DO vs MD - A practicing DO's response

[DD214_DOC]

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Originally posted by drhodz
well said cowboy, jkd seems to be just another dumba#$....ahh, to be 22 and ignorant...this person doesn't need to go into medicine....try computers or something that needs no human interaction....

I can certainly see they attract the people of utmost professionalism. Since all three of you chose to ignore the core of my statement, I'll post it again.

"I think it should be noted that when people consider DOs to be equal to MDs, they are in fact referring to allopathically-trained DO graduates."

I never brought up the issue that osteopathically-trained DOs are crappy doctors, but it's interesting to note that you guys did. Many people can practice medicine competently, even those trained in third-world countries. However, the quality of one's residency does determine what level beyond competency one practices. One need not go to medical school to understand this.

I pointed out that osteopathic-trained DOs are less likely to be considered on equal terms with allopathically-trained physicians, both MD and DO. You guys already agree that DO residencies have less pathology, fewer cases, and poorer quality of equipment .... yet they are equal to allopathic residencies? I don't think so. If they were, then so many DO graduates wouldn't flock to allopathic residencies.

Not to mention not a single one of you is past the MII stage of education, so you really don't have any "inside" knowledge that I lack. Ask some post-graduate DOs why they chose an allopathic residency over an osteopathic one.

 

[Buster Douglas]

Originally posted by JKDMed
I never brought up the issue that osteopathically-trained DOs are crappy doctors, but it's interesting to note that you guys did.

🙄

Originally posted by JKDMed
I would be hesitant to visit an osteopathically-trained DO.

 

[Cowboy DO]

😛 what I wouldn't give to spend a day in your head, it must be like a jungle in there. No offense but if you truly want to be a DO, show some pride in the profession. Its one thing to say that DO residencies could benefit from some restructuring and completely another thing to insinuate that they produce inferior physicians. I have spoken with DO's in the process of choosing residencies and choosing a residency has more to do with location, how you fit in among the staff and how well known the program is (ie more networking opportunities for getting a job later) than the quality of education, which im not saying is unimportant but your going to get a good education wherever you go. Comparing residencies based on the quality of physician they produce would be like splitting hairs on a fruit fly, and in reality is completely impossible to measure.

Sorry I can't stop feeding the trolls, I have all this blue seal troll feed just sitting around

 

[DD214_DOC]

Why go to a physician who was osteopathically trained, whose skills and abilities could be "less than optimum" when you can go to an allopathically-trained DO or an MD whose skills are "more than likely" optimum? When it comes to my health or my life, I'm going to place my bet on a physician who is more than likely better skilled and adept.

Sure, DO residencies may produce some fine physicians, but I'm not going to gamble on this notion with my life.

You still haven't answered my question: why do so many DOs avoid osteopathic residencies if there isn't that much of a difference?

 

[Cowboy DO]

Why go to a physician who was osteopathically trained, whose skills and abilities could be "less than optimum" when you can go to an allopathically-trained DO or an MD whose skills are "more than likely" optimum? When it comes to my health or my life, I'm going to place my bet on a physician who is more than likely better skilled and adept.

Why draw the line at DO residencies, maybe because it?s the easiest arbitrary line to draw? For no apparent reasons you decided not include SUNY programs, Howard, or other arguably less competitive programs that which by your logic ?could? produce ?less than optimum? doctor (whatever that means). So from now on please by all means only go to physicians that did their residencies at JHU, Harvard or Mayo

Sure, DO residencies may produce some fine physicians, but I'm not going to gamble on this notion with my life.

90% of the time when you go to the doctors its not a matter of life or death. And when you do its an emergency physician you see, and you don?t get to pick those. Also I feel having a physician you can completely trust is more important, medicine is not that difficult. A doctor who went to program X is going to treat diabetes the same way as Dr. Y regardless of residency traing. So with that in mind I want the guy who has people skills, and who has an honest vested interest in my well being (something that is not taught in GME).

You still haven't answered my question: why do so many DOs avoid osteopathic residencies if there isn't that much of a difference?

There are only so many osteopathic slots available (an issue in and of itself, which need to be corrected). So its more a matter of: we have no choice but to send some DO?s to AMA programs because we just cant handle them all, than DO avoidance. Also as I mentioned before, AMA programs tend to be more established and thus enhance job prospects after residency.


