Drug Test for Med School?

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UCmed2004

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I have a friend who smoked some of the old mary j. He has to take a blood test in a week for medical school because all the schools want blood. He is worried that this is one of the things they are going to be checking for. on the order form it reads "comprehensive metabolic panel" and "urinalysis w/rflx to Micro". The other ones are checking for rubella igg, mumps, etc. Any idea if the weed test is a standard one? because that means my friend cant have the blood checked now and hes in trouble. Thank you very much if you have any information or know someone who might have some info!

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good question, i'm also curious if you ever have to take a drug test in the med school application process...
 
UCmed2004 said:
I have a friend who smoked some of the old mary j. He has to take a blood test in a week for medical school because all the schools want blood. He is worried that this is one of the things they are going to be checking for. on the order form it reads "comprehensive metabolic panel" and "urinalysis w/rflx to Micro". The other ones are checking for rubella igg, mumps, etc. Any idea if the weed test is a standard one? because that means my friend cant have the blood checked now and hes in trouble. Thank you very much if you have any information or know someone who might have some info!

Let the LabMonkey work: If your friend did not sign a form, specifically a chain of custody form, that explicitly states his urine/blood sample will be used for a drug screen, then it won't be tested for drugs. We commonly test for drugs of abuse without consent, but these instances are for medical purposes only - they carry no legal weight. A chain of custody form informs the "donor" of their rights, and maintains the specimens integrity by ensuring it was in "professional" custody at all times. Drug testing bearing legal weight, which a medical school would need if they wanted to deny matriculation based on drug use, are performed at specially certified laboratories - NIDA labs - again, requiring informed consent on a chain of custody requisition.

The other tests are basic health screens and immunity checks.

In any event, unless your friend is a chronic THC user, THC metabolites are typically excreted in 3-5 days. Chronics have bigger problems - metabolites can stick around for a long time depending on ones particular liver enzyme concentration and THC ingestion.

Hope I covered it all for ya' :laugh:
 
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LauraMac said:
good question, i'm also curious if you ever have to take a drug test in the med school application process...

yes - it's part of your AMCAS primary application.
 
LabMonster said:
Let the LabMonkey work: If your friend did not sign a form, specifically a chain of custody form, that explicitly states his urine/blood sample will be used for a drug screen, then it won't be tested for drugs. We commonly test for drugs of abuse without consent, but these instances are for medical purposes only - they carry no legal weight. A chain of custody form informs the "donor" of their rights, and maintains the specimens integrity by ensuring it was in "professional" custody at all times. Drug testing bearing legal weight, which a medical school would need if they wanted to deny matriculation based on drug use, are performed at specially certified laboratories - NIDA labs - again, requiring informed consent on a chain of custody requisition.

The other tests are basic health screens and immunity checks.

In any event, unless your friend is a chronic THC user, THC metabolites are typically excreted in 3-5 days. Chronics have bigger problems - metabolites can stick around for a long time depending on ones particular liver enzyme concentration and THC ingestion.

Hope I covered it all for ya' :laugh:



LAB MONKEY....you are so wise! awesome answer! That's probably the best and straightest answer i've ever heard! Thank you!
 
sunUCB said:
yes - it's part of your AMCAS primary application.

i was so annoyed when i had to mail my own urine to AMCAS--i can't believe the ziplock baggy didn't break or leak!
 
UCmed2004 said:
LAB MONKEY....you are so wise! awesome answer! That's probably the best and straightest answer i've ever heard! Thank you!

Be sure that you relay it to your "friend" ;)
 
javert said:
Be sure that you relay it to your "friend" ;)
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

I was just thinking the exact thing!
 
i submitted my urine electronically with the rest of my application :laugh:

phleebie said:
i was so annoyed when i had to mail my own urine to AMCAS--i can't believe the ziplock baggy didn't break or leak!
 
sunUCB said:
i submitted my urine electronically with the rest of my application :laugh:

i heard you can just pee on a piece of paper, sign it, and fax it to them. :sleep:
 
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TheProwler said:
drugs are bad, mmmkay?


not sure if this was faceitious or not, but im just curious what you guys think: are drugs really that bad? It seems to me that addiction would be the problem, but not so much the drugs themselves. I mean, when i was growing up and took health classes etc they always told us drugs are bad; somehow society tends to equate drugs with being evil, but are the drugs themselves really all that bad? im afraid to try too many things b.c, like with alcohol, im worried that if i like it ill keep wanting it more and more.
 
