DO 2022 match thread?

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djiboutiman said:
Skipped through the video, so I didn't see all the matches, but the University of Washington Dermatology match stood out to me.
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That's an absolutely killer match.... I am floored... prbly the best match to come from a DO school this year..
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FutureDoctor5000 said:
That's an absolutely killer match.... I am floored... prbly the best match to come from a DO school this year..
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On par with Duke ENT and UPenn general surgery.

General Surgery as a whole is still strongly anti-DO starting at the mid-high tier level. UPenn is widely considered a top 10 program.
 
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DOVinciRobot said:
On par with Duke ENT and UPenn general surgery.

General Surgery as a whole is still strongly anti-DO starting at the mid-high tier level. UPenn is widely considered a top 10 program.
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But..... it's Derm 😱😱😱
Also isn't Mayo Rochester General surgery better? There were 2 DO's matched there this year...
 
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DrStephenStrange said:
Sorry, I have not looked into IM programs in a while since I lost interest in it and went the Neuro route instead, but are programs like Ochsner, UNLV, UIC, UTMB, OU, Wayne State, UAH not impressive? I thought that looked really good that students at my fairly new DO school matched at those programs, but I guess I don't know how high on the spectrum those programs rank.
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Is UAH. University of Alabama Huntsville? If so then no it’s not impressive. It’s community style and pretty disconnected from UAB. Good training I hear though
 
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FutureDoctor5000 said:
But..... it's Derm 😱😱😱
Also isn't Mayo Rochester General surgery better? There were 2 DO's matched there this year...
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No, Mayo is not really considered in the same elite category for surgery. Mayo is more known as a great place to get care, not necessarily to train as a surgeon. 2 DOs matched last year as well.

And ENT is actually considered more competitive than derm these days, I suspect we’ll see that reflected in the charting outcomes this year. Derm residencies have secretly been opening at a rapid pace.
 
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Either way, whichever program/specialty is more competitive, end of the day, I am just glad DOs are matching better/great and hope the trend continues to 2023!
 
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PCOM PA & GA Match Lists. Enjoy
 

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MADD!!! said:
PCOM PA & GA Match Lists. Enjoy
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Did I just see a UCSF IM match from the PA campus? that has to be a mistake lol or maybe its fresno? A DO seriously matched big4 IM? Also Case Derm, UConn ENT, Hopkins EM realll niceeeee

edit: fact checked UCSF IM and its not the real UCSF lol
 
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Deecee2DO said:
Did I just see a UCSF IM match from the PA campus? that has to be a mistake lol or maybe its fresno? A DO seriously matched big4 IM? Also Case Derm, UConn ENT, Hopkins EM realll niceeeee

edit: fact checked UCSF IM and its not the real UCSF lol
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Its most likely a mistake, loll.
 
U Maryland general surgery is a strong match. I don’t think they’ve ever had a DO. Very highly academic 7 year program.
 
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PCOM had an Emory IM. Reaallll nice. Best IM match so far this year that ive seen other than WashUSTL. Also my buddy at Rowan matched UMaryland EM theyre the #3 three year EM program in the country and T10 overall
 
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DOVinciRobot said:
U Maryland general surgery is a strong match. I don’t think they’ve ever had a DO. Very highly academic 7 year program.
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7 years for Gen Surg?? 😰 I thought the push was to get Gen Surg duration training shortened, not lengthened. Are the two extra research years unique to Maryland, or is that a growing trend?
 
Deecee2DO said:
PCOM had an Emory IM. Reaallll nice. Best IM match so far this year that ive seen other than WashUSTL. Also my buddy at Rowan matched UMaryland EM theyre the #3 three year EM program in the country and T10 overall
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WashU had a DO IM match!? I know they interviewed not sure if anyone matched tho
 
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Darrow O'Lykos said:
7 years for Gen Surg?? 😰 I thought the push was to get Gen Surg duration training shortened, not lengthened. Are the two extra research years unique to Maryland, or is that a growing trend?
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No…. The training is not being pushed to be shortened. Not sure where you got that.

Many large academic programs are transitioning to 7 years with two years of research built in. It’s not the majority, but it’s not uncommon. UPenn is also a 7 year program.
 
