Failed Step 2

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

stella_artois

Junior Member
10+ Year Member
5+ Year Member
15+ Year Member
Joined
Oct 18, 2005
Messages
14
Reaction score
0
Hey,
I'm a longtime reader, and this is my first post. I just found out that I failed Step 2. I barely passed step 1 (176), and I thought I could handle taking step 2 during a non-time intensive rotation, but I guess I shouldn't have. I'm applying in psych and I don't think that I am going to get any interviews - I chose the automatically transmit option.
Does anyone have any study ideas for this next time around, and when i should try to take it - meaning as soon as I can or when I can feasibly take a full block off to study?
Any advice would be appreciated,
S
 
check out some of my other posts. I think a combo of Crush the boards and USMLEworld is a great place to start. (If you click on my name it will bring you to other posts.) Sorry to hear about your score. Probably it was just that you should have taken actual time off to study, I would say that should be your major change in tactics so that you have only one thing to worry about. Just focus on the test for a few weeks (2-3 should be adequate.)
 
Can you work your schedule around so that you can take a block off soon to study? Because that would be the best arrangement in terms of boosting your application and getting more interviews during peak interview season. I would say definitely take 3-4 weeks off to study -- maybe 2-3 weeks is enough, but another week is can't hurt, and you don't want to risk failing. Even though it's easier than Step 1 for a lot of people, it is still a ton of material. I'm sure if you had had enough time to study thoroughly, you would have passed the first time. But you'll get through this and go on to your residency, just like others before you have. Secrets, Boards and Wards, and USMLEworld seem to work for most people. They're what I used to study, but I'm still waiting for my scores, so I can't tell you whether they worked for me. 🙂 Good luck!
 
Thanks for the posts. I am going to speak to my dean's office about when and how to take it again.
one more q - have i totally ended my chances at matching at a good hosp?
 
stella_artois said:
Thanks for the posts. I am going to speak to my dean's office about when and how to take it again.
one more q - have i totally ended my chances at matching at a good hosp?

Absolutely not. I do believe that truly good programs look at more than just your scores, the real test is do after, what have you learned from it all...be ableto explain this opportunity that you had to retake Step 2. Do not ever let anyone make you believe that all the geniuses in the world never failed or made mistakes, the test is what did you do with the failure! One of the characteristics that doctors should have is empathy and the only way sometimes empathy is developed is if we go through difficulties ourselves...I believe you will do fine the next time around and it will surely make you a better person/doctor if you allow it to. All the best
 
stella_artois said:
Hey,
I'm a longtime reader, and this is my first post. I just found out that I failed Step 2. I barely passed step 1 (176), and I thought I could handle taking step 2 during a non-time intensive rotation, but I guess I shouldn't have. I'm applying in psych and I don't think that I am going to get any interviews - I chose the automatically transmit option.
Does anyone have any study ideas for this next time around, and when i should try to take it - meaning as soon as I can or when I can feasibly take a full block off to study?
Any advice would be appreciated,
S
Hi,
I'm sorry to hear that you didn't pass step 2. But, if you were close, just a few points away, I'm sure you will pass the 2nd time. It's in the past now, so all you can do is start studying again and prepare to take it again. You will still get some interviews...just tell them that you will take step 2 again ASAP.
Did you do Usmleworld and Kaplan Qbank? Did you take any of the NBME self assessments for $45 each? They are really good to predict your score and tell you how you are doing, so I'd recommend that.
I have a question though....when you say you got 176 on step 1, how long ago did you take it? I was just wondering when they changed the passing score to 182.
Good luck!
 
yobabydoc said:
Absolutely not. I do believe that truly good programs look at more than just your scores, the real test is do after, what have you learned from it all...be ableto explain this opportunity that you had to retake Step 2. Do not ever let anyone make you believe that all the geniuses in the world never failed or made mistakes, the test is what did you do with the failure! One of the characteristics that doctors should have is empathy and the only way sometimes empathy is developed is if we go through difficulties ourselves...I believe you will do fine the next time around and it will surely make you a better person/doctor if you allow it to. All the best


This was such a nice post, I can't say much except that I echo the sentiments here. I will say a prayer for you but I'm sure you will do fine - and the above poster is right, a good program you would WANT to be at will understand, so don't pay much mind to the ones that won't. 🙂
 
Thanks for all the encouraging words! I have rescheduled and I am going to start studying for it again. I did Qbank once through and none of the NBME assessments. This time, no QBank, just NBME assessmants, Step 2 Q Book and the released NBME questions. any opinions?
Hopefully it'll go fine this time.

