Disability Insurance?

[LADoc00]

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Specifically, Professional Disability Insurance for PATHOLOGY, not M.D.s in general: is it worth it, seriously? For starters they cover only a portion of your income, they do not make you whole (unless you are underpaid...).

4-5K+ per year and Im afraid with 50%+ of my income coming in via admin work (medical directorships etc.), I would never collect on these policies because the insurer could always claim I could theoretically earn a living even if I was paralyzed Stephen Hawkings-style.

I can see these for hands on professions: surgeons, dentists or even some interventionalists, but Im thinking about dumping this expense for 2013.

What is the general consensus? I havent seen any, but is there some CAP or ASCP statements on these policies?

Thanks

 

[pathstudent]

Specifically, Professional Disability Insurance for PATHOLOGY, not M.D.s in general: is it worth it, seriously? For starters they cover only a portion of your income, they do not make you whole (unless you are underpaid...).

4-5K+ per year and Im afraid with 50%+ of my income coming in via admin work (medical directorships etc.), I would never collect on these policies because the insurer could always claim I could theoretically earn a living even if I was paralyzed Stephen Hawkings-style.

I can see these for hands on professions: surgeons, dentists or even some interventionalists, but Im thinking about dumping this expense for 2013.

What is the general consensus? I havent seen any, but is there some CAP or ASCP statements on these policies?

Thanks

I Don't take it. Too expensive. Insurance salesman say things like you are seven times more likely to be disabled than to die prematurely.

I don't believe them. Maybe if you are a roofer or electrician, you find any reason to be disabled to get out of your **** job, but I don't think that translates to pathology.

Thinking about the adults I knew as a kid I can only think of 1 that became disabled and he could probably still do pathology.

I could do pathology as a quadriplegic. If I had a hand cut off I could still do it.

 

[gbwillner]

I have disability. Shop around and you may get a decent rate. It's also important to get it as early as possible, because the older you are the more it will cost (your age is a factor in their calculations, in addition to your health).

As long as you get a physician-specific policy, it doesn't matter if you earn income, it doesn't matter if you get a new job. If you cannot practice pathology you can collect until retirement. These policies are not typical "disability" policies. But who knows- sickness, accident, injury... they can all happen, and you can keep a portion of your salary until 65. Hell, you may develop headaches from looking at the scope too long, and get a job doing construction, and still collect disability.

 

[Pathologee]

I have some that will pay me if I cannot do my specific job. It covers a quarter of my salary per month, but thats enough to pay my house and bills. I don't want to leave my family with nothing if I go down, and Ill be damned if I am going to do CP.

 

[2121115]

I have "own occupation" disability insurance that pays if I cannot practice pathology. It will pay out 15K per month, which was the maximum for whatever type of policy I was dealing with. It is somewhat pricey but worth it, IMO. You never know when a piece of glass from a broken cup will bounce into your eye, or an athletic accident hits your eye, etc. IMO, having no insurance at all is taking a big risk when you are early on in your career.

Now, if you have been in practice a long time and have substantial assets then it is a waste of money because 15K per month may be chump change compared to your portfolio. I don't know if that is you or not.

It all depends.

 

[Kunu]

Ive never seen this benefit as an ongoing payout as someone described- its almost always a capped sum like $100k for example. Most benefit plans offer some token disability blanket but i never opt for a higher amount that i'd actually have to pay into.

 

[2121115]

Ive never seen this benefit as an ongoing payout as someone described- its almost always a capped sum like $100k for example. Most benefit plans offer some token disability blanket but i never opt for a higher amount that i'd actually have to pay into.

You are talking about something different.

 

[gbwillner]

Ive never seen this benefit as an ongoing payout as someone described- its almost always a capped sum like $100k for example. Most benefit plans offer some token disability blanket but i never opt for a higher amount that i'd actually have to pay into.

Mine pays out $65K/year until age 65. More expensive plans allow you to "cash out" what you pay in as a form of tax shelter. The latter is good for high-income earners.

 

[deleted314957]

I think it is important to have until you are financially "set", just like term life if you have folks who depend on you.

 

[yaah]

Can I get government protection insurance so when the government screws up all health care reimbursement I can maintain my income?

 

[scienceguy19]

should pathologists purchase unemployment insurance?

 

[gbwillner]

should pathologists purchase unemployment insurance?

Nice troll. You will probably get a bite or two.

 

[WEBB PINKERTON]

All forms of insurance should disappear. They have inflated the cost of everything and allowed risky behavior that ALL of us must pay for. Although, probably 60 percent of us would not have a job if their wasnt health insurance creating this false market.

I am suprised LA Doc didnt give a lecture about socialism. Reagan wouldn't want you to buy this insurance. Just set money aside.

 

[mlw03]

All forms of insurance should disappear. They have inflated the cost of everything and allowed risky behavior that ALL of us must pay for. Although, probably 60 percent of us would not have a job if their wasnt health insurance creating this false market.

I am suprised LA Doc didnt give a lecture about socialism. Reagan wouldn't want you to buy this insurance. Just set money aside.

That may work if you already have it. But for someone who's right out of training, earning decent money but not yet set, and is effectively useless to the economy in any other profession, disability is certainly worth considering. I have it, costs a few grand a year, but if something happens I won't need to fret about having no money and tons of debt.

 

[deleted314957]

That may work if you already have it. But for someone who's right out of training, earning decent money but not yet set, and is effectively useless to the economy in any other profession, disability is certainly worth considering. I have it, costs a few grand a year, but if something happens I won't need to fret about having no money and tons of debt.

you are wise, and also make sure ( i assume you know this) to have life insurance until your dependents are not not "dependents". i paid for this shi* for years but i do not consider it "lost" money. It was a table bet to protect those I love, knowing that i would probably never collect.

