Doing very poorly in dental school

[yo shi]

I came out of undergrad with great grades. I took CC courses for about half of my classes and perhaps I am not smart enough to cut it in dental school.

I am heading in my second year of dental school and I consistently am in the lower end of the grades. I haven't seen my cum GPA, but it's around a 2.9. I am often the lowest grade or bottom 5. I am ranked one of the bottom 5 overall. I study hard and tried to change my study habits a lot. I go from reading the slides, to transcribing, to reading the entire text. Because I try to change it up every exam. For some reason, I always do poorly and much lower than the average. Does anyone else feel the same way? I guess someone has to be the last in the class. But it doesn't feel good to be at the bottom. Anyone else in a similar position? Any advice?

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[Muggsy Bogues]

Just graduate. Don't worry about grades. Work on your skills as best you can for the purpose of getting better as a dentist not for the purpose of better grades.

People say it all the time but out in the dental real world it's as true as ever... the person who graduates first in the class has the same degree as the person who graduates last.

 

[doc toothache]

I came out of undergrad with great grades. I took CC courses for about half of my classes and perhaps I am not smart enough to cut it in dental school.

I am heading in my second year of dental school and I consistently am in the lower end of the grades. I haven't seen my cum GPA, but it's around a 2.9. I am often the lowest grade or bottom 5. I am ranked one of the bottom 5 overall. I study hard and tried to change my study habits a lot. I go from reading the slides, to transcribing, to reading the entire text. Because I try to change it up every exam. For some reason, I always do poorly and much lower than the average. Does anyone else feel the same way? I guess someone has to be the last in the class. But it doesn't feel good to be at the bottom. Anyone else in a similar position? Any advice?

You must not know the name used for the absolute bottom performer in the class.

 

[stevesteve121]

You must not know the name used for the absolute bottom performer in the class.

"dentist"? "DMD?" "DDS"?

 

[Freeskier02]

"dentist"? "DMD?" "DDS"?

That, and also NO one knows who that person is in the class, because it doesn't matter. As long as he/she graduates its all gravy.

 

[yo shi]

thank you guys. it made me feel a lot better. I'm looking forward to really getting over this obsession with grades. I am looking forward to being a dentist and somehow I think my grades and doing me a favor and letting me learn how to chill out a little. thanks again

 

[dentalWorks]

thank you guys. it made me feel a lot better. I'm looking forward to really getting over this obsession with grades. I am looking forward to being a dentist and somehow I think my grades and doing me a favor and letting me learn how to chill out a little. thanks again

no matter how "bad" you think your doing, you are 1 year ahead of all of us pre-dents whom are starting out this July-August.... can't be that bad, 3 more years 🙂

 

[bing12]

i hear "C's get degrees"

 

[dentalWorks]

i hear "C's get degrees"

omg i was thinking about that phrase too... I forgot who said it

 

[lmaozedong1]

i hear "C's get degrees"

But they won't get you into Dental School. 😀 Damn, that woulda made my life so much easier.

 

[bing12]

But they won't get you into Dental School. 😀 Damn, that woulda made my life so much easier.

ha, very true..but once ur in, "C's get degrees".

 

[beeho]

ha, very true..but once ur in, "C's get degrees".

varies; it depends on which d-school you attend. if you go to a pass/fail curriculum, sure. however, go to my school at U.Kentucky and you have to maintain a 2.75 gpa.

keep your head up, OP. i know the stress that comes with having to do poorly in comparison to your peers. i would definitely utilize ALL the help your school offers (tutors, mentors, etc.)

edit: "C you next year?"

 

[Daurang]

The first year was the hardest for me, too, and I barely scraped through. Just get yourself into the second year and it become easier and more interesting. I wouldn't be surprised if I graduated near the bottom of my class; but yet I passed all my boards without problem in the +90 percentile. How many US presidents, including the current one that blocked out all his college records and didn't even have the business skill of running a lemonade stand, are really that smart in school? Yet we have them leading the world just fine. You will do just fine if you have the conviction like them.

 

[dentalWorks]

The first year was the hardest for me, too, and I barely scraped through. Just get yourself into the second year and it become easier and more interesting. I wouldn't be surprised if I graduated near the bottom of my class; but yet I passed all my boards without problem in the +90 percentile. How many US presidents, including the current one that blocked out all his college records and didn't even have the business skill of running a lemonade stand, are really that smart in school? Yet we have them leading the world just fine. You will do just fine if you have the conviction like them.

