Equine Internships and dogs

[SaintEx]

I'm a 3rd year veterinary student currently putting together my clinical year schedule and looking ahead at internships. For my clinical year, my 2 medium sized dogs will be staying with my fiancé when I'm on my equine externships. But, I am starting to worry about what to do with them during my internship. I can't imagine living away from them for an entire year, especially if I am multiple states away (likely). I know some internships allow interns to have pets, but how common is this? What are you guys planning to do with your dogs during internships? These guys have gotten me through vet school, and are sometimes the only thing I look forward to each day. I would be willing to leave one with my fiancé and only take one with me, but I am not sure I can survive dogless and I'm not sure my fiancé can handle all 3 of our dogs alone.

Sorry if this is completely illiterate, my brain is fried.

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[WhtsThFrequency]

How could an internship not allow you to have pets? Unless you were living in subsidized housing that the hospital owned and they did not allow animals. An internship is basically a job, and your job couldn't tell you not to live with pets in your own apartment/house.

 

[PippyPony]

I'm assuming the concern is not housing, but rather the number of hours per day that interns expect to be away from their houses, combined with inability to pay for a dog walker on an intern salary...?

 

[PippyPony]

In any case, paging @mizchiefmanaged

 

[SaintEx]

Nearly all equine internships require interns to live in the hospital so that they are available to take care of hospitalized patients and emergencies. Many of these don’t allow pets due to insurance purposes.

 

[mizchiefmanaged]

Nearly all equine internships require interns to live in the hospital so that they are available to take care of hospitalized patients and emergencies. Many of these don’t allow pets due to insurance purposes.

This isn’t necessarily true anymore. I’m actually starting to see off-farm housing more and more. My internship did NOT have on-site housing available so I brought my dog and parrot with me. I live close enough that I’m able to sneak home to let her out if needed. Another internship I was interested in had a camper on site for interns and they allowed dogs, so I think even some on site housing places allow dogs. It’s definitely doable!

 

[mizchiefmanaged]

I’m away from my husband this year and would be a mess without my dog.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Nearly all equine internships require interns to live in the hospital so that they are available to take care of hospitalized patients and emergencies. Many of these don’t allow pets due to insurance purposes.

That’s awful. Damn. I can understand being required to live within, say, a 10 to 15 minute radius....but at the actually facility? In some crappy little studio thing behind the barns most likely? What about people with families? Single parents? How ridiculous

 

[SaintEx]

That’s awful. Damn. I can understand being required to live within, say, a 10 to 15 minute radius....but at the actually facility? In some crappy little studio thing behind the barns most likely? What about people with families? Single parents? How ridiculous

Every externship I have set up requires interns to live in the hospital on nights that they are on call and highly recommended full time. Fun fact, you are pretty much always on call at clinics that don’t have a bunch of interns.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Every externship I have set up requires interns to live in the hospital on nights that they are on call and highly recommended full time. Fun fact, you are pretty much always on call at clinics that don’t have a bunch of interns.

Staying in the hospital when you are on call is one thing and understandable. Having to live there full time (where exactly does one live in a hospital anyways? Do they at least have an apartment block right next door? Or do they have bunk bed in the call room or something and a shower and kitchen somewhere?) is a whole nother matter. Horse people be cray.

 

[SaintEx]

Staying in the hospital when you are on call is one thing and understandable. Having to live there full time (where exactly does one live in a hospital anyways? Do they at least have an apartment block right next door? Or do they have bunk bed in the call room or something and a shower and kitchen somewhere?) is a whole nother matter. Horse people be cray.

Typically they have an apartment with several bedrooms and a shared living space for interns and externs that is attached to the hospital. This is a “perk” to be added on to your $20,000 a year salary.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Typically they have an apartment with several bedrooms and a shared living space for interns and externs that is attached to the hospital. This is a “perk” to be added on to your $20,000 a year salary.

And at the end of the day, so many of the horses come to me anyways What a racket.

 

[Minnerbelle]

Horse people be cray.

You just realized this?

 

[VIN-Foundation]

The terms "intern", "resident" and "house officer" all have a similar origin. The doctor in training resided or was interned in the "house", the hospital.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

The terms "intern", "resident" and "house officer" all have a similar origin. The doctor in training resided or was interned in the "house", the hospital.

