CUSOM vs. MUCOM vs. ACOM

[MADD!!!]

Hey Everyone,

So as these 3 amazing schools have officially posted board scores and students have undergone rotations, I was hoping some students from each school could chime in on the pro's and con's of each of their schools. All of the schools have done well and seem very similar to one another, so for those of us who may have options either between any two or all 3 of these schools, which factors should we consider most? Just location? Cost? (all similar cost) Rotations?

Or does it not matter which of these 3 schools you attend as all will provide you with nearly equivalent outcomes? Thank You for any and all responses.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[DocWinter]

I'm a 3rd yr @ ACOM.

I agree with Mr Kenobi that your effort and your ability will do more for you than your school will.
ACOM had a 89% 1st year and 91% pass rate 2nd year pass rate. Below the average, but on track for a new school. If I recall, WC had a unthinkable 74% in their first year.

ACOM rotations are solid. They have been in place since 2007 and we get it as good as any DO school. You get several selectives and electives in 3rd year and your 4th year is only mandatory ER and hospice, the rest of the year is yours to rotate and do electives.

 

[ATPsynthase123]

I dont know what you mean by budget cuts! LECOM- Bradenton for me had the best location out of CUSOM and ACOM, was cheaper, better board scores, and more reputable. It just made sense. PBL is an interesting way to learn for sure, and I hate lecture with a burning passion, because I learn better on my own, and PBL I think fit me better, both ACOM and CUSOM had mandatory attendance for lectures, and I just can't see my self going to lectures, when I never did in undergrad. I feel like a lot of people give LECOM a bad rep because they are immature, and can't deal with certain things. I mean its not perfect, but dress code, not eating/drinking, isn't really a big deal lol! They are revamping rotations for our class, so there is a definite change there. So far I am happy with the decision and Love florida!

Like I've heard stuff like you don't do your own anatomy dissections, or the lab is all digital simulation. That you basically get the cheap tuition, but you pay for it through budget cuts from the education budget


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[Wjldenver]

MADD! Give MUCOM serious consideration. Yeah, I'm a bit biased since I have a couple of degrees from Indiana U. and used to live in Indianapolis, but this is what I know. Marian ramped up quickly and very successfully DO wise. Indianapolis has a great health care infrastructure for quality rotations and it is a very solid biosciences/pharmaceutical hub as well. Lilly is based there and it is a Fortune 100 pharmaceutical company. Indiana University's medical school is based in Indianapolis also, and you will have an opportunity to have some clinical rotations along with their MD students. My vote is MUCOM out of the three schools you mentioned. Your clinical and research opportunities would be great. ...An additional thought, Lilly also has a summer research internship program open to both MD and DO students, you would have a shot at that.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[crazyboi1993]

Like I've heard stuff like you don't do your own anatomy dissections, or the lab is all digital simulation. That you basically get the cheap tuition, but you pay for it through budget cuts from the education budget


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

At LECOM B we do NOT do dissections, but we do see cadavers that are protected (dissections already done for you). I actually liked not dissecting, it is a huge waste of time, my friends at other medical schools say it takes them 5 hours to see something. I think its a waste of time, and what if you do it wrong.

 

[Ho0v-man]

At LECOM B we do NOT do dissections, but we do see cadavers that are protected (dissections already done for you). I actually liked not dissecting, it is a huge waste of time, my friends at other medical schools say it takes them 5 hours to see something. I think its a waste of time, and what if you do it wrong.

I think at my lecom interview someone said most of Europe has moved away from dissections in med school does essentially what lecom does.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[MADD!!!]

Judgement day has arrived!!!

CUSOM: Got 154 students into their first year match

ACOM: 132

MU-COM: 138

SOOoooo..... CUSOM > MU-COM > ACOM

https://www.natmatch.com/aoairp/stats/2017sklstats.html

@Goro thoughts?

 

[SlugMD]

Judgement day has arrived!!!

CUSOM: Got 154 students into their first year match

ACOM: 132

MU-COM: 138

SOOoooo..... CUSOM > MU-COM > ACOM

https://www.natmatch.com/aoairp/stats/2017sklstats.html

@Goro thoughts?

First of all, the # of graduates is a useless stat. Look at the huge number of people "not participating" aka they are in the ACGME match.

Plus I wouldn't consider any AOA match statistics until they are combined with the ACGME match that comes out next month. There's a ton of students who skip the AOA match in favor of ACGME.

In addition, many on SDN have said that reading match lists is like reading tea leaves. Not reliable since matching is mostly an individual effort.

