Creighton vs. Midwestern AZ

[Osity]

Creighton and Midwestern-AZ are the two schools that I'm deciding between. I am just wondering if anyone has any input one way or the other. I absolutely loved Midwestern, their location, facilities, and curriculum. Their only downside is the cost, but im my opinion, you can see where your money is going because everything is so nice there. For Creighton, they have a great reputation for producing general dentists (which is what I want to do), plus the cost is a lot less than Midwestern (around $70k less over the four years). I am pretty torn between the two, I really like both schools. If everything was equal, I would choose Midwestern, but the extra $70k would be hard to swallow. Any suggestions? Thanks!

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[Chemboy23]

I was sort of in your same predicament. I would say choose the one where you'll be happiest for what could quite possibly be some of the most stressful time of your life. I've heard lots of great things about the curriculum at Midwestern (system based - which IMO is much more effective). My wife and I have lived in Phoenix for about a year and I applied to Midwestern, but never got an interview there. I did go see the clinics and the school...and I agree, they are top notch.

I cannot speak for Creighton because I've never been there or really researched how the students felt about the school. What I can say is this, that extra 70k added onto the back end of whatever your total was will be more significant (especially if you chose the 25 yr repayment option) than you think, when you add interest in. So I would try to do the math and see if the difference is enough to sway you towards Creighton more than you initially thought.

Personally, I would probably choose Midwestern simply because of the lifestyle in the Phoenix area (very nice) and Creighton's atmosphere would be awfully cold to me. Also, Midwestern is very savvy with respect to clinical technology...so it's really up to you to make the choice. I say do what makes you happy, because you will be able to repay it all once you're a dentist and you get established and everything.

 

[Osity]

I was sort of in your same predicament. I would say choose the one where you'll be happiest for what could quite possibly be some of the most stressful time of your life. I've heard lots of great things about the curriculum at Midwestern (system based - which IMO is much more effective). My wife and I have lived in Phoenix for about a year and I applied to Midwestern, but never got an interview there. I did go see the clinics and the school...and I agree, they are top notch.

I cannot speak for Creighton because I've never been there or really researched how the students felt about the school. What I can say is this, that extra 70k added onto the back end of whatever your total was will be more significant (especially if you chose the 25 yr repayment option) than you think, when you add interest in. So I would try to do the math and see if the difference is enough to sway you towards Creighton more than you initially thought.

Personally, I would probably choose Midwestern simply because of the lifestyle in the Phoenix area (very nice) and Creighton's atmosphere would be awfully cold to me. Also, Midwestern is very savvy with respect to clinical technology...so it's really up to you to make the choice. I say do what makes you happy, because you will be able to repay it all once you're a dentist and you get established and everything.

I really like both areas. The weather in Phoenix is awesome in the winter, but brutal in the summer. Likewise, Omaha is great in the spring, summer, fall, and freezing in the winter. I think both areas are great as far as living goes, and both are very reasonably priced.

I think I would be really happy either place. Creighton has a great reputation for producing really good dentists and they have been around for 100 years. Midwestern, although they haven't yet graduated a class, I feel will be a top notch dental school, like Creighton, in a few more years (the only reason why they might not yet be is because they haven't had a graduating class yet).

As far as curriculum, I absolutely love Midwestern's. To me, system-based is awesome and a great way to learn. Also, Midwestern takes the boards after the first year, so you don't have to try and remember everything that you learned two years ago. Creighton just has the traditional curriculum but very high boards pass rates (as does Midwestern), so I don't think that would be an issue.

The biggest difference, I think, is the technology and the style of the clinics. Creighton has a great clinic, updated, digital records and x-rays, etc., so it's a very nice clinic. Creighton does not, however, have a simulation lab, so that is something to take into consideration. Midwestern's clinic is just, wow. It is an amazing set up, and they set it up as a private-practice model, meaning that you keep track of the amount of dentistry that you produce each hour, day, etc. I think as far as clinic goes, Midwestern would be tough to beat. They also have the nicest (I would be surprised if anyone has a nicer) sim lab.

As far as the money goes, $70k IS a lot, just like you said. I plan on paying back my loans over 10-years, so at a 7% interest rate (I think the current rate is 6.8% and you can get certain rate reductions for various payment plans, but for simplicity) I would be paying roughly $4050 for Midwestern monthly, and $3250 monthly for Creighton, so an additional $800 for ten years (which turns into about $10,000 of interest over that period). Obviously if I took longer to pay it off, then more interest would accrue, and I would be paying a lot more interest for either school.

So that's my dilemma. Go to my number one choice and pay significantly more, or go to my number 2 choice and pay less, but sacrifice a few things. Tough decision.

 

[Chemboy23]

I really like both areas. The weather in Phoenix is awesome in the winter, but brutal in the summer. Likewise, Omaha is great in the spring, summer, fall, and freezing in the winter. I think both areas are great as far as living goes, and both are very reasonably priced.

I think I would be really happy either place. Creighton has a great reputation for producing really good dentists and they have been around for 100 years. Midwestern, although they haven't yet graduated a class, I feel will be a top notch dental school, like Creighton, in a few more years (the only reason why they might not yet be is because they haven't had a graduating class yet).

As far as curriculum, I absolutely love Midwestern's. To me, system-based is awesome and a great way to learn. Also, Midwestern takes the boards after the first year, so you don't have to try and remember everything that you learned two years ago. Creighton just has the traditional curriculum but very high boards pass rates (as does Midwestern), so I don't think that would be an issue.

The biggest difference, I think, is the technology and the style of the clinics. Creighton has a great clinic, updated, digital records and x-rays, etc., so it's a very nice clinic. Creighton does not, however, have a simulation lab, so that is something to take into consideration. Midwestern's clinic is just, wow. It is an amazing set up, and they set it up as a private-practice model, meaning that you keep track of the amount of dentistry that you produce each hour, day, etc. I think as far as clinic goes, Midwestern would be tough to beat. They also have the nicest (I would be surprised if anyone has a nicer) sim lab.