I have also rescheduled most of my interviews for Jan b/c i want my new score to be out in time for programs to rank.

Thanks again,
Stella

ps. I took Step 1 in July 04. glad i took it then if they have changed the cutoff since!
 
I know just what you are going through, as I failed Step 2 CK last year. I felt as though my world had ended and that I had ruined all my chances for a "good" residency position. I agree with one of the above posts that you will get some interviews. Be sure to expand your list because yes, there will be programs who do not invite you because of your issue with Step 2, but there is not much you can do about that, so just focus on taking this again and passing. Put plenty of effort into studying for it -- it will help your score as well as your conifidence. I spent 3-4 weeks in March studying in the morning for a few hours followed by at least 2-3 hours of questions from a large question book... the name escapes me but it was Kaplan, or something. I think doing all those questions (I mean, hundreds and hundreds of questions) paid off for me; but be sure to figure out what areas you need work on.

I raised my score 26 points on my retake. I would never wish this to happen to anyone, but I grew a lot from the experience. I agree that going through something as difficult and confidence-shattering as this is very very scary, but then working hard and having success the second time around can be a very exhilirating experience.

You need some protected study time to do this right; be sure to work with your dean if you are having issues getting your credits in before graduation. They will make it work for you. Good luck and I will say a prayer for you. I've been there-- it sucks. But you'll get through it just fine. I know you will!!
 
hey,
here's a not so great update -i've been home studying for the past 2 wks from Kaplan's content books for the different fields and I have taken 3 Int Med tests in qbank, scoring about 55% on each, and this morning, i took an NBME assessment and did not pass (the score came out to 166 on the step 2 scale)! I am scheduled to take this exam next friday (12/30) and i think i am going to have to postpone. I have no idea how badly this might affect my chances going into match with only the failing score in my file. the only dates i can get now are like the 4th wk of jan, and i'll be interviewing for the first three weeks of january - so i don't know if the programs will even get the updated score in time to rank.

does anyone have any tips for reading/understanding the questions? i was planning to start studying out of crush and secrets, but now i don't know what to think. i feel like it is a problem with the test itself, not necessarily the content.
Thanks and i would appreciate your input,
Stella
 
If the score on the NBME self assessment is not a passing score, then definitely postpone the test even if it costs you money. The NBME self assessments are extremely accurate and you dont want your usmle transcript to take another hit.

Continue studying and don't lose hope. USMLEWorld is an excellent source of questions and is fairly cheap as compared to kaplan's qbank. Do as many questions as possible and make sure you read and understand the explanations. First Aid for USMLE Step 2 is a good review book although other people swear by Step 2 Secrets by by Borchard (?spelling).

Try to stay relaxed (obviously that is easier said than done in the present situation) because being nervous definitely detracts from studying. Study some more and do another $45 self assessment in a few weeks time.

One question about your original post: I thought the minimum step 1 passing score is 182, you wrote that you had a 176?
 
Definitely postpone the exam if you didn't get a passing score on the NBME assessments. You are probably close to passing, but you wouldn't want to risk it, so I think postponing the exam for a few weeks would be a good idea.
Don't get discouraged though!! Get more motivated instead to improve your score!
 
. . .have you considered withdrawing from the Match for this year? There is no way that programs would receive your score before they rank you if you re-take the exam in early January. I just took Step IICK on Monday, and they said allow 6 weeks for them to even transmit the score to you, and then there is a further short lag before they transmit them to residency programs. Considering that, even in a less-competitive field like Psych, you are unlikely to be ranked highly by a program if (as far as they know) you haven't passed Step II and barely passed Step I. You could always risk trying to find a place in the Scramble, but unless you bring up your Step II score dramatically (which will be hard to do if studying is interrupted all throughout January due to residency interviewing), you may not get a spot. Then, upon re-application next year, you would have to list on your Match application that you were an unsuccessful Match applicant previously, which many programs view as a major black mark. Although it sucks to have to postpone residency for a year, it could make you a much stronger applicant: by withdrawing now you won't have to list yourself as a previous failed Match candidate, you could devote the next year to psych research (which would go a long way towards counterbalancing the weaknesses of your application) and you could concentrate on getting the best Step II score possible without the added stress of worrying about residency placement.