 

[LADoc00]

Here is what I want to know: do these policies actually PAY OUT for Pathologists? I have only heard of like 1 case on the West Coast paying out in the last 10 years...

that concerns me.

I understand the concept of prof. disability insurance but am skeptical about these policies for us.

When I ask NW insurance etc for pay outs for Physicians they have no data for pathologists period in the last 5 decades to give me.

Term life: yes. That has a definitive pay out scenario, ie you are dead. But this is a bit more tricky, vastly more expensive and actually covers such a minimal fraction of your total income as make it better you just die off rather than become fully disabled.

 

[Tissue issue]

Here is what I want to know: do these policies actually PAY OUT for Pathologists? I have only heard of like 1 case on the West Coast paying out in the last 10 years...

that concerns me.

I understand the concept of prof. disability insurance but am skeptical about these policies for us.

When I ask NW insurance etc for pay outs for Physicians they have no data for pathologists period in the last 5 decades to give me.

Term life: yes. That has a definitive pay out scenario, ie you are dead. But this is a bit more tricky, vastly more expensive and actually covers such a minimal fraction of your total income as make it better you just die off rather than become fully disabled.

I have always kind of wondered about this but never thought to ask for data.

 

[KCShaw]

Good question. I can think of no data specific to pathology.

I'm aware of one story, but it starts with a young surgeon, not a pathologist; tried re-starting in pathology but that was after the fact. Between medical bills and substantially decreased income (though I believe there was some insurance that paid, at least for a while), it wasn't terribly long before finances were a significant issue. That person spent some time warning other newbies to not skimp on insurance, or at least understand the choice you make -- if you're gonna get it, do it right, don't just get some crappy minimalist policy providing little more than a false sense of security.

Growing up I was very sour on the concept of insurance in general -- the existence of for-profit insurance companies was proof enough that for the average person they were not necessary so long as one managed ones finances decently and/or could arrange a reasonable payment plan. I'm still a bit sour, but I more or less toe the party line and pay the tax like the other lemmings. No-one wants to be the outlier who "got screwed" by not having adequate insurance, and there comes a time when one may bend the knee at the altar of insurance more because of family.

 

[wp746911]

I think a reasonable approach is to have it for a few years, until you become self-insured (enough savings in the bank). I do agree that all this insurance stuff gets a little crazy- at some point you find yourself working just so you can insure you're ability to work...

I actually care LESS about life insurance (if I die tomorrow my wife can actually work a pretty good job, and her parents will help some) than disability (if I really become long term nasty disable, not only can I not work, but I will likely cost lots of $$ to maintain, and my wife will be less able to work b/c she will have to take care of me.

I personally would at least get a modest level of disability insurance (specialty specific) for 10 years or so until you get reasonable savings, then ditch it. Life insurance is even less mandatory...

 

[gbwillner]

I think a reasonable approach is to have it for a few years, until you become self-insured (enough savings in the bank). I do agree that all this insurance stuff gets a little crazy- at some point you find yourself working just so you can insure you're ability to work...

I actually care LESS about life insurance (if I die tomorrow my wife can actually work a pretty good job, and her parents will help some) than disability (if I really become long term nasty disable, not only can I not work, but I will likely cost lots of $$ to maintain, and my wife will be less able to work b/c she will have to take care of me.

I personally would at least get a modest level of disability insurance (specialty specific) for 10 years or so until you get reasonable savings, then ditch it. Life insurance is even less mandatory...

Sounds like you don't have any kids....

kids= mandatory life insurance. The more you have, the truer this is. Not everyone has parents that can help out in case you die. Also, you die, wife and kids are instantly rich. Actually, that's kinda scary.

 

[icpshootyz]

I don't have kids and we don't own a home yet, so right now I just have the basic life insurance that will cover a funeral and basic costs if I crap out. Once a mortgage and kids come into the picture life insurance will happen. But my fiance makes good money, no reason for her to get rich off my demise 😉

 

[pathstudent]

Just read that 9million people are collecting disability payments from the us govt.

In 1965 there were 50 people working for every 1 collecting disability. Today there are only 12 people working for every 1 collecting a check from the us govt Absurd.

Please get disability insurance so we don't have to support you also.

 

[KCShaw]

Dude, if you're paying for me, why should I bother? Actually, I seem to be developing some back pain...

 

[MR Insurance]

I think that a few people already touched on it, but perhaps a good option for someone who is skeptical of disability insurance would be to keep it until you are capable of living off your assets, for the rest of your life.
Certainly someone in or fresh out of training does not have this capability and should therefore have some level of protection.
Consider this, an individual earning $200K at age 35 will earn $6,000,000 by retirement age, assuming no salary increases. Is $6,000,000 worth protecting to you?
The purpose of long-term disability is simply to protect against a risk that is potentially too catastrophic to protect against yourself, unless you are independently wealthy of course.

 

[LADoc00]

I think that a few people already touched on it, but perhaps a good option for someone who is skeptical of disability insurance would be to keep it until you are capable of living off your assets, for the rest of your life.
Certainly someone in or fresh out of training does not have this capability and should therefore have some level of protection.
Consider this, an individual earning $200K at age 35 will earn $6,000,000 by retirement age, assuming no salary increases. Is $6,000,000 worth protecting to you?
The purpose of long-term disability is simply to protect against a risk that is potentially too catastrophic to protect against yourself, unless you are independently wealthy of course.

That is a good point...for me its more like $20,000,000 by retirement but I did decide to keep the insurance...

 

[pathstudent]

That is a good point...for me its more like $20,000,000 by retirement but I did decide to keep the insurance...

You bought a policy to pay you 600-700k a year in pre-tax dollars? Nice! Get hurt.