Did I overestimate myself

[joseph MD]

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Sorry if this is another freak out thread, but I seriously was looking for some similar threads and can't find any on search.

Background: US graduate at respectable mid tier allopathic. Canadian citizen.
Academics: step I 255, step 2 pending. Honors in IM, surgery. HP in the rest. Fantastic LORs and glowing MSPE "in comments sections" however no AOA. Above average class rank

Complete on sept 24.
Initially applied to: MGH, BIDMC, BWH, Hopkins, Yale, Penn, Pitt, Rochester, Rush, NW, UChicago, Mayo, U of M, Beaumont, Henry Ford, Stanford, UC Davis, UCSF. Got no interviews initially then added Case Western, Cornell.

So far, almost 1 month later, I only have 3 interviews at Rush, Beaumont, and Henry Ford and 3 rejections at Northwestern, UCSF, Stanford.

I understand it may be a tougher year for IM, but c'mon. I added 3 more programs yesterday at hopkins bayview, mayo Jacksonville and Emory. I'm getting virtually no love. What gives? lack of step 2? I'm trying to make sense of all of this as I know many of the programs have given out lots and lots of invites. I don't know if I should start calling programs or what, or I should take a chill pill but I haven't seen anyone else in this situation with my "stats" 1 month after being complete. All LORs, transcripts etc were in before I even applied.

 

[disorder]

Sorry if this is another freak out thread, but I seriously was looking for some similar threads and can't find any on search.

Background: US graduate at respectable mid tier allopathic. Canadian citizen.
Academics: step I 255, step 2 pending. Honors in IM, surgery. HP in the rest. Fantastic LORs and glowing MSPE "in comments sections" however no AOA. Above average class rank

Complete on sept 24.
Initially applied to: MGH, BIDMC, BWH, Hopkins, Yale, Penn, Pitt, Rochester, Rush, NW, UChicago, Mayo, U of M, Beaumont, Henry Ford, Stanford, UC Davis, UCSF. Got no interviews initially then added Case Western, Cornell.

So far, almost 1 month later, I only have 3 interviews at Rush, Beaumont, and Henry Ford and 3 rejections at Northwestern, UCSF, Stanford.

I understand it may be a tougher year for IM, but c'mon. I added 3 more programs yesterday at hopkins bayview, mayo Jacksonville and Emory. I'm getting virtually no love. What gives? lack of step 2? I'm trying to make sense of all of this as I know many of the programs have given out lots and lots of invites. I don't know if I should start calling programs or what, or I should take a chill pill but I haven't seen anyone else in this situation with my "stats" 1 month after being complete. All LORs, transcripts etc were in before I even applied.

You should apply more broadly. Unfortunately, I think your citzenship hurts you and this should have been elucidated by your dean/school. Still, you pretty much relegated yourself to top tier schools where it's pretty much a crapshoot.

Edit- I really think you should add at least 10 more schools, and make sure they are true safeties or mid-tiers. The only other school on your list who will probably give you a look is Rochester. And, honestly, even for the SDN gunner avg your list of schools is formidable for even the best of best applicants.

 

[Live4Life]

You might want to add another school. According to a friend, Emory is completely filled according to Interview Broker. I'm not holding my breath for an IV at this point.

 

[Dextrocardia]

Sorry if this is another freak out thread, but I seriously was looking for some similar threads and can't find any on search.

Background: US graduate at respectable mid tier allopathic. Canadian citizen.
Academics: step I 255, step 2 pending. Honors in IM, surgery. HP in the rest. Fantastic LORs and glowing MSPE "in comments sections" however no AOA. Above average class rank

Complete on sept 24.
Initially applied to: MGH, BIDMC, BWH, Hopkins, Yale, Penn, Pitt, Rochester, Rush, NW, UChicago, Mayo, U of M, Beaumont, Henry Ford, Stanford, UC Davis, UCSF. Got no interviews initially then added Case Western, Cornell.

So far, almost 1 month later, I only have 3 interviews at Rush, Beaumont, and Henry Ford and 3 rejections at Northwestern, UCSF, Stanford.

