Does Loma Linda discriminate based on Federal Protected Classes?

[SKaminski]

---

Members don't see this ad.

As many of you undoubtable know, Loma Linda University is a private, Seventh Day Adventist university located in Southern California.

As many of are also likely to know, the Federal Government protects certain Classes from being discriminated upon, including:

Race – Federal: Civil Rights Act of 1964
Color – Federal: Civil Rights Act of 1964
Religion – Federal: Civil Rights Act of 1964
National origin – Federal: Civil Rights Act of 1964
Age (40 and over) – Federal: Age Discrimination in Employment Act of 1967
Sex – Federal: Equal Pay Act of 1963 & Civil Rights Act of 1964
Genetic information – Federal: Genetic Information Nondiscrimination Act

For example, you can not say somebody can not eat at your establishment just because they're black. Similarly, you can not offer raised pricing to somebody because of their Class, either.

I will be applying to med school in the coming cycle, and was looking at Loma Linda Universities Secondary Essay Questions:

Discuss how your spiritual experience has influenced your life and how you integrate it into your daily life. (750 characters max)

What experiences in your life would illustrate your perspective on service to others? (750 characters max)

As a Christian educational institution the medical curriculum integrates spiritual, ethical, and relational issues from a Christian perspective into the practice of medicine. Weekly chapel services and religion courses are part of this program. Please respond to the above as it relates to your personal educational and career goals. (750 characters max)

Loma Linda University is a Seventh-day Adventist institution that has lifestyle expectations that include abstinence from alcohol, tobacco and illicit drugs/substances in all forms. In the past year, have you used any of these substances? If so, which one(s)? (250 characters max)

If accepted to LLUSM, are you willing to abide by the lifestyle policies of Loma Linda University School of Medicine? (250 characters max))

Myself being a passionate anti-theist found this to be outrageous.

A real quick headsup: I am not saying that I want to attend this Medical School I am stating that this school is (openly?) discriminating against other regions.

Firstly, the requirement that you abstain from Alcohol is infringement on the expression of religion of ANY other christian organization, as they drink the "blood of christ" which is wine.... and that's alcoholic.

Secondly, Rastafarian's have been recognized in US courts (multiple times) as having the right to smoke marijuana.

Thirdly, without expanding on the idea of 'spirituality', they are potentially infringing on anybody who is an atheist (atheists are a protected class).

Fourth, they recommend a letter from a pastor. By favoring letters from pastors, it can easily be conceived that they are discriminating on individuals who do not have letters from pastors, and thus those who are not religious.

How have they not been sued yet? How is this legal? Are they opening themselves open to legal action? They state that attending church is part of their 'program'. This has to be lawsuit worthy.

 

[MedPR]

As many of you undoubtable know, Loma Linda University is a private, Seventh Day Adventist university located in Southern California.

As many of are also likely to know, the Federal Government protects certain Classes from being discriminated upon, including:


For example, you can not say somebody can not eat at your establishment just because they're black. Similarly, you can not offer raised pricing to somebody because of their Class, either.

I will be applying to med school in the coming cycle, and was looking at Loma Linda Universities Secondary Essay Questions:


Myself being a passionate anti-theist found this to be outrageous.

A real quick headsup: I am not saying that I want to attend this Medical School I am stating that this school is (openly?) discriminating against other regions.

Firstly, the requirement that you abstain from Alcohol is infringement on the expression of religion of ANY other christian organization, as they drink the "blood of christ" which is wine.... and that's alcoholic.

Secondly, Rastafarian's have been recognized in US courts (multiple times) as having the right to smoke marijuana.

Thirdly, without expanding on the idea of 'spirituality', they are potentially infringing on anybody who is an atheist (atheists are a protected class).

Fourth, they recommend a letter from a pastor. By favoring letters from pastors, it can easily be conceived that they are discriminating on individuals who do not have letters from pastors, and thus those who are not religious.