DOVinciRobot said:
No…. The training is not being pushed to be shortened. Not sure where you got that.

Many large academic programs are transitioning to 7 years with two years of research built in. It’s not the majority, but it’s not uncommon. UPenn is also a 7 year program.
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7 years for general surgery is very unappealing. I couldn't imagine doing that just to become a general surgeon.... and then you have to add on additional training and years for those interested in fellowships...
 
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FutureDoctor5000 said:
7 years for general surgery is very unappealing. I couldn't imagine doing that just to become a general surgeon.... and then you have to add on additional training and years for those interested in fellowships...
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Remember 80% of surgery residents do fellowship. And research years are functionally required for Surg Onc and Peds. Those programs also launch their grads into academic careers.

I agree 100% that if your goal is to a be a community surgeon (even one fellowship trained in something that’s not Onc or Peds) going to a 7 year program isn’t really the best idea.
 
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DOVinciRobot said:
No…. The training is not being pushed to be shortened. Not sure where you got that.

Many large academic programs are transitioning to 7 years with two years of research built in. It’s not the majority, but it’s not uncommon. UPenn is also a 7 year program.
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I got that notion from some reading online as well as a couple vodcasts I’ve watched with cardiothoracic and vascular directors essentially arguing that a fair bit of the time spent in the current general surgery paradigm isn’t really helpful and is better spent once in fellowship. And while clearly Intergrated and fast track pathways are options in those fields, they’re less prevalent in others IIRC and that was one of the arguments for shortening GS training.

Man. I can’t imagine spending 7 years in surgical training before fellowships.
 
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Darrow O'Lykos said:
I got that notion from some reading online as well as a couple vodcasts I’ve watched with cardiothoracic and vascular directors essentially arguing that a fair bit of the time spent in the current general surgery paradigm isn’t really helpful and is better spent once in fellowship. And while clearly Intergrated and fast track pathways are options in those fields, they’re less prevalent in others IIRC and that was one of the arguments for shortening GS training.
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Those discussions are purely for getting people into those distantly related to general surgery fellowships faster. Not for actually shortening the training for general surgeons.

And honestly such fast tracking doesn’t make sense for most fellowships, such as CRS, MIS, Peds, Surg Onc, HPB, etc. All of those are directly related to general surgery, so short changing the residency part doesn’t help anyone.

Again, 7 year programs are generally for producing a specific type of academic surgeon. This is why I tell all interested med students to not just chase program name for the sake of prestige, programs are different and have different goals. Of your goals and the programs goals don’t align it’s going to be a rough time.
 
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Psych, the U Maryland GS match was prelim lol
 
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Darrow O'Lykos said:
I got that notion from some reading online as well as a couple vodcasts I’ve watched with cardiothoracic and vascular directors essentially arguing that a fair bit of the time spent in the current general surgery paradigm isn’t really helpful and is better spent once in fellowship. And while clearly Intergrated and fast track pathways are options in those fields, they’re less prevalent in others IIRC and that was one of the arguments for shortening GS training.

Man. I can’t imagine spending 7 years in surgical training before fellowships.
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That's just cancerous. Don't get why these surgical candidates stand for things like this.
 
scoopdaboop said:
That's just cancerous. Don't get why these surgical candidates stand for things like this.
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Like what? Research years? It’s pretty simple, if you don’t want to do them then don’t apply to the programs that require it….
 
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Neopolymath said:
This needs to be stickied every year. Myself and many others ranked and matched locations important to them #1 over higher ranked (arbitrarily by doximity or otherwise). You don't know the whole story although I believe you can know the trends.
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Yup. I ranked a T10 IM program in the bottom third of my list, matched my #1 at a small community program. Lots of people have other priorities.
 
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FutureDoctor5000 said:
Do prelims from stronger surgery programs have an easier time matching categorical surgery when they reapply?
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No. The best chance to match surgery is the first time around. The prelims that match tend, even from strong academic programs, to match community and newer programs. There are exceptions of course, but it’s not common.
 
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MADD!!! said:
PCOM PA & GA Match Lists. Enjoy
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I actually worked with the guy from PCOM-PA that matched Pitt Neuro during one of my audition rotations. Dude is super smart, real team player, kind, and a down-to-earth kinda guy. Well deserved spot.
 
