Coronavirus and Audition rotations

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Dr.Bruh

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M3 applying for EM aways currently. many of us are worried of the potential of programs canceling or restricting rotating students if the Coronavirus situation escalates (which it appears will happen). Anybody have any incite on this or is that idea just neurotic? lol.

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I’d imagine if this actually happens on any kind of a wide scale basis, programs are going to be a lot more comfortable with apps with no SLOEs or one SLOE. I think its just as likely the virus dies out this summer though. Who knows. Uncharted territory.
 
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If it's still going on in July/August maybe.
Many schools have already started limiting med student (and resident) interaction with possible coronavirus patients.
 
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For what it's worth, this was just sent out at our institution:

Consensus Statement Regarding SLOEs and Away Rotations
from the CORD Advising Students Committee in Emergency Medicine

With the unpredictable future of COVID 19, we are aware that institutions have begun altering
the clinical experience for students, and instituting bans on travel for both their faculty and
students. Several institutions have already decided not to accept any visiting students for
clerkship rotations, and it is likely that others will prohibit their own students from traveling to
complete away rotations. Further, students may be limited in their ability to evaluate and treat
respiratory complaints, potentially limiting a comprehensive assessment of their clinical skills.

The Council of Residency Directors in Emergency Medicine (CORD) Advising Students
Committee in Emergency Medicine (ASC-EM) anticipates that the travel restrictions will
significantly impact the number of visiting rotations available and the ability of EM bound
students to travel to any remaining available rotations.

We anticipate institutional and regional variability in both the spread and response to COVID 19.

Many students will likely be unable to complete any away rotations this academic cycle. This
will limit students’ collective ability to obtain Standardized Letters of Evaluation (SLOE) outside
of their home institutions. For students without a home residency program, these travel
limitations may prohibit their ability to obtain any SLOEs.
In this continuously evolving, exceptionally challenging time, we feel that it is important for the
educational community to be united and speak with a clear voice. ASC-EM proposes the
following recommendations for EM program leadership, medical schools, and EM-bound
medical students to consider for the upcoming EM application cycle.

1. Encourage programs to be flexible with their SLOE requirements
a. Programs have traditionally held non-SLOE letters of recommendation (LoR) in
lesser regard. Programs have also traditionally had expectations surrounding the
number of SLOEs a student would need to have submitted in order to be
considered for an interview (typically 1-2) or rank (typically 2).
b. ASC-EM recommends for application cycle 2020-2021 that residency program
leadership consider reducing their typical number of SLOEs needed to review an
application to one SLOE (or fewer) to account for students who cannot obtain a
SLOE at their home institution. We also recommend programs be willing to
accept alternative letters of recommendations to act as surrogates for their typical
SLOE requirements as detailed in the paragraphs below.

2. Encourage programs to give weight to alternative (non-SLOE) Letters
a. Examples of alternative LORs include, but are not limited to, orphan SLOEs (a
SLOE from a home EM rotation at an institution without an associated residency
program), EM sub-specialty SLOEs , or a letter written by an advisor for the
instance that a student has been entirely unsuccessful in obtaining an EM
rotation. The CORD website contains instructions and a template for writing such
SLOEs.
b. Given the increased emphasis that will be placed on non-SLOE letters, letter
writers who are not EM physicians should be made aware of the importance of
ensuring their letters address knowledge, skills, and behaviors typically seen in
the "qualifications for EM'' section of SLOEs. Standard template for this can be
found on the CORD website .

3. Use of clear language to reflect loss of opportunities:
a. Medical Student Performance Evaluation (MSPE): We anticipate institutional and
regional variability in both the spread and response to COVID 19. ASC-EM
recommends that institutions include a clear, explicit statement in their MSPE
explaining any institutional policy limiting their students’ ability to complete
emergency medicine rotations.
b. SLOE: ASC-EM recommends use of a standard verbiage to be added to SLOEs
or letters written by advisors for those schools who have students that could not
obtain the recommended number of rotations

4. Encourage students to go on fewer (if any) away rotations
a. Given the possibility of drastically limited EM rotation spots, ASC-EM would like
to revise the number of away rotations we have recommended students complete
in previous application cycles. In the event that a student is both able to travel
from his/her home institution and to secure an available clerkship position at an
institution accepting visitors, that student should not perform more than one
visiting rotation (for those with a home program), and not more than two,
maximum (for those without a home EM rotation). We ask all stakeholders in the
EM application process, including but not limited to faculty advisers, clerkships,
and students to be cognizant of the number of EM rotations each student
chooses to complete.