I understand it may be a tougher year for IM, but c'mon. I added 3 more programs yesterday at hopkins bayview, mayo Jacksonville and Emory. I'm getting virtually no love. What gives? lack of step 2? I'm trying to make sense of all of this as I know many of the programs have given out lots and lots of invites. I don't know if I should start calling programs or what, or I should take a chill pill but I haven't seen anyone else in this situation with my "stats" 1 month after being complete. All LORs, transcripts etc were in before I even applied.

You may get plenty of invites from your initial all-star list as the process progresses. In the mean time, I would add in some mid-level programs so you are assured at least 8 interviews. It may cost you an extra ~$200 or so, but it will be worth it to have some peace of mind while you waiting for the big dogs to give you a shout.

Good luck!

 

[disorder]

You may get plenty of invites from your initial all-star list as the process progresses. In the mean time, I would add in some mid-level programs so you are assured at least 8 interviews. It may cost you an extra ~$200 or so, but it will be worth it to have some peace of mind while you waiting for the big dogs to give you a shout.

Good luck!

I don't believe this will be true. I could be wrong (I am no authority), but better safe than sorry!

 

[LimbicResponse]

No AOA, no research?, no step 2, not us citizen.. not sure who told you to just apply to top tier schools...Even for someone with a perfect application, multiple threads here always advise to apply to "safety" schools, just in case.

 

[sunset823]

Given your citizenship and the fact you are applying to Detroit area programs, I have a pretty good idea where you go to med school (a school I know very well that takes a lot of Canucks, who may even live in Canada and commute). And yes, you are overestimating yourself. The 255 does not make up for not going to a 'name' school (and you're at a great school, it's just not got the top 20 sheen) and lack of AOA and only 2 honors grades, etc. etc. IM at the top tier programs seems to be a bloodbath recently, and unfortunately, I'm finding out that a Harvard or Hopkins med degree goes a long way even with AOA, great scores, etc.

You should have applied to way more mid tier programs when you first applied, I think it may be a bit late in the game now given how many invites have gone out, but it's worth a shot to add at least another 20 mid tiers, you may turn some heads with the 255 at programs that are not top 20.

 

[bombas238]

No AOA, no research?, no step 2, not us citizen.. not sure who told you to just apply to top tier schools...Even for someone with a perfect application, multiple threads here always advise to apply to "safety" schools, just in case.

I feel like the "lite" version of the topic creator. I am also an international US graduate from a well-respected allopatric program, I honored several clerkships, and I have very strong LORs. My board scores, however, are pretty mediocre (215/225). I applied "realistically" and quite broadly because I felt the need for a VISA would be a big turn-off for many programs, but I actually logged back on to ERAS and withdrew several dozen applications after my inbox kept getting flooded with invites. I won't be going to MGH or Hopkins, but I am going to get good training and I am excited about places like Brown, Wisconsin, Dartmouth, and several university programs. I posted some on the interview invite thread but in all honesty I stopped contributing because there's been so much movement and I just don't see a point in sharing anymore.

 

[joseph MD]

Given your citizenship and the fact you are applying to Detroit area programs, I have a pretty good idea where you go to med school (a school I know very well that takes a lot of Canucks, who may even live in Canada and commute). And yes, you are overestimating yourself. The 255 does not make up for not going to a 'name' school (and you're at a great school, it's just not got the top 20 sheen) and lack of AOA and only 2 honors grades, etc. etc. IM at the top tier programs seems to be a bloodbath recently, and unfortunately, I'm finding out that a Harvard or Hopkins med degree goes a long way even with AOA, great scores, etc.

You should have applied to way more mid tier programs when you first applied, I think it may be a bit late in the game now given how many invites have gone out, but it's worth a shot to add at least another 20 mid tiers, you may turn some heads with the 255 at programs that are not top 20.

Actually im not in Michigan but family in Canada close to Detroit border so I applied to some of the programs there. Do not like home program so I didn't not apply here but I probably should. But still respectable school definitely not in Top 20.

