Do I even have a shot?

[fr5w]

I graduated undergrad in '04
I had a horrible gpa - 2.8 cummulative, 3.0 major
B.A Biology

So....I decided to do a postbacc in 2005 at my state med school, and got a gpa of 3.8

[I was pre-dental at the time, never pre-med, but was faced with a choice....Dental school or MPH]

In 2005-2007, I did my MPH in London, England (forgot all about dental school)

So here I am in 2009, I finally had my epiphany and seriously thinking about med school for 2011. This is why:

-I have ALL the pre-requisites
-I received a high gpa at a post-bacc, which hopefully should count for something
-I did my Masters in Public Health with a thesis in global health
-I want to be able to combine my MPH and an MD degree to do research, especially in global health --> basis of hopefully a strong personal statement, and to answer the question "why now?"
-I have until March 2010 to study really hard for the MCATs, and get some volunteering/shadowing experience in.

What do you tihnk? Do I even have a shot?!?! or does my gpa just blow me out of the running. Taking the first step to commit to the application process is huge...i'm so confused! Any help would be great. Thanks!

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[physicsguy]

May I ask what your cummulative GPA for college and post-bac are? I don't actually have any advice. Rather, I'm in a similar situation (cGPA is 3.26), and I'm also wondering what my chances are.

 

[Yudid]

Alot of depends on the mcat, maybe u'll get a 43, then w/ this score many schools are going to be open for u. Everybody has a chance, just study hard for ur mcat.

 

[akinetopsia]

It's rare to hear the success stories of people with below average cGPA and average MCAT that get accepted. Additionally there appears to be diminishing returns on your MCAT score once it gets past a certain point. I think the reason for that is an MCAT of say 32/33 is impressive, but at some point I think there is a kernel of suspicion that you are just a good standardized test taker when you get closer to/above 40 and don't have a strong cumulative GPA/science GPA to back it up. Worst case, you just look like a smart, but lazy/inconsistent person.

A cGPA of 2.8 is pretty low. I think if you could get it to 3.0 you would have better chances, and an MCAT of 30+ should get you looked at somewhere. The MPH is good, but from what I've heard on these boards, master's degrees are mainly looked at as an EC, and the graduate GPA isn't factored in (partially because you have be over a 3.0 to remain in good standing in most master's programs, right?). One of your problems is you majored in biology. What's your science GPA? The way to raise your cGPA and sGPA is to take undergrad classes, that's all there is to it. Since you previously took all the prerequisites, maybe look into taking upper level BCPM classes you haven't previously taken to have a newer record and trend to look at in your application.

You just have to ask yourself how you can best strengthen your application. Good luck!

 

[DocHomer]

I graduated undergrad in '04
I had a horrible gpa - 2.8 cummulative, 3.0 major
B.A Biology

So....I decided to do a postbacc in 2005 at my state med school, and got a gpa of 3.8

[I was pre-dental at the time, never pre-med, but was faced with a choice....Dental school or MPH]

In 2005-2007, I did my MPH in London, England (forgot all about dental school)

So here I am in 2009, I finally had my epiphany and seriously thinking about med school for 2011. This is why:

-I have ALL the pre-requisites
-I received a high gpa at a post-bacc, which hopefully should count for something
-I did my Masters in Public Health with a thesis in global health
-I want to be able to combine my MPH and an MD degree to do research, especially in global health --> basis of hopefully a strong personal statement, and to answer the question "why now?"
-I have until March 2010 to study really hard for the MCATs, and get some volunteering/shadowing experience in.

What do you tihnk? Do I even have a shot?!?! or does my gpa just blow me out of the running. Taking the first step to commit to the application process is huge...i'm so confused! Any help would be great. Thanks!

You will need to sell yourself well in your application. Write a strong personal statement and make sure you have good clinical exposure.

As far as consistency goes, you did well in your post-bacc, so you will need to follow up with a good score on the MCAT (> 30). This will prove that you've changed your ways, and you have the aptitude and maturity for medical school. In addition, make sure you can explain your low undergraduate GPA and why this isn't a good reflection of who you are today.

Don't discount DO schools either. They tend to be more forgiving of this sort of thing. AACOMAS (the DO equivalent of AMCAS) only counts the latest retake in its GPA calculation. This can be your saving grace.

Good luck.

 

[fr5w]

Thanks guys for your insight, and a dose of reality. I think it's unrealistic on my part to expect a magnificent MCAT score.

I found out that my post bacc classes (10 in total), factor into my uGPA... and since I was a bio major, they don't put much of a dent in my gpa. I can only hope that the school I did my post bacc at will weigh the post bacc grades more since they are familiar with their own program.

I recalculated my grades with the AMCAS gpa calculator which factors in my post bacc grades:
cGPA - 3.0
sGPA - 2.8

I conclude... I don't have a shot, unless i have almost perfect MCAT scores.

 

[echo523]

You might want to check out http://www.journeysinmedicine.blogspot.com/ before you make the final decision.

