CSPM vs Western, current Pod students please help

[Summernight]

Hi all,

I got accepted to both this week and here is the list of my pros and cons.

CSPM
pros:
-traditional (MD-like) curriculum
-small class setting
-very friendly faculty/students, I got lots of help and advice from them
-early clinical rotations (love it)
-lots of different populations of patients from the Bay area
-potential for a 10/15K scholarship
-strong research
-great residency placements, such as Harvard, Yale, John Hopkins
-ability to take some days/weeks off to study for the boards and exams

cons:
-cost of living
-cost of tuition
-old campus
-super tiny gym
-I didn't qualify for a 1st year scholarship
-far away from my family (8 hour drive, can fly but its a lot of money)

WESTERN:
pros:
-cheaper tuition
-I can get a nicer apartment for the amount of money I have
-offered a small scholarship
-nice big clean campus
-super close to home, can commute home almost every night (leaving my daughter home for the 1st semester)
-overall debt will be much less

pros and cons:
-mixed curriculum adopted from a DO program
-lots of medical rotations
-the promise "when we will be able to take USMLE our students will be the most prepared"

cons:
-didn't like the streamed lectures program
-don't like to go to lectures with 220 people, but can deal with it
-no gym
-overloaded curriculum seems a bit unnecessary (I am a very hard working person with a military background)
-much younger crowd (I am in my 30s)
-less established school

PS.: I like the CSPM curriculum and professors better, however, Western sounds good too, its much less student loans and travel to home to see my daughter and boyfriend.

PPS.: I also have an interview with Barry, free tuition for all 4 years (I am a veteran and their Yellow ribbon program and Voc Rehab would cover the cost). But its so far away from my daughter that I will spend too much in travel money and never see my bf too. Don't know much about this School. Any advice?

Your advice is greatly appreciated.

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[josebiwasabi]

FYI, oftentimes the big names from the allopathic world don't mean anything for pod training. JHU doesn't have a pod residency, Yale is essentially a VA wth slightly better training, and the Harvard programs aren't really powerhouse programs either.

I have seen good and bad students from both schools. Choose whichever school makes the most sense financially and also for your family.

 

[I post PRN]

Follow the $. Period.

 

[dyk343]

Free tuition... that's hard to turn down.

You would not be flying home very often to visit your daughter due to the workload so she would have to come with you to FL.

You could generate >$200k (more likely $300k) with 7-9% interest rate by staying in CA. That's about 3.0-3.5k/month once you graduate in student loan debt for 10 years. You will repay almost half a million dollars once its all said and done.

You would generate food and cost of living by going to FL. so... 75-100k?

Any financial advisor would recommend you take the free tuition and find a way to make it work.

However you need to make your family your first priority. Not being swamped in debt may be a priority for your family. It may not. I guess a lot of that depends on the age of your daughter.

Barry sends students to top residencies just like CSPM and Western.

Good luck and be frugal regardless of your choice. Keep loans as low as possible.

 

[Summernight]

Thanks a lot for your fast replies!!
I should've explained a little more about the situation going to CA schools. My debt going to CSPM would be about 36K total vs 30K for Western vs 0K for Barry. I don't mind staying in CA accumulating this much debt (which isnt that much) and seeing my 3-year old daughter and bf. The drive from Pomona is under 1.5 hrs and Oakland is 8 hrs away. I really want to get the best education and residency placement.

 

[Dr.PatchAdams]

Congrats on your acceptances!

To chime in and address some of your concerns regarding WesternU, with lectures being streamed, not all students come to class. This results in about ~60 or so students in lecture instead of the full (230 DOs + 50 DPMs). I'm personally in the group that goes to class every day.

While there is no gym on campus (unless you live in the on campus apartments - Daumier/777), we get a heavily discounted unrestricted membership to LA Fitness. It costs 99$ a year for membership. There is an LA fitness ~5 minutes south (Chino Hills) and ~10 minutes north of WesternU (Montclair/Claremont). This also means you'll likely have a gym near by on rotations .

The curriculum will mostly consist of core medical courses we share with the DOs, taking place every week day. Podiatric courses take place 1-3 times a week. And smaller courses (IPP and IPE) are 1x a week. Through course evaluations and a curriculum representative, students are able to actively change the curriculum to the benefit of future classes. As a second year on my last course in pediatrics, I enjoyed the schedule. While our main medical courses do demand much of our time and smaller courses, like the inter professional one, can seem inconvenient as a result; I found it to be a nice mental health break and a way to meet others outside of our college.

While our average class age is around 24-26, there are a few students in their 30s. Of the schools, we tend to have a smaller class size and I can truly say we have become a family, as I'm sure future classes will too.

I hope this helps and I invite you ask if you have any questions about WesternU.

All of your options look great and I wish you the best in your decision!

 

[Cranjis McBasketball]

Did Western recently tell all their pod students to make SDN accounts and promote the school?

 

[Dr.PatchAdams]

Did Western recently tell all their pod students to make SDN accounts and promote the school?