How have they not been sued yet? How is this legal? Are they opening themselves open to legal action? They state that attending church is part of their 'program'. This has to be lawsuit worthy.

Ugh.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using SDN Mobile

 

[sinombre]

Should medical school admissions committees discriminate against applicants with lower scores?

Don't apply to Loma Linda if you're a "passionate" atheist. You would be miserable there.

 

[Goobs]

Ugh.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using SDN Mobile

Every year 🙄

 

[MedPR]

Every year 🙄

In less than 24 hours (I think) there's been an anti-URM thread, a thread saying that LOR requirements discriminate against introverts, and now this.

 

[TangoDown]

In less than 24 hours (I think) there's been an anti-URM thread, a thread saying that LOR requirements discriminate against introverts, and now this.

I think Med School needs to tone down the workload and maybe make classes part time. Reason being, the astronomical workload discriminates against work-allergic people like me.

I think that's protected under the constitution. 1st Amendment, or maybe 5th...

 

[Goobs]

Just fyi

http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Court-says-private-school-can-expel-lesbians-3253151.php

Read it and apply it to the situation you're talking about OP.

 

[CrimsonKing]

Tirade of militant atheist who wants his views respected but refuses to respect the views oa a private, religious institution.

Private program, brah. Why do you give a damn?

This may shock you, but religious institutions are allowed to discriminate, especially if they word things nicely.

They aren't saying "Jews, Muslims, and Atheists are forbidden from attending our school." They are saying that they have a code of conduct (every school does) and they are asking secondary questions to see how well you would fit in their school.

Get over it.

If this was a public institution, I would be more on your side.

 

[MedPR]

I think Med School needs to tone down the workload and maybe make classes part time. Reason being, the astronomical workload discriminates against work-allergic people like me.

I think that's protected under the constitution. 1st Amendment, or maybe 5th...

Agreed.

 

[touchpause13]

OP should try looking at the code of conduct at Bob Jones university/Liberity or BYU for ****s and giggles. makes this stuff look like a frat party.

 

[phranklee]

The Civil Rights Act of 1964 prohibits discrimination in all public schools and in any school receiving federal funds, not in private schools. As you mentioned in your post, Loma Linda is a private school.

 

[theherowedeserv]

is it a troll?

 

[sinombre]

is it a troll?

I don't think the OP is a troll. I think Californians are just genuinely upset when they discover that they can't really apply to one of the medical schools in their state. I'm still kinda bummed that I may have to leave CA this year.

 

[Akali]

Yeah...that's the only Cali school I didn't apply to.

I imagine they're just a bunch of crazies I would not like at that school.

I agree it's stupid what they do, but the way I see it, at least it'll draw some of those kinds of people over there instead of where I am lol

 

[LaughingMan]

I actually like this.

Wasn't planning on applying there but probably will now.

Only substance I take would be caffeine (I drink 6 cups of Oolong Tea a day).

Wonder how they would feel about a Muslim applying.

 

[MedPR]

Yeah...that's the only Cali school I didn't apply to.

I imagine they're just a bunch of crazies I would not like at that school.

I agree it's stupid what they do, but the way I see it, at least it'll draw some of those kinds of people over there instead of where I am lol

Intolerance running rampant on sdn lately.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using SDN Mobile

 

[touchpause13]

I'm sure there are religious people who go to Loma who aren't fundamentalists...and even if they are, that doesn't necessarily mean they are crazy.

Look, I'm an atheist, but I try to have an open mind about xtians. For example, my dad grew up in the assembly of god church, as a PK, and went to college at a place like Liberty U, but he experienced the world and found that a lot of things that he had learned in the church didn't make sense for his life (like bans on dancing, movies, secular music, etc). Years and years later when I came out, he was one of my biggest supporters. Basically, you gotta take people where they are at, i mean, i like to make jokes, but it really doesn't bother me that those schools exist.

 

[sector9]

As many of you undoubtable know, Loma Linda University is a private, Seventh Day Adventist university located in Southern California.

Your first sentence answers the rest of your tirade. They're a private university.

