Cpr/aed

[traumasurg]

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So I was walking in one of the buildings on campus the other day and I found an AED on the wall. I had to write a paper in english about campus safety so I decided to do an informal survey on all three floors of the building with any faculty member I could find. (I know it is not the best way to sample). I was shocked at what I found. After talking to 30 professors none of them were certified much less knew CPR or how to work an AED. (Commonly I got "what is an AED"). So my question is what policy does your school have towards teachers knowing CPR and how to use an AED?

I have a good relationship with our department of EMS and the director has told me they would teach the class for free to all faculty if the faculty would come. What do you think the possibility is that I could get the president of the university or the sga to do something about this? My english professor has been very supportive and said she would support my cause. (For whatever that is worth)

Let me know if you think I am fighting a losing battle.

Thanks

 

[armybound]

I have no idea what my undergrad's policy was, but we did have AEDs in our buildings.

The good thing about the AED is that it's simple enough that anyone that can read very large words can figure out how to use it.

 

[jonessoda]

The only university buildings I see AEDs in are the Student Commons on both campuses, and in the hospital buildings. The student managers in the Commons buildings are required to be trained in their use, as well as in CPR and first aid, and there's a student manager on duty at all times the building is open.

The hospitals, I assume, have plenty of people trained in CPR and AED.

 

[Lola2010]

The most important thing is that people know when (what type of situation) to use the AED. The best thing about it is that it tells you what to do.

 

[metalambience]

A free course would be excellent.

Our school had a free course for all students and faculty for first aid/cpr/aed cert. and turnout was huge.

I can vouch for it because I wound up using what I learned to help out some old lady that was choking- considering I was the only one around i'm really glad I took it.

 

[laryngo]

The most important thing is that people know when (what type of situation) to use the AED. The best thing about it is that it tells you what to do.

True, the AED is fairly self-explanatory, but there is one thing you have to know before you use: who to put it on! If you are a witness to someone having a heart attack and decide to put an AED on someone who still has a pulse, the AED could misread his rhythm and deliver a shock. An AED must only be applied to someone who is both apneic and pulseless. Could you imagine the surprise of the guy who gets shocked while he is still alert?!

 

[drpepper55]

AED's hardly ever misread a rhythm and deliver a shock. Rather, someone in cardiac arrest who has AED pads on them might be touched or shook when the AED is analyzing the patient's heart rhythm, mistake it for heart activity, and not deliver a shock to the patient. AED's only shock when a patient is in ventricular fibrillation or, less commonly, ventricular tachycardia. There have been patients that have been defibrillated when it was unnecessary, but this is extremely rare and the most likely culprit for this mistake is human error.

 

[runrunrudolph1]

True, the AED is fairly self-explanatory, but there is one thing you have to know before you use: who to put it on! If you are a witness to someone having a heart attack and decide to put an AED on someone who still has a pulse, the AED could misread his rhythm and deliver a shock. An AED must only be applied to someone who is both apneic and pulseless. Could you imagine the surprise of the guy who gets shocked while he is still alert?!

where are you getting this from? AED's analyze rhythms and only shock vfib and vtach. Any other rythm it picks up, it tells you to continue cpr...

 

[UCImed]

True, the AED is fairly self-explanatory, but there is one thing you have to know before you use: who to put it on! If you are a witness to someone having a heart attack and decide to put an AED on someone who still has a pulse, the AED could misread his rhythm and deliver a shock. An AED must only be applied to someone who is both apneic and pulseless. Could you imagine the surprise of the guy who gets shocked while he is still alert?!

I agree with above.

I am a Certified CPR/AED Instructor for the American Red Cross and that information is incorrect. The AED is built to detect a heart rhythm and if there is one then to continue CPR since most AEDs are Semi-Automated meaning that it tells you what to do and as you do each step it tells you the next step.

 

[metalambience]

all public access AEDs must be automated w/voice prompts by law

most states allow good samaritan law protection for any AED user, but a few require the user be certified...so check state law

 

[laryngo]

where are you getting this from? AED's analyze rhythms and only shock vfib and vtach. Any other rythm it picks up, it tells you to continue cpr...

I am getting my information from Mistovich, Prehospital Emergency Care, 8th edition, pp 438-439. The two shockable rhythms the AED will read are v-fib and v-tach, but not all of the latter are appropriate for shock. That's all I was trying to say. However, it's very easy to tell the ones who are not: they are responsive and with a pulse. Mistovich writes, "However, you should be aware that some V-Tach patients remain responsive; since they are not pulseless, they are not appropriate candidates for defibrillation. The AED should ONLY be applied to patients who are pulseless, not breathing (apneic), and unresponsive."

 

[UCImed]

Well anyone who is trained in CPR/AED from the American Red Cross or the American Heart Association knows that we no longer check for pulse and only check for signs of life.

Therefore we check for breathing and if none then begin CPR regardless if there is a pulse or not.

When an AED arrives in the middle of a trained person doing CPR then the AED will try to detect a rhythm and either shock or not shock.

SO to the everyday person who is trained in use of an AED but not trained in how to recognize a vtach or vfib then all that matters is that they know CPR and how to use an AED and follow the directions of the AED.

 

[laryngo]

Well anyone who is trained in CPR/AED from the American Red Cross or the American Heart Association knows that we no longer check for pulse and only check for signs of life.

Therefore we check for breathing and if none then begin CPR regardless if there is a pulse or not.

When an AED arrives in the middle of a trained person doing CPR then the AED will try to detect a rhythm and either shock or not shock.

SO to the everyday person who is trained in use of an AED but not trained in how to recognize a vtach or vfib then all that matters is that they know CPR and how to use an AED and follow the directions of the AED.

Okay if that's how they do it in Cali then... Shame since I'm from palm springs and my family lives out there. I hope none of these "trained" people get near my loved ones. I am a certified EMT in the states of ks and mo and we check for alertness and ALWAYS check the ABCs. You check level of coscieousness ("sir? Are you ok? Can you hear me?" in the context of a CPR drill. )No response. Take 5-10 secs to check breathing. None? Head tilt chin lift if no trauma. Still none? 2 breaths. Check carotid pulse. Pulseless? 30 chest compressions for 2 min at 100bpm. If aed is present, apply before chest compressions if either (1) saw pt go into cardiac arrest, or (2) was within 5 minutes of collapse, otherwise deliver 2 min of CPR to fet blood flowing.

I'm not saying anything negative about aed, only not to put it on and press analyze to someone who still has a pulse- who could be someone in V-tach! Another contraindication is a trauma patient.