Haybrant said:
not sure if this was faceitious or not, but im just curious what you guys think: are drugs really that bad? It seems to me that addiction would be the problem, but not so much the drugs themselves. I mean, when i was growing up and took health classes etc they always told us drugs are bad; somehow society tends to equate drugs with being evil, but are the drugs themselves really all that bad? im afraid to try too many things b.c, like with alcohol, im worried that if i like it ill keep wanting it more and more.

I think the behavior associated with drug use tends to be bad... To curb bad behavior, you do a few things: make the behavior illegal and stigmatize it.

Drug use isn't necessarily bad, but some bad behaviors necessarily include drug use.

proof=tequila :eek:
 
Haybrant said:
not sure if this was faceitious or not, but im just curious what you guys think: are drugs really that bad? It seems to me that addiction would be the problem, but not so much the drugs themselves. I mean, when i was growing up and took health classes etc they always told us drugs are bad; somehow society tends to equate drugs with being evil, but are the drugs themselves really all that bad? im afraid to try too many things b.c, like with alcohol, im worried that if i like it ill keep wanting it more and more.

if there is any chance at all that i might die just by trying the drug once i won't do it no matter what. other than that, i say everything in moderation.
 
Haybrant said:
not sure if this was faceitious or not, but im just curious what you guys think: are drugs really that bad? It seems to me that addiction would be the problem, but not so much the drugs themselves. I mean, when i was growing up and took health classes etc they always told us drugs are bad; somehow society tends to equate drugs with being evil, but are the drugs themselves really all that bad? im afraid to try too many things b.c, like with alcohol, im worried that if i like it ill keep wanting it more and more.

No - he was just imitating Mr. MacKey from South Park. I guess drugs are bad for people with addictive personalities (which you admit to). So you should stay away.
 
Drugs are also illegal (Duh), which makes them bad automatically on one level at least. Besides, if you do get caught and get a drug related conviction, even for MJ, guess what, no more Federal Loans for you. Good luck paying for med school with no staffords. Why don't you people just NOT do something that is illegal, unhealthy, and addictive. I have NO repect for ANY med student who uses. There is a time and place for everything, and it was called undergrad ;) Are you going to pop some valiums and vicodins when you get your DEA license too?
 
medic170 said:
Drugs are also illegal (Duh), which makes them bad automatically on one level at least. Besides, if you do get caught and get a drug related conviction, even for MJ, guess what, no more Federal Loans for you. Good luck paying for med school with no staffords. Why don't you people just NOT do something that is illegal, unhealthy, and addictive. I have NO repect for ANY med student who uses. There is a time and place for everything, and it was called undergrad ;) Are you going to pop some valiums and vicodins when you get your DEA license too?

Oh, get off your high horse. There is nothing wrong with a little chronic. In fact, I would argue it is good for your mental health. Relax, your ass is wound way too tight
 
medic170 said:
Drugs are also illegal (Duh), which makes them bad automatically on one level at least. Besides, if you do get caught and get a drug related conviction, even for MJ, guess what, no more Federal Loans for you. Good luck paying for med school with no staffords. Why don't you people just NOT do something that is illegal, unhealthy, and addictive. I have NO repect for ANY med student who uses. There is a time and place for everything, and it was called undergrad ;) Are you going to pop some valiums and vicodins when you get your DEA license too?


oh, republicans....
 
for real. i love pot.
 
Iamajew said:
for real. i love pot.