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Deecee2DO said:
I just matched and im at RowanSOM. Pretty underwhelming list for sure aside from Dartmouth and CCF IM, Univ of Maryland EM, Brown Psych, Duke Peds, 2 ophtho (1 was MD ophtho at EVMS stellar applicant), 1 DO uro, 2 DO ortho
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Thank you for sharing! Do you know where the 2 Ortho matched?
 
I have been a part of these threads since undergrad (2015! (wow)) and while its fun here is your friendly reminder that you really do have to be careful in interpreting the match lists. As an example, one of our interns we matched (DO orthopaedics) interviewed at 15+ programs with many being MD. They ranked us 1 (which blew our mind) and on match day we got texts from residents at both do AND MD programs we know stating they ranked this person to match. The MD program that texted us would have been extra shiny on this forum. The other intern we matched also interviewed at double digit programs, and was easily a top 5 applicant in the country for both MD and DO students ((I personally read over 600 apps this year and they were the best on paper we had, think 250 and 260 USMLEs, 30+ pubs, NIH grants awarded, amazing letters from multiple programs saying they were RTM, best ortho knowledge of any study etc.). Both these people ended up at a DO program that will not look shiny on the forums.

Other examples: There was a DO student with a letter from a prominent MD program PD that literally said they would be RTM and was basically the most studly stud after completing a research year with them and this person matched at a DO program. Next, in my opinion the second best DO applicant this year who I thought would for sure match MD also matched DO. This process is literally so crazy.

While these people are all studly, I am sure there are many many star students at other schools who made similar "business decisions".

After 8 years of trying to find meaning from these lists I think the most important factors are

1. Overall pre-soap match rate (which we may never know for some schools)
2. % of residencies matched at home or nearby institutions. Take TCOM, OSU, PCOM and MSU for example. If match lists are full of "home" matches to me it indicates a security blanket of GME / connections that will likely last through the craziness of P/F boards and DO school expansion. I worry that schools without 1. Home GME and 2. nearby connections that are robust and will keep these students "home" will have a harder and harder time as DO school expansion propagates. IMO schools that used to thrive on great board scores (RVU as an example) will lose stock with p/f board due to not a ton of GME and an anti DO environment from U of C. All schools with have the occasional "glass ceiling" shattering match, but this says more about 1. the student and 2. the random process of the match than it says about the program or the school. Proceed with caution.

While it is amazing to see superstar matches, it does not tell the whole story and oftentimes is inexplainable.

This is just my take, take it or leave it.
 
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Dr. Foresight said:
Having basically all rotations at teaching hospitals/environments is hugely important. In terms of the cost, would you be willing to pay the extra tuition if it meant matching into your top competitive specialty (ENT, Ortho, Uro, Ophtho, even Gen Surg). This is one of the advantages CCOM has in that it sets you up well to match into those. I'm not defending CCOM's tuition at all. I think it's horrendous to see student's taken advantage of the way CCOM's president and upper administration do. They should be ashamed. Every year they lose out on fantastic student's due to cost. But it can't be denied that they set students up for success.

But CCOM's administration should not kid themselves, the tuition needs to, at least, be made competitive with other schools across the country.
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Shaming them does nothing. There needs to be federal regulations to put a limit on what a medical school can charge for tuition.
 
flightjordan said:
Why not exactly?

People won't stop applying, that's why there are 40+ Caribbean schools.
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Why do we need federal regulation to limit something that 1000s of people are willing to pay?

It’s clear people don’t care that much, because they keep applying and paying the tuition. It’s not like there aren’t 40 other DO schools to apply to.

People need to start factoring finances and COL instead of just applying to things and then complaining that they cost so much. It’s like the dozens of posts on Reddit of people matching programs in big coastal cities and then getting on Reddit and complaining their salary is too low to afford even a crappy apartment at $4000/month rent…. It’s not like that info isn’t readily available to factor into application strategies.
 