True enough. Doesn't mean that we should support such a practice being the expected norm (the whole "I suffered so you should suffer too" argument), unless the internship is in a place where there is literally nowhere else to live. Of course when you're on call I can see staying there...but 24/7? What about people who have spouses and/or children? Is the family expected to live there too? Or are you de facto expected to leave them for 1-3 years? What about single parents? As far as I know, small animal interns/residents typically do not live AT the hospital - simply close by to be able to get over there quickly. I didn't know equine was so different.

If there is anything I have learned thus far in my career, it is that having a space outside of work - even if it is a small space, and even if it just a small amount of time - is essential to ones well-being. Especially in the pressure cooker of internships/residencies.

 

[PippyPony]

Yep. I want to do an internship, but not if I'm going to have to leave my family.

10 years ago I probably would have been ok with it, but now? Hard no. I'm too old for that and would feel very out of place and alone. And we don't even have kids yet.

 

[PippyPony]

@WhtsThFrequency I'm glad you are bringing up families and single parents, because I feel like vet med still has a ways to go on that front. I appreciate someone bringing up ways in which the current system may shut people out.

 

[yogapony]

Many (most, probably) equine internships require you to live on site, and provide housing. This is because, generally speaking, you are always on call and need to be available to help with inpatients or emergencies.

 

[WhtsThFrequency]

Many (most, probably) equine internships require you to live on site, and provide housing. This is because, generally speaking, you are always on call and need to be available to help with inpatients or emergencies.

I understand the supposed rationale. Yet this type of required arrangement seems uncommon in, say, small animal internships. Where interns also need to be available to help with inpatients and emergencies, and are almost always on call as well - they just have to live within a certain radius of the hospital (5-15 minutes or thereabouts) in order to get there quickly. They don't typically do this in human medicine either.

Unless it is an issue with lack of places to live near the hospital (i.e. rural areas) this whole living on site things smacks more of tradition than anything else.

Anyway, sorry I can't help with the original question, OP.

 

[yogapony]

I do think there is often limited (or no) housing options close enough to be reasonable. Even the people I know who lived off site during their internships admitted that they ended up spending many nights sleeping on the couch at the intern house anyway though, just because it becomes more practical to be at the hospital, especially if it's a hospital that requires interns to split up the overnight patient duties each night. Honestly I feel like paying rent for a place you would barely see seems even more unreasonable than living on site in free housing.

 

[PippyPony]

Honestly I feel like paying rent for a place you would barely see seems even more unreasonable than living on site in free housing.

This is true if you are 25...but my husband and I are 36, and if I told him he had to move into a studio connected to the hospital, we would no longer be married. It has zero to do with how committed I would be to my job. Work ≠ home.

If you want to live at a hospital and are young and single and looking to save money, then sure. I can see how that would make sense.

The point is just that a setup like that one is completely bonkers if you're not in that life stage, and thus making it mandatory is potentially prohibitive to qualified applicants who cannot feasibly live like that.

 

[PippyPony]

But like... godspeed to people who do want that. You do you.

 

[yogapony]

Sometimes people who are married and the spouse will be moving locally will end up living nearby. But I'd say more often than not the non-intern partner stays behind at their established location while the intern does their thing for a year. My intern group had two people who fell into the "25-28 and single" category. The others were in established relationships - married or engaged. The husbands/fiances stayed at the house when they visited, but all of them lived elsewhere. All of these people were 30-37 years old. It's only a year, and honestly it's less stressful to have them somewhere else and knowing that quality time will be limited to the maybe one day off you get a week, rather than feeling guilty for having to spend 16 hours a day in the hospital and not make it home in time for anything, crashing into bed exhausted, and getting up 5 hours (if you're lucky) later to do it all again. Equine internships just operate differently than small animal.

 

[PippyPony]

All of these people were 30-37 years old. It's only a year, and honestly it's less stressful to have them somewhere else and knowing that quality time will be limited to the maybe one day off you get a week,

Right...but as @WhtsThFrequency said, I don't think a single parent (or any parent, tbh) is going to be able to swing "only a year" of sending their kid off to live with someone else. Straight up, that is cray cray and is going to exclude some otherwise qualified people from pursuing a career in that area of vet med.