Exactly. Smoking chronic will not get you kicked out of med school. I mean, you gotta have it to get through the daily grind
 
dude get this stuff from GNC called orange something Q carb something liek that. just ask them yo i gotta DT what should i get. they hook it up. tastes mad nasty but does the trick, 24 hrs in advance, oK? listen tho, it depends on usage, if its chronic (haha no pun intended) habitual use then it wont work, u need to just wait a month. also if u fail a DT u can always be like wtf i need another one, that amust have been wrong they usually give u another one. thats happened to my friends b4. DTs are so f*king lame dont get me started. bc all the harder drugs (ie yay, smack, tina) they get out of your system w/n 3-7 days. dt's basically test for trees and thats one F"d up story.
 
medic170 said:
Drugs are also illegal (Duh), which makes them bad automatically on one level at least. Besides, if you do get caught and get a drug related conviction, even for MJ, guess what, no more Federal Loans for you. Good luck paying for med school with no staffords. Why don't you people just NOT do something that is illegal, unhealthy, and addictive. I have NO repect for ANY med student who uses. There is a time and place for everything, and it was called undergrad ;) Are you going to pop some valiums and vicodins when you get your DEA license too?

lol, what a jackass. first of all, it was pot. second it was spring break. third it was probably good. 4th he didnt say he got behind a wheel or anything close to it. 5th laws are made to be broken if theyre dumb. 6th persons still undergrad since they are worried about getting in. 7th its probably not addictive. 8th its healthier than smoking nicotine regularly. 9th who cares about what you think, dude asked a technical question and lab monkey had the answer.
 
blump said:
Oh, get off your high horse. There is nothing wrong with a little chronic. In fact, I would argue it is good for your mental health. Relax, your ass is wound way too tight

Did you/would you tell your med school med school interviewers, or the ADCOM, when they asked what you like to do to relax, that you like to get high smoking weed? I bet not, but why not be honest if there is nothing wrong with it. Since I am sure none of you people would do this, then I must assume that most people in prominent places in the medical academics comminity, besides me, have the same opinion as me. Please, tell them that and see if you get admitted to any medical school.
 
superso said:
lol, what a jackass. first of all, it was pot. second it was spring break. third it was probably good. 4th he didnt say he got behind a wheel or anything close to it. 5th laws are made to be broken if theyre dumb. 6th persons still undergrad since they are worried about getting in. 7th its probably not addictive. 8th its healthier than smoking nicotine regularly. 9th who cares about what you think, dude asked a technical question and lab monkey had the answer.

Pot is illegal, so it was ppot, so what? Who cares if it was good?

Probably not addictive, it is absolutly scientifically proven to be psychologically addictive.

Healthier than nicotine? This is also proven wrong, Pot has more chemicals than nicotine and I never saw a joint with a filter on it.

so, if I think the law against murder is dumb, then it is ok to murder you?
If following the law and not doing illegal drugs makes me a jackass, then i guess I am guilty as charged. Grow up!

Who cares what I think, I do you immature little brat..yup, I can call names too :rolleyes:
 
it's stupid to make pot illegal...but since it is non addictive and illegal, there is no compelling reason for one to smoke it either. it's not worth the risk. If you get piss drunk no one is gonna mind...so if you choose to abuse, at least don't risk your livelihood over it.

you have too much to lose and nothing to gain.
 
medstyle said:
it's stupid to make pot illegal...but since it is non addictive and illegal, there is no compelling reason for one to smoke it either. it's not worth the risk. If you get piss drunk no one is gonna mind...so if you choose to abuse, at least don't risk your livelihood over it.

you have too much to lose and nothing to gain.

Obviously, opinions vary on whether it should remain illegal, but the fact is that it is illegal, and therefore, it is very stupid for a physician to be to use it regardless of one's opinion on it.
 
Uh actually smoking pot is safer and healthier than becoming a rampant alcoholic.

The country has painted marijuana as such a horrible and dangerous drug that its equated to doing heroine or cocaine or having unprotected sex.

If you do the research on your own and forget the government propaganda on weed, you'll realize that it's not as bad as it's toted to be.

One of the reasons why we haven't legalized marijuana yet is because we still have a rascist view towards blacks and hispanics when they used it primarily back in the 1800s , and we won't admit that we made a mistake with banning it.


Historically not one person has died from overdose on marijuana not ONE. However, you see many people overdosing on alcohol and involved in DWI charges.

You never see this for marijuana. All you see is a black man who is arrested and then gets sent to jail for 30 years.

versus a white man who will get less than year or a slap on the wrist.

