Dr. J.D.

[Hayduke]

I'm interested in law school. As a pre-intern (3.5 months) I realize pursuing a law degree during my EM residency would probably be impossible. I still would like to start as soon as possible.

Does anyone here have any information regarding types of programs and realistic time expectations? Anyone here w/experience doing the law thing while in practice?

Thanks.

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[sunlioness]

There's no way you could go to school full time and be a full time resident. NO WAY. I don't know if law schools have parttime students, but even so recognize that residency is extremely demanding and so are law school classes. And your program is NOT going to be receptive to organizing your ED shifts and call schedule around your class schedule. So at this point, you probably have to choose . . . Law school now and no residency, or law school when residency is over.

You probably could do it after residency, working parttime. EM as an attending is shiftwork and pretty flexible, I think, depending on how much money you need to be making.

 

[loveumms]

I want to get my MBA and was talking with one of the program directors during interviews who had an MBA. He told me that residents can't do other professional degrees while in residency. Apparently, hours in class have to be added to your work week hours so, if you take outside classes you are only allowed to take the number of hours you have left after your residency hours per week and this must total to be less then 80. So, even in an anesthesia residency where I would only be working around 65 hours per week, it would have been impossible to get the MBA under normal circumstances even though many MBA programs allow 'part time' students.

 

[DOCTORSAIB]

I want to get my MBA and was talking with one of the program directors during interviews who had an MBA. He told me that residents can't do other professional degrees while in residency. Apparently, hours in class have to be added to your work week hours so, if you take outside classes you are only allowed to take the number of hours you have left after your residency hours per week and this must total to be less then 80. So, even in an anesthesia residency where I would only be working around 65 hours per week, it would have been impossible to get the MBA under normal circumstances even though many MBA programs allow 'part time' students.

This is not entirely true as there are plenty of residency programs (Ophtho included) that allow residents to get their MBA during residency.

But I agree, it'd be close to impossible in "most" other fields where working ~80 hours/week is not uncommon.

 

[path15]

You can do whatever you want with your free time away from residency work and if you are going to get a law degree from a school different than the university/hospital where you are a resident then I don't see why you would have to report any kind of hours - this sounds silly to me, unless they were paying for it or something.
Many law schools offer part time night classes - you might be able to squeeze one class a semester -

 

[EUA]

I'm getting my MBA right now during residency, but I think that's nothing compared to law school!

I never heard about school hours having to count towards your 80-hour rule. I think that's B.S. My PD and other attendings were certainly not enthusiastic or supportive about the MBA though, so I just didn't tell them when I started it.

Besides, the hospital pays for most of it. It's foolish not to do it.

 

[Stimulate]

I want to get my MBA and was talking with one of the program directors during interviews who had an MBA. He told me that residents can't do other professional degrees while in residency. Apparently, hours in class have to be added to your work week hours so, if you take outside classes you are only allowed to take the number of hours you have left after your residency hours per week and this must total to be less then 80. So, even in an anesthesia residency where I would only be working around 65 hours per week, it would have been impossible to get the MBA under normal circumstances even though many MBA programs allow 'part time' students.

The duty hour rules only apply to patient care and educational activities related to the residency program. Obtaining an additional degree, especially in a non-patient care related field is NOT prohibited by duty hours rules. For clarification please read the following link:

http://www.acgme.org/acWebsite/dutyHours/dh_Lang703.pdf

Also, I just wanted to add that many of the physicians who possess law degrees primarily practice medicine rather than law (from what I have seen). I don't know if this is because of financial reasons...at least initially, earning a six figure salary imay be easier in medicine...

A law degree is probably more useful if you are pursuing political or industry-type careers rather than if you are simply going to be a trial lawyer. Medical malpractice defense may be a good option, however, the money is more lucrative on the plaintiff side.

Unless you are a super-genius, I would probably consider either keeping it to a class or two during residency or just waiting until after residency and do some locum tenens while in law school. Just my 2 cents.

Best of luck in your endeavors.

 

[loveumms]

I'm getting my MBA right now during residency, but I think that's nothing compared to law school!

I never heard about school hours having to count towards your 80-hour rule. I think that's B.S. My PD and other attendings were certainly not enthusiastic or supportive about the MBA though, so I just didn't tell them when I started it.

Besides, the hospital pays for most of it. It's foolish not to do it.

Huh - maybe I misinterpreted what he was saying. Could you give me some advice on how you do this. I would really like to start working on my MBA during residency and would like to hear about what kind of course load you are taking and how you got the hospital to pay for it.

Thanks!