As far as the money goes, $70k IS a lot, just like you said. I plan on paying back my loans over 10-years, so at a 7% interest rate (I think the current rate is 6.8% and you can get certain rate reductions for various payment plans, but for simplicity) I would be paying roughly $4050 for Midwestern monthly, and $3250 monthly for Creighton, so an additional $800 for ten years (which turns into about $10,000 of interest over that period). Obviously if I took longer to pay it off, then more interest would accrue, and I would be paying a lot more interest for either school.

So that's my dilemma. Go to my number one choice and pay significantly more, or go to my number 2 choice and pay less, but sacrifice a few things. Tough decision.

Yes, it's a very tough decision to make. I think another thing to take into consideration would be where you'll be living/practicing when you get out. If you'll be in Cali/AZ/somewhere where dentists make significantly more...the money becomes less of a factor. You may want to just go with Creighton because I see there's a pretty significant difference in monthly payments. Only you can make the best decision for yourself...so good luck and best wishes.

 

[OU11BB]

If midwestern is your #1 then go there. How many people get the option to go to their first choice? Dpnt worry about the money, b/c when you get established you may be taking home your loan payment in one day of work for the month.

 

[Osity]

The other question is this: At Midwestern, since they take their boards after the first year, they have three years in the clinic, and since they are set-up as a private practice, their goal is to make you ready to jump into a private practice when you graduate.

At Creighton, I am thinking that I might want to do a residency to get an extra year of practicing in before I am working in a private practice.

So, even if school is $70k more at Midwestern, it might come out cheaper since I would be working a year earlier and making possibly $150k instead of $50k working as a resident coming out of Creighton.

 

[OU11BB]

why do you say you will need extra year of training from creighton? Do you not feel you will be ready. One thing that I like about any school is taking boards after first year. i have heard that is much easier on the student.

 

[Osity]

why do you say you will need extra year of training from creighton? Do you not feel you will be ready. One thing that I like about any school is taking boards after first year. i have heard that is much easier on the student.

I have heard from some students that they feel like they can really use that extra year of training (their residency), and that has come specifically from Creighton grads. Whether or not I will remains to be seen, but it is one consideration.

 

[cgunny]

I was in the exact same situation Osity. I got accepted to Midwestern on Dec. 1 and it was by far my favorite school. We put down a deposit and my wife and I had made plans to go down to Glendale in February and see the campus and look at some housing etc. Then, at the end of December I got a call from Dr. Powell at the RDEP program (which I think you got accepted to?) and turned our world upside down for a few days. We were really looking forward to moving to Arizona but after being accepted to the RDEP program the amount of savings for us was around 150k over the 4 years. We are going to live with my in-laws for the first year and my wife can keep her good job for an extra year so the savings for us are greater than in your situation. At first I didn't really care how much it would be saving me, like many people have said, the 70k over a 40 year career isn't going to be that significant, but I agree that it depends on what you want to do after you graduate. If you want to practice outside of Utah (say in Arizona) than Midwestern might be a better fit and give you opportunities to know the area better. If you plan to come back to Utah when you are finished than the RDEP program is obviously a better choice as they will give you some tuition reimbursement.

The fact is that all dental schools will prepare you for a career in dentistry. They all have different philosophies or facilities but at the end of 4 years you get the same degree and you can enter a practice. Whatever decision you make just make sure that it is what YOU want to do. If you go to Creighton but think everyday how much you would rather be in Arizona then you will hate the 4 years. I shadowed a dentist who went to Creighton through the RDEP program and he absolutely loved it. He loved the school and Omaha and has a booming practice in Salt Lake City. He also teaches at the GPR program at the U and says that Creighton grads do very well in that program. I am a firm believer that you will get out of dental school what you put in to it, so if you want to go to Creighton and have a fabulous time, you will. If you want to to go Arizona and have a fabulous time, you will. It just depends on what YOU want.

 

[Blarelli]

I had the same issue between Midwestern and Ohio. In the end I decided to fork up the extra money and go to Midwestern. I like how they run their clinic, how they try to get it into the students heads how much everything they do during a procedure costs, and I think the patient base will provide more opportunities.

 

[Osity]

I was in the exact same situation Osity. I got accepted to Midwestern on Dec. 1 and it was by far my favorite school. We put down a deposit and my wife and I had made plans to go down to Glendale in February and see the campus and look at some housing etc. Then, at the end of December I got a call from Dr. Powell at the RDEP program (which I think you got accepted to?) and turned our world upside down for a few days. We were really looking forward to moving to Arizona but after being accepted to the RDEP program the amount of savings for us was around 150k over the 4 years. We are going to live with my in-laws for the first year and my wife can keep her good job for an extra year so the savings for us are greater than in your situation. At first I didn't really care how much it would be saving me, like many people have said, the 70k over a 40 year career isn't going to be that significant, but I agree that it depends on what you want to do after you graduate. If you want to practice outside of Utah (say in Arizona) than Midwestern might be a better fit and give you opportunities to know the area better. If you plan to come back to Utah when you are finished than the RDEP program is obviously a better choice as they will give you some tuition reimbursement.

The fact is that all dental schools will prepare you for a career in dentistry. They all have different philosophies or facilities but at the end of 4 years you get the same degree and you can enter a practice. Whatever decision you make just make sure that it is what YOU want to do. If you go to Creighton but think everyday how much you would rather be in Arizona then you will hate the 4 years. I shadowed a dentist who went to Creighton through the RDEP program and he absolutely loved it. He loved the school and Omaha and has a booming practice in Salt Lake City. He also teaches at the GPR program at the U and says that Creighton grads do very well in that program. I am a firm believer that you will get out of dental school what you put in to it, so if you want to go to Creighton and have a fabulous time, you will. If you want to to go Arizona and have a fabulous time, you will. It just depends on what YOU want.

