DO vs masters

[bangtan13]

Is it worth settling for LECOM or trying again with an improved MCAT and ivy masters degree?

A few months back, I interviewed with LECOM. Unfortunately it was the only school who wanted to interview me, so I kept my eye on the school for any updates on my application. After many unanswered emails and vague phone calls, I decided to apply to a bunch of masters programs as a backup. I ended up committing to an ivy and was fully prepared to retake my MCAT next summer and apply to DO schools again during the 2024-2025 cycle. This week I received a call asking if I was still interested in going to the school and if I would be able to put in the deposit immediately upon committing. The second question felt a little fishy and encouraged me to believe some of the negative things I have seen about the school online. I can't seem to find too many opinions on the school however, so does anyone have any direct accounts of what it is like there? The student ambassador I met with seemed to love it but they are the ambassador for a reason. Or would it be worth waiting and trying again?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Goro]

Go with LECOM. You won't delay a year of attending salary.

And even if you reinvent yourself, you'll still need DO on you eventual school list.

 

[MateoGM416]

Guaranteed acceptance at one of the cheapest DO schools versus more debt and a year you're not making an attending's salary. I know it seems like LECOM has problems from stuff you read online but most med schools do. There's also no guarantee that you'll get enough of a significantly better MCAT score or would get in anywhere at all after you graduate.

 

[Goro]

Go with LECOM. You won't delay a year of attending salary.

And even if you reinvent yourself, you'll still need DO on you eventual school list.

 

[Bluesandstuff]

Go to medical school. Stop rolling the dice, you can do much worse than LECOM.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

I always ask the question..." Why would you apply to a medical you don't want to go to? Any school you apply to should be the school you attend if it is your only accptance. Having said that, I also usually recommend attending the cheapest school. If you want to drive 200 mph, you can buy a covette, or a Ferrari at 3 times the price. You still got to 200 mph. Insurance companies pay the same if you are DO or an MD. The IVY would be way more expensive if you get in the Masters and then 4 yrs of med school. Do the math, it's the same as a very nice house. LECOM always has a good match list. The risk of attending he masters program and not getting in would not be worth it to me. Many masters programs only guarantee an interview, not acceptance. I have written LORs for students to Masters programs who had high GPAs from undergrad and could not make the cutoff for med school acceptance. Life is full of choices. Good luck and best wishes.

 

[Sidus1011]

Rolling the dice on gaining an MD acceptance is not worth it. LECOM is established and has a pretty good reputation among PDs, not to mention that they have a good number of residency programs that passed through the transition through ACGME accreditation. As much as it is maligned on the internet, LECOM is fairly good at getting it's students where they need to be - even if draconian policies are still in place.

 

[theoceanman]

Anywhere that is a US MD/DO school, always take the acceptance.

Sure if your only acceptance is a Caribbean or foreign medical school, defintiely take a gap year, but it’s an establish DO school that has cheap tuition on top of it, 100% go for it. If you want to specialize, IM to various sub-specialties exist, and LECOM always sends a few to dermatology, urology, ENT, and a bunch to anesthesiology, radiology, and surgery.

 

[thepoopologist]

Is it worth settling for LECOM or trying again with an improved MCAT and ivy masters degree?

A few months back, I interviewed with LECOM. Unfortunately it was the only school who wanted to interview me, so I kept my eye on the school for any updates on my application. After many unanswered emails and vague phone calls, I decided to apply to a bunch of masters programs as a backup. I ended up committing to an ivy and was fully prepared to retake my MCAT next summer and apply to DO schools again during the 2024-2025 cycle. This week I received a call asking if I was still interested in going to the school and if I would be able to put in the deposit immediately upon committing. The second question felt a little fishy and encouraged me to believe some of the negative things I have seen about the school online. I can't seem to find too many opinions on the school however, so does anyone have any direct accounts of what it is like there? The student ambassador I met with seemed to love it but they are the ambassador for a reason. Or would it be worth waiting and trying again?

I didn't go the master's route, the initial reasons were the separate DO match (this was 2009), the cost of the master's, and the one year attending salary at the end. The primary motivating factor was finishing as soon as possible.

I've seen threads like this where the masters resulted in MD or DO or no acceptance, with the former resulting in failing out of med school or getting a specialty or getting a specialty of their choice. Same without the masters. If the added cost and time results in greater opportunity then go for it. If it simply results in greater cost -including time which is a currency arguably more valuable than money - then don't.

 

[MateoGM416]

I am always amazed by these threads.

Is the poster really serious?

As someone who has recently been in this position where you have to make arguably the most important decision of your life up to that point, it helps to get advice and hear from others what the best option is even if the answer is obvious, especially if you have no pre-med advisor or doctors in your family to guide you.

Instead of being condescending, you could just not click on or reply to the thread at all.

 

[group_theory]

Is it worth settling for LECOM or trying again with an improved MCAT and ivy masters degree?

