DO residents in California - any advice?

[stardust379]

Hi all!

I'm currently a first-year osteopathic medical student at a medical school located in the Midwest. I'm from California and am desperately wanting to go back to the West Coast (specifically somewhere in SoCal) for residency.

I want to pursue emergency medicine at the moment. I generally know that for DOs, it's a little tougher to secure a residency in a state as highly sought after as California.

I know it may be a little too early to think about this, but does anyone (especially someone who is currently a DO and a resident in a California hospital) have any advice? I just don't know where to start in terms of how to boost my competitiveness for a California residency. I know I'd have to pretty much kill it on the board exams, but what else? I'm planning on taking both the USMLE and COMLEX. Also, does research really play as heavy a role as everyone else says it does? I'm trying to get in some research experience as I don't have any solid publications or poster presentations during undergrad.

Any advice would be appreciated!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I just don't know where to start in terms of how to boost my competitiveness for a California residency

The path is the same. High boards, research, good LORs (SLOEs for EM), and great aways. That's the formula for having the best chance at literally anything from FM to Neurosurgery.

Also, does research really play as heavy as a role as everyone else says it does?

Yes. When programs get lots of applicants it's an easy way to weed applicants out. No you don't need a first author in NEJM but having some output and decent experience helps.

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

Auditions will be your only hope. Even then, I wouldn't bet on CA.

 

[drducky.]

If you do your residency elsewhere, will it be easier to get a job as an attending in CA as opposed to doing a residency in CA?

 

[PapaGuava]

Thread moved to Medical Students - DO

 

[MADD!!!]

I'm from CA and want to go back too (SoCal actually as well). For now, just know there isn't much you can do other than focusing on learning medicine and doing well in your classes. By year 3 and after you have taken boards, you will have a better understanding of what kind of medicine you want to do (most people re-evaluate what kind of medicine they want to pursue multiple times throughout med school) and see what the climate of residency apps are then. Whether someone gave you a guaranteed acceptance into a CA residency or told you you have 0% chance of matching in CA, it shouldn't change your work ethic. So kind of bittersweet, but until year 3 don't worry about any of this and just do your best to be the best student you can be. Good luck!!

 

[AliBabaMD]

Try to focus on what will be in your dean's letter and that will help...
1) get involved with an international humanitarian effort
2) raise funds for something you are passionate about
3) create something interesting, even if it is small
don't over focus on research or grades. Pass but the rest of this journey is about creating a professional you, not a student you!

hope this helps.
AB

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Try to focus on what will be in your dean's letter and that will help...
1) get involved with an international humanitarian effort
2) raise funds for something you are passionate about
3) create something interesting, even if it is small
don't over focus on research or grades. Pass but the rest of this journey is about creating a professional you, not a student you!

hope this helps.
AB

Lol this is terrible advice

 

[AliBabaMD]

Lol this is terrible advice

I assume the poster should take your advice because you like everything to be cookie cutter. I feel your advice is terrible and frankly how most people end up not being able to match into their choice. Scores are an endless pursuit of a number that means absolutely nothing, except for you it seems.

 

[AliBabaMD]

Lol agreed. I think that may be the actual worst advice ever given on SDN.

Right. Because you were there when SDN from the beginning? A dose of humility and accepting other opinions other than your own may help. Seriously, get out of your tunnel and see the world for what it is. Both you and the guy you back are focusing on grades. No one said grades are not important but that 10 points one direction or another doesn't determine destiny. Beyond helping you get through a computer filter, grades don't help in distinguishing candidates.

 

[Goro]

Try to focus on what will be in your dean's letter and that will help...
1) get involved with an international humanitarian effort
2) raise funds for something you are passionate about
3) create something interesting, even if it is small
don't over focus on research or grades. Pass but the rest of this journey is about creating a professional you, not a student you!

Hope this helps.
AB

This advice might be helpful for someone trying to get into med school, but I've never, ever heard of this being useful for getting into residency.
How do I know this? Here's one database:
http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/NRMP-2018-Program-Director-Survey-for-WWW.pdf

 

[AliBabaMD]

Goro-

You are right. I was not doing a zero sum calculation. Both of us can be right. You need grades and scores to get noticed, but you need more than that to get in.

