx patel and no amount of effort can reverse time.
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:laugh:
 
Retsage said:
This is tiresome.

You can do the following:

A) Stop listening to them. Grow up. Live your own life.
B) Continue to listen to them. Be miserable. Commit suicide at 32.

Seriously. Every post you make is one excuse after the other. Change is scary, no ****. Everyone is afraid of leaving the comfortable. But everything in your posts suggest that you are absolutely miserable. If the last few years of your life have been horrific, why would continuing down the same path make your life *better*? Being comfortable and unhappy is surely worse than taking a chance and hopefully profiting.

The only time, by your admission, that you were happy was during your undergrad, doing English. So why are you perseverating in your decisions endlessly, doing something that you know will not make you happy, knowing exactly what the end result will be - more depression.

For the love of Christ, change is scary, but grow a spine already. This has nothing to do with your culture and everything to do with you. I had a Jewish friend who was exactly like you and, five years down the line, he's as miserable as he was in high school due to his controlling parents treating him like he's still 15. Grow up, man. You are 26, act like a ****ing adult. Stop blaming your parents for your dependence. Move out already. Doing that alone, living by yourself, will help build your self-esteem and self-confidence more than any other single action could.
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Qft.
 
oilrig25 said:
hey all,

ive been reading through the forums for about a year now, getting advice on what i need to do to get into medical school and all. However, ive gotten to the point where i myself need to post here to get some advice on what i need to do because i am in a situation where i just feel stuck.

i realize that these forums are not for seeking advice about personal issues that i guess people would see a mental health professional for, but because pre-medicine sort of intertwines with what i am dealing with, i guess i can have some justification for posting here.

i am 26 years old and i am south asian (i feel that taking note of my ethnic background would be of relevance here). ever since i was a kid, my parents have been dreaming of me becoming a doctor...not just an ordinary one, but a money-making one that could buy a mansion and cars and so on and so forth. growing up in my community of south asians that liked to shelter themselves from every other community (something i found problematic from a young age), my parents would always compare me to other bright kids within the community, kids who are now residents and their families are all-smiles and happy and they have houses with green grass outside of them and stuff. one of them is even a full-blown orthopaedic surgeon who is only 29 years old...did the whole accelerated pre-med thing. anyway, from a young age, i was always judged according to what these "gods" in my community have done.

when i finally got to undergrad, i was repulsed by the idea of pre-med, so i did what i wanted to do...i love literature and i love writing, so i decided to become an english major. i found solace in reading books about characters that i identified with, so my four year of being an english major were probably the happiest of my life. of course, my parents were having a fit. every night in the home, arguments, fights, debates..."youre going to be homeless as an english major...blah, blah, blah." my hope was that my parents would eventually come around and see how good of a writer i was, and they would eventually accept it (i am a good writer...please excuse my deficient writing in this post. i'm too stressed to follow proper prose at the moment).

then came graduation, probably one of the most devastating days of my life. my parents showed up only as a formality, and they didnt crack a single smile on that day. that crushed me...being surrounded by graduates who were being congratulated by friends and family and all i had were parents that were angry.

my parents just wouldnt give up on the whole pre-med thing. day after day after day, "youre not like so-and-so from our community, youre going to be homeless, you wont be able to provide for yourself, and so on." i couldnt take it anymore. about a year after doing an internship at a prominent library, i decided that i would do something generous for my parents. i would begin this seemingly noble path to medical school, so while working full time as a librarian, i dished out the money to take some pre-med classes. surprisingly, i did very well in them. i completed them all with a 3.7 gpa.