A few months back, I interviewed with LECOM. Unfortunately it was the only school who wanted to interview me, so I kept my eye on the school for any updates on my application. After many unanswered emails and vague phone calls, I decided to apply to a bunch of masters programs as a backup. I ended up committing to an ivy and was fully prepared to retake my MCAT next summer and apply to DO schools again during the 2024-2025 cycle. This week I received a call asking if I was still interested in going to the school and if I would be able to put in the deposit immediately upon committing. The second question felt a little fishy and encouraged me to believe some of the negative things I have seen about the school online. I can't seem to find too many opinions on the school however, so does anyone have any direct accounts of what it is like there? The student ambassador I met with seemed to love it but they are the ambassador for a reason. Or would it be worth waiting and trying again?

Go with LECOM. You won't delay a year of attending salary.

And even if you reinvent yourself, you'll still need DO on you eventual school list.

At least two year's attending salary. Instead of starting med school Fall 2023, the OP is planning to apply summer 2024 to start Fall 2025.
So instead of Class of 2027, it'll be Class of 2029 at the earliest (if the OP is successful at first retry). Remember that the OP is no longer a first time applicant but considered a reapplicant.

A 1 year master's tuition + interest + cost of living loans + 2 years attending salary - OP is approaching 2/3 - 3/4 million $$$ (cost +opportunity cost) for the chance to get that coveted MD (and that's not taking into account the effects of compounding over time, the net increase in medical school graduates from newly opened DO/MD schools graduating their inaugural classes competing for residencies during those two years that the OP pass up, etc)

That's a lot of stress - to get a near perfect gpa during the masters program (will the program be cutthroat for grades? intense competition?) and get to know the few professors teaching the course (for updated LOR) as well as well as updating/maintaining meaningful healthcare experience, while studying for the MCAT, and also thesis work (if the masters is thesis-based) - to make the 2/3 million dollar (or more) sacrifice worth it

And if the OP do make it to MD school (likely low rank or unranked, since OP is unlikely to get top rank MD given his/her undergrad application failed to get any bites except 1), the OP have to do well and impress for the next 3.5 years in med school (including audition rotations during 4th year) as well if the OP wants a competitive specialty that will make that MD worth passing on the DO + 2/3 million dollars

If the OP fail to get MD on his/her 2nd attempt, but manage to get DO - the OP is back to square one - right here, except having a masters and more loans + lost time + opportunity cost of half million dollars. If the OP doesn't do well in the masters - well, there's a chance he/she leaves empty handed.

And that's before residency (grueling hours and workload) even starts (good luck if you want a competitive fellowship)

 

[Cath Up]

I am a PGY1 and attended a DO school.

DO schools continue to proliferate at quite a clip. LECOM now has 4 campuses, and clinical rotations are increasingly a gamble regarding quality.

I have multiple DO classmates, myself included, who have suffered at the hands of the "DO" behind our name- markedly less competitive for certain specialties and for the most selective residencies in essentially all specialties (which removes entire cities from your rank list). If you are reasonably confident that you don't want to apply to a surgical subspecialty or derm and don't care about matching into a specific city with a big name institution, DO is still reasonable. But if you are strongly considering something competitive, you will LIKELY require either a ton more effort and very strong performance in med school (which is NOT a given- med school is brutal for most people) than essentially any MD to obtain a comparable result. If you want those, in your shoes, I would reapply. The admittedly enormous opportunity cost is worth training where you want in a field you actually want (which you are more liable to not obtain as a DO). Regardless- good luck.

 

[chilly_md]

OP, you shared in a prior post that you have a 3.2 sGPA and a 504 MCAT. Reapplying with some improvements would likely only lead to an acceptance at a different, more expensive DO school (and that is a best case scenario).

 

[Angus Avagadro]

I am a PGY1 and attended a DO school.

DO schools continue to proliferate at quite a clip. LECOM now has 4 campuses, and clinical rotations are increasingly a gamble regarding quality.

I have multiple DO classmates, myself included, who have suffered at the hands of the "DO" behind our name- markedly less competitive for certain specialties and for the most selective residencies in essentially all specialties (which removes entire cities from your rank list). If you are reasonably confident that you don't want to apply to a surgical subspecialty or derm and don't care about matching into a specific city with a big name institution, DO is still reasonable. But if you are strongly considering something competitive, you will LIKELY require either a ton more effort and very strong performance in med school (which is NOT a given- med school is brutal for most people) than essentially any MD to obtain a comparable result. If you want those, in your shoes, I would reapply. The admittedly enormous opportunity cost is worth training where you want in a field you actually want (which you are more liable to not obtain as a DO). Regardless- good luck.

