Ended up getting a fairly rough M3 schedule...

[Treebeard]

My first 2 rotations are OB and then Surgery. I am interested in surgery and hopefully urology depending how Step 1 goes. Not my ideal situation obviously, and there is a process to try to get some swaps but no guarantees. If I am going for urology, my home program director specifically told me he likes to see honors in these + IM 🙁

Is it possible to get honors in these rotations so early in the year? Any advice for doing so?

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[HomeSkool]

Of course it's possible; someone will get honors on every rotation and there's no reason that can't be you. The basic recipe for success on any rotation is the same: work hard, study hard, be proactive, do a good job on your pre-rounding and notes, be an engaged and interested learner, and play nicely with others.

 

[raiderette]

Yes, it is possible, but it can be difficult. The great thing for you is that OB will help you with surgery. You will go in feeling more comfortable. I would say for ob/gyn, study extremely hard for your test, since in most places that can make honoring much easier. The surgical test has a lot of IM material.

 

[Treebeard]

Yes, it is possible, but it can be difficult. The great thing for you is that OB will help you with surgery. You will go in feeling more comfortable. I would say for ob/gyn, study extremely hard for your test, since in most places that can make honoring much easier. The surgical test has a lot of IM material.

Would you suggest studying from an IM resource in addition to surgery resources while on my surgery rotation?

 

[Redpancreas]

My first 2 rotations are OB and then Surgery. I am interested in surgery and hopefully urology depending how Step 1 goes. Not my ideal situation obviously, and there is a process to try to get some swaps but no guarantees. If I am going for urology, my home program director specifically told me he likes to see honors in these + IM 🙁

Is it possible to get honors in these rotations so early in the year? Any advice for doing so?

A good rule of thumb with all of this is that for every disadvantage there is an advantage. Here are the advantages I see:

1. You have a surgical rotation before surgery. There are a lots of overlap in concepts (i.e. acute abdomen, medical vs. surgical management decisions, pre-operative evaluations) that will prepare you for surgery. In addition to that, you can use OB/GYN as an opportunity to practice your knots, etc. whenever you are given the chance so by the time you're on surgery you'll be able to do basic closures.

2. You have IM last so you'll come into that with a good knowledge base.

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Don't let your home program director's words turn into an absolute. That will stress you out. Your Home PD can loftily throw out his ideals, but at the end of the day he'll be at the mercy of the match which favors the applicant like every other program. Take solace in the fact that thousands of now urology attendings and residents matched at great programs and many probably did it without honoring OB, Surgery, and Internal Medicine. Also know that residents and attendings know what time of year it is and you'll be evaluated relative to your experience not some absolute scale (with exception to the shelf). In regards to that, I guess start reading some Devirgilio's but go very slowly or else you'll burn out.

 

[ciestar]

Would you suggest studying from an IM resource in addition to surgery resources while on my surgery rotation?

I havent done surgery yet, but most say parts of UWorld are great for surgery too.

 

[CherryRedDracul]

Would you suggest studying from an IM resource in addition to surgery resources while on my surgery rotation?

From what I remember 4 years ago, my surgery shelf was largely a medicine shelf with some surgical management questions here and there. I don't know how much that's changed.

 

[raiderette]

Would you suggest studying from an IM resource in addition to surgery resources while on my surgery rotation?

Yes. That is how I made sure to honor. Also, read through the Surgery thread on clinical rotation on SDN and use resources. I am most likely doing ob/gyn and was told to honor surgery.

 

[Entadus]

Suck it up buttercup! Let me get this straight, you want a career in uro to spend your life as a surgeon, and you're not super excited to shine on your clerkships and make it happen?

Your M3 schedule is hard? What do you think your surgical internship will be like? Really, spend 2 minutes and think about that.

My advice is go buy Pestana and some thread and stay nerdy after your step 1 is over

 

[Treebeard]

Suck it up buttercup! Let me get this straight, you want a career in uro to spend your life as a surgeon, and you're not super excited to shine on your clerkships and make it happen?

Your M3 schedule is hard? What do you think your surgical internship will be like? Really, spend 2 minutes and think about that.

My advice is go buy Pestana and some thread and stay nerdy after your step 1 is over

Nooo I am very excited to get out of the classroom and into the OR and hospital. I am just nervous about having 2 of my most important rotations first up in the year and looking for tips on how to succeed.

 

[raiderette]

Nooo I am very excited to get out of the classroom and into the OR and hospital. I am just nervous about having 2 of my most important rotations first up in the year and looking for tips on how to succeed.

There is a reason why those of us with a choice don't put our preferred rotation first. But you can do this.

 

[operaman]

If anything the early rotations are an advantage. I frontloaded mine too and honored all of them. What you lose in shelf prep you gain in clinical leeway as people understand there’s a bit of a learning curve.

In addition to busting your tail, make sure to tell people you want to do a surgical field. Be interested and people will like you.

The surgery shelf is NOT a medicine shelf despite what people say. It just seems like it. Focus on surgery material and lots of practice questions and you’ll do just fine.