Thanks for the advice. I threw off some apps to Yale-Waterbury, Case Metrohealth, university at buffalo, brown, Dartmouth and CC-Weston. Hopefully add some more as I research.

Did not think the interview season would go down like this, thanks for the advice.

 

[joseph MD]

No AOA, no research?, no step 2, not us citizen.. not sure who told you to just apply to top tier schools...Even for someone with a perfect application, multiple threads here always advise to apply to "safety" schools, just in case.

I have 1 basic science pub, multiple posters. Safety schools IMO were mid tiers like Rush, Beau, HF, Rochester, but again I think I shouldve added more safeties

 

[omentum]

sorry to hear about your plight, i hope it turns better as the season progresses and people start to cancel interviews. just for your information and so that you can clearly evaluate the situation, penn and cornell have no remaining interview spots on their interview site. you have great stats and i hope one of those big name schools gives you a shot!

 

[dozitgetchahi]

Actually im not in Michigan but family in Canada close to Detroit border so I applied to some of the programs there. Do not like home program so I didn't not apply here but I probably should. But still respectable school definitely not in Top 20.

Thanks for the advice. I threw off some apps to Yale-Waterbury, Case Metrohealth, university at buffalo, brown, Dartmouth and CC-Weston. Hopefully add some more as I research.

Did not think the interview season would go down like this, thanks for the advice.

I have to admit that I don't understand your strategy here. Dartmouth is still quite competitive. Metrohealth and Buffalo are garbage programs. Never heard of CC-Weston. You need programs somewhere in-between these tiers.

Pick like 15-20 decent mid-tier programs and send apps...*now*. You like Chicago? Try UIC, Loyola, Rush, Advocate Lutheran, and UC Northshore. Granted, some of these programs are likely full at this point, but you get the general idea. Try to find decent progs that still have openings.

 

[C5toC9]

Just checked out Buffalo's IM site

http://medicine.buffalo.edu/departm...icine/current-residents/housestaff-pgy-1.html

Seems to be 90% FMG

 

[darkelven29]

Mayo, Pitt, UCDavis didn't give you an interview? That's odd.
Rush is a good place though.

Make sure you look at application deadlines, some of them may be in October.

 

[gutonc]

You've got the weirdest sense of where you should be expanding your search. Yale-Waterbury? Metrohealth? B'Lo? WTF?

Thinking about the geographic regions you've applied already, what about UW Madison, UMinn, Iowa, Indiana, MSSM, NYU, USC, OHSU, UWash? Add Utah and Colorado too. Those are all programs that are likely to give you a look (excepting perhaps MSSM and NYU)...assuming you haven't waited too long.

 

[joseph MD]

You've got the weirdest sense of where you should be expanding your search. Yale-Waterbury? Metrohealth? B'Lo? WTF?

Thinking about the geographic regions you've applied already, what about UW Madison, UMinn, Iowa, Indiana, MSSM, NYU, USC, OHSU, UWash? Add Utah and Colorado too. Those are all programs that are likely to give you a look (excepting perhaps MSSM and NYU)...assuming you haven't waited too long.

Based off various locations family which is important give that it's been kind of lonely being away in medical school, or based of reputation. I thought case western, Cleveland clinic and yale were good schools and I have to admit I'm just getting freaked out about not matching so I just added things in a rush

All those places you mentioned I thought are not mid tier aside for, uminn and Iowa, rather i thought they woukd be competitive. Will add them, thanks for everyone's help, I appreciate it.

 

[LimbicResponse]

Based off various locations family which is important give that it's been kind of lonely being away in medical school, or based of reputation. I thought case western, Cleveland clinic and yale were good schools and I have to admit I'm just getting freaked out about not matching so I just added things in a rush

All those places you mentioned I thought are not mid tier aside for, uminn and Iowa, rather i thought they woukd be competitive. Will add them, thanks for everyone's help, I appreciate it.