 

[njbmd]

Thanks guys for your insight, and a dose of reality. I think it's unrealistic on my part to expect a magnificent MCAT score.

I found out that my post bacc classes (10 in total), factor into my uGPA... and since I was a bio major, they don't put much of a dent in my gpa. I can only hope that the school I did my post bacc at will weigh the post bacc grades more since they are familiar with their own program.

I recalculated my grades with the AMCAS gpa calculator which factors in my post bacc grades:
cGPA - 3.0
sGPA - 2.8

I conclude... I don't have a shot, unless i have almost perfect MCAT scores.

Be aware that a high MCAT does not offset a low uGPA. You need to get those grades higher or look into entering a SMP (Special Masters Program) and acing those courses. Many SMPs will have you taking the same coursework as medical students (you will be held to a higher standard) but a strong performance in an SMP can make you more competitive for medical school. Again, you would need to do very well in this type of program or you would tank your chances of acceptance.

If you retook some of your older poorer undergraduate courses, osteopathic medical schools will substitute your older poor grades with the new ones. In that case, your uGPA might be higher under their system. In any event, getting into osteopathic medical school might come sooner for you because of the grade substitution policy.

To get into an allopathic school, you may end up having to do a complete new degree, get all "As" and still you will be under a competitive uGPA. This is why an SMP makes sense for low uGPA applicants such as yourself. Many of these programs require the MCAT and thus you need to take that too.

MCAT scores do not make up for poor uGPAs or offset them. MCAT is another part of the application that needs to be competitive along with uGPA (not instead of uGPA).

 

[HCameronMD]

I'm a bit confused about some things, as I am in a similar situation.

My cGPA in college was 2.6, and I received a BFA in Art History.

I'm currently earning an entirely new degree, this time a BS in Technology, and my GPA is currently 3.2, but I'm working to pull it up to about a 3.6-3.8 when I'm finished with this degree.

What I'm confused about is, I assumed med schools would take the newest GPA that was earned, not combine both of them? Since I'm also a Post-Bacc student, and getting a second Bachelor's, (not simply just taking 30 semester credits (10 classes) but the standard 120 hours for completion) how does it work in terms of GPA?

So before I even apply for med school, I'll have 2 degrees:

1.) BFA in Art History
2.) BS in Technology



TIA!

 

[DrMidlife]

My cGPA in college was 2.6, and I received a BFA in Art History.

I'm currently earning an entirely new degree, this time a BS in Technology, and my GPA is currently 3.2, but I'm working to pull it up to about a 3.6-3.8 when I'm finished with this degree.

What I'm confused about is, I assumed med schools would take the newest GPA that was earned, not combine both of them? Since I'm also a Post-Bacc student, and getting a second Bachelor's, (not simply just taking 30 semester credits (10 classes) but the standard 120 hours for completion) how does it work in terms of GPA?

Bad assumption, unfortunately. All your undergrad work gets averaged together.

The most important number on your med school app is your combined, cumulative, overall undergrad GPA. As long as you take undergrad courses, they're averaged into that number. (The 2nd & 3rd most important numbers are cumulative undergrad science GPA & MCAT.)

So that 2.6 and your current 3.2 are a big problem. Back of the napkin, best case (4.0 from here on out) you could have a cumulative 2.93 when you finish your 2nd bachelors. That's not competitive, unfortunately. (I strongly recommend that you do your own spreadsheet to figure out what's possible GPA-wise - I'm just estimating. Hours/classes/credits aren't standards.)

What I suggest:
- keep taking undergrad (omg start getting A's and only A's!) until your cumulative is over 3.0
- kill the MCAT
- do an SMP (see the postbac forum)
- and/or make friends with DO
...meanwhile, start doing clinical volunteering and start collecting faculty recommendations

Best of luck to you.

 

[da Vincis World]

Have you thought about D.O. school. VCOM has a strong global health focus and organizes many international mission trips every year. They have clinics setup in several countries and also offer a DO/PhD in Global Health.

http://www.vcom.vt.edu/outreach/dophd.html

With your global health experience you would probably have a good shot at admissions.

 

[gman33]

With a sub-3.0 gpa, the best choice is DO schools.
You can retake classes and they only count the new grades.

If you are only looking at MD schools you need a couple of years of UG coursework + a SMP (and a few prayers).

You can get into MD schools from your starting point, but it will take 3-4 years of work and near perfect grades along the way.

 

[bfmoody]

I am also a non-traditoinal applicant I will mostly focus on DO schools I have an undergraduate gpa of a 2.8 and a graduate gpa of a 4.0 I plan to take the MCAT this March (2010) I'll be 27 when I enter medical school. I currently do prostate cancer research in molecular biology at Emory University. There is no doubt in my mind that I won't get in to medical school. I think sometimes when we listen to others we allow them the power to change how we feel about our own abilities. If this is something you really want, study hard for your MCAT, and prove yourself worthy... besides no-one is perfect and everyones path isn't meant to be traditional. Just study hard you will do fine