Really? I was under the assumption 2nd year gets tougher.... I guess it varies from school to school

 

[lemoncurry]

I came out of undergrad with great grades. I took CC courses for about half of my classes and perhaps I am not smart enough to cut it in dental school.

I am heading in my second year of dental school and I consistently am in the lower end of the grades. I haven't seen my cum GPA, but it's around a 2.9. I am often the lowest grade or bottom 5. I am ranked one of the bottom 5 overall. I study hard and tried to change my study habits a lot. I go from reading the slides, to transcribing, to reading the entire text. Because I try to change it up every exam. For some reason, I always do poorly and much lower than the average. Does anyone else feel the same way? I guess someone has to be the last in the class. But it doesn't feel good to be at the bottom. Anyone else in a similar position? Any advice?

welcome to the club. sub-3.0 gpa here. it gets better, especially when you start doing actual dental stuff.

 

[rph3664]

I wouldn't be surprised if I graduated near the bottom of my class; but yet I passed all my boards without problem in the +90 percentile.

I'm not a dentist but the same thing happened to me.

 

[hoylematt]

My buddy and I were talking about this recently. He said that his first year in Law school made him feel like a failure because he got a 3.0 when he was used to getting straight A's in undergrad.

Then the realization hit him: Post grad programs like Law or Medicine or Dentistry or the like consist of the best-of-the-best. You are competing with the brightest minds to come out of schools all across the country and often times are graded on a curve. There can only be so many A's, B's, C's etc.

I thought of my own experience in undergrad. I thought of those classes where I worked my butt off, got an A--but was still below several other kids as far as class ranking goes. I then realized that if I was able to make it into Dental school, then there would definitely be other kids better than me when I got there.

So If you really think about it, getting a B average in a Dental program is like being average in an insanely smart group of individuals. What the hell is wrong with that? The best bet is to decide early to excel, but do not compare yourself to others much beyond your level of ability. It will only cause you pain in the end. (You should work to your ability though of course)

 

[Masseter]

I am also on the 3.0 GPA crew.

So far I've come to be interested in periodontics. If I were to raise that GPA to around 3.6 would that be enough to do a residency and then getting into perio if that still in my plans in 3 years?

I had to work my @ss to get in dentistry and I love every single bit of it. I unfortunately didn't take that first year as serious as I used to be (drinking at the bars the night before exams...). I just don't want my future to be jeopardized because of a low GPA...

Oh well! I will take it like a man and move on 🙂

 

[Daurang]

Masseter...if you're in Montreal I can't blame you. There are just too many beautiful distractions on St. Catherine and I'd probably flunked out of dental school.

 

[txaggie03]

Hope this helps.

Very much so. Thank you.

 

[yo shi]

The first year was the hardest for me, too, and I barely scraped through. Just get yourself into the second year and it become easier and more interesting. I wouldn't be surprised if I graduated near the bottom of my class; but yet I passed all my boards without problem in the +90 percentile. How many US presidents, including the current one that blocked out all his college records and didn't even have the business skill of running a lemonade stand, are really that smart in school? Yet we have them leading the world just fine. You will do just fine if you have the conviction like them.

That's pretty inspiring. I would like to do well on boards. I remember everything I learned for the most part. I just don't learn 100% of the material because I cannot get through the mountains of powerpoints!

Big thank you to everyone that responded with your inspiration. It's good to know I'm not alone at the bottom!

 

[sweetdaises2000]

My buddy and I were talking about this recently. He said that his first year in Law school made him feel like a failure because he got a 3.0 when he was used to getting straight A's in undergrad.

Then the realization hit him: Post grad programs like Law or Medicine or Dentistry or the like consist of the best-of-the-best. You are competing with the brightest minds to come out of schools all across the country and often times are graded on a curve. There can only be so many A's, B's, C's etc.

I thought of my own experience in undergrad. I thought of those classes where I worked my butt off, got an A--but was still below several other kids as far as class ranking goes. I then realized that if I was able to make it into Dental school, then there would definitely be other kids better than me when I got there.

So If you really think about it, getting a B average in a Dental program is like being average in an insanely smart group of individuals. What the hell is wrong with that? The best bet is to decide early to excel, but do not compare yourself to others much beyond your level of ability. It will only cause you pain in the end. (You should work to your ability though of course)

This is my personal philosophy as well. Do your personal best, after all, what else can you do?

 

[sweetdaises2000]

That's pretty inspiring. I would like to do well on boards. I remember everything I learned for the most part. I just don't learn 100% of the material because I cannot get through the mountains of powerpoints!