Also reading the comment "I didn't like my home program" makes me wonder if the feeling was mutual? Maybe you have a negative letter from your home program thats making some of these places put your application aside... I'm just guessing

 

[doobiedoobah]

Actually im not in Michigan but family in Canada close to Detroit border so I applied to some of the programs there. Do not like home program so I didn't not apply here but I probably should. But still respectable school definitely not in Top 20.

Thanks for the advice. I threw off some apps to Yale-Waterbury, Case Metrohealth, university at buffalo, brown, Dartmouth and CC-Weston. Hopefully add some more as I research.

Did not think the interview season would go down like this, thanks for the advice.

I'm sorry that you're not getting as many interviews as you hoped for. It seems like this year IM has been much more competitive than in the past. I would take the advice people give on here with a grain of salt, my advice included. Obviously you know you need to apply to more programs, but I would definitely second Rochester (Strong) rather than Buffalo. Buffalo is a little closer to Canada, but the training you'll get in Rochester is much better. Maybe consider Albany Med as well. It isn't the most desirable location, and does accept a lot of DO's and FMGs, but it's a great program. I'm sure everything will work out one way or another in the end. Good luck to you.

 

[EPADHA]

Sorry if this is another freak out thread, but I seriously was looking for some similar threads and can't find any on search.

Background: US graduate at respectable mid tier allopathic. Canadian citizen.
Academics: step I 255, step 2 pending. Honors in IM, surgery. HP in the rest. Fantastic LORs and glowing MSPE "in comments sections" however no AOA. Above average class rank

Complete on sept 24.
Initially applied to: MGH, BIDMC, BWH, Hopkins, Yale, Penn, Pitt, Rochester, Rush, NW, UChicago, Mayo, U of M, Beaumont, Henry Ford, Stanford, UC Davis, UCSF. Got no interviews initially then added Case Western, Cornell.

So far, almost 1 month later, I only have 3 interviews at Rush, Beaumont, and Henry Ford and 3 rejections at Northwestern, UCSF, Stanford.

I understand it may be a tougher year for IM, but c'mon. I added 3 more programs yesterday at hopkins bayview, mayo Jacksonville and Emory. I'm getting virtually no love. What gives? lack of step 2? I'm trying to make sense of all of this as I know many of the programs have given out lots and lots of invites. I don't know if I should start calling programs or what, or I should take a chill pill but I haven't seen anyone else in this situation with my "stats" 1 month after being complete. All LORs, transcripts etc were in before I even applied.

I am sorry to hear about your predicament. I think from the list you have provided above, you may get 1-3 more interviews once the MSPEs are released (if you indeed are in the middle tier of your class). I think having an excellent step 2 score, and having a mentor write to or call a few PDs may help. Please meet with an adviser at school and see how they can help. Please be careful when you interview, and do the best you can.
I completely support the idea of applying to 15-20 middle-tier programs STAT. Did you apply to good programs at now-so-great locations? UAB (top tier but location knocks it down- so within reach for you)? Wisconsin? Iowa? Colorado? Other programs to consider- UIC, Florida Gainesville, Jefferson, Temple, BU, OHSU, UCI, Cedars-Sinai, U Miami.
I think that you will match- may not be at the best program within you reach given how things have gone. But do give things your best shot. Good interviewing skills, and coming across as sincere and commited will go a long way.
Good Luck!

 

[filritchie]

Look around at your medical school for some people who can advocate for you. Initial rejections are likely due to algorithms that allow for people to be screened out. Perhaps somebody at your school knows someone at one of these programs. An email can go a long way!

 

[Raryn]

I am sorry to hear about your predicament. I think from the list you have provided above, you may get 1-3 more interviews once the MSPEs are released (if you indeed are in the middle tier of your class). I think having an excellent step 2 score, and having a mentor write to or call a few PDs may help. Please meet with an adviser at school and see how they can help. Please be careful when you interview, and do the best you can.
I completely support the idea of applying to 15-20 middle-tier programs STAT. Did you apply to good programs at now-so-great locations? UAB (top tier but location knocks it down- so within reach for you)? Wisconsin? Iowa? Colorado? Other programs to consider- UIC, Florida Gainesville, Jefferson, Temple, BU, OHSU, UCI, Cedars-Sinai, U Miami.
I think that you will match- may not be at the best program within you reach given how things have gone. But do give things your best shot. Good interviewing skills, and coming across as sincere and commited will go a long way.
Good Luck!