 

[AliBabaMD]

Unless your scores are in the top 5% which in this case I am wrong and openly admit

 

[AliBabaMD]

Dude signed up today and has like 60 posts.

Seems legit

So I signed up to give feedback and got into it and somehow my advice sucks? You really have a legit litmus test on judging people. Take a break and I will too. It seems you do better criticizing me rather than just considering this as part of a series of advice feedback received.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I assume the poster should take your advice because you like everything to be cookie cutter. I feel your advice is terrible and frankly how most people end up not being able to match into their choice. Scores are an endless pursuit of a number that means absolutely nothing, except for you it seems.

Goro-

You are right. I was not doing a zero sum calculation. Both of us can be right. You need grades and scores to get noticed, but you need more than that to get in.

Unless your scores are in the top 5% which in this case I am wrong and openly admit

So I signed up to give feedback and got into it and somehow my advice sucks? You really have a legit litmus test on judging people. Take a break and I will too. It seems you do better criticizing me rather than just considering this as part of a series of advice feedback received.

Your advice is horrendous. It’s advice so bad that you should honestly be banned for giving it. There are documents and PD surveys that literally show how wrong you are. How about this, I’ll focus on grades, boards, and research; and you go focus on creating something small, raise some funds for something, and doing man international humanitarian trip. We’ll come back and see who has a more successful match day, deal?

 

[jw3600]

So I signed up to give feedback and got into it and somehow my advice sucks? You really have a legit litmus test on judging people. Take a break and I will too. It seems you do better criticizing me rather than just considering this as part of a series of advice feedback received.

Somehow your advice is the worst I’ve read in months.

I actually thought your post was in jest when I first read it.

 

[AliBabaMD]

Somehow your advice is the worst I’ve read in months.

I actually thought your post was in jest when I first read it.

Post by OP said:

"I know I'd have to pretty much kill it on the board exams, but what else? I'm planning on taking both the USMLE and COMLEX. Also, does research really play as heavy a role as everyone else says it does?"

I don't know why my advice is so terrible to you but perhaps reason is you don't give credit to advice besides the one you believe is true. Read the post above and you will understand why I responded as such with other things beyond good scores, LORs, etc. for the OP to do to improve her chances.

AB

 

[MightBeACylon439]

Learn how to live off of a stagnant residency salary and living costs that have outpaced the increase in that salary for decades.

 

[alprazoslam]

Try to focus on what will be in your dean's letter and that will help...
1) get involved with an international humanitarian effort
2) raise funds for something you are passionate about
3) create something interesting, even if it is small
don't over focus on research or grades. Pass but the rest of this journey is about creating a professional you, not a student you!

hope this helps.
AB

Was thinking of forming a non profit to fight fake news such as yourself.


OC dermworthy?

 

[AliBabaMD]

Was thinking of forming a non profit to fight fake news such as yourself.


OC dermworthy?

There are multiple avenues to do something.

The OP asked for advice. You are giving it in criticizing another post. Board scores and LORs are always important. I was giving additional food for thought. No reason to hate.

 

[alprazoslam]

There are multiple avenues to do something.

The OP asked for advice. You are giving it in criticizing another post. Board scores and LORs are always important. I was giving additional food for thought. No reason to hate.

Backpeddlin

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

There are multiple avenues to do something.

That doesn't make all avenues equal.

The OP asked for advice. You are giving it in criticizing another post. Board scores and LORs are always important. I was giving additional food for thought.

Hmm lets remind ourselves what you said:

Pass but the rest of this journey is about creating a professional you, not a student you

You gave terrible advice. Medical school absolutely is about creating a student you. Everything you mentioned in your original post is shown to have almost no bearing on residency selection.

 

[alprazoslam]

If you want the best advice ever


High boards
Research dep on specialty
Hot bod
Bernie Sanders bumpersticker
Plus or minus Kia Soul


That will get you anything in SoCal

 

[AliBabaMD]

That doesn't make all avenues equal.



Hmm lets remind ourselves what you said:



You gave terrible advice. Medical school absolutely is about creating a student you. Everything you mentioned in your original post is shown to have almost no bearing on residency selection.

How are you such a great judge of this residency program selection as a med student? With your tone, even if you were right which you are not, because I never claimed there is one solution as you have, I wouldn't want you as my doctor.