Thanks for the input cgunny. Just out of curiosity, when did you interview for the RDEP Program? And I am exactly like you, I was set to go at Midwestern, already had my deposit in, and then I got a call from Creighton a few weeks ago that has been making me think.

I agree, at the end of the day, I'll be a dentist, regardless of where I graduate. Also, $70k over 40 years is next to nothing, but when you are fresh out of school, and extra $800 could go a long way. As far as RDEP goes, we can get it either way, we just have to apply for the RDEP At-Large Program. And I'm not sure where I want to practice yet, there are tons of variables.

I have heard so many good things about Creighton, and everyone I have talked to that graduated from there has loved it. The same goes for Midwestern, they all seem to love school, and I do prefer their curriculum and clinical set-up, but that extra money is my sticky point.

Anyway, I still have a little while to decide because I have deposits at both places. Have you already sent you Creighton deposit?

Final thought: Do you think, since Midwestern will only have 2 classes graduate in front of our class, that it would be harder to get an associateship right out of school? Simply because it doesn't yet have the reputation that Creighton does?

 

[Osity]

I had the same issue between Midwestern and Ohio. In the end I decided to fork up the extra money and go to Midwestern. I like how they run their clinic, how they try to get it into the students heads how much everything they do during a procedure costs, and I think the patient base will provide more opportunities.

I love all of those things boards after first year, system-based curriculum, etc. MWU has those advantages, while Creighton is cheaper and well-known. Hopefully I can something something one way or the other that will push me in the right direction.

 

[Chemboy23]

I love all of those things boards after first year, system-based curriculum, etc. MWU has those advantages, while Creighton is cheaper and well-known. Hopefully I can something something one way or the other that will push me in the right direction.

Well, you've already stated that if you were to choose Creighton, you would need to do a residency before practicing. The differences (when you add the cost of attending Creighton an additional year) will be very minute. The only other factor you have now is which one makes YOU happiest. I would sort of sway toward Midwestern because you'd be ready coming out of school (no residency required), the weather (not too bad, I've lived there for a year), and the top notch clinical technology. Bottom line is this, you'll be a dentist wherever you go. I'd personally rather be able to practice dentistry in four years rather than five LOL.

 

[Osity]

Well, you've already stated that if you were to choose Creighton, you would need to do a residency before practicing. The differences (when you add the cost of attending Creighton an additional year) will be very minute. The only other factor you have now is which one makes YOU happiest. I would sort of sway toward Midwestern because you'd be ready coming out of school (no residency required), the weather (not too bad, I've lived there for a year), and the top notch clinical technology. Bottom line is this, you'll be a dentist wherever you go. I'd personally rather be able to practice dentistry in four years rather than five LOL.

I completely agree. It's not that I have to do a year of residency, but I think it's something that I would be very interested in if I choose Creighton. Also, the residency can be in many different places, not just Omaha.

When I talked to Dr. Gilpatrick (MWU's Dean) he said that the reason they set up the school is specifically so you don't have to do a residency, but so that you'll be ready coming out of school.

I know not everyone does a residency coming out of school, but it is something that has been highly spoken of by dentists that I have shadowed.

 

[fodog]

Hey Osity,

I was in a very similar situation as you are in right now. I got accepted to both Midwestern and Creighton on December first. I was having a tough time choosing between these two schools for all of the reasons you have mentioned. Of all the interviews I went to, I was most impressed with Midwestern and their philosophy and how they treat their students. But I choose to go with Creighton for a couple reasons: Cost and clinics.

By choosing Creighton, I will end up coming out of Dental School about 150K cheaper.

Although Midwestern is a new school and everything seems to run smoothly there, I wouldn't say you would get a better clinical experience there than Creighton. Creighton has some of the most rigorous clinical requirements and from what I've heard, Creighton far surpasses clinical experiences at other schools. Although I think GPRs are great, Creighton will prepare you just as well as any other school for the real world of dentistry. If you are planning on doing a GPR after Creighton, I would be ready to do a GPR after school at Midwestern, or after any other school for that matter.

In the end, I had to ask myself this: What would I GAIN by going to Midwestern? I would probably gain an overall smoother dental school experience (transition from sim labs to clincs- Creighton doesn't have the greatest sim labs), and 150K more debt. For me, the choice was clear that Creighton was the right choice.

Like what Cgunny said, it all depends on what YOU want. If you are going to be much happier at Midwestern, I would go there! But if you're just looking at cost, clinical experience, school reputation, I think Creighton through the RDEP program is the way to go.

Good luck!

 

[UndergradGuy7]

Ask this question in the dental forum and check what real dentists will say.

I will bet they will all say go to the cheaper school.

I didn't interview at Midwestern or Creighton, but isn't Creighton one of the best clinical schools (like UPacific)? Because they do not have any specialties there... not sure never looked into either school.

 

[bday185]

Hey Osity,

I was in a very similar situation as you are in right now. I got accepted to both Midwestern and Creighton on December first. I was having a tough time choosing between these two schools for all of the reasons you have mentioned. Of all the interviews I went to, I was most impressed with Midwestern and their philosophy and how they treat their students. But I choose to go with Creighton for a couple reasons: Cost and clinics.

By choosing Creighton, I will end up coming out of Dental School about 150K cheaper.

Although Midwestern is a new school and everything seems to run smoothly there, I wouldn't say you would get a better clinical experience there than Creighton. Creighton has some of the most rigorous clinical requirements and from what I've heard, Creighton far surpasses clinical experiences at other schools. Although I think GPRs are great, Creighton will prepare you just as well as any other school for the real world of dentistry. If you are planning on doing a GPR after Creighton, I would be ready to do a GPR after school at Midwestern, or after any other school for that matter.

In the end, I had to ask myself this: What would I GAIN by going to Midwestern? I would probably gain an overall smoother dental school experience (transition from sim labs to clincs- Creighton doesn't have the greatest sim labs), and 150K more debt. For me, the choice was clear that Creighton was the right choice.