MSPEs were released Oct 1 this year.

 

[ArcGurren]

Look around at your medical school for some people who can advocate for you. Initial rejections are likely due to algorithms that allow for people to be screened out. Perhaps somebody at your school knows someone at one of these programs. An email can go a long way!

Anybody know if that's how the topmost programs work? Like do they screen out at a certain score/AOA status? (places like Hopkins or Penn or MGH)

 

[DrVanNostran]

Anybody know if that's how the topmost programs work? Like do they screen out at a certain score/AOA status? (places like Hopkins or Penn or MGH)

Who knows. But I am sure: Medical school rank, AOA, Boards are 3 major screens. IMO, School rank>AOA>Boards.

 

[GOINGDUMB]

.

 

[gutonc]

Who knows. But I am sure: Medical school rank, AOA, Boards are 3 major screens. IMO, School rank>AOA>Boards.

Except you can make ERAS do the work for you if you screen based on discrete data. AOA and Step scores are discrete data, med school rank is not.

 

[gutonc]

Based off various locations family which is important give that it's been kind of lonely being away in medical school, or based of reputation. I thought case western, Cleveland clinic and yale were good schools and I have to admit I'm just getting freaked out about not matching so I just added things in a rush

Clearly you were in a rush. Because you applied to:
A community program in Waterbury, CT that has a "name-only" affiliation with Yale.
The 2nd-tier program at Case (Case University Hospital is the real academic program).
The CC affiliate in Florida...not the mothership in Cleveland...as with Mayo-Jax, it's a completely different beast than the main program.

All those places you mentioned I thought are not mid tier aside for, uminn and Iowa, rather i thought they woukd be competitive. Will add them, thanks for everyone's help, I appreciate it.

With the exception of the NYC programs (which are pretty equivalent to Cornell) and possibly UWash, all of the programs I mentioned are solidly mid-tier, with a pretty broad spread across that tier.

Also, if you actually would like to be in FL (and didn't apply there completely by accident) both UF and USF are better programs than the Mayo and CCF affiliates.

The only real "red flag" is that you need a visa. I'm frankly not sure what's up, but I definitely think more programs are in order. It's a small investment for a little peace of mind.

 

[quepatho]

(I don't like spreading rumors and this might be wrong, but I've heard CC Weston almost exclusively looks at IMGs - I would be welcome to corrections if that's untrue. fwiw.)

 

[darkelven29]

Clearly you were in a rush. Because you applied to:

Also, if you actually would like to be in FL (and didn't apply there completely by accident) both UF and USF are better programs than the Mayo and CCF affiliates.

If you like county hospital setting and speaks some Spanish, UMiami is pretty good too

 

[LovelyBRass]

Given your citizenship and the fact you are applying to Detroit area programs, I have a pretty good idea where you go to med school (a school I know very well that takes a lot of Canucks, who may even live in Canada and commute). And yes, you are overestimating yourself. The 255 does not make up for not going to a 'name' school (and you're at a great school, it's just not got the top 20 sheen) and lack of AOA and only 2 honors grades, etc. etc. IM at the top tier programs seems to be a bloodbath recently, and unfortunately, I'm finding out that a Harvard or Hopkins med degree goes a long way even with AOA, great scores, etc.

You should have applied to way more mid tier programs when you first applied, I think it may be a bit late in the game now given how many invites have gone out, but it's worth a shot to add at least another 20 mid tiers, you may turn some heads with the 255 at programs that are not top 20.

Can you tell them this over at Pre-allo? I'm getting a little sick of the "it doesn't matter where you go to med school" prattle.

 

[mig26x]

you should also apply to suny downstate in NY.
UMDNJ in Newark.