 

[deleted950463]

There are multiple avenues to do something.

The OP asked for advice. You are giving it in criticizing another post. Board scores and LORs are always important. I was giving additional food for thought. No reason to hate.

How did you come up with this advice? Are you an attending? Resident? Med student? Undergrad?

 

[alprazoslam]

How did you come up with this advice? Are you an attending? Resident? Med student? Undergrad?

With advice this bad probably either premed or DO administration

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

How are you such a great judge of this residency program selection as a med student?

Oh I don't know, maybe the PD surveys, the numerous PDs of our own programs, the multitude of residents I know in all kinds of specialties involved with resident selection. You however have..... what exactly that shows you know what you're talking about?

With your tone, even if you were right which you are not, because I never claimed there is one solution as you have, I wouldn't want you as my doctor.

Aaaaand there it is. Burnett's law in action.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

How did you come up with this advice? Are you an attending? Resident? Med student? Undergrad?

No attending would invoke Burnett's law lol, I'm guessing a pre-med, likely a sophomore or lower.

With advice this bad probably either premed or DO administration

This too lol

 

[precisiongraphic]

Op should perhaps be wary of advice from someone who joined today and already has 83+ posts, no track record, and no “verified physician “ label despite claiming to be an MD.

That doesn't make all avenues equal.



Hmm lets remind ourselves what you said:



You gave terrible advice. Medical school absolutely is about creating a student you. Everything you mentioned in your original post is shown to have almost no bearing on residency selection.

 

[deleted950463]

Why was he banned lol?

 

[Postictal Raiden]

I am from SoCal, attended Western and applied neurology last year with heavy emphasis on programs in the West. I was fortunate to interview at every program in the West I applied to. However, when match came, I found out I didn't match any of the handful CA programs I ranked. Matched my first choice out of CA. I thought I had very competitive stats but this is the nature of the process. Things can be very unpredictable. Also, keep in mind that, due to the current political atmosphere, California has become even more competitive.


Keep an open mind. Not matching in CA won't be the worst thing in the world. I thought it would be, but now I'm convinced that not matching in CA was the best thing that happened to me...and to my family.

Best of luck.

 

[deleted950463]

I understand that California is not a DO friendly state.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Why was he banned lol?

Troll.

 

[DrStephenStrange]

Haha that was great.

Sent from my SM-G950U using SDN mobile

 

[BorntobeDO?]

I assume the poster should take your advice because you like everything to be cookie cutter. I feel your advice is terrible and frankly how most people end up not being able to match into their choice. Scores are an endless pursuit of a number that means absolutely nothing, except for you it seems.

Lol troll level 10/10. However the entertainment value is only 6/10. I did chuckle.

 

[precisiongraphic]

How did you come up with this advice? Are you an attending? Resident? Med student? Undergrad?

I'd say undergrad or high school.

 

[precisiongraphic]

I am from SoCal, attended Western and applied neurology last year with heavy emphasis on programs in the West. I was fortunate to interview at every program in the West I applied to. However, when match came, I found out I didn't match any of the handful CA programs I ranked. Matched my first choice out of CA. I thought I had very competitive stats but this is the nature of the process. Things can be very unpredictable. Also, keep in mind that, due to the current political atmosphere, California has become even more competitive.


Keep an open mind. Not matching in CA won't be the worst thing in the world. I thought it would be, but now I'm convinced that not matching in CA was the best thing that happened to me...and to my family.

Best of luck.

Great advice from someone who's been there.

 

[TheaterOfTheme]

Lol troll level 10/10. However the entertainment value is only 6/10. I did chuckle.

The sad thing is that type of **** is exactly what my school would tell you to some degree. "Residencies don't just want high board scores, they want volunteering and the complete package" --An actual quote justifying our mandatory volunteering hours

 

[alprazoslam]

The sad thing is that type of **** is exactly what my school would tell you to some degree. "Residencies don't just want high board scores, they want volunteering and the complete package" --An actual quote justifying our mandatory volunteering hours

The more I’m on sdn the more I like my school.

Sorta.


