DO vs MD vs Ireland

[PostBaccEngineer]

Hello all,
I just got an interview request from RCSI in Ireland and as someone who is extremely interested in living there, I am now seriously considering the possibility of attending med school there (if I get accepted).

I got accepted to 2 DO schools and waiting to hear back from 1 MD, and know that most discourage attending Med School in the carribbean, but what about attending medschool in ireland? Are match rates and residencies in the US good? Would you be able to practice anywhere other than NA? If I have to pick between DO and Irish MD, is DO a no brainer?

Thanks!

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[Obnoxious Dad]

Hello all,
I just got an interview request from RCSI in Ireland and as someone who is extremely interested in living there, I am now seriously considering the possibility of attending med school there (if I get accepted).

I got accepted to 2 DO schools and waiting to hear back from 1 MD, and know that most discourage attending Med School in the carribbean, but what about attending medschool in ireland? Are match rates and residencies in the US good? Would you be able to practice anywhere other than NA? If I have to pick between DO and Irish MD, is DO a no brainer?

Thanks!

If you can't have a great time in the Republic of Ireland, you can't have a great time. It's beautiful. The people are great. The food is better than advertised. However, your chances of matching into a US residency would probably be diminished if you go to RCSI. Look at the data:

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting-Outcomes-MD-Seniors-2022_Final.pdf

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting_Outcomes_DO_Seniors_2022_Final-Updated.pdf

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting-Outcomes-IMG-2022_Final.pdf

If you go to a US DO school, I suspect your chances of practicing medicine in Ireland would be zilch. Good luck.

 

[PostBaccEngineer]

If you can't have a great time in the Republic of Ireland, you can't have a great time. It's beautiful. The people are great. The food is better than advertised. However, your chances of matching into a US residency would probably be diminished if you go to RCSI. Look at the data:

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting-Outcomes-MD-Seniors-2022_Final.pdf

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting_Outcomes_DO_Seniors_2022_Final-Updated.pdf

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting-Outcomes-IMG-2022_Final.pdf

If you go to a US DO school, I suspect your chances of practicing medicine in Ireland would be zilch. Good luck.

Thank you so much for the insight! I do hear amazing things about Ireland, and I appreciate the link!

 

[PostBaccEngineer]

If you can't have a great time in the Republic of Ireland, you can't have a great time. It's beautiful. The people are great. The food is better than advertised. However, your chances of matching into a US residency would probably be diminished if you go to RCSI. Look at the data:

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting-Outcomes-MD-Seniors-2022_Final.pdf

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting_Outcomes_DO_Seniors_2022_Final-Updated.pdf

https://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/Charting-Outcomes-IMG-2022_Final.pdf

If you go to a US DO school, I suspect your chances of practicing medicine in Ireland would be zilch. Good luck.

Do you have any insight on match rates, stats comparing Irish to Caribbean stats

 

[LizzyM]

The problem with looking at match rates for International Medical Graduates (IMGs), is that it is like comparing apples, oranges, and pineapples.
The pool includes:
Americans who didn't get in to any US school and went abroad,
Americans who did get into a DO school but chose to do the MD abroad (perhaps a bit more skilled that the first group),
Non-US citizens/permanent residents who went to medical school in their home country (they will need to be sponsored for a visa).

This last group can be divided into new grads and highly experienced physicians who are starting over in the US.

Looking at data from all these groups combined tells you very little about how a new grad who declined a slot at a DO school to go abroad will fare in the match 4 years from now.

You are best off asking the school in Ireland how many matriculated in summer/fall 2017 and, as of March 2022, how many of them matched and in what countries. Also ask how many graduated within 5 years. The school has those figures. If they won't share them, take that information seriously.