There has not been a solid WesternU presence around these parts; so, a few of us agreed to check in when we could to answer any questions members may have. I hope we've been helpful

 

[dyk343]

Thanks a lot for your fast replies!!
I should've explained a little more about the situation going to CA schools. My debt going to CSPM would be about 36K total vs 30K for Western vs 0K for Barry. I don't mind staying in CA accumulating this much debt (which isnt that much) and seeing my 3-year old daughter and bf. The drive from Pomona is under 1.5 hrs and Oakland is 8 hrs away. I really want to get the best education and residency placement.

No one can make the decision for you however it's easier to narrow down your choices. Goal is to keep loans as low as possible. So western has CSPM beat on tuition, cost of living, and most important to you close to family.Now you need to decide what is more important: proximity to home vs free tuition altogether. Miami has cheaper cost of living?

Read the chapter written for medical students from the book "the white coat investor". It will change the way you look at schools. You do NOT want crippling debt 7 years from now.

 

[dyk343]

As for quality of education. I like western's philosophy but they are by far the worst prepared in terms of podiatry/ foot and ankle surgery knowledge in my experience with students coming out of that school. Their medical knowledge is superb. I don't know where you draw the line.

I second this. It's wrong to make a blanket statement as there are exceptions but the trend is true.

Sorry seasoned posters that went to DMU and AZPOD, but I also would add those two schools to the list of lacking skills to work up a podiatric patient. Obviously this is opinion from a small sample group and maybe I just have a bad crop so take it for what it's worth. But this is my experience working with students (and residents) over the last 3 years. These students know medicine really well. But the second these students see a mildly complicated podiatric case they tend to freeze up. I don't think they have a lot of face to face time with patient's as a student and it shows.

East coast students (NY, Temple, Barry) tend to perform very well as does Scholl and CSPM working up patients. I've had mixed experiences with Ohio.

We only accept 3.0+ GPA and top 1/2 class for externs.

Getting off tract here. Go where tuition and cost of living is the cheapest. In the end it really does not matter. Residency will teach you the skills you need regardless of where you went to school. Sorry for the diversion.

Again that's my opinion. Others may disagree but my opinion will still be my opinion.

 

[Summernight]

You guys are great, thank you for all the advice so far. I decided to cancel Barry interview, unfortunately. I have 2 acceptances that I need to confirm/decline before I even make it to Florida for the interview. I don't mind taking some small debt on in order to see my family. I liked the CSPM curriculum and faculty but the area is very expensive and Im not sure how often I will see my family. Western is nice too, less loans, closer to family. My only worry- is that I want a solid foundation that leads to the best residency possible. As of few days ago I was leaning towards CSPM for that reason, but I didn't qualify for their 1st year scholarship. Western offered a small scholarship on top of their cheaper tuition and low cost of living. Still trying to find the balance. Don't want to regret going somewhere I won't like

 

[Weirdy]

You guys are great, thank you for all the advice so far. I decided to cancel Barry interview, unfortunately. I have 2 acceptances that I need to confirm/decline before I even make it to Florida for the interview. I don't mind taking some small debt on in order to see my family. I liked the CSPM curriculum and faculty but the area is very expensive and Im not sure how often I will see my family. Western is nice too, less loans, closer to family. My only worry- is that I want a solid foundation that leads to the best residency possible. As of few days ago I was leaning towards CSPM for that reason, but I didn't qualify for their 1st year scholarship. Western offered a small scholarship on top of their cheaper tuition and low cost of living. Still trying to find the balance. Don't want to regret going somewhere I won't like

You are too focused on residency placement.
If you have the work ethic and brains to get in, you have what it takes to land a top residency regardless of institution attended.
It is more dependent on the student than you think. You have more control over what residency you want than you think.

Those factors aside- Where do you see yourself more comfortable for 4 years? Which location is more conducive to your studying and family?

 

[sfgiantsfan13]

Those factors aside- Where do you see yourself more comfortable for 4 years? Which location is more conducive to your studying and family?

Totally agree with this...

What it came down to for me was location. I ended up choosing between CSPM, Western, and AZPOD. My family lives in northern California and that is home so ultimately CSPM won me over. They offered more scholarship as well but as you said cost of living is very high so that shouldn't be your determining factor.

You will get a good education at either of those schools. I had clerkships with many western students and I enjoyed working with all of them, they seemed very well prepared and matched at some great programs across the country. The same can be said for my classmates at CSPM. Every school has their things they preach to applicants that makes them "unique and special", and every school has issues you will not discover until you are there. I have heard complaints from students at all 9 of the different schools, none of them are perfect. Honestly you will get what you need at any of them and anything you feel you're lacking will be on you to self-study. Your performance in your 4th year on clerkships will mean much more than what school you choose. So look at the numbers, consider your quality of life in the different locations and know that you will have the opportunity to be successful at either school if you work hard.

 

[I post PRN]

You are too focused on residency placement.
If you have the work ethic and brains to get in, you have what it takes to land a top residency regardless of institution attended.
It is more dependent on the student than you think. You have more control over what residency you want than you think.

Those factors aside- Where do you see yourself more comfortable for 4 years? Which location is more conducive to your studying and family?

Nailed it. Good students and bad students come from all schools. Not one have we ever said, they were a great fit, good gpa...but they went to....doesn't happen