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DNC127 said:
I have been a part of these threads since undergrad (2015! (wow)) and while its fun here is your friendly reminder that you really do have to be careful in interpreting the match lists. As an example, one of our interns we matched (DO orthopaedics) interviewed at 15+ programs with many being MD. They ranked us 1 (which blew our mind) and on match day we got texts from residents at both do AND MD programs we know stating they ranked this person to match. The MD program that texted us would have been extra shiny on this forum. The other intern we matched also interviewed at double digit programs, and was easily a top 5 applicant in the country for both MD and DO students ((I personally read over 600 apps this year and they were the best on paper we had, think 250 and 260 USMLEs, 30+ pubs, NIH grants awarded, amazing letters from multiple programs saying they were RTM, best ortho knowledge of any study etc.). Both these people ended up at a DO program that will not look shiny on the forums.

Other examples: There was a DO student with a letter from a prominent MD program PD that literally said they would be RTM and was basically the most studly stud after completing a research year with them and this person matched at a DO program. Next, in my opinion the second best DO applicant this year who I thought would for sure match MD also matched DO. This process is literally so crazy.

While these people are all studly, I am sure there are many many star students at other schools who made similar "business decisions".

After 8 years of trying to find meaning from these lists I think the most important factors are

1. Overall pre-soap match rate (which we may never know for some schools)
2. % of residencies matched at home or nearby institutions. Take TCOM, OSU, PCOM and MSU for example. If match lists are full of "home" matches to me it indicates a security blanket of GME / connections that will likely last through the craziness of P/F boards and DO school expansion. I worry that schools without 1. Home GME and 2. nearby connections that are robust and will keep these students "home" will have a harder and harder time as DO school expansion propagates. IMO schools that used to thrive on great board scores (RVU as an example) will lose stock with p/f board due to not a ton of GME and an anti DO environment from U of C. All schools with have the occasional "glass ceiling" shattering match, but this says more about 1. the student and 2. the random process of the match than it says about the program or the school. Proceed with caution.

While it is amazing to see superstar matches, it does not tell the whole story and oftentimes is inexplainable.

This is just my take, take it or leave it.
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How do you think p/f will affect those bigger schools with 3+ branch campuses? VCOM, LECOM, PCOM, etc.
 
DOVinciRobot said:
Why do we need federal regulation to limit something that 1000s of people are willing to pay?

It’s clear people don’t care that much, because they keep applying and paying the tuition. It’s not like there aren’t 40 other DO schools to apply to.

People need to start factoring finances and COL instead of just applying to things and then complaining that they cost so much. It’s like the dozens of posts on Reddit of people matching programs in big coastal cities and then getting on Reddit and complaining their salary is too low to afford even a crappy apartment at $4000/month rent…. It’s not like that info isn’t readily available to factor into application strategies.
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To add on to this, I know this causes people to borrow an insane amount, and its going to suck to pay off. But correct if im wrong but I haven't heard about people who did end up being doctors not being able to pay it off. The problem with giving loans to undergrad liberal arts majors at a private university, is some of them are worthless in job market, its not the same with a DO degree. The DOs will be able to pay it off eventually, and still probably live a descent life while doing it
 
FootballAndSkiing said:
To add on to this, I know this causes people to borrow an insane amount, and its going to suck to pay off. But correct if im wrong but I haven't heard about people who did end up being doctors not being able to pay it off. The problem with giving loans to undergrad liberal arts majors at a private university, is some of them are worthless in job market, its not the same with a DO degree. The DOs will be able to pay it off eventually, and still probably live a descent life while doing it
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Yeah for some specialties eventually theyll pay it off but not for a long time. It would suck to still be paying loans when youre about to retire in 5 years. Depending on the area (i understand there are outliers in rural areas pulling half a mill) some Peds and FM doctors really dont make that much ~150K-200K on the very low end of the spectrum and some have 300K+ in loans. Bottom line we shouldnt be paying out the ass to go to med school and have interest rates of almost 10% but thats a discussion for another thread/time
 
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Deecee2DO said:
Yeah for some specialties eventually theyll pay it off but not for a long time. It would suck to still be paying loans when youre about to retire in 5 years. Depending on the area (i understand there are outliers in rural areas pulling half a mill) some Peds and FM doctors really dont make that much ~150K-200K on the very low end of the spectrum and some have 300K+ in loans. Bottom line we shouldnt be paying out the ass to go to med school and have interest rates of almost 10% but thats a discussion for another thread/time
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Why would those attending physicians be pulling in ~150K-200K? That seems super low..
 
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