I'm sure that KCU grad who matched ENT at Tulane last year would have done it had he gone to another DO school. Same with the integrated plastics match from PCOM and the RadOnc match from VCOM-CC a while back.

 

[FCMike11]

Judgement day has arrived!!!

CUSOM: Got 154 students into their first year match

ACOM: 132

MU-COM: 138

SOOoooo..... CUSOM > MU-COM > ACOM

https://www.natmatch.com/aoairp/stats/2017sklstats.html

@Goro thoughts?

No idea how/why you'd try to extrapolate > > without match statistics from AOA & ACGME match.



Sent from my Nexus 6P using SDN mobile

 

[MADD!!!]

First of all, the # of graduates is a useless stat. Look at the huge number of people "not participating" aka they are in the ACGME match.

Plus I wouldn't consider any AOA match statistics until they are combined with the ACGME match that comes out next month. There's a ton of students who skip the AOA match in favor of ACGME.

In addition, many on SDN have said that reading match lists is like reading tea leaves. Not reliable since matching is mostly an individual effort.

I'm sure that KCU grad who matched ENT at Tulane last year would have done it had he gone to another DO school. Same with the integrated plastics match from PCOM and the RadOnc match from VCOM-CC a while back.

No idea how/why you'd try to extrapolate > > without match statistics from AOA & ACGME match.



Sent from my Nexus 6P using SDN mobile

The link shows how many students GRADUATED from each school, regardless of what they do with the match. So the numbers that I listed shows how many students actually finished the 4 year program at each of these schools. Now, if you look at the next columns, it shows OUT OF THE TOTAL NUMBER OF GRADUATES how many of them matched AOA, how many of them applied and didn't match, and how many didn't participate at all (A.K.A. waiting for ACGME match).

make more sense?

Edit: Another way to put it, adding up all the "non-participants' (AKA students applying ACGME), plus students who matched AOA, plus students who applied and didn't match AOA, all add up to the number of students I listed for each school. Subtract that from the 162 students that each school started with (150 + 8% a.k.a 12 = 162) and you find your true attrition rate for the first year class of each program. (With the exception of those who fell behind and will be partaking in next year's match)

 

[FCMike11]

People apply to both matches. They may still match ACGME.

https://www-forums.studentdoctor.net/index.php?threads/1059335/

Sent from my Nexus 6P using SDN mobile

 

[Waillin]

Think those people who did not match (applied AOA but did not match) were gunning for competitive specialties (AOA) with safer (ACGME) specialties as back up if they didnt match? All the schools had a surprising number of people who tried but did not match.

 

[FCMike11]

Think those people who did not match (applied AOA but did not match) were gunning for competitive specialties (AOA) with safer (ACGME) specialties as back up if they didnt match? All the schools had a surprising number of people who tried but did not match.

Idk. Conjecture at this point. Probably some of both.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using SDN mobile

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

People apply to both matches. They may still match ACGME.

https://www-forums.studentdoctor.net/index.php?threads/1059335/

Sent from my Nexus 6P using SDN mobile

No those are actual attrition rates. ACOM and MUCOM had first class attrition rates of 19 and 15%, respectively. CUSOM had an attrition rate of 5%. Those numbers have nothing to do with the two matches.

 

[FCMike11]

No those are actual attrition rates. ACOM and MUCOM had first class attrition rates of 19 and 15%, respectively. CUSOM had an attrition rate of 5%. Those numbers have nothing to do with the two matches.

I see that now. That's terrible.

Sent from my Nexus 6P using SDN mobile

 

[Mosonik]

What's are some of you guys take on these programs with high attrition rates?

I can only speak to CUSOM but the way they've at least handled our early class was basically entirely related to inability to pass didactic coursework or due to withdrawal for personal reasons. I never heard of any frivolous "letting go". I think when looking at attrition you have to consider both students matriculated as well as school support/institutional policies when things aren't going well (ie think board failures, unprofessional behaviors, remediations, etc).

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

It is important to note that the true attrition rate won't be seen for a year or two because the reported number also includes those who took an extra year to graduate. Including those who had to remediate a year or did research. I would be surprised though if very many were taking research years. The current attrition is brutal.

 

[Alienman52]

No idea how/why you'd try to extrapolate > > without match statistics from AOA & ACGME match.



Sent from my Nexus 6P using SDN mobile

Hahaha strongly concur. looks like someone doesn't know how to interpret data.

"Only ~54 people from ACOM matched!!"



Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Hahaha strongly concur. looks like someone doesn't know how to interpret data.

"Only ~54 people from ACOM matched!!"



Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

This discussion has nothing to do with match rate... this is strictly the attrition and percentage of GRADUATES. No matter how you hash it ACOM has a brutal first class attrition rate. 19% of their students did not graduate in 4 years.

 

[Alienman52]

This discussion has nothing to do with match rate... this is strictly the attrition and percentage of GRADUATES. No matter how you hash it ACOM has a brutal first class attrition rate. 19% of their students did not graduate in 4 years.

Yep, not denying that. Pretty terrible.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[HappyFeet14]

No those are actual attrition rates. ACOM and MUCOM had first class attrition rates of 19 and 15%, respectively. CUSOM had an attrition rate of 5%. Those numbers have nothing to do with the two matches.

I can only speak for MUCOM as a 2nd year student. I had heard from the 4th years above us that the original 162 1st class had about 6-7 students drop out in the first couple months of 1st year due to personal reasons that were not related to the school or within the school's control. Additionally, if we assume that 3-4 students are taking an extra year (for whatever reason), then: 162 - (7+4) = 151 --> 1- (138/151)*100 = 8.6% relative attrition. Currently in the 2nd year class we have 155/162 and I know for a fact that AT LEAST 3-4 students are repeating 1st year and would therefore take 5 years to graduate if they make it all the way through.

 

[Alienman52]

I can only speak for MUCOM as a 2nd year student. I had heard from the 4th years above us that the original 162 1st class had about 6-7 students drop out in the first couple months of 1st year due to personal reasons that were not related to the school or within the school's control. Additionally, if we assume that 3-4 students are taking an extra year (for whatever reason), then: 162 - (7+4) = 151 --> 1- (138/151)*100 = 8.6% relative attrition. Currently in the 2nd year class we have 155/162 and I know for a fact that AT LEAST 3-4 students are repeating 1st year and would therefore take 5 years to graduate if they make it all the way through.

I would hope this is also true for ACOM.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[Mosonik]

It is important to note that the true attrition rate won't be seen for a year or two because the reported number also includes those who took an extra year to graduate. Including those who had to remediate a year or did research. I would be surprised though if very many were taking research years. The current attrition is brutal.

I'm willing to be corrected on this but actually attrition does NOT include research/masters years. Our class had multiple that did this and somehow it came up that attrition is actually utilized in accreditation standards and so for students on a leave of absence for additional academic/professional training the school is not penalized by their ability to leave students within their original matriculating class for attrition stats. I'm a bit of a nerd and since our school is new and provisionally accredited, these are the kinds of useless facts I learned the last few years.

 

[IslandStyle808]

No those are actual attrition rates. ACOM and MUCOM had first class attrition rates of 19 and 15%, respectively. CUSOM had an attrition rate of 5%. Those numbers have nothing to do with the two matches.

I can only speak for MUCOM as a 2nd year student. I had heard from the 4th years above us that the original 162 1st class had about 6-7 students drop out in the first couple months of 1st year due to personal reasons that were not related to the school or within the school's control. Additionally, if we assume that 3-4 students are taking an extra year (for whatever reason), then: 162 - (7+4) = 151 --> 1- (138/151)*100 = 8.6% relative attrition. Currently in the 2nd year class we have 155/162 and I know for a fact that AT LEAST 3-4 students are repeating 1st year and would therefore take 5 years to graduate if they make it all the way through.

As stated by HappyFeet14, those are the percentage of people who didn't make it to graduation in 4 years, not necessary those who withdrew or were dismissed (just clarification for those of you who don't understand). We don't know how many of them are repeating the year or taking LOAs. Best not to look at attrition rates until at least 2 classes have graduated (i.e. the 6 year graduation rule).

 

[Ho0v-man]

How many are doing the "omm fellow" year at these schools? Those guys/gals are taking a year off to be a TA/anatomy lab grunt to get a tuition break.

I'm sure it's only a handful, but that would skew this negatively too.

 

[Dhooy7]

I dont know what you mean by budget cuts! LECOM- Bradenton for me had the best location out of CUSOM and ACOM, was cheaper, better board scores, and more reputable. It just made sense. PBL is an interesting way to learn for sure, and I hate lecture with a burning passion, because I learn better on my own, and PBL I think fit me better, both ACOM and CUSOM had mandatory attendance for lectures, and I just can't see my self going to lectures, when I never did in undergrad. I feel like a lot of people give LECOM a bad rep because they are immature, and can't deal with certain things. I mean its not perfect, but dress code, not eating/drinking, isn't really a big deal lol! They are revamping rotations for our class, so there is a definite change there. So far I am happy with the decision and Love florida!

Mind if I PM you? I have a question about LECOM-B's rotations.