Like what Cgunny said, it all depends on what YOU want. If you are going to be much happier at Midwestern, I would go there! But if you're just looking at cost, clinical experience, school reputation, I think Creighton through the RDEP program is the way to go.

Good luck!

From your stand point, do you think Creighton students should do GPRs or not? My top choice is Creighton but I'm not looking forward of spending another year of school to do that.
I heard that Creightion has really good reputation on training their students clinically so why do they need an extra year?

 

[wantVCUdental]

Well, you've already stated that if you were to choose Creighton, you would need to do a residency before practicing.

Who said creighton graduates require residency? Creighton is known for graduating capable students with some of the strongest clinical skills. When I interviewed there, I felt the students there didn't really behave like students, they were more like doing their own things like an experienced dentist. And the fact that they only have an undergrad dental program means the students there get to perform on all kinds of procedures. If you want to become a competent general dentist, i don't see any other school can better prepare you than creighton.

To the OP, 80k may not seem like a lot now when you are seeing dentists make a lot of money, but you should consider planning conservatively, 5 years back who would have thought bankers on wall street would be jobless today? Back in the good old days, those bankers would spend $20k on a day's lunch but look at them now. I am not saying dentistry will be like that in several years, but, what if?...

If i were you, i would goto Creighton 🙂. Congrats on your achievement!

 

[Osity]

Who said creighton graduates require residency? Creighton is known for graduating capable students with some of the strongest clinical skills. When I interviewed there, I felt the students there didn't really behave like students, they were more like doing their own things like an experienced dentist. And the fact that they only have an undergrad dental program means the students there get to perform on all kinds of procedures. If you want to become a competent general dentist, i don't see any other school can better prepare you than creighton.

To the OP, 80k may not seem like a lot now when you are seeing dentists make a lot of money, but you should consider planning conservatively, 5 years back who would have thought bankers on wall street would be jobless today? Back in the good old days, those bankers would spend $20k on a day's lunch but look at them now. I am not saying dentistry will be like that in several years, but, what if?...

If i were you, i would goto Creighton 🙂. Congrats on your achievement!

I'm definitely not saying that of you go to Creighton (or Midwestern, or any school for that matter),
That you have to do a residency. I am just considering doing an AEGD because some dentists have recommended it. Anyway, I do think that Creighton has the edge on clinical training, but I do like Midwestern's private practice set up, which I don't believe Creighton does.

When you interiewed at Creighton, how did you like the facilities? Are they pretty new an updated? Since I got accepted through the RDEP program, I had my interview at the University of Utah, not actually at Creighton.

 

[vtizzy]

I had to choose between Creighton and Midwestern. I choose Creighton. For one, I got the IDEP scholarship and will be saving around $150K (plus the interest) and plus my parents live in Lincoln NE and it will be nice to be close to them. We like the living options in Omaha (Village Green Townhouses aka "little Provo") and all of the family activities in Omaha (Botanical Gardens, Zoo, Children Museums, etc.). The people I have talked to that are going to school there LOVE it because there is so much for their families to do and Village Green is a great place to live.
I loved Midwestern, but it was way too expensive! The dean there told my group of interviewees that they are still working on getting an adequate patient base. Also, Midwestern may have a sweet clinical set up, but if they don't have a huge patient base like Creighton, you won't come out with all the experience that you need to go straight into a private practice.
I work for an Orthodontist and he said that if its under 150K difference, don't worry about the difference. You'll make it back. He turned down a huge scholarship offer to LSU to go to UCLA where he had to pay over $200K more. He said he does not regret it one bit, but then again, he's an orthodontist and makes bank.
If you look at it from Dave Ramsey's point of view (if you don't know who Dave is, you should really look him up...he's a financial guru) he would tell you to the cheaper school. He says to avoid as much debt as possible. He's got a great point and if you listen to his stuff, you'll understand why.
In the end, I personally would choose the cheaper school, but I HATE debt and want to minimize my debt as much as possible. Dental school will be as good as YOU want to make it. If you are proactive in school and in the clinic, you will come out prepared at either school.

Good luck in your decision!

 

[bballrules]

Hi, I'm a D2 here at Creighton and my bro is a D4. We both did our undergrads in CA. You're right, we take boards after D2 but don't worry, I think 86/88 people passed last year. It's no big deal taking it after D1 or D2. I have no idea about MW's curriculum but they spend 3 years in the clinic? Is that even possible? Schools that take boards after D1 concentrate heavily on the academics 1st year and lab work 2nd year. Does that mean MW squeezes in lab work and academics in the first year? I know the curriculum at CU is mixed, that's why we take boards after D2. Don't worry about how nice the simulation lab is. The top notch state of the art tech doesn't necessarily equate to the best. CU does not have sim labs but every year they rank in the top 5 on the part 2 boards(clinical boards). Professors here know that CU is one of the top schools clinically and that's why they continually push and teach students to be the best general practitioner.

I don't have friends or know anyone who go to MW, but what is the private practice set up? And how does that differ from any school? I think you are getting caught up on how "nice and fancy" schools are. All you need in dental school is patients. The more, the better practice that will prepare you after you graduate. At CU, there are too many patients and you will get tons of opportunities to do each procedures. Not sure if it's easy to get patients at MW so I can't help you on that. Someone stated above that we don't have specialties. That is correct, when your patient needs something, you take full control of the case and do everything yourself. This is awesome practice and if you get stuck, the professors will walk you through it and help you. You said that MW's dean sets up the private practice so you'll be ready once you graduate? Like I said before, I don't know much about the school but they have no graduating class yet. Don't believe what everyone says, just check out the history at CU. Not trying to bring down or brag about any school, but every school's aim is to produce a good dentist. Every school has charts, whether electronically or paper to keep track of records for the patient. I'm not sure how MW's setup is diff from these schools. Every school's system functions like a private practice. I don't really understand what you are referring to when you are talking about this. If you could elaborate, I can help you more on this and tell you if CU is the same or diff.