I don't mean to be a downer, but be careful that some posts here don't give you false hope. Realistically, for right or wrong, USMLE scores are a major factor that ALL residency programs look carefully at, because many believe they are the best predictor of success on board certification exams after residency. Programs are not going to overlook your scores just because your letters of recommendation say you are a nice, compassionate person...a strong knowledge base is essential to all fields of medicine. Because of your scores, you will not be a competitive applicant to many programs (that is just a fact). You have a LONG career ahead of you--make sure that you are not making long-term sacrifices (such as being stuck out in a Scramble match spot in Wyoming!) for short-term gains.

As far as advice for the Step IICK itself, I would echo the advice of others. The USMLEWorld questions were great, although much harder than the actual exam. Be sure to take them with a legal notepad in hand, read the excellent answers THOROUGHLY and write down everything you didn't know. After doing all 2100 questions, I had 24 pages of notes from this resource. I also briefly used the Crush the Boards, but it was a bit simplistic. The book is good, though, for fleshing out your knowledge base and acquainting you with the "buzzwords" frequently used on the Boards (e.g. "patient from Brazil"=Chagas disease, "former shipyard worker"=asbestos exposure, etc.). I didn't use the NBME practice exams, but I keep hearing that they are a good reflection of what is actually on the test. Finally, ask yourself what is the real reason you keep doing poorly on these exams. Are you running out of time during the sections? If so, take the exam with a stopwatch next to you and practice with a big book of questions (like the NMBE USMLE Step II question book) until you are down to 1 min, 10 sec per question. Do you get anxious taking the test? Talk to your med school study counsel bureau for test taking advice. Is your knowledge base lacking? Flesh it out using a book like the BRS Pathology book (still the best book I have read in med school).
Whatever you decide, best of luck with both the Step II exam and the residency interview process!
 
The post above from HMS '05 gives excellent advice. I agree that withdrawing from the match is something you should consider.

About step 2CK, I would not take it next Friday if I were you. You need more time to bring up your score. The best way to do that is to do questions - many, many questions. I really liked USMLEWorld; I finished it a few days ago and now redoing questions I got wrong the first time. If you really read all of the explanations on UW and take notes or make yourself flashcards, you will pick up a lot of information. I was very impressed with USMLEWorld. I'm taking step 2CK tomorrow so I don't know for sure if my method worked, but I took the NBME practice test (the one you have to pay for, argh) and did very well, so I'm hoping my real score will be similar.
If you failed the NBME practice test, it's likely that you will fail the real thing, so it's probably best to delay the exam.
 
Hmmm ... I dunno. Plenty of people dont even take step II until after they've matched, as long as they get it done by the time they enter into the program. But obviously it will affect how you are ranked, if at all.

HMS '05 said:
. . .have you considered withdrawing from the Match for this year? There is no way that programs would receive your score before they rank you if you re-take the exam in early January. I just took Step IICK on Monday, and they said allow 6 weeks for them to even transmit the score to you, and then there is a further short lag before they transmit them to residency programs. Considering that, even in a less-competitive field like Psych, you are unlikely to be ranked highly by a program if (as far as they know) you haven't passed Step II and barely passed Step I. You could always risk trying to find a place in the Scramble, but unless you bring up your Step II score dramatically (which will be hard to do if studying is interrupted all throughout January due to residency interviewing), you may not get a spot. Then, upon re-application next year, you would have to list on your Match application that you were an unsuccessful Match applicant previously, which many programs view as a major black mark. Although it sucks to have to postpone residency for a year, it could make you a much stronger applicant: by withdrawing now you won't have to list yourself as a previous failed Match candidate, you could devote the next year to psych research (which would go a long way towards counterbalancing the weaknesses of your application) and you could concentrate on getting the best Step II score possible without the added stress of worrying about residency placement.

