Does name of Undergrad matter for application? YES - read this story!

[cpants]

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The Ivy League admissions are "need blind." If you are accepted, they will give you adequate grants and loans to attend.

They give NO merit or athletic scholarships. It is forbidden.

Also, several of the Ivies ONLY give grants. So a poor person would get an education and leave with NO debt.

(You are significantly uninformed.)

Uh, no I'm not. You stated: "Again, if you really went to an "elite" college and you couldn't afford to pay, you wouldn't have to." That is false. Even at need blind schools (which not all elite schools are, by the way), a significant portion of your aid will likely be loans, subsidized or otherwise. In other words, you still have to pay for it.

More importantly, the college's idea of your need is not necessarily the reality. Like I said, if you have a wealthy family, you are pretty much screwed, b/c the college will say you have no need and the family should pay for it. It doesn't matter if your family actually will be paying for it or not.

 

[slowbutsteady]

Uh, no I'm not. You stated: "Again, if you really went to an "elite" college and you couldn't afford to pay, you wouldn't have to." That is false. Even at need blind schools (which not all elite schools are, by the way), a significant portion of your aid will likely be loans, subsidized or otherwise. In other words, you still have to pay for it.

More importantly, the college's idea of your need is not necessarily the reality. Like I said, if you have a wealthy family, you are pretty much screwed, b/c the college will say you have no need and the family should pay for it. It doesn't matter if your family actually will be paying for it or not.

I guess you are missing my point. If the school of which you speak were truly "elite," as you claim, they would provide grants not loans.

Also, do you understand the concept here? Yes, it is true that if you come from a wealthy family, you will get neither grants nor loans.

Do you expect colleges to grant aid to persons from wealthy families because their parents "don't want to pay?" Wouldn't ALL wealthy parents say they do not want to pay under such a system? And why is it the college's fault that some parents choose to finance their child's education and others do not. Should they be asked to delve into the family dynamic to discern why the parents choose not to pay?

Absurd.

I am beginning to understand why you do not attend an "elite" school.

 

[cpants]

I guess you are missing my point. If the school of which you speak were truly "elite," as you claim, they would provide grants not loans.

Also, do you understand the concept here? Yes, it is true that if you come from a wealthy family, you will get neither grants nor loans.

Do you expect colleges to grant aid to persons from wealthy families because their parents "don't want to pay?" Wouldn't ALL wealthy parents say they do not want to pay under such a system? And why is it the college's fault that some parents choose to finance their child's education and others do not. Should they be asked to delve into the family dynamic to discern why the parents choose not to pay?

Absurd.

I am beginning to understand why you do not attend an "elite" school.

I think you are missing the concept. Admission to a university, even a need blind one, does not as you claimed mean you will be able to afford the cost of education. Need blind (they don't consider need in admissions) does not equal full need (they will give you all the aid you need to attend). Currently, there are only 6 schools in the whole country which are need blind and full need: Dartmouth, Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Yale, Amherst. I think you would agree that many elite schools are not included on that list.

I'm not saying the schools should be giving aid to students from wealthy families, but the point remains that if you are from a wealthy family who won't pay for your schooling (not uncommon, by the way), you are pretty much screwed. You get no aid and no family support.

 

[slowbutsteady]

I think you are missing the concept. Admission to a university, even a need blind one, does not as you claimed mean you will be able to afford the cost of education. Need blind (they don't consider need in admissions) does not equal full need (they will give you all the aid you need to attend). Currently, there are only 6 schools in the whole country which are need blind and full need: Dartmouth, Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Yale, Amherst. I think you would agree that many elite schools are not included on that list.

I'm not saying the schools should be giving aid to students from wealthy families, but the point remains that if you are from a wealthy family who won't pay for your schooling (not uncommon, by the way), you are pretty much screwed. You get no aid and no family support.

I do not agree. A few, maybe. Many? No.

 

[45408]

Am I right that most of you guys that are so mad and resort to name calling go to a no-name school? Because you understand how that would call into question your angry remarks, right?

Am I right that you're as much of a tool in real life as you are online?

 

[cpants]

I do not agree. A few, maybe. Many? No.

Ok.

 

[RogueUnicorn]

I think you are missing the concept. Admission to a university, even a need blind one, does not as you claimed mean you will be able to afford the cost of education. Need blind (they don't consider need in admissions) does not equal full need (they will give you all the aid you need to attend). Currently, there are only 6 schools in the whole country which are need blind and full need: Dartmouth, Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Yale, Amherst. I think you would agree that many elite schools are not included on that list.

I'm not saying the schools should be giving aid to students from wealthy families, but the point remains that if you are from a wealthy family who won't pay for your schooling (not uncommon, by the way), you are pretty much screwed. You get no aid and no family support.