Don't worry about the 1 year residency after you graduate from CU. You should do the 1 year res if you think it will help you become a stronger applicant for a specialty school. You don't need the extra year for practice, trust me, you'll be in good hands after you graduate from CU. My brother and his friends that are about to graduate are confident and they say they're pretty much real dentists now. Good luck with your decision and if you have anymore questions, please ask.

 

[wantVCUdental]

I'm definitely not saying that of you go to Creighton (or Midwestern, or any shook for that matter),
That you have to do a residency. I am just considering doing an AEGD because some dentists have recommended it. Anyway, I do think that Creighton has the edge on clinical training, but I do like Midwestern's private practice set up, which I don't believe Creighton does.

When you interiewed at Creighton, how did you like the facilities? Are they pretty new an updated? Since I got accepted through the RDEP program, I had my interview at the University of Utah, not actually at Creighton.

i just saw someone saying that you need residency after going to creighton, that's why i brought up the fact that creighton graduates are very skilled. I am not saying MWU is better/worst than Creighton, they are different. It's like comparing apples w/ oranges, they have different taste, texture, but in the end, they are both fruits 😛.

As for Creighton's facilities, I would say it's perfect for what you need to do in dental school! there are more chairs than there are students, so you will never have to worry about that. No they don't have fancy lcd screens or cabinets, but they have the handpieces that you need for all your procedures. The chairs+equipments are pretty up to date, so i think you'll be good for dschool there.

I come from a big city in the north east, going to Omaha was a huge shock for me when i found out there was pretty much nothing in the city. Also, all male students at creighton are required to wear shirt+tie every day, which gets really stuffy in the summer. IF Creighton was located in Cali or Boston, I bet it'd be one of the top choices for everyone 🙂.

 

[Osity]

Hi, I'm a D2 here at Creighton and my bro is a D4. We both did our undergrads in CA. You're right, we take boards after D2 but don't worry, I think 86/88 people passed last year. It's no big deal taking it after D1 or D2. I have no idea about MW's curriculum but they spend 3 years in the clinic? Is that even possible? Schools that take boards after D1 concentrate heavily on the academics 1st year and lab work 2nd year. Does that mean MW squeezes in lab work and academics in the first year? I know the curriculum at CU is mixed, that's why we take boards after D2. Don't worry about how nice the simulation lab is. The top notch state of the art tech doesn't necessarily equate to the best. CU does not have sim labs but every year they rank in the top 5 on the part 2 boards(clinical boards). Professors here know that CU is one of the top schools clinically and that's why they continually push and teach students to be the best general practitioner.

I don't have friends or know anyone who go to MW, but what is the private practice set up? And how does that differ from any school? I think you are getting caught up on how "nice and fancy" schools are. All you need in dental school is patients. The more, the better practice that will prepare you after you graduate. At CU, there are too many patients and you will get tons of opportunities to do each procedures. Not sure if it's easy to get patients at MW so I can't help you on that. Someone stated above that we don't have specialties. That is correct, when your patient needs something, you take full control of the case and do everything yourself. This is awesome practice and if you get stuck, the professors will walk you through it and help you. You said that MW's dean sets up the private practice so you'll be ready once you graduate? Like I said before, I don't know much about the school but they have no graduating class yet. Don't believe what everyone says, just check out the history at CU. Not trying to bring down or brag about any school, but every school's aim is to produce a good dentist. Every school has charts, whether electronically or paper to keep track of records for the patient. I'm not sure how MW's setup is diff from these schools. Every school's system functions like a private practice. I don't really understand what you are referring to when you are talking about this. If you could elaborate, I can help you more on this and tell you if CU is the same or diff.

Don't worry about the 1 year residency after you graduate from CU. You should do the 1 year res if you think it will help you become a stronger applicant for a specialty school. You don't need the extra year for practice, trust me, you'll be in good hands after you graduate from CU. My brother and his friends that are about to graduate are confident and they say they're pretty much real dentists now. Good luck with your decision and if you have anymore questions, please ask.

Hey bballrules,

MWU's private practice set-up is that when you are in the clinic, you know how much each procedure you do is producing (would be producing for your own hypothetical clinic). I don't know if Creighton does that, but I know from talking to lots of other dentists that have graduated from Creighton that they are getting awesome clinical training at CU.

Also, as far as doing clinical work the second year, at MWU it is mostly lab work, like you said they do at CU. So not a big difference there, just that they take their boards after year one, but it also sounds like taking it after D2 isn't a big deal.

The three huge selling points for me at Creighton at the reputation, clinical training, and cost. I'm leaning that way for sure, I just wanted to get some input. If there's any other info you have I would really appreciate it! Thanks!

 

[Osity]

i just saw someone saying that you need residency after going to creighton, that's why i brought up the fact that creighton graduates are very skilled. I am not saying MWU is better/worst than Creighton, they are different. It's like comparing apples w/ oranges, they have different taste, texture, but in the end, they are both fruits 😛.

As for Creighton's facilities, I would say it's perfect for what you need to do in dental school! there are more chairs than there are students, so you will never have to worry about that. No they don't have fancy lcd screens or cabinets, but they have the handpieces that you need for all your procedures. The chairs+equipments are pretty up to date, so i think you'll be good for dschool there.

I come from a big city in the north east, going to Omaha was a huge shock for me when i found out there was pretty much nothing in the city. Also, all male students at creighton are required to wear shirt+tie every day, which gets really stuffy in the summer. IF Creighton was located in Cali or Boston, I bet it'd be one of the top choices for everyone 🙂.

Good call on the analogy. At the end of the day you'll be a dentist, and CU has been producing them for years; I also think MWU will have a really strong program in a few years as well. I am leaning towards CU because of reputation, clinic, and cost. Thanks for the input, very helpful.

Side not: are the male students really required to wear a shirt and tie every day? Not even scrubs, did you see that at your interview?

 

[bballrules]

Good call on the analogy. At the end of the day you'll be a dentist, and CU has been producing them for years; I also think MWU will have a really strong program in a few years as well. I am leaning towards CU because of reputation, clinic, and cost. Thanks for the input, very helpful.