I don't mean to be a downer, but be careful that some posts here don't give you false hope. Realistically, for right or wrong, USMLE scores are a major factor that ALL residency programs look carefully at, because many believe they are the best predictor of success on board certification exams after residency. Programs are not going to overlook your scores just because your letters of recommendation say you are a nice, compassionate person...a strong knowledge base is essential to all fields of medicine. Because of your scores, you will not be a competitive applicant to many programs (that is just a fact). You have a LONG career ahead of you--make sure that you are not making long-term sacrifices (such as being stuck out in a Scramble match spot in Wyoming!) for short-term gains.

As far as advice for the Step IICK itself, I would echo the advice of others. The USMLEWorld questions were great, although much harder than the actual exam. Be sure to take them with a legal notepad in hand, read the excellent answers THOROUGHLY and write down everything you didn't know. After doing all 2100 questions, I had 24 pages of notes from this resource. I also briefly used the Crush the Boards, but it was a bit simplistic. The book is good, though, for fleshing out your knowledge base and acquainting you with the "buzzwords" frequently used on the Boards (e.g. "patient from Brazil"=Chagas disease, "former shipyard worker"=asbestos exposure, etc.). I didn't use the NBME practice exams, but I keep hearing that they are a good reflection of what is actually on the test. Finally, ask yourself what is the real reason you keep doing poorly on these exams. Are you running out of time during the sections? If so, take the exam with a stopwatch next to you and practice with a big book of questions (like the NMBE USMLE Step II question book) until you are down to 1 min, 10 sec per question. Do you get anxious taking the test? Talk to your med school study counsel bureau for test taking advice. Is your knowledge base lacking? Flesh it out using a book like the BRS Pathology book (still the best book I have read in med school).
Whatever you decide, best of luck with both the Step II exam and the residency interview process!
 
stella_artois said:
Hey,
I'm a longtime reader, and this is my first post. I just found out that I failed Step 2. I barely passed step 1 (176), and I thought I could handle taking step 2 during a non-time intensive rotation, but I guess I shouldn't have. I'm applying in psych and I don't think that I am going to get any interviews - I chose the automatically transmit option.
Does anyone have any study ideas for this next time around, and when i should try to take it - meaning as soon as I can or when I can feasibly take a full block off to study?
Any advice would be appreciated,
S

Take it ASAP. I would not worry too much about your failure and focus on what you can do. I would study as hard for it as possible. I would not withdraw from the match. If you don't match, you can scramble. Hopefully, if you do have to scramble, then your scores saying that you passed should help you find a position. You should not give up. If a PD asks about your failure then tell them that you are preparing to take the Step II again and will send the scores ASAP. You should see my academic record. Even, I received interviews which I had to cancel. Thus, hang in there. Interview season does not end until Feb. and scramble is in March. Try to have passed Step II by March 13th, 2006.

psychedoc2b
 
Anath said:
Hmmm ... I dunno. Plenty of people dont even take step II until after they've matched, as long as they get it done by the time they enter into the program. But obviously it will affect how you are ranked, if at all.

while it is true that a lot of people don't take step 2, and are ranked, it is because the assumption by the program is that the applicant WILL pass step 2. obviously, having already failed step 2 once, a program is going to be very, very hesitant to assume that this particulare applicant will pass. consider the consequences to the program...they match somebody who cannot start in july, they gotta get somebody last minute, they will not be getting the pick of the litter in july...

no offense to the OP, but if you don't have results by rank order day, i would echo the withdraw from the match advise. you don't want to either not match, or worse match and not be able to hold your end of the obligation. you will be far worse off next year. one candidate that i am familiar with this year was interviewed at several places last year for general surg, and wound up failing CS. this year he has ONE interview so far. i am of the opinion that his previous failure to meet obligations hurt him a LOT.

do some research, study hard and get a decent mark on step 2 ck, become a strong applicant. it is a big gamble, especially if your scores are currently projected well below passing. this is not the time to rush, and stress, as it will add to your anxiety, which will make it very difficult to perform well. take the pressure off, relax, and enjoy the year of becoming an excellent applicant.
 
Top