Check...

 

[DD214_DOC]

"Also as I mentioned before, AMA programs tend to be more established and thus enhance job prospects after residency.
"

Thanks for supporting my argument. 😀

 

[Cowboy DO]

Originally posted by JKDMed
"Also as I mentioned before, AMA programs tend to be more established and thus enhance job prospects after residency.
"

Thanks for supporting my argument. 😀

Actually no. "More established" meaning they have better networks so you can meet more people and name drop, making it easier to get a job you want. Not to imply that you'd have a hard time finding work from an AOA residency. This has absolutely nothing to do with quality of training.


...its like talking to a wall, but then even a wall serves a purpose in that its holding up the ceiling. (sorry I couldn't resist using a SCRUBS quote, love that show)

 

[BigBopper]

Originally posted by bikehorse
That is true, but choosing the DO route will require more effort. I know, for example, that lecture and lab time at osteopathic schools average around 30-35hours! Whereas, MD's are closer to 20-25 hours. Most DOs end up having to study for both the COMLEX and the USMLE, which is no small task.

umm what do you base this statement on? My med school had 35-40 hours class week plus half a day on every other saturday. I have not heard of many allopathic schools with 20-25 hours/week. I am sure there may be some out there but they certainly are not the norm.

BTW nobody is forcing DOs to take the USMLE. They take it because they want to get into allopathic residencies. You don't see any MDs taking the COMLEX.

 

[Cowboy DO]

Originally posted by BigBopper
My med school had 35-40 hours class week plus half a day on every other saturday.

Want a cookie?

 

[Amy B]

Originally posted by BigBopper
BTW nobody is forcing DOs to take the USMLE. They take it because they want to get into allopathic residencies.

Hi,
Actually at my medical school we are forced to take the USML in order to graduate.🙂

 

[funniexannie]

great post 👍

 

[Robz]

Hi,
Actually at my medical school we are forced to take the USML in order to graduate.🙂

We'll since this post got bumped from the nether regions....

I was wondering does you school help pay for the USMLE? Is considered part of the tuition? I am thinking its a double slam as far as test fees go though.


Its ok I am taking the USMLE no matter what so I know I'm gonna pay. I jsut would hate to pay for that ugly step 2 PE twice......ugh

 

[Amy B]

Actually they do pay for the USML as well as the COMLEX. 😀

 

[sophiejane]

Is there anything that VCOM does NOT pay for? Like maybe weekly pedicures? Do they pick your kids up from school and do the laundry too? 🙂

 

[delicatefade]

They should pay for the tests. Ever seen their tuition???

 

[DD214_DOC]

Rock on VCOM. 👍 In my top 5.

 

[BrooklynDO]

You don't see any MDs taking the COMLEX.

two reasons for that...
1. Mds arent allowed to
2. You'd prolly fail, or at least not do as well as you did on the USMLE

please dont take #2 to mean MD's arent as well educated or whatever... Im just saying that an MD student wouldnt be able to cover the OMM component in the amount of time usually relegated to studying for the USMLE. You have to learn something to be able to review it in the time you study for the usmle. While i can review all the biochem and histo that is generally heavier represented on the usmle, an MD students cant review OMM simply because they never learned it the first time.

as for someone saying that they havent heard of many allopathic schools having 25-35 hours of class time a week, id have to say that I have... so should we now start a pissing contest over who heard what from where?

 

[Stroganoff]

Rather than turn this thread into a flame war, maybe a mod could re-post the original letter as a new thread, close the thread, then sticky it?

 

[Drfting Sun]

Does anyone really believe that MD's and DO's have no statistical difference between grades and MCAT's?

I have the ability to keep an open mind, as well as use it to discern. I'd "believe" if I saw the study, not by someone's idle mention of a study never published.

Can you really believe that DO's are not considered inferior in the medical world if it is significantly more difficult for them to get the same residency as an MD?

Significance, if you remember, is a statistics term requiring validation by testing of a null hypothesis. Have you done research? Where is it published that "it is significantly more difficult..."? Secondly, why would a DO want "the same residency as an MD"?

Can you really rely on the opinion of a person who's major premise for their argument is false?😕

No. Honestly, I cannot believe your opinion because the major premise for your argument is false until you produce "signficance."