 

[487806]

Your first sentence answers the rest of your tirade. They're a private university.

👍

 

[Shockwave456]

Basically it has to do with the freedom of association, which refers to the right of private organizations to collaborate with other individuals and express common interests and work toward a shared goal.

You might want to read about Boy Scouts of America v. Dale (2000). Note that this was a 5-4 decision, and that the freedom of association is not absolute. Some courts have rejected the concept when an individual would not significantly impair the organization's ability to pursue its primary objective.

 

[Shockwave456]

I'm sure there are religious people who go to Loma who aren't fundamentalists...and even if they are, that doesn't necessarily mean they are crazy.

Look, I'm an atheist, but I try to have an open mind about xtians. For example, my dad grew up in the assembly of god church, as a PK, and went to college at a place like Liberty U, but he experienced the world and found that a lot of things that he had learned in the church didn't make sense for his life (like bans on dancing, movies, secular music, etc). Years and years later when I came out, he was one of my biggest supporters. Basically, you gotta take people where they are at, i mean, i like to make jokes, but it really doesn't bother me that those schools exist.

👍

Now, if a public university if ever tried to pull this, well, the s***'s gonna hit the fan.

 

[qwerty89]

But you have to keep in mind that the number of medical schools is tightly controlled (unlike for undergrad and possibly law schools) and therefore the fact that LLUSM exists will effect the development of other schools.

Even if you had a billion dollars and wanted to open a medical school next door you can't (or at least would find it VERY difficult to do so). People would say "Hey why do we need another medical school here when we already got LLUSM which produces X number of grads each year with y number eventually practicing in the local area...we don't need any more". So if the school's admissions policy favors one group over the other then the group that is not favored does not have any alternatives.

On the other hand if we were talking about a private catholic college that followed strict catholic rules (required mass attendance, confession, etc) that would NOT be discriminatory because nothing would stop (in theory at least) somebody from establishing another private school nearby that was entirely secular, or protestant, or muslim, etc.

 

[impact2d]

Also they have identified other religions represented in their student body, including Muslim. As with most organized groups, it is the loud mouths on the fringe that make the rest look bad. My dad is a pastor and I'm a lifelong Christian, and yet I'm not a young earth creationist (although I do believe in some forms of intelligent design, which even some atheists embrace on some level). My friends are normal people. We like to avoid swearing to much, getting plastered, etc but we are not judgemental loudmouth claiming sandy hook happened because we took prayer out of schools. Do I think my beliefs are right, sure? Do I believe you are entitled to yours? Most definitely. I think having one sectarian school in the us is great. If you grew up around a certain lifestyle and feel your education would be enriched by experiencing that lifestyle in med school, go for it. If not, apply elsewhere and no one will hassle you for NOT applying. To me complaining that a private school is faith based is akin to the fundies that complain public school is non sectarian.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using SDN Mobile

 

[NickNaylor]

I'm sure there are religious people who go to Loma who aren't fundamentalists...and even if they are, that doesn't necessarily mean they are crazy.

Look, I'm an atheist, but I try to have an open mind about xtians. For example, my dad grew up in the assembly of god church, as a PK, and went to college at a place like Liberty U, but he experienced the world and found that a lot of things that he had learned in the church didn't make sense for his life (like bans on dancing, movies, secular music, etc). Years and years later when I came out, he was one of my biggest supporters. Basically, you gotta take people where they are at, i mean, i like to make jokes, but it really doesn't bother me that those schools exist.

Yeah, seriously. OP sounds like one of those people that gets butthurt about Christmas decorations being put up by municipalities. Get over it and let people do their thing. Why would you even want to go to that school if you're so openly hostile to their culture?

(sent from my phone)

 

[Ashley1989]

As many of you undoubtable know, Loma Linda University is a private, Seventh Day Adventist university located in Southern California.

As many of are also likely to know, the Federal Government protects certain Classes from being discriminated upon, including:


For example, you can not say somebody can not eat at your establishment just because they're black. Similarly, you can not offer raised pricing to somebody because of their Class, either.