HOWEVER, throughout that period when i was taking pre-med classes, my parents werent assuaged ONE BIT! they kept saying i wasnt good enough to be a doctor, i was like...holy ***, im doing what you want me to do now! they didnt give a ****, all they did was belittle me and say that "people like me" (a rebellious south asian who went against the tide by studying the "ignoble" field of english) can never succeed at anything in life. at the end of each semester, i would get good grades...hoping to get their approval, but after each pre-med class, it was always the same reply: "yeah, well...we'll see how you do next class." nothing changed...the arguments continued, but this time, their problem was, "youre too late! other people your age are already beginning residency! you wont provide for us!"

even when i was done all my pre-med classes, the mantra was, "yeah, well...we'll see how you do on the MCAT." i took the MCAT back in june and voided the exam because i didnt feel too confident. despite doing very well in the classes, i was so browbeaten by the fact that my parents barely recognized what i did with the pre-med classes that i didnt feel like going on, and that affected my MCAT studying. even though medicine is not what i would prefer to do (i wouldnt mind it, seeing as how i get the opportunity to be a humanitarian and help people), it really sucks and depresses me to know that i forfeited my own dreams to try and fulfill the dreams of my parents...only to see them just as angry today as they were before i started the pre-med classes. i talked to them and asked them if i can get any credit, they said, "you dont mean anything until you actually get into medical school." great...

now im stuck, i had this elaborate plan to study for my MCAT one more time and i know i can rock more than a 35, but im so down and depressed. there is no encouragement for me to go any further. i thought my parents and i would finally get along as a result of this, but nothing...theyre not any happier today than they were before i started the pre-med classes. and i thought about going back to english, but my writing skills have drastically decreased as a result of not keeping up with my writing and reading ever since taking this pre-med detour. also, i want to move away from home into an apartment with some friends and my parents are like, "no way!" im 26 years old, about to be 27 in two months! i feel like im a teenager thats stuck!

i apologize for making this post longer than any i have personally read in the forums, but im hoping my pre-med colleagues out there on SDN could offer a metaphorical shoulder for me to lean on by giving me some advice on what i can do. i know i can focus on the goal of becoming a doctor, but im just so down right now. i feel like i have to finish the mission now since i invested a lot of time and money into the pre-med classes...but my parents...man.
Click to expand...


---> I'll make it simple for you, being middle-eastern and having the same family mentality:

Always honor your mother and father, most of us do owe them more than we realize. I feel like this is forgotten in the American melting pot.

But I will also insist, more bluntly: stop being a wuss, be a man, and live your life in whatever manner you see best fit for YOU and nobody else. This doesn't mean disrespect your parents, it just means that in the long run, life is short and you better live it to your own standards and nobody else's.
 
I haven't read the last many posts, but here's my take again. I seriously think you should consider going to medical school and becoming a doctor. I understand your dilemma, as we(Asians) understand that parents can be tricky. When you become a doctor you will get the financial security to pursue your interests in other fields. Sure, you'll need to pay back loans, but your disposable income will probably be greater than if you pursued another career.
 
Look yaar, I think if you can actually get your head around going to medical school and being a doctor, you should. Like you said, you think you'll be ok with it, which is the key. I'm assuming you have pretty tough skin, so you can probably make it through. You're intelligent, so you probably won't have too much trouble getting in. When things are all said and done, you would be able to provide for your family and easily get a wife. But CAN you be content with this life? I'm not asking you if you prefer it, or if you would like to do something more. I'm asking if you can accept it, at all. If so, I think you can end up generally happy in life, and achieve what you want to achieve. You can incorporate your hobbies and your skills into your career or in various side projects. But, shadow some doctors to see what they actually do, and try to look into different specialties and environments that doctors work in. If you can wrap your head around the idea of being a doctor after that, and muster some enthusiasm, you're golden. You don't have to have known for sure since you were 5 that you wanted to be a doctor, for the profession to be right for you.

But, even if you get into medical school and then residency and then into practice, your parents won't stop there. They will try to control your life as long as they can, whether it be marriage, buying a house, friends. Honoring and respecting your parents is noble, but that doesn't mean relinquishing all control. You have to do things on your own too. Don't let their money be a stranglehold. Take loans if you have to. Get a job if you have to. Then one day, you can take care of them because you want to take care of them, and how you see fit. But don't do things just to appease them because they will find other things to criticize and control you with. That will probably never change, but at least you'll know where you stand, and be confident in your own decisions if you start taking responsibility for your own actions and stop reacting to what your parents say or do.

P.S. I suggest that if you do take care of your parents when you're settled, do not live in the same house, because they will drive you up the wall.
 
