Do you think homeopathic medicine works?

[museabuse]

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Many people think homeopathic medicine is just another word for herbal or natural medicine. It is not. When you take herbal medicine it is supposed to work like a drug and preform some action on the body. However homeopathic medicine is completely different.
This is my understanding of it. Let's say you go to a homeopathic dr. They ask u what your symptoms are. They match your symptoms to the same symptoms someone would have if they took too much of some natural substance.. For example your symptoms can be similar to arsenic poisoning. So you would be prescribed 100X arsenic. This mean the dilute arsenic 100 times to untraceable levels. In between each dilution they magically shake the dilution. They then pour the liquid over sugar pellets and that is what u take to get better. If you put the sugar pill in a spectometer or whatever chemical measuring device we used it organic it would say there is only sugar no other substance in the pill. The philosophy is like cures like so to treat an illness you have to give a diluted substance that causes same illness when taking too much.
This is very hard to understand using logic but people swear by it but most people when they buy these products think they're buying a drug like sudafed that has actually been proven to preform an action on the body. These products are Leg Cramps, Oscillococcinum, zicam, Humphreys, and anything made by Similasan or Hylands.
Do you reccomend any of these and when someone asks what it is or how it works what do u say?

 

[Pharmavixen]

Homeopathic remedies get diluted to the point where the levels of "drug" are lower than the background contaminants in the water, or where there's less than one molecule left. It's superstition that costs the British National Health Service millions of dollars a year.

Though it gives neurotic perfectly healthy people something to do rather than bother their PCP.

I liken it to those websites where people do bowel cleanses and post pictures of the results...talk about waaaaay too much free time on your hands.

 

[naseuy]

 

[npage148]

Are you asking if I believe in the placebo effects? Yeah I do.

 

[whyteout]

Last week the owner of an herbal shop downtown came into our OTC class to talk about homeopathic meds. She told us you could give an entire bottle to an infant and it wouldn't have any effect on the kid. What the hell is it supposed to do for adults then?

 

[aboveliquidice]

Homeopathic - placebo effect aside - is completely fabricated. However, the placebo effect has profound implications, and should not be discounted.

 

[museabuse]

Homeopathic - placebo effect aside - is completely fabricated. However, the placebo effect has profound implications, and should not be discounted.

But should these companies make tons of money off the placebo effect? The 10.99 earache relief and pink eye relief by Similasan flies off the shelves at my store and the customers buying it have no idea that they are buying liquid with nothing in it. They think they are actually buying pain medication and antibiotics. Seems very wrong to me. How does the placebo effect work on a 1 or 2 year old?

 

[Pharmavixen]

Some healthy people feel compelled to medicate themselves and it's better they do it with something that does no harm, IMO.

Homeopathic remedies also cut down on antibiotic abuse when people with colds take them instead of running to their PCP, who in the interest of practising defensive medicine will prescribe an antibiotic.

 

[slimcutt]

I find Zicam swabs work wonderfully at eradicating my sense of smell.

 

[aboveliquidice]

How does the placebo effect work on a 1 or 2 year old?

It doesn't - In the very same way it doesn't work for a patient in a coma.

Don't you worry about the legit pharmacy businesses though - after those "alternative" remedies fail - patients will eventually turn to real medicine.

 

[Praziquantel86]

It doesn't - In the very same way it doesn't work for a patient in a coma.

I disagree. You've never put a Band-Aid on a three year-old kid with a bruise and seen them magically stop hurting? It couldn't have really done anything, but the power of suggestion works wonders in the younger crowd.

 

[Carboxide]

I disagree. You've never put a Band-Aid on a three year-old kid with a bruise and seen them magically stop hurting? It couldn't have really done anything, but the power of suggestion works wonders in the younger crowd.

Yes, on someone old enough to be conditioned into believing (and old enough to understand the concept) that a band-aid or a gross tasting liquid will make you feel better. Also... a bruise is difference from an ear infection. One is persistent, one probably doesn't really hurt, but it just surprised the kid.

I don't have much experience with kids, but I imagine a 1 year old doesn't have enough verbal and mental capacity to believe or not believe in medicine.

 

[pharmplz11]

But should these companies make tons of money off the placebo effect? The 10.99 earache relief and pink eye relief by Similasan flies off the shelves at my store and the customers buying it have no idea that they are buying liquid with nothing in it. They think they are actually buying pain medication and antibiotics. Seems very wrong to me. How does the placebo effect work on a 1 or 2 year old?

I think the similasan ear ache/ pink eye relief is probably a bunch of bull but man some of those parents swear by it. I mean if they give their kid the pink eye relief and the pink eye goes away, who's to say it didn't help? I'd rather take some cheap gentamycin or something but the homeopathic stuff has to be doing something or people wouldn't buy more. Right?