I will be applying to med school in the coming cycle, and was looking at Loma Linda Universities Secondary Essay Questions:


Myself being a passionate anti-theist found this to be outrageous.

A real quick headsup: I am not saying that I want to attend this Medical School I am stating that this school is (openly?) discriminating against other regions.

Firstly, the requirement that you abstain from Alcohol is infringement on the expression of religion of ANY other christian organization, as they drink the "blood of christ" which is wine.... and that's alcoholic.

Secondly, Rastafarian's have been recognized in US courts (multiple times) as having the right to smoke marijuana.

Thirdly, without expanding on the idea of 'spirituality', they are potentially infringing on anybody who is an atheist (atheists are a protected class).

Fourth, they recommend a letter from a pastor. By favoring letters from pastors, it can easily be conceived that they are discriminating on individuals who do not have letters from pastors, and thus those who are not religious.

How have they not been sued yet? How is this legal? Are they opening themselves open to legal action? They state that attending church is part of their 'program'. This has to be lawsuit worthy.

They're a private university so they are allowed to do that. On their website, they openly state that they give preference to Seventh Day Adventists, but that they do set aside a number of spots each year for non-Seventh Day Adventists.

The reasons for this are:
#1 they have their mission and would like students whose goals fit to help further that mission.
#2 it's a school founded and funded independently by the Seventh Day Adventist church, therefore it's a school primarily for the Seventh Day Adventist church. It's important that Seventh Day Adventists who would like to become doctors have a place to go to school that is in a community who shares and supports their faith. Many of their students are people who have been in the faith their entire lives, and a good portion of them attended a private Seventh Day Adventist undergrad. They therefore would do best in a medical school that is also a Seventh Day Adventist institution, and a decent number of students in their class have known each other previously because of growing up in the community. This of course isn't everyone, they have students from around the world and have a very religiously (and non religiously) diverse class.
#3 At Loma Linda they have a Christ-centered curriculum, so choosing candidates that are comfortable with that is paramount for that student's happiness and well being in addition to that of the rest of the class.
And lastly #4 if you're a diehard non-thiest, then just don't apply there and move along. There really isn't a need to get upset about it because its perfectly legal and does make sense when you think about it. If you're this upset reading about the place then you obviously wouldn't be happy there anyways.

 

[notbobtrustme]

Wonder how they would feel about a Muslim applying.

According to Mormon doctrine, only those brown people born after 1979 have souls. That's why they are allowed in the church now and not before.

 

[Ashley1989]

According to Mormon doctrine, only those brown people born after 1979 have souls. That's why they are allowed in the church now and not before.

They're Seventh Day Adventist, not Mormon.

 

[touchpause13]

Yeah, seriously. OP sounds like one of those people that gets butthurt about Christmas decorations being put up by municipalities. Get over it and let people do their thing. Why would you even want to go to that school if you're so openly hostile to their culture?

(sent from my phone)

Ugh I've never understood that. Everytime I hear about an atheist doing that i just want to call them up and tell them to stop it, seriously your making the rest of us look bad. The nativity thing makes more sense to me, but seriously leave the xmas tree/decorations alone

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

 

[Ashley1989]

I don't think the OP is a troll. I think Californians are just genuinely upset when they discover that they can't really apply to one of the medical schools in their state. I'm still kinda bummed that I may have to leave CA this year.

You have a good point but on the flip side I know many Seventh Day Adventists who only apply to LLU. Having a Christ centered education is so important to them that they decide to only apply to one medical school. We both know how difficult applying to only one medical school would be. Yes, it's their choice, but it's that important to them. In that light it would be understandable why they would give preference to SDAs.

 

[487806]

Yeah, seriously. OP sounds like one of those people that gets butthurt about Christmas decorations being put up by municipalities. Get over it and let people do their thing. Why would you even want to go to that school if you're so openly hostile to their culture?

