Exhaling before you dive??

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whatsupdoc7

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Can anyone please explain to me why it's better to exhale before you dive? Why can we hold our breathe longer this way? I was listening to Dr. Kudrath explaining this but I still don't understand why emptying the conducting zone will help? Can someone please clarify this??
 
Can anyone please explain to me why it's better to exhale before you dive? Why can we hold our breathe longer this way? I was listening to Dr. Kudrath explaining this but I still don't understand why emptying the conducting zone will help? Can someone please clarify this??

I thought it was related more to the fact that it's not hypoxia that is the primary drive for respiration, but the build up of CO2 that stimulates breathing. By hyperventilating (or i guess even exhaling) you blow off CO2 and delay your body's sensing of hypercarbia. It's just bad news if you do it too much and then pass out underwater...
 
I thought it was related more to the fact that it's not hypoxia that is the primary drive for respiration, but the build up of CO2 that stimulates breathing. By hyperventilating (or i guess even exhaling) you blow off CO2 and delay your body's sensing of hypercarbia. It's just bad news if you do it too much and then pass out underwater...

👍
 
Truth.

It's the hyperventilation that let's you stay down longer. I remember for my scuba certification they made us do this to see the difference. It was pretty impressive!

Never heard of just exhaling before a dive; although you are supposed to exhale on the way up for pv=nrt reasons.
 
Truth.

It's the hyperventilation that let's you stay down longer. I remember for my scuba certification they made us do this to see the difference. It was pretty impressive!

Never heard of just exhaling before a dive; although you are supposed to exhale on the way up for pv=nrt reasons.

I thought it was due to Dynamic Compression that you give a hard exhale so that you trap some of the air in your airways (it has been a while before I have seen the Dr. Kudrath lecture though). So is this not correct?
 
Lots of diff thoughts... I thought he said that when you exhale quickly it will empty out your conducting zone the upper airways collapse, while trapping oxygen in the lower respiratory tract. Hence more oxygen available and allows to stay under water for longer.
 
Not sure what a Dr. Kudrath lecture is, but I'm going to give this a shot. I'm an M4, not a respiratory physiologist, so don't take this as Gospel. It's my informal opinion based on physiology and what I could find on pubmed & google.

You mentioned dynamic compression trapping air to help a dive. It's true dynamic compression may trap air, but dynamic compression is... dynamic. That is, it requires a process to perpetuate. In emphysema patients, for example, that process is continued expiration. Pressure from the thoracic wall translated to pressure on your respiratory tree, which due to elastic weaking from all those cigarettes can no longer tolerate those pressures, so they collapse. When the chest wall stops moving the system equilibrates and they expand again. I did not find anything in a medline search to suggest that the phenomenon of dynamic compression could be of benefit to diving.

One mention about 'why we exhale before diving' on a livestrong website said it was because of CO2, as mentioned above, which suggests that at least some in the field are based off the bicarb theory.

Diving reflex and thoracic squeeze in deep sea diving - As you descend, pressures increase and your lung compresses. When it drops below residual volume, this is known as 'thoracic squeeze.' It is potential fatal, and complications include hemoptysis and pulmonary edema (read: fluid extravasation 2/2 increased pressures in the thoracic cavity vs. alveoli). When you dive, your cold-water diving reflex causes your body to 1) bradycardia, 2) vasoconstric peripherally, and 3) shift blood into your thoracic cavity. Blood shift counteracts increased depth pressures and keeps your chest wall from collapsing as you dive. There is a theory that exhalation can help initiate your diving reflex, triggering these responses sooner.

Some diverse use a technique of glossopharyngeal exsufflation to simulate thoracic squeeze in more shallow waters. This causes their RV to decrease, which means that they have a greater threshold to reach thoracic squeeze and can dive deeper (this has actual data to support it, see below).

Exhalation before deep dives helps prevent decompression sickness because you do not have as much nitrogen present to diffuse into your blood.

In short, repeated exhalation is a technique used to prolong the length of a dive. Exhalation prior to descent has some data to suggest it may be useful in increases the depth of a dive.

Ok, well I hope that helps with at least some random party trivia. I hope someone who knows more about this subject than I would comment to clarify interesting topic.


http://www.livestrong.com/article/3...-a-surface-dive-in-a-lake-or-a-swimming-pool/

http://books.google.com/books?id=dW...epage&q=exhalation to increase diving&f=false
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18202166
 
Can anyone please explain to me why it's better to exhale before you dive? Why can we hold our breathe longer this way? I was listening to Dr. Kudrath explaining this but I still don't understand why emptying the conducting zone will help? Can someone please clarify this??

This is what I remember: Dr. Kudrath said that after a maximal inspiration, we should do a 'short forceful expiration' before diving to empty the conducting zone, thereby activating a reflex in the Bronchus to narrow them. This is the mechanism of 'dynamic compression of the airways', whereby the flow rate (of air) becomes independent of effort and dependent totally on radius...Flow proportional to radius, and by that token we can delay alveolar emptying and spend longer time under water...hope that makes some kinda sense and helps....🙂
 
This is what I remember: Dr. Kudrath said that after a maximal inspiration, we should do a 'short forceful expiration' before diving to empty the conducting zone, thereby activating a reflex in the Bronchus to narrow them. This is the mechanism of 'dynamic compression of the airways', whereby the flow rate (of air) becomes independent of effort and dependent totally on radius...Flow proportional to radius, and by that token we can delay alveolar emptying and spend longer time under water...hope that makes some kinda sense and helps....🙂

In terms of diving I think the explanation involving hypercarbia is accurate.

With the whole dynamic compression thing, all it means is that the flow becomes dependant simply on radius. By exhaling you empty conducting zone and decrease radius.

If you remember all those equations decreased radius = decreased flow. So decreased flow just means decreased expiratory flow = DELAYED EMPTYING.

That's my take on it.
 
This is what I remember: Dr. Kudrath said that after a maximal inspiration, we should do a 'short forceful expiration' before diving to empty the conducting zone, thereby activating a reflex in the Bronchus to narrow them. This is the mechanism of 'dynamic compression of the airways', whereby the flow rate (of air) becomes independent of effort and dependent totally on radius...Flow proportional to radius, and by that token we can delay alveolar emptying and spend longer time under water...hope that makes some kinda sense and helps....🙂

I just watched the lecture now, and found this thread. This explanation still does not make sense to me. How would a short forceful exhalation emptying of the conducting zone and causing bronchoconstriction prevent the alveoli from emptying any longer? The air pressure between the anatomical dead space and alveoli was already equilibrated after inhalation (it is all at atmospheric pressure) and no air would be leaving or entering the alveoli regardless.

If anything, it seems like after a short forceful expiration of air would leave the alveoli into the conducting zone to equilibrate air pressure since air was just exhaled from the conducting zone. I guess this explanation could make sense if CO2-driven breathing is the limiting factor of holding your breath, since CO2 diffusing into the alveoli would then move up into the negative pressure conducting zone as well, and allow a larger total CO2 volume to be expired before alveolar partial pressure of CO2 equilibrates with venous partial pressure CO2?

Anyone else have any input on this? I hate not understanding things! Maybe Dr. Kudrath is just throwing some pseudoscience at us all.
 
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