 

[Farmercyst]

Yes, on someone old enough to be conditioned into believing (and old enough to understand the concept) that a band-aid or a gross tasting liquid will make you feel better. Also... a bruise is difference from an ear infection. One is persistent, one probably doesn't really hurt, but it just surprised the kid.

I don't have much experience with kids, but I imagine a 1 year old doesn't have enough verbal and mental capacity to believe or not believe in medicine.

I guarantee my 2 year-old does.
Two seconds with an ice-pack and he's good as new. The biggest problem is when they have something that actually needs medicine, they're then conditioned to ask for it. So after cold and flu season, every little ache and pain "needs" medicine. It's kind of sad. When we tell our 4 year old that "coughing medicine" is just for coughs, she'll start to cough and says, but "I am coughing."

 

[metrarx]

....

 

[PharmDstudent]

Doesn't some of that earache OTC medicine have belladonna in it? It could work, I guess.

"Belladonna is known to contain active agents with anticholinergic properties, such as the tropane alkaloids atropine, hyoscine (scopolamine), and hyoscyamine. There are few available studies of belladonna alone for any indication. Most research has evaluated belladonna in combination with other agents, such as ergot alkaloids or barbiturates, or in homeopathic (diluted) preparations. Preliminary evidence suggests possible efficacy in combination with barbiturates for the management of symptoms associated with irritable bowel syndrome. However, there is currently insufficient scientific evidence regarding the use of belladonna for this or any other indication." -
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/druginfo/natural/patient-belladonna.html

 

[metrarx]

....

 

[museabuse]

Doesn't some of that earache OTC medicine have belladonna in it? It could work, I guess.

you missed the whole point. It may say belladonna but it is diluted to a point where there is no traceable evidence of belladonna. So tell me how it works? You just confirmed my point that people have no idea what what they are buying, and they think they are buying medicine with active ingredients that actually do something to the body but in reality they are buying water, hopefully sterile.

 

[FarscapeGirl]

Here's a really good post on homeopathy from a Canadian pharmacist:

http://sciencebasedpharmacy.wordpress.com/2009/01/31/the-cognitive-dissonance-of-homeopathy/

Since homeopathy is just water, it has no positive or negative effects. If anyone thinks a true homeopathic remedy works, it's just because of the placebo effect.

 

[CopToEM]

Just saw the Zicam article in the newspaper today... terrible.

 

[PharmDstudent]

you missed the whole point. It may say belladonna but it is diluted to a point where there is no traceable evidence of belladonna. So tell me how it works? You just confirmed my point that people have no idea what what they are buying, and they think they are buying medicine with active ingredients that actually do something to the body but in reality they are buying water, hopefully sterile.

No. I didn't miss the point at all. My point is that it COULD work, but no one can say for sure, which means that even if it doesn't work at all, the lack of evidence won't stop people from using it and may even tempt them to try it... because it COULD work.

Septic ooze in a capsule could be the latest thing for wrinkles, but as of right now, no one knows if septic ooze does anything for wrinkles.

Do you get my point? Maybe you missed it? 😉




It's late. Can I go back to sleep now? 😴

 

[museabuse]

It's late. Can I go back to sleep now? 😴

no.

 

[PharmDstudent]

no.

😛
You know, I soooo didn't go back to sleep. I went for a walk instead and have been awake since. I'm going for another walk soon, just no runs today since I'm "resting", but then maybe I'll be able to go to sleep after that.

 

[FarscapeGirl]

No. I didn't miss the point at all. My point is that it COULD work, but no one can say for sure, which means that even if it doesn't work at all, the lack of evidence won't stop people from using it and may even tempt them to try it... because it COULD work.

Septic ooze in a capsule could be the latest thing for wrinkles, but as of right now, no one knows if septic ooze does anything for wrinkles.

Do you get my point? Maybe you missed it? 😉




It's late. Can I go back to sleep now? 😴

But homeopathy has been shown over and over to not work, beyond maybe the placebo effect. It violates the whole idea of "the dose makes the poison." Read the article I posted from the Canadian pharmacist.

We take drugs based on how long they stay in body, their effective dose, etc. But homeopathic remedies are diluted so much that it's nothing but water. There isn't even a single molecule of the compound in most preps. The idea there is that the water "remembers" from being in contact with the compound. Most drugs are given different dosing instructions, but nearly all homeopathic 'drugs' are to be taken every 8 hours.

Accupuncture also most likely also only works through the placebo effect, even for pain. Part of me thinks that as long as people feel better, whatever they use is okay. However, they're also being taken advantage of, they may be taking woo instead of getting proper treatment, and they're spending a lot of money for junk that may prevent them from then spending money on proper treatment or other things that could be truly keeping them healthy.

 

[Old Timer]

Do you think homeopathic medicine works?

About as well as OBECALP.