(sent from my phone)

Ugh I've never understood that. Everytime I hear about an atheist doing that i just want to call them up and tell them to stop it, seriously your making the rest of us look bad. The nativity thing makes more sense to me, but seriously leave the xmas tree/decorations alone

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

It's a double standard. Initially, the atheists were a minority who essentially demanded equal rights. When they got them, they used them to suppress the rights of the majority. Not generalizing, but this happens quite often especially in politically correct societies

 

[touchpause13]

It's a double standard. Initially, the atheists were a minority who essentially demanded equal rights. When they got them, they used them to suppress the rights of the majority. Not generalizing, but this happens quite often especially in politically correct societies

You think the US is a politically correct society?
🤣
That's adorable

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

 

[487806]

You think the US is a politically correct society?
🤣
That's adorable

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

😳 why not? We are restricted from saying anything without offending someone.

 

[touchpause13]

😳 why not? We are restricted from saying anything without offending someone.

Restricted by whom exactly?
You have the right to say anything offensive.
I also have the right to comment on something I find offense and say it's offensive.

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

 

[OCDOCDOCD]

OP, I'm an atheist and I facepalmed while reading that. Who cares that there's religious schools out there? If seventh-day Adventists want to have their own private med school, let them. It's not like it's being supported by taxpayer money. If you don't like the school, don't go. As an athiest I won't be applying to any religious schools because I know that even if I did get accepted I would be miserable at those places. Considering that the vast majority of med schools in the US are secular though (or religiously affiliated on paper only, like Emory) I hardly feel limited in my choices as a result of having to cross a few schools off my list.

😳 why not? We are restricted from saying anything without offending someone.

You still have the right to say whatever you want as long as it isn't a call for violence. What you don't have is the right to be immune from society's judgement of you.

 

[touchpause13]

OP, I'm an atheist and I facepalmed while reading that. Who cares that there's religious schools out there? If seventh-day Adventists want to have their own private med school, let them. It's not like it's being supported by taxpayer money. If you don't like the school, don't go. As an athiest I won't be applying to any religious schools because I know that even if I did get accepted I would be miserable at those places. Considering that the vast majority of med schools in the US are secular though (or religiously affiliated on paper only, like Emory) I hardly feel limited in my choices as a result of having to cross a few schools off my list.



You still have the right to say whatever you want as long as it isn't a call for violence. What you don't have is the right to be immune from society's judgement of you.

+1

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

 

[Shockwave456]

It's a double standard. Initially, the atheists were a minority who essentially demanded equal rights. When they got them, they used them to suppress the rights of the majority. Not generalizing, but this happens quite often especially in politically correct societies

😕 That's a pretty sweeping generalization you just made. Could you give an example of any significant group of atheists trying to suppress the rights of the majority?

 

[487806]

Restricted by whom exactly?
You have the right to say anything offensive.
I also have the right to comment on something I find offense and say it's offensive.

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

You still have the right to say whatever you want as long as it isn't a call for violence. What you don't have is the right to be immune from society's judgement of you.

Yeah right. Say whatever you want and someone will get oversensitive and report it to the police department and news media. The point is... we have too many oversensitive people (OP is a good example) in general.

😕 That's a pretty sweeping generalization you just made. Could you give an example of any significant group of atheists trying to suppress the rights of the majority?

Since the topic was on atheists and Christians, I just generalized it to make a point. Don't take it literally.

 

[Ashley1989]

😕 That's a pretty sweeping generalization you just made. Could you give an example of any significant group of atheists trying to suppress the rights of the majority?

It can't happen right now because its very difficult for a minority to suppress the rights of a majority in the type of system we have set up in the US today. With that being said, I've seen enough religion bashing/hating atheists to feel certain that if some actually were in the majority, they would suppress the rights of religious people.

 

[OCDOCDOCD]

Yeah right. Say whatever you want and someone will get oversensitive and report it to the police department and news media. The point is... we have too many oversensitive people (OP is a good example) in general.