Finally, total hypocrisy is seen when marijuana is legalized in Alaska as an incentive to live there.

Alcohol was illegal during hte roaring twenties yet everyone bootlegged it. Its about time we legalize marijuana because it doesn't mess you up as long as everything is kept in line and you don't become a pothead.
 
Hermit MMood said:
Uh actually smoking pot is safer and healthier than becoming a rampant alcoholic.

The country has painted marijuana as such a horrible and dangerous drug that its equated to doing heroine or cocaine or having unprotected sex.

If you do the research on your own and forget the government propaganda on weed, you'll realize that it's not as bad as it's toted to be.

One of the reasons why we haven't legalized marijuana yet is because we still have a rascist view towards blacks and hispanics when they used it primarily back in the 1800s , and we won't admit that we made a mistake with banning it.


Historically not one person has died from overdose on marijuana not ONE. However, you see many people overdosing on alcohol and involved in DWI charges.

You never see this for marijuana. All you see is a black man who is arrested and then gets sent to jail for 30 years.

versus a white man who will get less than year or a slap on the wrist.

Finally, total hypocrisy is seen when marijuana is legalized in Alaska as an incentive to live there.

Alcohol was illegal during hte roaring twenties yet everyone bootlegged it. Its about time we legalize marijuana because it doesn't mess you up as long as everything is kept in line and you don't become a pothead.

1. Show me one real study that shows that alcoholics are less healthy than pothead MJ abusers. If your going to say it, back it up buddy.

2. We do not measure the safety of a drug by whether overdosing is possible. That is irrelevant! However, scientific studies show users are just as impaired at driving as alcohol users, and DUI covers MJ use too. Yes, you DO see this for MJ, although you claim you NEVER do, I would be happy to show you some cases if you like.

3. You really think MJ is illegal because America is racist? Again, prove it to me. Or did you make this up too?

4. MJ is NOT legal in Alaska, the bill to do this did not pass, get your facts straight.

5. You say MJ does not "mess you up" Prove this to me. i know I can site studies showing the opposite.


You think weed is so safe, look at my next post for the REALITY with CITED RESEARCH rather than anecdotal made up evidence.
 
For all you guys who seem to know everything, here is some CITED information for you PROVING MJ is harmful, unhealthy, bad for your brain, and of course illegal. If you think you can refute any of this, go for it, but do it with cited scientific research or it means nothing!

Marijuana is an addictive drug1 with significant health consequences to its users and others. Many harmful short-term and long-term problems have been documented with its use:


The short term effects of marijuana use include: memory loss, distorted perception, trouble with thinking and problem solving, loss of motor skills, decrease in muscle strength, increased heart rate, and anxiety2.


In recent years there has been a dramatic increase in the number of emergency room mentions of marijuana use. From 1993-2000, the number of emergency room marijuana mentions more than tripled.


There are also many long-term health consequences of marijuana use. According to the National Institutes of Health, studies show that someone who smokes five joints per week may be taking in as many cancer-causing chemicals as someone who smokes a full pack of cigarettes every day.


Marijuana contains more than 400 chemicals, including most of the harmful substances found in tobacco smoke. Smoking one marijuana cigarette deposits about four times more tar into the lungs than a filtered tobacco cigarette.


Harvard University researchers report that the risk of a heart attack is five times higher than usual in the hour after smoking marijuana.3


Smoking marijuana also weakens the immune system4 and raises the risk of lung infections.5 A Columbia University study found that a control group smoking a single marijuana cigarette every other day for a year had a white-blood-cell count that was 39 percent lower than normal, thus damaging the immune system and making the user far more susceptible to infection and sickness.6


Users can become dependent on marijuana to the point they must seek treatment to stop abusing it. In 1999, more than 200,000 Americans entered substance abuse treatment primarily for marijuana abuse and dependence.


More teens are in treatment for marijuana use than for any other drug or for alcohol. Adolescent admissions to substance abuse facilities for marijuana grew from 43 percent of all adolescent admissions in 1994 to 60 percent in 1999.