Although, I agree in general that DOs have a harder time matching competitive specialties at big name institutions as you mention, these specialties are also harder for MDs to match. They might match with some lower stats, but your aren't matching these places as an MD with a 23x Step 2 score. With the proliferation of MD and DO schools continuing, these specialties will be even harder to match. If you achieve a 505 Mcat chances are you won't score 265 on Step 2 coming from a lower tier MD school. Med school is a bridge to the specialty you want, it's up to the student how to play the game of making themselves a competitive applicant. Most med schools leave that up to you and do little to help. Lecom and other established schools always have a decent match list. The lower third and those not playing the match game well might have trouble matching their desired specialty

 

[Bluesandstuff]

I am a PGY1 and attended a DO school.

DO schools continue to proliferate at quite a clip. LECOM now has 4 campuses, and clinical rotations are increasingly a gamble regarding quality.

I have multiple DO classmates, myself included, who have suffered at the hands of the "DO" behind our name- markedly less competitive for certain specialties and for the most selective residencies in essentially all specialties (which removes entire cities from your rank list). If you are reasonably confident that you don't want to apply to a surgical subspecialty or derm and don't care about matching into a specific city with a big name institution, DO is still reasonable. But if you are strongly considering something competitive, you will LIKELY require either a ton more effort and very strong performance in med school (which is NOT a given- med school is brutal for most people) than essentially any MD to obtain a comparable result. If you want those, in your shoes, I would reapply. The admittedly enormous opportunity cost is worth training where you want in a field you actually want (which you are more liable to not obtain as a DO). Regardless- good luck.

As a graduated DO, I agree it’s sucks being a DO. BUT if your stats didn’t get you any bites at the MD apple I don’t think a masters is going to be the difference in getting you into something super competitive. I wouldn’t be a doctor at all if I kept trying to be an MD because I simply don’t have what they want.

If you’re open to anything my best advice is leave healthcare and so literally anything else. I have friends driving for UPS are setup to retire by 50 when I’m still paying off my loans. Learn to code and go into tech and make 180,000 base with 100,000 of stock options or go into orthopedic sales or other medical device sales.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

As a graduated DO, I agree it’s sucks being a DO. BUT if your stats didn’t get you any bites at the MD apple I don’t

think a masters is going to be the difference in getting you into something super competitive. I wouldn’t be a doctor at all if I kept trying to be an MD because I simply don’t have what they want.

If you’re open to anything my best advice is leave healthcare and so literally anything else. I have friends driving for UPS are setup to retire by 50 when I’m still paying off my loans. Learn to code and go into tech and make 180,000 base with 100,000 of stock options or go into orthopedic sales or other medical device sales.

Ortho sales makes big bucks. Not for the quality of life types. They basically are married to the orthos they cover. Take vacation when they do, take call when they do, work nights and weekends when they do. But if you are flexible, you can do very well.

 

[DO2015CA]

As a graduated DO, I agree it’s sucks being a DO. BUT if your stats didn’t get you any bites at the MD apple I don’t think a masters is going to be the difference in getting you into something super competitive. I wouldn’t be a doctor at all if I kept trying to be an MD because I simply don’t have what they want.

If you’re open to anything my best advice is leave healthcare and so literally anything else. I have friends driving for UPS are setup to retire by 50 when I’m still paying off my loans. Learn to code and go into tech and make 180,000 base with 100,000 of stock options or go into orthopedic sales or other medical device sales.

Being a doctor sucks lol. Once you’ve matched and are in your specialty, being DO doesn’t suck any more than being an MD imo. Granted I was not stop gated from my desired specialty as a DO and went to my number 1 program in the city I wanted to live

 

[NontradICUdoc]

As a graduated DO, with a subspecialty, I love being a DO. In addition, I have not had a single patient or family ask where I went to medical school, residency, or fellowship. If you are a good doctor, you are a good doctor. You could go to Harvard for medical school, MGH for residency, and Yale for fellowship and still be a Double 0 and be a horrible doctor.

 

[Isoval]

I realize that the OPs question may have been answered already, but I would like to add my opinion to the pile.

Let’s get this straight:
You’re going to turn down an acceptance to medical school to spend more money, waste more time, AND reduce your medical school odds from 100% back to 30-40%?? And that doesn’t even include the cost of application fees this cycle and the subsequent.

Basically, you’re saying you’re willing to piss away tens of thousands of dollars and at least one year to go from a 100% chance of acceptance to a 30-40% chance of acceptance.

This has nothing to do with the MD/DO argument. This is just categorically stupid as s***.

For anyone reading in the future:
1) Apply only when you are very competitive for the schools you are interested in attending.
2) STOP APPLYING TO DO SCHOOLS IF YOU WOULDNT BE OKAY GOING TO A DO SCHOOL.

Ty for coming to my Ted talk.

 

[Dr. Puffs]

Anecdotally I did a masters. 2 of my classmates turned down the DO acceptance to try to get into an MD school. Neither of those classmates are physicians right now and I'm currently interviewing for attending jobs. Also in the real world no one cares if you're a DO.

 

[DocSherman]

Grab the DO acceptance, as others have said. Its a shot at becoming a physician.