I do not agree. A few, maybe. Many? No.

according to a recent letter from the university president of my alma mater, our school is "among the 27 private universities that are need blind and meet the full demonstrated financial need of accepted undergraduate students"

 

[cpants]

according to a recent letter from the university president of my alma mater, our school is "among the 27 private universities that are need blind and meet the full demonstrated financial need of accepted undergraduate students"

Sorry, my error. Those 6 are the 6 that are need blind full need for international students. There are 27 for US students.

But keep in mind that these schools are calculating your need and then meeting their own calculation. There is often a significant difference between what they say your contribution should be and the actual cash you and your family can come up with.

 

[RogueUnicorn]

i wonder how that works for international students, considering the visa requirement for F1 is an up-front demonstration of 4 years' worth of tuition

 

[roseglass6370]

Call me a skeptic, but I find this a bit hard to believe. It's near impossible to have everything else on an app be "controlled" except the undergrad institution. Were you an URM?

 

[tncekm]

...
[@cpants:] I am beginning to understand why you do not attend an "elite" school.

At the risk of being a hypocrite (I am guilty of plenty of trash talk on SDN) I'm going to go ahead and say that was definitely uncalled for. The two of you had a disagreement, but he certainly didn't say anything that warranted belittling.

In addition, that arrogant statement implying your intellectual superior to cpants' is largely unjustifiable, especially when considering the fact you were talking to another med student. I know many very average people at very "elite" schools (e.g. MIT)--they just worked hard (which is highly commendable) during high school, which is frankly a joke. I'd wager that most bottom 5% med students would do very well at elite schools, and it's very silly to pull the "you're not elite" card out, as if it were proof of some significant difference in your abilities or accomplishments. Success in the vast majority of academic fields has much more to do with motivation and dedication than it does intelligence. So, don't kid yourself. The same goes for medical school. If you want to go Ivy, work hard early on and don't let up. Average intelligence won't stop you.

 

[slowbutsteady]

At the risk of being a hypocrite (I am guilty of plenty of trash talk on SDN) I'm going to go ahead and say that was definitely uncalled for. The two of you had a disagreement, but he certainly didn't say anything that warranted belittling.

In addition, that arrogant statement implying your intellectual superior to cpants' is largely unjustifiable, especially when considering the fact you were talking to another med student. I know many very average people at very "elite" schools (e.g. MIT)--they just worked hard (which is highly commendable) during high school, which is frankly a joke. I'd wager that most bottom 5% med students would do very well at elite schools, and it's very silly to pull the "you're not elite" card out, as if it were proof of some significant difference in your abilities or accomplishments. Success in the vast majority of academic fields has much more to do with motivation and dedication than it does intelligence. So, don't kid yourself. The same goes for medical school. If you want to go Ivy, work hard early on and don't let up. Average intelligence won't stop you.

OK, FINE, I'm sorry for being snarky to cpants.


(BTW, I totally agree with you that hard work, not superior intellect, is what gets most kids into so-called elite schools.)

 

[Guile]

The vast majority of applicants do not write their own letters. I used the word "rare" which is synonymous with "uncommon." In other words, it is NOT common.

I never said I haven't heard of it happening; there is a prof at my college who routinely does this. I challenged the OP, who concocted a story about how he and his pal wrote all of their letters for all of their profs. If you believe the OP's story, you are quite gullible.

Rare is not synonymous with uncommon. If you think so, you'll get straightened out third year. But I'm not going to argue diction or semantics with you. A lot of people were calling out the OP for saying he wrote his LORs. I'm just saying it's not uncommon and it's plausible that he and his friend wrote theirs.

 

[cpants]

OK, FINE, I'm sorry for being snarky to cpants.


(BTW, I totally agree with you that hard work, not superior intellect, is what gets most kids into so-called elite schools.)

Hey don't worry about it man. We're used to the condescending attitudes when you elites come down amongst feebler minds.

 

[bravofleet4]

this thread is ******ed proving absolutely nothing. it sounds like someone just looking for a superficial difference to explain their feelings of inferiority when comparing themselves to their friend. of course, the explanation has to lie somewhere that's out of the applicant's control and we have to take it for his word that their applications are nearly identical.

 

[slowbutsteady]

hey don't worry about it man. We're used to the condescending attitudes when you elites come down amongst feebler minds.

Thanks!!

 

[Ilvcurst]

Maybe you screwed your friend over? Since you guys applied to many of the same schools and around the same time, maybe the adcom noticed that you guys had similar apps. Most schools want diversity and not necessary the same person X2 so given a choice between you or your friend, obviously if the only thing that differed was your undergrad then yah.....of course they would take you.

I went to Cal too and also taught O-Chem 2 semesters (Chem3b) 👍