Marijuana is much stronger now than it was decades ago. According to data from the Potency Monitoring Project at the University of Mississippi, the tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) content of commercial-grade marijuana rose from an average of 3.71 percent in 1985 to an average of 5.57 percent in 1998. The average THC content of U.S. produced sinsemilla increased from 3.2 percent in 1977 to 12.8 percent in 1997.7
Q. Does marijuana have any medical value?

Any determination of a drug's valid medical use must be based on the best available science undertaken by medical professionals. The Institute of Medicine conducted a comprehensive study in 1999 to assess the potential health benefits of marijuana and its constituent cannabinoids. The study concluded that smoking marijuana is not recommended for the treatment of any disease condition. In addition, there are more effective medications currently available. For those reasons, the Institute of Medicine concluded that there is little future in smoked marijuana as a medically approved medication.8


Advocates have promoted the use of marijuana to treat medical conditions such as glaucoma. However, this is a good example of more effective medicines already available. According to the Institute of Medicine, there are six classes of drugs and multiple surgical techniques that are available to treat glaucoma that effectively slow the progression of this disease by reducing high intraocular pressure.


In other studies, smoked marijuana has been shown to cause a variety of health problems, including cancer, respiratory problems, increased heart rate, loss of motor skills, and increased heart rate. Furthermore, marijuana can affect the immune system by impairing the ability of T-cells to fight off infections, demonstrating that marijuana can do more harm than good in people with already compromised immune systems.9


In addition, in a recent study by the Mayo Clinic, THC was shown to be less effective than standard treatments in helping cancer patients regain lost appetites.10


The American Medical Association recommends that marijuana remain a Schedule I controlled substance.


The DEA supports research into the safety and efficacy of THC (the major psychoactive component of marijuana), and such studies are ongoing, supported by grants from the National Institute on Drug Abuse.


As a result of such research, a synthetic THC drug, Marinol, has been available to the public since 1985. The Food and Drug Administration has determined that Marinol is safe, effective, and has therapeutic benefits for use as a treatment for nausea and vomiting associated with cancer chemotherapy, and as a treatment of weight loss in patients with AIDS. However, it does not produce the harmful health effects associated with smoking marijuana.


Furthermore, the DEA recently approved the University of California San Diego to undertake rigorous scientific studies to assess the safety and efficacy of cannabis compounds for treating certain debilitating medical conditions.


It's also important to realize that the campaign to allow marijuana to be used as medicine is a tactical maneuver in an overall strategy to completely legalize all drugs. Pro-legalization groups have transformed the debate from decriminalizing drug use to one of compassion and care for people with serious diseases. The New York Times interviewed Ethan Nadelman, Director of the Lindesmith Center, in January 2000. Responding to criticism from former Drug Czar Barry McCaffrey that the medical marijuana issue is a stalking-horse for drug legalization, Mr. Nadelman did not contradict General McCaffrey. "Will it help lead toward marijuana legaization?" Mr. Nadelman said: "I hope so."
Q. Does marijuana harm anyone besides the individual who smokes it?

Consider the public safety of others when confronted with intoxicated drug users:


Marijuana affects many skills required for safe driving: alertness, the ability to concentrate, coordination, and reaction time. These effects can last up to 24 hours after smoking marijuana. Marijuana use can make it difficult to judge distances and react to signals and signs on the road.11


In a 1990 report, the National Transportation Safety Board studied 182 fatal truck accidents. It found that just as many of the accidents were caused by drivers using marijuana as were caused by alcohol -- 12.5 percent in each case.


Consider also that drug use, including marijuana, contributes to crime. A large percentage of those arrested for crimes test positive for marijuana. Nationwide, 40 percent of adult males tested positive for marijuana at the time of their arrest.
Q. Is marijuana a gateway drug?

Yes. Among marijuana's most harmful consequences is its role in leading to the use of other illegal drugs like heroin and cocaine. Long-term studies of students who use drugs show that very few young people use other illegal drugs without first trying marijuana. While not all people who use marijuana go on to use other drugs, using marijuana sometimes lowers inhibitions about drug use and exposes users to a culture that encourages use of other drugs.


The risk of using cocaine has been estimated to be more than 104 times greater for those who have tried marijuana than for those who have never tried it.12
In Summary:

Marijuana is a dangerous, addictive drug that poses significant health threats to users.