OP, I suggest that you tell your parents that you are pinning your hopes on reincarnation. Or perhaps investment banking. Apparently Lehman Brothers is hiring.
 
geenelln said:
Having a lot of these discussions with my asians friends, pretty much we've traded free will for money. Most of us don't have to work, pay back loans, cover the application process, pay for kaplan, etc...because our parents will do anything to ensure our success in life. In return, we promise to do whatever they want.
Click to expand...

So true. I know many Asians/Indians in medicine, dentistry, and pharmacy that don't really have a particular passion for the field, but went into it just to appease their parents. At the end of the day, they are still great professionals who are good at their jobs and make a very handsome income.
 
noskill said:
So true. I know many Asians/Indians in medicine, dentistry, and pharmacy that don't really have a particular passion for the field, but went into it just to appease their parents. At the end of the day, they are still great professionals who are good at their jobs and make a very handsome income.
Click to expand...

Yups. And one of my white friends gets mad at this because she claims that we're not "passionate" about medicine as other people might be. Which might be true, but if asians can outscore all the other races on the mcat and grades, indicating that we do at least have the aptitude to go into this field..why not? We might not be passionate about it, but we're at least compatible for the field.

That was kinda getting off topic. People are telling the OP to ignore his parents, and that's how I felt too, but you do have to understand where they are coming from. They sacrificed so much for you to come to this country, worked so hard and they want you to be successful so you don't have to suffer as much as they did. They mean well, but foreign parents usually don't present this in the right way. In a way, they shelter their children too much.
 
geenelln said:
Yups. And one of my white friends gets mad at this because she claims that we're not "passionate" about medicine as other people might be. Which might be true, but if asians can outscore all the other races on the mcat and grades, indicating that we do at least have the aptitude to go into this field..why not? We might not be passionate about it, but we're at least compatible for the field.
Click to expand...

I disagree completely. Compatible for a scientific career? Yes. Compatible for medicine? NO. (And hopefully AdComs see this.)

The lack of passion is evident in one's bedside manner....and that's all I'll say.
 
Yea, I feel ur pains. Grow some nuts and follow ur dreams. =P I got one sister who my parents wanted to enter the medical field. She went to Stanford undergrad btw. She decided med wasnt the thing for her and is pursuing teaching right now. I mean they were mad at her at first, but it's good to do what makes u happy.
 
achang88 said:
I haven't read the last many posts, but here's my take again. I seriously think you should consider going to medical school and becoming a doctor. I understand your dilemma, as we(Asians) understand that parents can be tricky. When you become a doctor you will get the financial security to pursue your interests in other fields. Sure, you'll need to pay back loans, but your disposable income will probably be greater than if you pursued another career.
Click to expand...

Money isn't everything. From what Ive seen there're plenty of other ways to make money.
 
geenelln said:
Your story is def not uncommon among asians, especially ones whose parents have come here from china, india, korea, japan etc... I've seen common themes with all of these families.

1) Why did we come here if you're gonna have some crap job? You could've had some crap job in X country.
2) What else can you do with your life? You're not suited for anything else. Mention any other career and prepare for a barrage of lecturing. What? You want to write? How are you gonna make a living off that? What? You want to work for a magazine? You're gonna be making X amount of money a year.

Pretty much....asian parents care about one thing. MONEY. They couldn't give a crap about "helping people"....when I was applying to med school, my mom was like why are you volunteering and wasting your time...kicker is..she is a doctor and doesn't believe in helping people.

Having a lot of these discussions with my asians friends, pretty much we've traded free will for money. Most of us don't have to work, pay back loans, cover the application process, pay for kaplan, etc...because our parents will do anything to ensure our success in life. In return, we promise to do whatever they want.

As for happiness...my parents say.."You gonna be happy when you're poor and homeless?"

One of my friends was pre-med, she had a nervous breakdown in college and had to go to therapy. You know what her parents did? No sympathy. "Whaa?? You know you can't have this mental health issue your record when you apply to med school!? Don't go get help."

At the same time, my white friend has to pay for college herself, constantly worries about covering fees, books, couldn't apply to as many schools because of money. That sucks too.

Pretty much, life will suck unless you somehow take what your parents want and find something you love in it. Keep digging.
Click to expand...