Can’t believe they make you volunteer. Not that volunteering is a bad thing but it’s not volunteering if it’s mandantory it’s slavery


Sorta why it’s ugh voluntary


Funny thing is the schools make all the money and don’t seem to do much community good themselves. They are just parasitic bone wizarding towers of injustice


Giant scam

 

[plee]

Hey OP,
1. Do your best on Step and Level
2. Set up audition rotations IN Cali
3. Get good SLOEs
4. Send in residency app within the time period that allows you to be stamped as the first release date.

 

[TheaterOfTheme]

The more I’m on sdn the more I like my school.

Sorta.


Can’t believe they make you volunteer. Not that volunteering is a bad thing but it’s not volunteering if it’s mandantory it’s slavery


Sorta why it’s ugh voluntary


Funny thing is the schools make all the money and don’t seem to do much community good themselves. They are just parasitic bone wizarding towers of injustice


Giant scam

The last statement is the truest. During my second year thus far, I have gone from being indifferent/patronizing toward my school to outright hating it. I honestly can't believe all of the things they get away with at our constant expense. We essentially lost a month of board studying due to OMM and our clinical class due to the exorbitant amount of tests that you must "get greater than a 70 on" or you fail the whole course. It was possible to fail our OMM course with an overall score as high as an 86. We are literally slaving away at OMM and unnecessarily preemptive clinical skills that are assessed by patient actors that couldn't tell you the appendix from the gall bladder. DO schools can go to hell for all I care.

PSA for Premeds reading these threads: Don't go to DO schools and certainly don't go to mine. You're better off waiting 3 years or doing something else entirely--plenty on here told me to wait and I would have been wise to listen. PM me if you need to.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

The last statement is the truest. During my second year thus far, I have gone from being indifferent/patronizing toward my school to outright hating it. I honestly can't believe all of the things they get away with at our constant expense. We essentially lost a month of board studying due to OMM and our clinical class due to the exorbitant amount of tests that you must "get greater than a 70 on" or you fail the whole course. It was possible to fail our OMM course with an overall score as high as an 86. We are literally slaving away at OMM and unnecessarily preemptive clinical skills that are assessed by patient actors that couldn't tell you the appendix from the gall bladder. DO schools can go to hell for all I care.

PSA for Premeds reading these threads: Don't go to DO schools and certainly don't go to mine. You're better off waiting 3 years or doing something else entirely--plenty on here told me to wait and I would have been wise to listen. PM me if you need to.

Man I am sorry this happened. There is a lot of truth to the thought that you don't know till you do. Don't be too hard on yourself. Just do what you have to brother, push through! You can make it. I got through that nonsense and you will too.

 

[Staphylococcus Aureus]

He is right. The consensus on how to stand out and match competitive specialties you won’t find with the cookie cutter hive mind of SDN:

International humanitarian missions
Raising donations online for a cause you are passionate about via gofundme or Facebook
Taking a year off between OMS2 to do a fellowship in OMM or masters in social determinants of health
Student organizations leadership, especially if you are able to get VP or even president
School committees and tours
OMM research
Undergraduate GPA and volunteer work (especially international missions with hands on clinical experience)
Moving to the city your top residency choice during the summer to show connections to the area
Join the democratic party and make your voice heard
Volunteer clinical work with homeless populations during OMS1-3 to show consistency
Attending every lecture to show commitment
Adopting an injured or vulnerable animal
Social media advocacy (especially if you can gain a YouTube or Instagram presence on how to survive as a student doctor)

 

[TheaterOfTheme]

Man I am sorry this happened. There is a lot of truth to the thought that you don't know till you do. Don't be too hard on yourself. Just do what you have to brother, push through! You can make it. I got through that nonsense and you will too.