Marijuana has no medical value that can't be met more effectively by legal drugs.


Marijuana users are far more likely to use other drugs like cocaine and heroin than non-marijuana users.


Drug legalizers use "medical marijuana" as red herring in effort to advocate broader legalization of drug use.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1Herbert Kleber, Mitchell Rosenthal, "Drug Myths from Abroad: Leniency is Dangerous, not Compassionate" Foreign Affairs Magazine, September/October 1998. Drug Watch International "NIDA Director cites Studies that Marijuana is Addictive." "Research Finds Marijuana is Addictive," Washington Times, July 24, 1995.
2National Institue of Drug Abuse, Journal of the American Medical Association, Journal of Clinical Phamacology, International Journal of Clinical Pharmacology and Therapeutics, Pharmacology Review.
3"Marijuana and Heart Attacks" Washington Post, March 3, 2000
4I. B. Adams and BR Martin, "Cannabis: Pharmacology and Toxicology in Animals and Humans" Addiction 91: 1585-1614. 1996.
5National Institute of Drug Abuse, "Smoking Any Substance Raises Risk of Lung Infections" NIDA Notes, Volume 12, Number 1, January/February 1997.
6Dr. James Dobson, "Marijuana Can Cause Great Harm" Washington Times, February 23, 1999.
72000 National Drug Control Strategy Annual Report, page 13.
8"Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base," Institute of Medicine, 1999.
9See footnotes in response to question 4 regarding marijuana's short and long term health effects.
10"Marijuana Appetite Boost Lacking in Cancer Study" The New York Times, May 13, 2001.
11Marijuana: Facts Parents Need to Know, National Institute on Drug Abuse, National Institutes of Health.
12Marijuana: Facts Parents Need to Know, National Institute on Drug Abuse, National Institutes of Health.
DEA Information on Marijuana use usdoj.gov/dea/ongoing/marijuana.html
 
Sure marijuana is stronger than it used to be. So now you just have to smoke less to get high :p I don't remember actually where I saw this study, but in fact a counter to that data about the THC content going up was a study that showed that in fact people do smoke proportionally less now.

Also, the BS about it being a gateway drug -- such nonsense. It's the most available drug, yes. So anybody who is likely to use drugs will probably use it first. That doesn't mean that because you use it you are therefore going to go use other drugs. It's like the argument that marijuana leads to crime because people who are arrested test positive. First of all, that includes people arrested for drugs -- of course they test positive. And unless you go out and test everybody, just saying that a certain percentage of people who are arrested test positive means absolutely nothing. It's all faulty logic.

Marijuana has its faults, for sure. Smoke too much of it for too long and you get a bit dull-headed, I'd say. My brother stopped smoking it as a young teen because he noticed it made his Tourrette's worse. But you know, I and tons of people I know used plenty of it in high school, and we all turned out fine. Of all of the people I know who used it in high school (this would be maybe over 30 or 40 people), all except 2 are now college juniors, seniors, or graduates and either in graduate school or employed. One of those other 2 is currently in college, having taken off time to pursue a musical career. The other I lost touch with, and she's the only one out of all of them who went on to use any harder drugs, and she had already started using them when she was very young (14 or so); yes, she had tried marijuana first, but only in passing, and it certainly wasn't her drug of choice. She was looking to do harder drugs from the start, by her own admission.

I'm not advocating marijuana use. In fact I think people shouldn't use it, although I'm not going to judge anybody for doing so. It was a mistake I made in the past. However, all of these propaganda arguments put out by the government or government-funded entities are just BS. I absolutely hate lies and I hate the governmental manipulation that goes into this cr*p.

Of course my own personal experiences amount to a case study of sorts, and may not be representative. I'd bet they are fairly representative, at least of middle-class teenage marijuana users. My arguments here aren't going to actually convince anybody of anything, I'm sure. Those of you who know propaganda and faulty logic when you see it will have already written off the previous post; those of you who actually believe it....well yeah.
 
god damn that's too much for me to read right now, i'll refute that some other itme.
 
Hermit MMood said:
god damn that's too much for me to read right now, i'll refute that some other itme.

that's what I thought.
 
medic170 said:
If you think you can refute any of this, go for it, but do it with cited scientific research or it means nothing!