Big thank you to everyone that responded with your inspiration. It's good to know I'm not alone at the bottom!

Yo shi! I haven't even started yet but I have talked to some of my friends who will be 2nd years and ask them how they do it. I'm starting to wonder as well...i mean, how much can one really retain from an 80-100 ppt presentation?!

 

[txlonghorn]

Yo shi! I haven't even started yet but I have talked to some of my friends who will be 2nd years and ask them how they do it. I'm starting to wonder as well...i mean, how much can one really retain from an 80-100 ppt presentation?!

I wonder the same. I mean, I think I already forgot all of ochem. lol

 

[dentalWorks]

Yo shi! I haven't even started yet but I have talked to some of my friends who will be 2nd years and ask them how they do it. I'm starting to wonder as well...i mean, how much can one really retain from an 80-100 ppt presentation?!

I wonder the same. I mean, I think I already forgot all of ochem. lol

haven't you guys ever crammed crammed crammed for a test... did well... then 1 week later forgot more than 50% of material?

 

[txlonghorn]

haven't you guys ever crammed crammed crammed for a test... did well... then 1 week later forgot more than 50% of material?

1 week? You mean 1 hour later? lol. I guess dental school is going to be a bunch of memorize for test, forget, then memorize again for boards, and forget session.

 

[dentalWorks]

1 week? You mean 1 hour later? lol. I guess dental school is going to be a bunch of memorize for test, forget, then memorize again for boards, and forget session.

lmao.... retention half-life is 1 hour
But yeh I know what you mean....

 

[SoulPower]

haven't you guys ever crammed crammed crammed for a test... did well... then 1 week later forgot more than 50% of material?

Lol yea, it was called the DAT and instead of 1 week it was 4.

 

[UBDent19]

As they say....spaghetti on the wall 😀

 

[Jackson-Ave-Dental]

My buddy and I were talking about this recently. He said that his first year in Law school made him feel like a failure because he got a 3.0 when he was used to getting straight A's in undergrad.

Then the realization hit him: Post grad programs like Law or Medicine or Dentistry or the like consist of the best-of-the-best. You are competing with the brightest minds to come out of schools all across the country and often times are graded on a curve. There can only be so many A's, B's, C's etc.

I thought of my own experience in undergrad. I thought of those classes where I worked my butt off, got an A--but was still below several other kids as far as class ranking goes. I then realized that if I was able to make it into Dental school, then there would definitely be other kids better than me when I got there.

So If you really think about it, getting a B average in a Dental program is like being average in an insanely smart group of individuals. What the hell is wrong with that? The best bet is to decide early to excel, but do not compare yourself to others much beyond your level of ability. It will only cause you pain in the end. (You should work to your ability though of course)

Someone listen to this man! 👍

 

[TeethVader]

I was second to last in my class almost on the edge of getting the boot. 2 years after, I am a dentist and making ~200K-210K a year. Some of my classmates that where much better than me only wish they made that much money. Don't worry about you're ranking just finish school! It doesnt matter where you stand on rankings, take it from an experienced bottom dweller.

 

[Colos]

I was second to last in my class almost on the edge of getting the boot. 2 years after, I am a dentist and making ~200K-210K a year. Some of my classmates that where much better than me only wish they made that much money. Don't worry about you're ranking just finish school! It doesnt matter where you stand on rankings, take it from an experienced bottom dweller.

Hey Vader...I'm currently pretty much at the bottom right now. We're doing our sims right now over the summer & feels like I'm being so rushed that I'm just learning nothing at all. Any tips for preps/filling techniques??

 

[Daurang]

Hey Vader...I'm currently pretty much at the bottom right now. We're doing our sims right now over the summer & feels like I'm being so rushed that I'm just learning nothing at all. Any tips for preps/filling techniques??

You just keep practicing and practicing and practicing.

 

[TeethVader]

Hey Vader...I'm currently pretty much at the bottom right now. We're doing our sims right now over the summer & feels like I'm being so rushed that I'm just learning nothing at all. Any tips for preps/filling techniques??