We understand that these proposed changes may be uncomfortable for programs, who have
relied on SLOEs to be the ultimate representation of a student’s abilities, and for students, who
are eager to be able to demonstrate their skills in the audition setting. Ultimately, these
recommendations are motivated by preserving the health and safety of our EM community and
ensuring that our students who traditionally are at the greatest disadvantage in navigating the
application process are not excluded entirely from consideration.
 
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Man, next app cycle is gonna be impossible without rotations for students without home programs and for community programs. The easiest way to recruit is to have students come in for a month and see your program. I have no idea how we will evaluate applicants next year. For what its worth, I recently asked about this any we werent planning on turning students away as of yet. Obviously a fluid situation though.

For students, if this actually happens this means your match chances now will mostly about board scores. Totally sucks. And what about DO schools, who send their 4th years all over the place for rotations? They dont really have a “home” spot for the most part. Do they just skip 4th year?

Last, if students arent doing much EM, and some of their fourth year rotations just get cancelled, Id anticipated a lot of brand new interns showing totally unprepared for the start of residency.
 
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From the graphs I've seen, the peak of the outbreak in China lasted about 1.5-2 months or so. With social distancing, I'm expecting the USA outbreak to last maybe 3-4 months and then wind down. There should be enough time for some away rotations but it will be a huge scramble.
 
From the graphs I've seen, the peak of the outbreak in China lasted about 1.5-2 months or so. With social distancing, I'm expecting the USA outbreak to last maybe 3-4 months and then wind down. There should be enough time for some away rotations but it will be a huge scramble.

Well that's the thing - we haven't gotten any instruction from our school on applying for aways still or not. Even though CORD sent that message out, I'm still inclined to send away applications until programs outrightly state that they are banning away institutions. I imagine if things are at a halt till June/July, then the mass scramble to try filling away rotation spots will only be a larger clusterF.

I'm not sure if there's a definitive answer to this but @gamerEMdoc - since many students may only get a home institution SLOE, if my home institution has 2 hospitals that have residency programs, would it be reasonable to get 2 home SLOE's if I'm not able to get one away rotation or is that pointless? Maybe I'm just a bit paranoid that this entire pandemic/rotation ban will last longer than it really will but I'm just trying to plan in advance.
 
Well that's the thing - we haven't gotten any instruction from our school on applying for aways still or not. Even though CORD sent that message out, I'm still inclined to send away applications until programs outrightly state that they are banning away institutions. I imagine if things are at a halt till June/July, then the mass scramble to try filling away rotation spots will only be a larger clusterF.

I'm not sure if there's a definitive answer to this but @gamerEMdoc - since many students may only get a home institution SLOE, if my home institution has 2 hospitals that have residency programs, would it be reasonable to get 2 home SLOE's if I'm not able to get one away rotation or is that pointless? Maybe I'm just a bit paranoid that this entire pandemic/rotation ban will last longer than it really will but I'm just trying to plan in advance.

As long as they are from the same program, you should get as many sloes as you can. Regardless of what cord says, students with sloes will be at a distinct advantage. The only way they wont be is if cord just cancel sloes altogether and shuts down the esloe website.
 
Should we even bother applying to more aways in the meantime?
 
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i'm applying anyways, I don't care. I am on my surgery rotation now and my school hasn't mentioned anything about pulling 3rd/4th year students. If that's the case, I am going into my hospital anyway. I am paying for this learning experience. On surgery, I can still help intubate the patients for surgery, remove staples in clinic, put in IV's, help prep patients for the OR. I literally signed up for this stuff. My surgeon said when he was in training, there was a big national disaster at that time which required all 4th year students/interns to put in central lines, arterial sticks, intubate, etc.

If the OR bans my ass, then I will reach out to the head of the ER to see if I can help there somehow. If they're swamped, I want to help. Even if that means I have to take thorough H&P's from the parking lots.
 
If I get ban-hammered from the entire hospital then I will play infection/zombie based video games at home and study for step2
 
It's almost better that there are no medical students in the ED right now. Nobody to trip over while trying to take care of patients.

I kid I kid I kid. (kind of)
 
I disagree, if there are any med students with a shaved head who could wear PPE and my ID and fake their way through patient encounters while wearing an earpiece as I sit at home and give direction, I'd be all for it.
 
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