It's very difficult to cite research when almost all research done in this area has been funded by anti-marijuana entitities. We are unwilling to accept biased drug studies for prescription drugs, and we should have the same attitude about other drugs as well.

Also, I'm wondering where you pulled this from. It's obviously pulled straight off some anti-drug propaganda page. I could certainly go to a pro-marijuana propaganda site and copy a whole bunch of stuff from there, but I'm not going to because it's not my own thoughts or reasoning. Also, you should really cite your source; I don't think you typed this stuff yourself.

An argument for illegality based on the ability of the drug to impair motor function such that it may lead to motor vehicle accidents is completely ludicrious, because alcohol is obviously legal and commonly leads to accidents. If you want to argue this, you should also argue for a return to Prohibition.

Countries that have legalized marijuana have not seen negative effects from this. Periodically there are articles in newspapers and magazines describing the results in these countries; I don't have the time or the energy to go search out info on this, but if you're at all interested in basing your opinion on reality, you should check it out.

Again, as I said above, I'm actually very much against marijuana use. [And even if I weren't against it in theory, I would be against it in practice only because it's silly to risk yourself by being in possession of an illegal drug.] There are many things I personally disapprove of, but I won't demonize anything based on shady info or shady logic. I support legalization of marijuana because I think it's stupid for it to be illegal. In America we have the right to make decisions for ourselves even if other people don't necessarily agree with them. This is a perfect example of that. To a certain degree we are forced to rely on personal responsibilty; every time we get into a car, we rely on the other motorists to not be intoxicated with alcohol or other drugs; to wear their glasses or contact lenses; to not drive if they are too ill to do so; etc. To what degree we legislate our own morality, however, is a very significant issue to consider.

I just have to add this: In an earlier post you responded to something by mentioning that murder is illegal. In doing so you basically equated smoking marijuana with murder. Don't you find that somewhat extreme? If not, please do explain.
 
tigress said:
However, all of these propaganda arguments put out by the government or government-funded entities are just BS. I absolutely hate lies and I hate the governmental manipulation that goes into this cr*p.

.

Most of what I put in there was cited with scientific studies. that negates it from being BS or from being a lie. It may turn out to be refuted, but for now, the studies show this and it is NOT fair to call it BS or lies when scientific studies are there to back it up.

Anyway, I am signing off. You people go ahead and smoke it, but if your such advocates, don't be hippocrates. Tell you interviewers, the ADCOMS, the dean of your schools, your attendings, and of course the police that you smoke pot and that it is safe. Are you willing to do that? let us know how it turns out in between looking for a new career and your court date.
 
tigress said:
Also, you should really cite your source; I don't think you typed this stuff yourself.
I did cite all the sources. What are you talking about? Also, if you people belive the research is biased, go ahead and point out the flaws in the methodology if you have no research to refute the findings.

As far as the murder thing, the guy said that laws that we think are bad laws are meant to be disobeyed. So I asked if I were to think the murder law is bad, if it is ok to kill him. I was pointing out the major flaw in his logic.
 
medic170 said:
I did cite all the sources. What are you talking about? Also, if you people belive the research is biased, go ahead and point out the flaws in the methodology if you have no research to refute the findings.

Did you type the entire text of what you posted? If so, I apologize, but it reads as if it were pulled from an anti-drug website. Not just the information, but the wording. All of the stuff in between the citations.
 
tigress said:
Did you type the entire text of what you posted? If so, I apologize, but it reads as if it were pulled from an anti-drug website. Not just the information, but the wording. All of the stuff in between the citations.