 

[afib123]

this just depends on the person you are. if you are fast learner, adaptable but not a good test taker, this is a good spot to have the rotation in. Ob/gyn will set you up nicely for the OR. shelf exams are traditionally not too high in the first few clerkships because people are still learning how to do well, so if you are not a good test taker this will benefit as class averages will be lower especially if you are curved against everyone else.

If you are an excellent test taker, and methodical/slow learner, having it after IM might benefit you more as you will exposed more to the wards and clinical knowledge.

either way but just don't say anything stupid or ask questions without trying to look up the answer first. as long as you ask 1-2 thoughtful questions a day and are attentive and prepared for rounds, no one really expects more

 

[ortnakas]

MS3 schedule ends up mattering far less than it feels like it will as a MS2.

Work hard, study, and you’ll be okay.

 

[831929]

If you get any choice in your obgyn rotation schedule maybe spend more time with surgical parts like urogyn and gyn onc. Otherwise, study hard and be a nice hard working person and shouldn't be an issue. Make sure you work hard for the shelf exams. Those are hard and you don't want to wait till last week to study.

 

[Eyeronic]

Opening this thread made me feel the need for a cigarette, or 50. I don't miss this.

Of course you can honor Surgery. I had no business being in the OR and I honored Surgery without having either IM or OB/GYN before it, and honors were not handed out like candy as even several ~250 Step 1 kids on my block who ended up becoming surgeon sub-specialists did not get honors.

Come flying straight out of the gate, and destroy the OB/GYN rotation. Find those threads we all posted in 10 years ago that talk about ways to absolutely kill the shelf exam. When it's time for a powerpoint presentation, slaughter it. We can't guide you on the interpersonal stuff that will matter; just don't royally screw up. What everyone says is correct, this is excellent preparation for the Surgery rotation. Set the tone, and set the bar high for yourself. Period.

 

[Treebeard]

Opening this thread made me feel the need for a cigarette, or 50. I don't miss this.

Of course you can honor Surgery. I had no business being in the OR and I honored Surgery without having either IM or OB/GYN before it, and honors were not handed out like candy as even several ~250 Step 1 kids on my block who ended up becoming surgeon sub-specialists did not get honors.

Come flying straight out of the gate, and destroy the OB/GYN rotation. Find those threads we all posted in 10 years ago that talk about ways to absolutely kill the shelf exam. When it's time for a powerpoint presentation, slaughter it. We can't guide you on the interpersonal stuff that will matter; just don't royally screw up. What everyone says is correct, this is excellent preparation for the Surgery rotation. Set the tone, and set the bar high for yourself. Period.

This post made me feel inspired, thanks 🙂

 

[Frazier]

My M3 schedule started with the sequence:
IM, Surgery, OBGYN, inpatient peds...

It was a fast start to clinical medicine. Get ready to work your ass off for a few months.

It's done by many students every single year. Someone has to man these rotations. Someone has to pull the honors... Might as well be you.

Look up old advice on here and speak with some of your MS4's for tips. Tactfully get the attendings expectations for honors early in the rotation (i.e. dont introduce yourself as "hi, I'm Sam. Nice to meet you. So anyway, I'm interested in urology, what do i need to do for honors?")

Good luck.

And the unlucky stretches of rotations dont stop with MS3. My current residency schedule? ...MICU, PICU, MICU...

 

[Treebeard]

Thanks everyone! I'm feeling good about this now actually. Work my butt off June-November and I'll be able to take a breath toward the end of the year.

 

[mrbreakfast]

It could be worse. I started with IM and spent my first week as an M3 getting pimped on vent settings and antibiotic dosages.

Starting on OBGYN is big, because it's the most similar rotation to surgery. Learn to tie knots well and you'll score points later on in the surgical OR. Study hard (and study some IM, too) but frequently ask the residents what else you could do better. Tell the surgical residents you want to do surgery and honor the rotation. They'll work you harder but ideally that will lead to better evaluations.

Surgery is a good rotation to earn brownie points by doing scut work. Ask a resident to show you how to remove sutures, then do it for them in the future. If an ED consult comes in and the team is swamped, volunteer to go take the history by yourself and page the resident when you're done. In my experience, compared to other residents, the surgery residents cared much less about how much we knew and much more about how much we could help them out.

And for any surgical case, spend 5 minutes beforehand reading about the procedure and about the patient. Sounds really obvious, but the students I saw who got in the most trouble on surgery were going into ORs without knowing anything about what the procedure was or why it was being done for that particular patient.

 

[Eyeronic]

If an ED consult comes in and the team is swamped, volunteer to go take the history by yourself and page the resident when you're done.

Glad you mentioned this.
Rather than memorize IM material before you do Surgery, far more high-yield to teach yourself some:
1.) Emergency Medicine (perhaps get the latest ER case files and get thru it cover to cover before the rotation?)
2.) Radiology (CXR, Head CT, etc.)

Yet another way to succeed on the Surgery rotation, particularly when on the front lines and doing an initial ER consult for the intern/resident, is to have a good know-how of when the patient does NOT need the OR.