Correcting your staff?

[allie1081]

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I'm doing my surgery rotation and found that I answer some pimp questions correctly from my resident and attending, but they would say I have it wrong. I even checked surg recall and the web to double check my answers. Normally, I don't correct them b/c I'm the one at the bottom of the totem pole, but it's been happening 4-5x now and I've only been doing surgery for a short while. I didn't want them to think I'm dumb or unprepared, when I do read up the night before surgery and prepare as much as I can. I admit I don't answer all the questions they ask me correctly, but I just feel as if when I do answer something correctly, they just shoot me down anyway. What do you think I should do? Should I just let it go? Or somehow confront them? Thanks.

 

[Medstudentquest]

I'm doing my surgery rotation and found that I answer some pimp questions correctly from my resident and attending, but they would say I have it wrong. I even checked surg recall and the web to double check my answers. Normally, I don't correct them b/c I'm the one at the bottom of the totem pole, but it's been happening 4-5x now and I've only been doing surgery for a short while. I didn't want them to think I'm dumb or unprepared, when I do read up the night before surgery and prepare as much as I can. I admit I don't answer all the questions they ask me correctly, but I just feel as if when I do answer something correctly, they just shoot me down anyway. What do you think I should do? Should I just let it go? Or somehow confront them? Thanks.

Certainly not confront them. Confronting someone in a surgical specialty certainly will not bestow any benefits to you. What I normally do when that occurs is say something like, "Oh really? well I read in such and such a book and it said that bla bla." Or you can at a later time ask them to elaborate on that because it "interests" you and then you can give your rationale for your answering. I would only do that if it's something that's constantly happening, but if it happens ocassionally, I'd let it go. That happens though, and there is not much you can do about it.

 

[Becky]

I once did the "when I read in such and such it said this" in a nice and pleasant way and I was flamed. the attending got annoyed and ignored me for the rest of the rotation...

may I suggest that you begin by stating your source first, for example: when asked about the prognosis of X , you respond confidently, according to X and Y, blah blah....ect...

My 2 cents anyway.

 

[domer621]

Don't correct them.

 

[Hard24Get]

I'm doing my surgery rotation and found that I answer some pimp questions correctly from my resident and attending, but they would say I have it wrong. I even checked surg recall and the web to double check my answers. Normally, I don't correct them b/c I'm the one at the bottom of the totem pole, but it's been happening 4-5x now and I've only been doing surgery for a short while. I didn't want them to think I'm dumb or unprepared, when I do read up the night before surgery and prepare as much as I can. I admit I don't answer all the questions they ask me correctly, but I just feel as if when I do answer something correctly, they just shoot me down anyway. What do you think I should do? Should I just let it go? Or somehow confront them? Thanks.

NOOOOO! 😱

What you CAN do (which I have done) is give a presentation w/ handouts the next day or so, saying, " I didn't understand enough about this the other day, so I thought I'd prepare an overview", then give a little talk for which you will receive due credit. You slip in the part they were wrong about like it's nothing (often their data is just outdated so you can say, "while it was previously thought that", etc. Make sure the handout has your references and you never actually allude to their answer being wrong. Everybody leaves happy. 😎

 

[persia]

I don't know why people do this, it stinks. How about when you are given an oral exam, answer all the questions correctly and are told you didn't? What do you do then???? Nothing I guess. 🙁

Why do some people do this? You of course want the credit for your hard work, and someone is refusing to give it to you and instead you are made to look like you know nothing. If you speak up, because there is that part of us that believes in fairness - well, it will be MUCH worse for you.

I guess that is part of the clinical training. Lesson: don't do this to your students and interns when you're a resident or attending. I honestly don't know how to deal with it 'right' when it happens to me. I am learning to just keep my mouth shut and not say too much.

 

[QuinnB]

This has been talked about a lot on these forums. I think the consensus, and I tend to agree, is the following:

1) Only correct an attending if it has a direct effect on patient care ("we can't write for xyz b/c Mr. ABC is on jkl and they interact as lmn")

2) If #1 must happen, try not to do it in front of the patient

3) Try to give your source - as was stated above - if you come across attendings/residents who consistently say the stuff you are saying is incorrect, when it is really actually correct (for instance, "According to current surgical diagnosis and treatment, blah blah blah). This is super valuable on surgery for two reasons, first they tend to pimp on very esoteric stuff (strange anatomy, music, history, etc...) and secondly they often don't know the current literature to many of their pimp questions (I got so many "good jobs" on surgery after clearly answering pimp questions incorrectly).

4) Never pimp up

5) Talk to your interns if it gets out of control - but be cautious, interns just like anybody else, don't really care for whiners

 

[allie1081]

Thanks for the advice. 🙂

It just feels unfair and frustrating b/c I've only been in the OR for a week and it seems like each time I give them an answer, I'm wrong. At times, it's just gets discourgaging. I'm seriously tempted not to read the night before b/c chances are good I'll be told I'm wrong anyway (maybe ignorance is bliss and I won't get so frustrated). And I have to say, they ask me really basic anatomy and still give me the wrong answers. I just feel as if I can't trust them as much b/c what if they give me wrong answers to the ones that I'm not sure about.

ok, I know I shouldn't complain but I'm dreading going to the OR and facing this again. I'll definitely take your advice and preface my answer with a source. And hopefully it'll be ok b/c I don't think I can live with this for 3 months. The sad part is I was actually looking forward to surgery and I do like being in the OR...but this whole hierarchy rule is so confusing and frustrating.

 

[Tired]

This happens to everyone. My general approach is to respectfully disagree with any resident who corrects me with incorrect info, but never correct anyone in front of a superior, or disagree with an attending.

That being said, what I have done is put together one-page summaries of important subjects in the OR, complete with citations. If people still try to tell me I'm wrong, I'll xerox the relevant pages and stick it in their mailbox. This doesn't get them to admit you were right, but it does make it less likely they will correct you incorrectly in the future.

 

[I am Hans]

There are a lot of huge egos in medicine and correcting them doesn't go over well. Even when they are found to be wrong, as Tired notes they will not likely admit it.

I will never forget, as an intern, writing "nil by mouth" in a patient's chart. The 2nd year surgical resident crossed it out and arrogantly told me not to "make up terms" when writing notes. I had no idea what she was talking about and she continued her tirade on attending rounds. She looked pissed when the attending corrected her, stating that "nil" IS a word and that he LIKED it, "gives the note a touch of class" (as apparently did the term Paediatric Surgery). Of course, she never apologized or admitted she was wrong.

That said, I agree with others that if something affects patient care, make mention of it, outside the room, outside of ear shot of the patient. Try to direct the information to the person providing it...ie, if its the intern who is incorrect, don't embarass him/her by correcting him in front of the attending. You will reap what you sow if you don't.

 

[doctorp82]

At least you didn't counter-pimp the doctor like one guy in my class did a surgeon. Word is still out on whether that doc is one who will do an eval on him...

 

[Final]

this is where 'people's skills' comes in handy. Can't teach these, and the gunners typically don't have these...