Just because something was done a certain way in the past does not make it good. And honestly -- perpetuating the "it's just a year" mentality smacks of denial. We have a term for supporting terrible living conditions because it makes sense in context. Again, you do you -- consider me one less person who will be competing with you for those internship spots.

 

[battie]

Equine internships at academia don't have the interns living at the school (at least not my school). They have to live within 15 minutes of the school and they know their in house shifts at least a week before hand if not sooner.

I don't really see a reason for equine internships to have interns living onsite the whole year. An argument can be made for lack of staffing. But my school is regularly down a tech or two in large animal land, and we still manage. And, if a facility is that down on staff that the intern needs to be right there, should they really be running an internship to begin with?

 

[SaintEx]

I have been in a long distance relationship for going on 9 years. My dogs are my only family that I have with me every day. When I went to vet school is was “only 4 years”. Now I’m looking ahead at an extra year but this time with out my significant other AND without my dogs. I don’t know if I can mentally handle it. My significant other has a wonderful job and we own a beautiful home. It doesn’t make sense for him to come with me but, there are no internships that I am interested in near by. I need this internship to get where I want to be, but I really can’t imagine not having at least one of my dogs, some sanity, with me. I am prepared for the misery that comes with an internship, I just would like to endure it with one (preferably both) of my pups.

 

[battie]

I need this internship to get where I want to be, but I really can’t imagine not having at least one of my dogs, some sanity, with me. I am prepared for the misery that comes with an internship, I just would like to endure it with one (preferably both) of my pups.

Possibly consider academia. At my school, interns live within 15 minutes doing what they do. I can't imagine it varies greatly from school to school.

 

[mizchiefmanaged]

I have been in a long distance relationship for going on 9 years. My dogs are my only family that I have with me every day. When I went to vet school is was “only 4 years”. Now I’m looking ahead at an extra year but this time with out my significant other AND without my dogs. I don’t know if I can mentally handle it. My significant other has a wonderful job and we own a beautiful home. It doesn’t make sense for him to come with me but, there are no internships that I am interested in near by. I need this internship to get where I want to be, but I really can’t imagine not having at least one of my dogs, some sanity, with me. I am prepared for the misery that comes with an internship, I just would like to endure it with one (preferably both) of my pups.

What part of the country are you looking at for an internship?

 

[SaintEx]

What part of the country are you looking at for an internship?

As long as it's in the United States, I am happy. I am much more interested in finding a solid program that will provide me with good learning opportunities and mentorship. That being said, all of the places I have set up rotations with are up and down the east coast. I start in south Florida and end in New Hampshire.

 

[yogapony]

Right...but as @WhtsThFrequency said, I don't think a single parent (or any parent, tbh) is going to be able to swing "only a year" of sending their kid off to live with someone else. Straight up, that is cray cray and is going to exclude some otherwise qualified people from pursuing a career in that area of vet med.

Just because something was done a certain way in the past does not make it good. And honestly -- perpetuating the "it's just a year" mentality smacks of denial. We have a term for supporting terrible living conditions because it makes sense in context. Again, you do you -- consider me one less person who will be competing with you for those internship spots.

It's not for everyone. But internship in general isn't for everyone. I think it's important that everyone seek the opportunities that are the best fit for their lifestyle and career goals, and respect that other people may not share or understand your choices. You don't have to compete with me for those internship spots, because I've already completed mine. There's no denial involved; living off-site would have added to the stress and definitely reduced the amount of sleep. Equine hospitals and internships just function differently than small animal. It was a ridiculously exhausting year, there were multiple occasions where I worked for 48 straight hours, and it wasn't unusual for us interns to not have time to leave the property at all for over a week at a time. There were days I absolutely hated it. But being on the other side of it and out in practice, I am grateful EVERY DAY for having done it, on a personal and professional level.

To the OP - my dogs lived with my fiance. They got more attention than I would have been able to give them, and I saw them on my days off. I know people who interned in various places along the east coast and lived off-site with their dogs. I also know people who were allowed to have pets in their intern housing. Just be sure to know ahead of time what the expectations are for interns and living arrangements, and what the overnight responsibilities are. If there is local housing that isn't cost-prohibitive, often interns pass it down year to year. Know when you're applying what those expectations are so that you can make an informed decision.