The citation for the text from the DEA site is at the very bottom
 
I was just talking to my husband about this and he pointed out that a research trying to get funding for a study involving marijuana (or any other illegal drug) basically can't get funding unless the grant proposal is specifically anti-marijuana in nature. There are also extreme resetrictions on its use in research not directed by the anti-marijuana agencies. That in and of itself should make you somewhat wary of the data. (no, I don't have citations right now. There was a long segment on NPR about it a while ago, and I personally knew a researcher who attempted to get funding for a study of this nature...that's as good as I can do right now)

You can't just say that something is from scientific research and therefore it is true. We should all be mature enough to realize that.
 
tigress said:
I was just talking to my husband about this and he pointed out that a research trying to get funding for a study involving marijuana (or any other illegal drug) basically can't get funding unless the grant proposal is specifically anti-marijuana in nature. There are also extreme resetrictions on its use in research not directed by the anti-marijuana agencies. That in and of itself should make you somewhat wary of the data. (no, I don't have citations right now. There was a long segment on NPR about it a while ago, and I personally knew a researcher who attempted to get funding for a study of this nature...that's as good as I can do right now)

You can't just say that something is from scientific research and therefore it is true. We should all be mature enough to realize that.

I see your point here. Look, my original point, that was refuted by several posters, was that:
1. MJ in illegal, so people should NOT be using it, because it is illegal, using it is bad. If they believe in it so much, why not just tell the med school adcom they like to smoke pot and see if they get admitted.
2. MJ is unhealthy in several known ways, and who knows if there are more. Somebody said it was healthier that cigarettes, another said that it is actually GOOD for your brain.
3. MJ is a psychoactive substance that is, at least, psychologically addictive, mood altering, and nobody really knows what long lasting harmful affects it can have on the brain

Do you really disagree with any of these points?????? Can these points, at least, be accepted as facts?
 
medic170 said:
Did you/would you tell your med school med school interviewers, or the ADCOM, when they asked what you like to do to relax, that you like to get high smoking weed? I bet not, but why not be honest if there is nothing wrong with it.
If the ADCOM asked what you do to relax, would you tell him that you masterbate? Why not be honest, if there is nothing wrong with it?

Sloppy logic, boy, sloppy logic...
 
notdeadyet said:
If the ADCOM asked what you do to relax, would you tell him that you masterbate? Why not be honest, if there is nothing wrong with it?

Sloppy logic, boy, sloppy logic...


I don't do that though. However, i did tell them I like to spend quiet evenings home alone with my wife. My logic stands.
 
medic170 said:
I see your point here. Look, my original point, that was refuted by several posters, was that:
1. MJ in illegal, so people should NOT be using it, because it is illegal, using it is bad. If they believe in it so much, why not just tell the med school adcom they like to smoke pot and see if they get admitted.
2. MJ is unhealthy in several known ways, and who knows if there are more. Somebody said it was healthier that cigarettes, another said that it is actually GOOD for your brain.
3. MJ is a psychoactive substance that is, at least, psychologically addictive, mood altering, and nobody really knows what long lasting harmful affects it can have on the brain

Do you really disagree with any of these points?????? Can these points, at least, be accepted as facts?

1. Yes, marijuana is illegal. Hard to dispute that :laugh: Is using it "bad"? No, I don't think so. I don't think in black and white like that. It's risky, true. Why not tell the med school adcom that you smoke it? Well, like an above poster said, when asked what you like to do for fun, you probably wouldn't say "have sex," or "sit around reading internet joke sites."
2. Yup, marijuana isn't healthy. Although if you eat it, it's not actually so bad for you at all. I would say it is overall better than cigarettes, in that most people do not smoke enough marijuana to damage their lungs to the extent that cigarette smokers do. However this is certainly not universal, and marijuana is potentially very bad for your health. So is alcohol, of course. Moderation in all things is key. If somebody wishes to use marijuana and not risk their health in doing so, I believe that is possible.
3. It is unclear what lasting effects marijuana has on the brain. It is perhaps psychologically addicting, but so is the internet, shopping, pornography, chocolate, etc. As I said above, used in moderation it can have no ill effects on a person's life. The long-term effects on the brain are somewhat bothersome to me. I personally wouldn't risk my intelligence for the sake of getting high. I also don't drink to get drunk for the same reason. But I do believe in freedom of personal choice. If somebody thinks that risk is worth it, fine by me.
 
medic170 said:
I don't do that though. However, i did tell them I like to spend quiet evenings home alone with my wife. My logic stands.

So people can just say, "I like hanging out with my friends," and this can mean they like to smoke pot. It's just as evasive as "I like to spend quiet evenings home alone with my wife," when what you really mean is "I like to have sex with my wife."
 
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