Side not: are the male students really required to wear a shirt and tie every day? Not even scrubs, did you see that at your interview?

Yup, he's right. We have a dress code here at CU. Males wear dress shirts, dress pants, and ties. Females also have to wear nice clothes as well but it's more lenient towards them. The school wants you to try to keep a professional look. At first it was hard and I hated it, but then I got use to it, it's normal and no big deal at all.

Oh ok, now I understand the private set up thing. Nope, we don't do that here. We just have a software program that keeps track of everything we do, scheduling, and info of our patients. We have clinic all M, all T, W afternoon, T morning, and F afternoon. W morning, T afternoon, and F morning are lectures. Our schedules are 8-12 block, 12-1 lunch, 1-5 block. Don't worry too much about how much you are producing. It is useless to compare your first 2 years of doing dentistry to what you'll do later on or what real dentist are producing. Just concentrate on your requirements and helping your patients with their needs. Good luck man

 

[Osity]

Yup, he's right. We have a dress code here at CU. Males wear dress shirts, dress pants, and ties. Females also have to wear nice clothes as well but it's more lenient towards them. The school wants you to try to keep a professional look. At first it was hard and I hated it, but then I got use to it, it's normal and no big deal at all.

Oh ok, now I understand the private set up thing. Nope, we don't do that here. We just have a software program that keeps track of everything we do, scheduling, and info of our patients. We have clinic all M, all T, W afternoon, T morning, and F afternoon. W morning, T afternoon, and F morning are lectures. Our schedules are 8-12 block, 12-1 lunch, 1-5 block. Don't worry too much about how much you are producing. It is useless to compare your first 2 years of doing dentistry to what you'll do later on or what real dentist are producing. Just concentrate on your requirements and helping your patients with their needs. Good luck man

Thanks for the input man. I'll probably end up seeing you in a year and a half, after the RDEP program.

 

[James Dean]

Hey Osity,

I had the exact predicament that you are facing. December 1st, I was accepted to Midwestern and December 2nd, I was accepted into the IDEP program (Idaho-Creighton). I was basically set on Midwestern until I got the Creighton acceptance. However, I made the decision to go with IDEP. Here is why (these are the points that I considered when making my decison- your situation might be different):

1. The cost difference is significant. If you want to go straight into General Dentistry after graduation, the debt will not be hanging over your head quite as much as if you went to Midwestern. I also know, that coming from a rural lower income state, my starting income as a beginning dentist probably isn't going to be really huge (I'm assuming the same might be true for Utah but I could be wrong).

2. Creighton, while it may seem to be a "traditonal" and less interesting sounding program, definitely has the reputation of producing quality general dentists. While I don't wish to speak ill of any school, Midwestern is only three years old and is only in its initial accreditation stage. That probably doesn't mean anything, but it is still something to consider.

3. This may not mean anything either, but Creighton only has about 85 students in each class, while Midwestern has 110. They probably have a similar student/faculty ratio though.

4. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I really got the feeling that Creighton very strongly stressed service to the community. While Midwestern did too, I don't know if it was quite as much. That is something that is very important to me.

Please note that my goal is General Dentistry and being a solid clinical dentist in a more rural environment. I might have looked at it differently if I really was looking to specialize. I hope that this is helpful. I know you will be happy regardless of which school you choose- I really like them both. If you do choose Creighton, I'll see you in two years!

 

[Osity]

Cgunny and fodog, are you both RDEP? Where are you planning on living in slc?

 

[cgunny]

Cgunny and fodog, are you both RDEP? Where are you planning on living in slc?

Im doing RDEP. We will live with my parents in Centerville or my in-laws in Bountiful.

 

[fodog]

Cgunny and fodog, are you both RDEP? Where are you planning on living in slc?

Yeah, I'm doing RDEP. My parents live about 5 minutes from the U, so I'll probably just live with them. It sounds like you're more set on Creighton now?

 

[Osity]

Yeah, I'm doing RDEP. My parents live about 5 minutes from the U, so I'll probably just live with them. It sounds like you're more set on Creighton now?

Yeah, I've definitely been leaning that way ever since I got accepted there, and after more input and talking to some CU students, I'm thinking that's where I'll be headed. We just have to find a place up here now.

 

[gsinccom]

Why did you decide aganist attending USN (South Jordan, Utah campus) through the at large RDEP?

Congrats on getting in through RDEP by the way. My brother is a dentist in Utah. He graduated from NOVA about four years ago. He loved the school but I know he would've loved having RDEP $ to help.

G

 

[Osity]

Why did you decide aganist attending USN (South Jordan, Utah campus) through the at large RDEP?

Congrats on getting in through RDEP by the way. My brother is a dentist in Utah. He graduated from NOVA about four years ago. He loved the school but I know he would've loved having RDEP $ to help.

G

Here are a list of my reasons:

1) They didn't invite to interview until Dec. 1, and by then I had already been accepted to 6 schools.
2) Their tuition is over $10,000 more a year than Creighton (about the same as Midwestern, but Midwestern at least has a few years behind it and has worked out some of the bugs. Plus, Glendale is an awesome area).
3) Brand new program, no reputation yet.
4) I wasn't a big fan of their curriculum (I took a tour there actually the day before I interviewed for Creighton at the U of U).
5) They don't have any facilities built yet.

Those a some of the main reasons. Comparing RDEP Creighton with RDEP At-Large is a wash because either way you end up getting $60k back over 3 years. I think USN will have no difficulty at all filling their program and becoming a good school, but it just wasn't a good fit for me. I'd rather spend less and go to a top school like Creighton, but that is just me.

 

[gsinccom]

Here are a list of my reasons:

1) They didn't invite to interview until Dec. 1, and by then I had already been accepted to 6 schools.
2) Their tuition is over $10,000 more a year than Creighton (about the same as Midwestern, but Midwestern at least has a few years behind it and has worked out some of the bugs. Plus, Glendale is an awesome area).
3) Brand new program, no reputation yet.
4) I wasn't a big fan of their curriculum (I took a tour there actually the day before I interviewed for Creighton at the U of U).
5) They don't have any facilities built yet.