 

[PostBaccEngineer]

The problem with looking at match rates for International Medical Graduates (IMGs), is that it is like comparing apples, oranges, and pineapples.
The pool includes:
Americans who didn't get in to any US school and went abroad,
Americans who did get into a DO school but chose to do the MD abroad (perhaps a bit more skilled that the first group),
Non-US citizens/permanent residents who went to medical school in their home country (they will need to be sponsored for a visa).

This last group can be divided into new grads and highly experienced physicians who are starting over in the US.

Looking at data from all these groups combined tells you very little about how a new grad who declined a slot at a DO school to go abroad will fare in the match 4 years from now.

You are best off asking the school in Ireland how many matriculated in summer/fall 2017 and, as of March 2022, how many of them matched and in what countries. Also ask how many graduated within 5 years. The school has those figures. If they won't share them, take that information seriously.

Thank you!

 

[Goro]

If you want to practice medicine in the US, go to a US medical school.

 

[Obnoxious Dad]

The problem with looking at match rates for International Medical Graduates (IMGs), is that it is like comparing apples, oranges, and pineapples.
The pool includes:
Americans who didn't get in to any US school and went abroad,
Americans who did get into a DO school but chose to do the MD abroad (perhaps a bit more skilled that the first group),
Non-US citizens/permanent residents who went to medical school in their home country (they will need to be sponsored for a visa).

This last group can be divided into new grads and highly experienced physicians who are starting over in the US.

Looking at data from all these groups combined tells you very little about how a new grad who declined a slot at a DO school to go abroad will fare in the match 4 years from now.

You are best off asking the school in Ireland how many matriculated in summer/fall 2017 and, as of March 2022, how many of them matched and in what countries. Also ask how many graduated within 5 years. The school has those figures. If they won't share them, take that information seriously.

As usual, LizzyM makes some very good points. However, I would still look at the "charting" data.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

I would also explore how the NHS works in the UK in case you have thoughts of staying there.There are a finite number of Consultant(.Attending) positions. You stay at the Registrar, ( Resident) level until an consultant job opens due to retirement or death. Meaning, you could be a resident for an extra 5 years due to lack of Comsultant openings. Just something to consider while you process all of your options. Good luck and best wishes!

 

[BlackLotus95]

I'm certainly not as experienced here as many others, but I will say I looked into Ireland at one point. From my understanding, the Irish residency matches fall into a few priority categories as well: Irish citizens first, EU citizens next, and then they would look at a US visa holder. This is from the Atlantic Bridge website which you may not be using to get into Irish med school, but they have a lot of info about the process:

"All graduates of Irish medical schools who hold EU Passports and who applied to medical school in Ireland through the CAO (Central Applications Office) are guaranteed an internship post in Ireland. Graduates who hold EU Passports, but did not apply through the CAO, are ranked below those who hold CAO numbers, regardless of their centile ranking in their graduating class. This system was introduced in early-2016.

American and Canadian citizens are eligible to apply for any remaining residency positions but it should be noted that there are very few places available and the application process will be extremely competitive."

So if you did want to stay, not impossible, but a real pain I've heard. Most who stay have strong ties like family or are married to an Irish person. I don't really know which is tougher to get, back in the US for residency or staying in Ireland for residency. But either can put you in a funky position from a competitiveness perspective.

 

[PeteytheFish]

I would also explore how the NHS works in the UK in case you have thoughts of staying there.There are a finite number of Consultant(.Attending) positions. You stay at the Registrar, ( Resident) level until an consultant job opens due to retirement or death. Meaning, you could be a resident for an extra 5 years due to lack of Comsultant openings. Just something to consider while you process all of your options. Good luck and best wishes!

Ireland is not in the UK (you may be thinking about Northern Ireland, which is), so looking into the NHS isn't likely to be helpful for this applicant.

For what it's worth, I have several friends who went to RCSI, successfully matched in the US, and are working as attendings in their chosen field. One of them managed it even with a failed Step 1 on their record. They all went through about ten years ago, so perhaps things have changed, but the Irish programs are generally pretty well regarded here in the US.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

Thanks for the clarification.