Sounds to me like you've been watching too much Fox News. That or you have a viewpoint that most people find very disagreeable and you're one of those people who thinks that society's hatred of bigots is just everyone being "oversensitive".

 

[touchpause13]

Yeah right. Say whatever you want and someone will get oversensitive and report it to the police department and news media. The point is... we have too many oversensitive people (OP is a good example) in general.



Since the topic was on atheists and Christians, I just generalized it to make a point. Don't take it literally.

Soooo are you going to offer up any kind of evidence or just continue to spew a bunch of bull****?

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

 

[Shockwave456]

Since the topic was on atheists and Christians, I just generalized it to make a point. Don't take it literally.

As opposed to metaphorically? You stated this event as a matter of fact (in the past tense).

 

[Ashley1989]

Soooo are you going to offer up any kind of evidence or just continue to spew a bunch of bull****?

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

I fail to see what is wrong with what Agent posted aside from simply posting their opinion. Why do you and OCD have to attack them for it? The fact that they can't even express their opinion without people jumping all over it helps aid in their point that we are too over sensitive these days

 

[Shockwave456]

Yeah right. Say whatever you want and someone will get oversensitive and report it to the police department and news media. The point is... we have too many oversensitive people (OP is a good example) in general.

Could you list some examples of these "oversensitive people?"

 

[Shockwave456]

I fail to see what is wrong with what Agent posted aside from simply posting their opinion. Why do you and OCD have to attack them for it? The fact that they can't even express their opinion without people jumping all over it helps aid in their point that we are too over sensitive these days

If you post an opinion, be prepared to get a response. Why would you even post something if you did not want others to read it and react to it?

 

[OCDOCDOCD]

I fail to see what is wrong with what Agent posted aside from simply posting their opinion. Why do you and OCD have to attack them for it? The fact that they can't even express their opinion without people jumping all over it helps aid in their point that we are too over sensitive these days

I wasn't aware that calling someone out on an unfounded accusation counts as "attacking" them.

 

[touchpause13]

I fail to see what is wrong with what Agent posted aside from simply posting their opinion. Why do you and OCD have to attack them for it? The fact that they can't even express their opinion without people jumping all over it helps aid in their point that we are too over sensitive these days

I fail to see how "over senstivity" is a net negative.
Also I'm not sure how disagreeing = attacking.

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

 

[487806]

Sounds to me like you've been watching too much Fox News. That or you have a viewpoint that most people find very disagreeable and you're one of those people who thinks that society's hatred of bigots is just everyone being "oversensitive".

Soooo are you going to offer up any kind of evidence or just continue to spew a bunch of bull****?

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

Could you list some examples of these "oversensitive people?"

Yahoo, NBC and Fox News all provide valid evidence to this claim.

As opposed to metaphorically? You stated this event as a matter of fact (in the past tense).

Yep. The main point is yielding excessively to the minority will cause the minority to become the majority and to suppress the powers of the previous majority in a stateless society. Basically, it's the main reason why anarchism is flawed.

 

[touchpause13]

I've seen enough religion bashing/hating atheists to feel certain that if some actually were in the majority, they would suppress the rights of religious people.

I resent this generalization

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

 

[touchpause13]

Yahoo, NBC and Fox News all provide valid evidence to this claim.

Please enlighten us

Sent from my SCH-I405 using SDN Mobile

 

[487806]

QUOTE=Ashley1989;13643962]I fail to see what is wrong with what Agent posted aside from simply posting their opinion. Why do you and OCD have to attack them for it? The fact that they can't even express their opinion without people jumping all over it helps aid in their point that we are too over sensitive these days[/QUOTE]

👍

I wasn't aware that calling someone out on an unfounded accusation counts as "attacking" them.

It's not unfounded. I think you guys missed the underlying point and believe that this is rather off-topic to the purpose of the thread. Let me clarify. OP was ranting about the illegal and unjustified "screening" principles by Loma Linda to restrict students. But OP was being oversensitive and served as an example in a macroscopic scale.