Those a some of the main reasons. Comparing RDEP Creighton with RDEP At-Large is a wash because either way you end up getting $60k back over 3 years. I think USN will have no difficulty at all filling their program and becoming a good school, but it just wasn't a good fit for me. I'd rather spend less and go to a top school like Creighton, but that is just me.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Anyone else care to share?

When is Utah RDEP ending and the UofU dental school opening? What did Dr. Powell say about that?

 

[Osity]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Anyone else care to share?

When is Utah RDEP ending and the UofU dental school opening? What did Dr. Powell say about that?

Not anytime soon. Someone donated $30 million to build a dental school, but the state has to approve $1-2 million a year for the dental school's use, and that is not going to happen soon. Dr. Lowder said he thought 5-10 years at a minimum.

 

[MulberryDMD]

.

 

[WesManTooth]

Good call on the analogy. At the end of the day you'll be a dentist, and CU has been producing them for years; I also think MWU will have a really strong program in a few years as well. I am leaning towards CU because of reputation, clinic, and cost. Thanks for the input, very helpful.

There was a lot of talk on this post about needing a GPR or AEGD after school, but really there is no way to compare the two schools about the necessity of such a residency. Not only are the two schools different, but going along with the analogy of apples and oranges, there is no precedent for the oranges. Midwestern has never graduated a class, and as much as they promise a strong clinical education preparing you for instant private practice, there is no way to really KNOW yet.

You may very well need a GPR/AEGD after 4 years at Creighton, but the same might be true after MWU. As a newly graduating dentist, extra or more intensely focused PRE-CLINICAL exposure as a D2 (essentially the main difference in the clinical aspect of the two schools) will make essentially no difference in your comfort level doing the real procedures. Maybe it will as a D3, but eventually Creighton's proven clinical exposure will even the playing field.

All I'm saying is that there is no proven correlation yet between MWU's curriculum, clinic, and practice models and REAL world dentistry. I'm not saying they won't turn out great dentists in the coming years, but there is no real PROOF it works like they say it does. If you choose Creighton, you know EXACTLY what you get: PROVEN EXCELLENCE IN CLINICAL TRAINING.

At the end of the day, a dentist is a dentist! But a new dentist with $70k in his pocket sleeps much easier at night. Choose Creighton.

 

[bballrules]

It seems like many people are worrying about money. We are all very fortunate to even have a spot at a dental school. As you all know, it's extremely difficult getting in. There are just so many variables. For example, pretend you got denied this year and had to apply again. Or another example is that there are some D1s that are 22 years old and others 27. They'll graduate at 26 and 31 respectively. The younger guy obviously will work earlier and make money and pay off his loans at an earlier age. What if you fail boards and it may take you 5 years. You wasted a year of salary... Everyone wants the ideal situation, like going to the best school with low tuition and loans. In the end, we will all make money and pay off our loans. I've never heard of a struggling dentist, even in today's economy. This is quite an exaggeration but there are wal mart workers working to support their families. We are very lucky and just go to the school you like the best. Don't worry about money too much. Look at all those people going to USC, NYU, etc... the most expensive schools. I'm pretty sure they're not the lower applicants that had no choice. Just do what feels best and don't take money too much into consideration.

 

[sokrman14]

i just saw someone saying that you need residency after going to creighton, that's why i brought up the fact that creighton graduates are very skilled. I am not saying MWU is better/worst than Creighton, they are different. It's like comparing apples w/ oranges, they have different taste, texture, but in the end, they are both fruits 😛.

As for Creighton's facilities, I would say it's perfect for what you need to do in dental school! there are more chairs than there are students, so you will never have to worry about that. No they don't have fancy lcd screens or cabinets, but they have the handpieces that you need for all your procedures. The chairs+equipments are pretty up to date, so i think you'll be good for dschool there.

I come from a big city in the north east, going to Omaha was a huge shock for me when i found out there was pretty much nothing in the city. Also, all male students at creighton are required to wear shirt+tie every day, which gets really stuffy in the summer. IF Creighton was located in Cali or Boston, I bet it'd be one of the top choices for everyone 🙂.

Its quite the opposite of Creighton grads. Almost everyone going into residency gives feedback to the school and say its a waste of time. The only thing it helps them with is their speed, which is something everyone graduating from every school has to deal with. In fact, I know a few in current GPR's and they wont even bother going back for the 2nd year. They aren't learning anything new that they haven't already done at Creighton. With Creighton not having any residency programs of their own, you get a complete hands on for every patient you see in all aspects of dentistry.

 

[mr24]

Creighton hands down! especially since its RDEP. I hear that is pretty competitive. congrats!!

 

[revoapparel]

Just got back from a MWU-AZ interview yesterday. Facilities are top-notch, great dean, awesome clinical experience taught in a private practice model. Cons would be obviously cost and set to rise 5% each year! Def have a tough decision ahead of u.

 

[DrReo]

Creighton and Midwestern-AZ are the two schools that I'm deciding between. I am just wondering if anyone has any input one way or the other. I absolutely loved Midwestern, their location, facilities, and curriculum. Their only downside is the cost, but im my opinion, you can see where your money is going because everything is so nice there. For Creighton, they have a great reputation for producing general dentists (which is what I want to do), plus the cost is a lot less than Midwestern (around $70k less over the four years). I am pretty torn between the two, I really like both schools. If everything was equal, I would choose Midwestern, but the extra $70k would be hard to swallow. Any suggestions? Thanks!

This isn't even a consideration. It isn't $70k. It's that plus interest over 10, 20, 25, etc. years!