God bless my asian parents for never, ever trying to force me to pursue a certain career with my life, and always being 100% supportive of me choosing to pursue whatever I wanted to pursue. I know too many stories similar to what you suggest in this post, and it really makes me appreciate them even more.

To the OP, it's your life man. Eventually you'll have to make sure that you are doing what will make you happy and the most fulfilled. You have to decide whether making your parents happy will make you happiest, or whether pursuing the things that you want to pursue will make you happiest. In any situation that you are presented with, you always have a choice. That's where the power of your free-will comes from, and the power to change your situation.
 
noskill said:
So true. I know many Asians/Indians in medicine, dentistry, and pharmacy that don't really have a particular passion for the field, but went into it just to appease their parents. At the end of the day, they are still great professionals who are good at their jobs and make a very handsome income.
Click to expand...
I just wanted to ditto this. Who cares what your motivations for entering the career were, as long as you can do your job?

There are a lot of people on SDN who need to realize that in some parts of the world, people can't just choose a career because they're "passionate" about it. They have to do what it takes (within their capabilities) to support a family. And not just 2.5 kids. I'm talking a huge extended family, many of whom are living on sub $5k a year, etc.

That said, OP sounds like he'd be miserable as a doc. Get your memoirs published and you'll be rich anyway.
 
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MsKrispyKreme said:
I disagree completely. Compatible for a scientific career? Yes. Compatible for medicine? NO. (And hopefully AdComs see this.)

The lack of passion is evident in one's bedside manner....and that's all I'll say.
Click to expand...

Yes, maybe that's why we have the highest drop out rate of the all the races.

But surviving the "immigrant" days has really given many Asian kids the drive to succeed. Even if they aren't sure medicine is their life-long love yet...they'll make sure to do everything they can to beat the competition.

It's kinda like an arranged marriage. The passion with come with time.
 
1. Your parents don't respect you and they never will unless you start acting like an adult. They came to America for a reason.
2. Patients don't care about the song in their doctor's heart. They just want someone who will answer the phone in the middle of the night with the right answer.

I'll take a grumpy, competent asian over a passionate dunce any day. I just want his opinion, not his mommy's.
 
geenelln said:
Yes, maybe that's why we have the highest drop out rate of the all the races.

But surviving the "immigrant" days has really given many Asian kids the drive to succeed. Even if they aren't sure medicine is their life-long love yet...they'll make sure to do everything they can to beat the competition.
Click to expand...

What's that line from House... about the "Asian kid who spends 20 hours a day in the library"?
 
geenelln said:
Your story is def not uncommon among asians, especially ones whose parents have come here from china, india, korea, japan etc... I've seen common themes with all of these families.

1) Why did we come here if you're gonna have some crap job? You could've had some crap job in X country.
2) What else can you do with your life? You're not suited for anything else. Mention any other career and prepare for a barrage of lecturing. What? You want to write? How are you gonna make a living off that? What? You want to work for a magazine? You're gonna be making X amount of money a year.

Pretty much....asian parents care about one thing. MONEY. They couldn't give a crap about "helping people"....when I was applying to med school, my mom was like why are you volunteering and wasting your time...kicker is..she is a doctor and doesn't believe in helping people.

Having a lot of these discussions with my asians friends, pretty much we've traded free will for money. Most of us don't have to work, pay back loans, cover the application process, pay for kaplan, etc...because our parents will do anything to ensure our success in life. In return, we promise to do whatever they want.

As for happiness...my parents say.."You gonna be happy when you're poor and homeless?"

One of my friends was pre-med, she had a nervous breakdown in college and had to go to therapy. You know what her parents did? No sympathy. "Whaa?? You know you can't have this mental health issue your record when you apply to med school!? Don't go get help."

At the same time, my white friend has to pay for college herself, constantly worries about covering fees, books, couldn't apply to as many schools because of money. That sucks too.

Pretty much, life will suck unless you somehow take what your parents want and find something you love in it. Keep digging.
Click to expand...