I sure hope so. You know what's crazy though? I am never seriously worried about failing my systems/science classes. These f***ing extra BS classes like OMM and clinical skills literally threaten you with everything. Idk, maybe it is just my school but I feel that the grading system for these extra classes is highly unethical. Not only do we have to teach ourselves material for boards (something that I have accepted and am OK with), but we are constantly on edge for fear of failure in some stupid class where a patient actor might just dislike you. After a month of exams like this, I honestly want to just say **** it--whats the point of medical school if you don't even get to learn medicine? I would f***ing kill to get a whole day to spend reading Robbins pathology or doing question banks at this point.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

I sure hope so. You know what's crazy though? I am never seriously worried about failing my systems/science classes. These f***ing extra BS classes like OMM and clinical skills literally threaten you with everything. Idk, maybe it is just my school but I feel that the grading system for these extra classes is highly unethical. Not only do we have to teach ourselves material for boards (something that I have accepted and am OK with), but we are constantly on edge for fear of failure in some stupid class where a patient actor might just dislike you. After a month of exams like this, I honestly want to just say **** it--whats the point of medical school if you don't even get to learn medicine? I would f***ing kill to get a whole day to spend reading Robbins pathology or doing question banks at this point.

Trust me I felt the same way with my school, its why we try and warn the premeds who thrn proceed to tellus how we are just 'jaded' or rude. For me it even got so bad I had to use SSRIs before boards for a couple months cause everything was agitating me to the point where it was difficult to study. The clinical course was driving me insane with thier nonsense. I mean a new manadatory activity and quiz was being added every week in the 4th semester. So yeah I get it. You can do this, get help if you have to, you can't control your school, but you can help yourself. Whether thats counseling, meds, working out, whatever, just doing something will help give you at least something to control thats positive. I know I felt better after I even went to the physician because I knew I was doing what I could to get thru the hell that was happening to me.

 

[TheaterOfTheme]

Trust me I felt the same way with my school, its why we try and warn the premeds who thrn proceed to tellus how we are just 'jaded' or rude. For me it even got so bad I had to use SSRIs before boards for a couple months cause everything was agitating me to the point where it was difficult to study. The clinical course was driving me insane with thier nonsense. I mean a new manadatory activity and quiz was being added every week in the 4th semester. So yeah I get it. You can do this, get help if you have to, you can't control your school, but you can help yourself. Whether thats counseling, meds, working out, whatever, just doing something will help give you at least something to control thats positive. I know I felt better after I even went to the physician because I knew I was doing what I could to get thru the hell that was happening to me.

I definitely appreciate the advice. In addition, we should be telling first year DO students to start board studying/zanki ASAP. I've come to realize that once you adjust to medical school, its never too early to start.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

I definitely appreciate the advice. In addition, we should be telling first year DO students to start board studying/zanki ASAP. I've come to realize that once you adjust to medical school, its never too early to start.

I agree, anki is the main reason I made it. I keep telling my second year friends to do at least a couple questions a day, but they are telling me they are just trying to survive and I totally get that. It only takes one crap class and suddenly you have to dedicate extra effort just to make sure you pass something that should be a gimme. It seems to be a near universal issue at COMs.

The problem is once you get off your prep schedule it starts becoming very difficult to get back on somethimes. I was doing great till Nov of my 3rd semester and then suddenly everything had to go on the backburner while I took care of a bad class. Then 4th semester my already bad clinical course kicked into overdrive. I wasn't able to get back in the flow till april and when I finally took another practice exam my score actually dropped, which was scary. I had to go crazy to make it up.

You know what to do, just got to do it. Grind baby, grind for that win. You got to want to succeed more then sleep. Cause thats where the extra time has to come from. Not saying you shouldn't have a rest day, but rather that you need to working your butt off if you do. Cant be sleeping 8, 9 hours a night if you gonna take a day off. Residency with all its sleep deprivation is coming, prove yourself worthy.

 

[LutGholein]

He is right. The consensus on how to stand out and match competitive specialties you won’t find with the cookie cutter hive mind of SDN:

International humanitarian missions
Raising donations online for a cause you are passionate about via gofundme or Facebook
Taking a year off between OMS2 to do a fellowship in OMM or masters in social determinants of health
Student organizations leadership, especially if you are able to get VP or even president
School committees and tours
OMM research
Undergraduate GPA and volunteer work (especially international missions with hands on clinical experience)
Moving to the city your top residency choice during the summer to show connections to the area
Join the democratic party and make your voice heard
Volunteer clinical work with homeless populations during OMS1-3 to show consistency
Attending every lecture to show commitment
Adopting an injured or vulnerable animal
Social media advocacy (especially if you can gain a YouTube or Instagram presence on how to survive as a student doctor)

That list above is absolutely HIGH YIELD. I cannot emphasize this enough.