 

[321931]

Creighton and Midwestern-AZ are the two schools that I'm deciding between. I am just wondering if anyone has any input one way or the other. I absolutely loved Midwestern, their location, facilities, and curriculum. Their only downside is the cost, but im my opinion, you can see where your money is going because everything is so nice there. For Creighton, they have a great reputation for producing general dentists (which is what I want to do), plus the cost is a lot less than Midwestern (around $70k less over the four years). I am pretty torn between the two, I really like both schools. If everything was equal, I would choose Midwestern, but the extra $70k would be hard to swallow. Any suggestions? Thanks!

Midwestern is more expensive, and does not have a graduating class. It also doesn't have research nor specialities. I dunno much about creighton, but I would choose it for cost and since it is established.

 

[kdawg]

Geesh...I'm never on SDN anymore! I don't remember the last time I've posted. But I wanted to offer my 2 cents. I'm a MWU D-3.

I've always believed in choosing the school that will be the right fit for YOU. Trick is...how do you know until you've already chosen, been in school long enough to start to develop a practice philosophy, and then look back on the experience to analyze if you made a good match? You don't. So unless you have a clear vision of what you want to do (ie: specialize)---and a good reason why one school will help you get there over another---you just kind of go with your gut.

I chose MWU over several other schools, all but one of which were cheaper. $$$ wasn't as big of a factor for ME, based on: 1) many dentists, accountants, lenders who all seem to agree that dentists rarely have issues paying back loans; 2) I knew d-school would be tough to get through no matter where I went, so going to a school that made the experience less painful would be well worth the extra $$$ (who knows, maybe I wouldn't have even made it through a school where I was having a miserable experience); 3) I plan to minimize the accummulating interest on my loans by repaying them quickly.

Now, had I gotten the RDEP, I might have changed my mind! I'm from SLC, was a UofU grad, and would love to practice in Utah. That said, I'm kind of glad now that I don't have obligations to go back, and plan on going wherever I can maximize my opportunity. Still amazed that the U & the Y, while putting out other top-notch post-grad programs, still have not dipped into the dental school cash cow.

MWU is phenomenal. It still continues to impress me what we have going on here. We've had to pick up the dropped jaws of visiting administrators from other dental schools. They tell us things like, "Your D-3's have already done more operative in 9 months than our grads do their whole time". I felt better when I heard that---felt bad the day before that when it took me the entire morning appointment to complete 2 post/cores & 2 crown preps. We are (and have been since day #1) doing molar endo, implant placement and restoration (including cone beam CT imaging), surgical extractions, flaps, crown lengthening, complex fixed & removable, nitrous & sedation, and other treatment often reserved for either D-4's or specialty programs (or just simply not allowed!) at other dental schools. We rub shoulders with our specialists, like little mini residencies, on a daily basis.

The facilities...yes they're nice to have. Digital sensors, cone beam CT, microscopes in endo (going to install one in each of our suites---meaning one scope per about every 22 students), decked-out OS suites, 240 chairs, excellent sim clinic, etc, etc.

Sometimes you might feel like our school touts the facilities so much that we're covering up something. In reality, board scores have been solid, we have received zero CODA recommendations (never before happened at a new school), the basic science curriculum is extremely solid, and the faculty couldn't be better. They ARE getting us as ready for practice as a dental grad can be straight out of school. Scary thing is...D-2's had it better than we did & D-1's even moreso. An unstoppable force that is just gaining momentum. Speaking as an insider and as unbiased as possible (which is IMpossible🙂), I think it's only a matter of time before dental applicants drive and demand this kind of dental education from the other schools.

MWU students aren't special, in and of themselves, by any means. I think that any school's students could produce what we're doing if their school adopted the same philosophy.

Feels like I've robbed a bank....but then my student loan statement shows up in the mail.😀

This post is getting long, & I didn't want it to...I could keep going on. But in short, when it came to accepting the schools' offers, I asked myself, "Which school would never make me question if I should have gone elsewhere." For me, the choice was then obvious and the hangups I had about MWU were negated. Fortunately, I have NEVER thought twice about my decision and, quite frankly, feel like I picked the ideal school to meet my post-grad goals. A degree is a degree, of course. But if I come out of school blazing, which I plan on doing😎, I made the right choice for myself.

For anybody that made it through the post I hope it was helpful.

 

[Oracle DMD]

well said.

 

[Osity]

Kdawg, what other schools did you pck MWU over? Thanks for the info, very insightful!

 

[doanh]

I'm a D1 at MWU and I love it here. Yes the cost of attendance is expensive but there are ways to cut it down. For example, most of our lecture notes are printed out (b&w) and textbooks are not really needed so you can cut that out of the equation.

Housing is cheap and you don't have to buy the school's health insurance if you'd like a cheaper option.

The school is always willing to work with us, for example, they moved our practicals and finals around so that it can better accommodate us. The professors are amazing and friendly. Most of them really want to help you learn and we have an open door policy so you can walk into their office whenever you want.

We also get 3 months off for the summer to study for boards and a 2 week thanksgiving... :]

 

[John Durian]

(Heat stroke + $70k) vs (Frost Bite - $70k) = Creighton

 

[mr24]

Geesh...I'm never on SDN anymore! I don't remember the last time I've posted. But I wanted to offer my 2 cents. I'm a MWU D-3.



Now, had I gotten the RDEP, I might have changed my mind! I'm from SLC, was a UofU grad, and would love to practice in Utah. That said, I'm kind of glad now that I don't have obligations to go back, and plan on going wherever I can maximize my opportunity.

Just to clarify... There is NO obligation to go back to Utah with the RDEP program, but if you do go back to utah to practice you receive reimbursement for tuition. No penalty for never returning to utah, and it still ends up cheaper than a lot of schools.

 

[Osity]

Just to clarify... There is NO obligation to go back to Utah with the RDEP program, but if you do go back to utah to practice you receive reimbursement for tuition. No penalty for never returning to utah, and it still ends up cheaper than a lot of schools.[/QUOTE]

Very good point. You are a smart kid. Creighton is definitely cheaper than most schools, plus if you do come back to Utah (which you don't have to do, like Mr24 said), then you get an extra $60k in your pocket.