Practice and practice like there is no tomorrow. Ask a classmate that really knows whats going on. Practice following the criteria given; otherwise you'll defeat the purpose of prcticing. I remember staying 'till they kick me out b/c I honestly had no handskills......none. however, with discipline, I was able to finish and had only to take the wreb one time and passed. I mean after prepping on thousands of teeth for 4 years and withstand the toughest faculty, the wreb becomes a walk in the park. Use your weaknesses to your advantage. Good luck

 

[budentite]

For didactic courses:
-Attend all lectures, and pay attention. The most important thing to do is to come prepared. Spending 10 minutes to skim and preview the material before a lecture will save you several hours of studying after the lecture, plus you will actually learn the material, and not just memorize some things. I would usually print out the lecture the night before and quickly read through it; I come to lecture 10 minutes early and skim the material once more. This made studying for exams quick and easy because I already learned all the material during lecture, and just need a refresh to refine my memory. I spent just two or three hours to study for almost all exams.

I started doing this in the middle of my first year because I got failing grades on my first 3 exams in dental school. The Dean thought I was incapable of being a dentist and told me to take a leave of absence. I refused of course. I started talking to a therapist and almost overnight became an "A" student, which pissed off the Dean even more. I'm not sure what irritated him more, the fact that I proved him wrong, or that I got help from a therapist, but he always had a hard-on for me after that.

 

[budentite]

For preps/restorations:
Practice, practice, practice. But it has to be meaningful practice. I've seen people race to drill on every tooth in their kit, but butcher every single one of them, making no progress.

You need to be able to honestly critique yourself to figure out what is right/wrong, what needs to be improved. Unscrew the teeth from the type-o-dont when you're finished and examine the proximal surfaces - how is the gingival margin, how is the contact/embrasures?

Then think about how your going to do things differently to fix the problems, then try it out, be creative. Take your time, work on individual components instead of doing the entire procedure start to finish. Don't just mindlessly drill, because then you're just getting better at doing things badly.

 

[8 SNAKE]

The Dean thought I was incapable of being a dentist and told me to take a leave of absence. I refused of course. I started talking to a therapist and almost overnight became an "A" student, which pissed off the Dean even more.

That doesn't seem to make sense to me. Why would the dean want one of his students to fail or get pissed when the student turned things around?

 

[full]

I'm in the same situation.

I graduated cum laude from a top 25 university and got 21/21/20 on the DAT. I go to one of the dental schools that widely regarded as easier to get into.

I'm working just as hard if not harder than I did in undergrad but I'm at the bottom of my class and it's not just hand skills. I'm even getting Bs and Cs in the science portion.

 

[Voltron2010]

success and grades dontbalways go hand and hand. in thevreal world people skills and ur handskill play a major role. in my class the second to last place studentbhas excellent people skills open a clinic and is in high demand by patients seeking him, he is now a millionaire. on the otherhand our number one student got sued his first year, and no longer practices. our number two student failed her boards part 2 and credits. so go figure... theres more to denstistry than grades.

 

[full]

For didactic courses:

The Dean thought I was incapable of being a dentist and told me to take a leave of absence. I refused of course. I started talking to a therapist and almost overnight became an "A" student, which pissed off the Dean even more. I'm not sure what irritated him more, the fact that I proved him wrong, or that I got help from a therapist, but he always had a hard-on for me after that.

A similar thing is happening to me. A lead professor contacted higher ups about my fate as a student here--- saying that my hand skills are doomed and I won't improve regardless of seeking help. I got a tutor and improved. I've shown him my improved work and he blocks it out of his reality. He seeks out negative things about my work--harping on the nitty gritty (presumably to stay consistent with his testimony about me to the higher ups) even though it's 100X better and would easily have passed the first time around. He never says anything about my improvement, never anything positive. It's like he is trying to stay consistent with his first statement ("expert opinion" about a student). I suppose for a person in that position to admit he is wrong about a testimony about a student is really embarrassing and hard to cope with.

 

[budentite]

That doesn't seem to make sense to me. Why would the dean want one of his students to fail or get pissed when the student turned things around?

You know, I even made the Dean's List for getting above a 3.5gpa, after such a terrible start to school. It doesn't make sense to anyone but he retaliated and discriminated against me several times through the rest of my education.
In my opinion, the reason for his behavior is that 1) he is mad that I refused his advice and proved him completely wrong, but more importantly 2) he is a bigot who looks down on people who see therapists (like Tom Cruise). There are several students who have made that 2nd claim.
I'm sure it doesn't help that he is a short man with a napoleon complex. It's a real tragedy that someone like him works with students, but c'est la vie.

 

[spearmint]

I was second to last in my class almost on the edge of getting the boot. 2 years after, I am a dentist and making ~200K-210K a year. Some of my classmates that where much better than me only wish they made that much money. Don't worry about you're ranking just finish school! It doesnt matter where you stand on rankings, take it from an experienced bottom dweller.