Reading through these comments, this was the one that inspired me to write a response - as a South Asian who has, in my community, seen way too many times the OP's situation, but who herself has been under minimal (note minimal, not none) pressure to conform to a certain standard - And the reason for that is that from a young age, my brother and I were supporting ourselves, through part-time jobs and financial management - the poster above notes that Asian families tend to provide everything for their kids in return for 'following their orders' - basically a form of indentured servitude - I broke out of that at a young age, and have therefore had a lot of emotional freedom to pursue my own passion (which is government/policy) - I am 23, and voluntarily moved back home after grad school elsewhere, but I feel no pressure from my family and will move out whenever I'm ready, whether that is to pursue medicine (for which I'm applying for my reasons), or, if schools don't like the reasons I am applying, to further my career in the field I've chosen...

to the OP, moving out is not going to solve anything - finding a job is not going to be easy in this economy, and you have a lot of issues to deal with before you suddenly cut ties - however, getting a job while living at home and gradually weaning yourself off of your parents 'providership' will only help you...:luck: to you
 
You'll be alright. You probably don't want to live a life on the streets, but perhaps it's time to start living your own life.
Do what makes you happy, but have a plan. Being a librarian is kind of a crappy plan.
 
Some day somebody is gonna make you want to
Turn around and say goodbye
Until then baby are you going to let them
Hold you down and make you cry
Dont you know?
Dont you know things can change
Things will go your way
If you hold on for one more day
Can you hold on for one more day
Thingsll go your way
Hold on for one more day
 
oilrig25 said:
w0lf137,

i agree with you in that there are two sides to every story, however...i think its a bit too much to imply that im making my parents out to be monsters. not a day goes by without me understanding that i wouldnt have the health and life that i have today had it not been for my parents' willingness to provide for me for everything that i needed...food, home, most of my tuition, etc.

if you want my parents' side of the story, here is what they would tell you: we provided for our son for more than 20 years and therefore, he must listen to us and agree to be a doctor because that is the only career which can provide the stability that we need. other sons and daughters in our community have become amazing doctors, why cant our son do it? whats wrong with him? and why would he want to be an english professor or a writer? low people do those kinds of jobs. i would rather him be a janitor than a writer. janitors make more money than writers! who will want to marry him? we are in our 50s now and he has to provide for us as we have provided for him when he was young and dependent.

nothing in that above quote is an exaggeration...each one of those statements have been made. the only variation may be the exact wording. also, i mean no disrespect to janitors as i do not agree with my parents' class-based worldview.

you tell me what im supposed to do with parents who literally (and no exaggeration here) believe that the only career that can bring the bread home is medicine. while diverting me away from my original aspirations to be a writer may not make them monsters, the act itself is a monstrosity.
Click to expand...


I am going to take an extreme example. Ever since I been immersed in the mainstream culture, I've seen MORE than my share of English writer men pairing off with medicine-going women and live a pretty comfortable life, throw that in your parents face.
 
littlealex said:
You'll be alright. You probably don't want to live a life on the streets, but perhaps it's time to start living your own life.
Do what makes you happy, but have a plan. Being a librarian is kind of a crappy plan.
Click to expand...

I am Asian myself (home grown and flew in from China), but some of the attitude here really make me sick. How is librarian a bad job? A lot of librarians have a wonderful family, enough time to support that family and pursue their own passion. It's a GREAT job.

I think I underestimated how many here just wants money.
 
fizzle said:
Before that, though, engineers can and do easily make six figures for quite a while.

I mean, the average starting wage for a new engineer starting his first job after graduating from UC Berkeley is around $50k-55k...you can't claim that this wouldn't easily rise above six figures.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry but you don't know what you're talking about. As an engineer, I can safely say that you cap out around $95k. It is not kosher for a firm to have engineers paid 6 figures. Yes, starting salaries are good, but they don't go anywhere. You should be making $80k after 10 years in the biz for sure. But keep in mind that raises hardly keep up with inflation and COL.

The only engineers who do better than this are the ones who either (1) consult or (2) get in with a successful start-up.
 
geenelln said:
but if asians can outscore all the other races on the mcat and grades, indicating that we do at least have the aptitude to go into this field..why not? We might not be passionate about it, but we're at least compatible for the field.
Click to expand...

Did you seriously just say this?
 
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