Wow, I've never heard of a grad making $200K+/yr that is just out of school. Do you own a solo practice or bought into a partnership? If you're practicing in SoCal as a recent grad and making that much, that is really impressive since the market is pretty saturated. I guess USC must have done something right.

 

[immike1234]

Wow, I've never heard of a grad making $200K+/yr that is just out of school. Do you own a solo practice or bought into a partnership? If you're practicing in SoCal as a recent grad and making that much, that is really impressive since the market is pretty saturated. I guess USC must have done something right.

Lol I think you should be giving him credit instead of the school 😉

 

[TeethVader]

Wow, I've never heard of a grad making $200K+/yr that is just out of school. Do you own a solo practice or bought into a partnership? If you're practicing in SoCal as a recent grad and making that much, that is really impressive since the market is pretty saturated. I guess USC must have done something right.[/QUO

USC showed me not to fear any case I'm presented with, discipline and ergonomics. I happened to land in a corporation that offers great bonuses + our base salary of 10k/month. I gained speed along the way and it reflects on my bonuses. And like I said before, hand skills were not my strong quality in d-school, but I practiced like a madman everyday and the end results are obvious. Ergonomics are really important to practice! My colleague that works with me doesn't know how to use loupes nor use the right posture and he's at the chiropractor once a week.

 

[spearmint]

Lol I think you should be giving him credit instead of the school 😉

Oh, I definitely give TeethVader the credit. I know that how good you are depends on how much you're willing to put into it. But with all the bad rap that USC has received recently, I figured it must not be THAT bad if a recent grad from their school could be so successful. Just wanted to throw USC a bone. I know they're trying to revamp their program. But I know, becoming successful is up to the individual.

USC showed me not to fear any case I'm presented with, discipline and ergonomics. I happened to land in a corporation that offers great bonuses + our base salary of 10k/month. I gained speed along the way and it reflects on my bonuses. And like I said before, hand skills were not my strong quality in d-school, but I practiced like a madman everyday and the end results are obvious. Ergonomics are really important to practice! My colleague that works with me doesn't know how to use loupes nor use the right posture and he's at the chiropractor once a week.

👍👍 That's really impressive! You must be lightning fast to almost double your base salary in bonuses. Glad to hear that a recent grad can do well in this economy. Thanks for giving us hope.

 

[Flosstooth]

A- students make the best educators
B- students make the best clinicians
C- students make the most money

 

[TeethVader]

Oh, I definitely give TeethVader the credit. I know that how good you are depends on how much you're willing to put into it. But with all the bad rap that USC has received recently, I figured it must not be THAT bad if a recent grad from their school could be so successful. Just wanted to throw USC a bone. I know they're trying to revamp their program. But I know, becoming successful is up to the individual.



👍👍 That's really impressive! You must be lightning fast to almost double your base salary in bonuses. Glad to hear that a recent grad can do well in this economy. Thanks for giving us hope.[/QUOTE
Thanks future docs, look, i used to hate SC for all the nightmares they put me through. However I'm grateful. i was mr. Remedial man 'cause I had to remediate everything, even Perio!! I did soo much off all the disciplines in dentistry that during my wreb I scored 100% in perio and 4s across the board for ops and endo (4 out of 5). I had practiced soo much that I pretty much learned to prep everything!
I know all of you can do it, just b disciplined. Just today I extracted the hardest root canal treated #30 and the staff and my pt. Along with wife told me they had no doubt I could do it. You know why, b/c us, unlike your classmates that are gifted w/ crazy handskills will not have to face the challenges we have to day in and day out. Everyday for us will b special,and will learn to face those challenges. The speed I've gained is b/c I considered myself a hard worker, heck! Ever since I started dental school I've had no choice but to bust my arse!!
Docs, never give up! I know all of you will do it, if a guy that could't rescue a class I prep for the life of him was able to do it,I'm pretty sure you'll be in grat shape during d-school. Good luck to you all!!👍

 

[UBDent19]

A- students make the best educators
B- students make the best clinicians
C- students make the most money

That's because C students know they've already got their parents' practice waiting for them after dental school, paid off with a full load of patients! 😀

 

[Demeter]

Remember C= DDS.

 

[SoulPower]

That's because C students know they've already got their parents' practice waiting for them after dental school, paid off with a full load of patients! 😀

I wonder if there's a correlation to students that have a "legacy" to lower or higher grades in dental school.