Falsifying Volunteer Hours

[Radon XP]

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This is what I was more concerned about. If his volunteering position is boring and useless, then sure he should quit it if he doesn't want to go anymore. But it's definitely not right to lie and say that you volunteer when you don't. It's one thing to quit, but another thing to quit but still lie and make the hospital think yore going just to gain an unfair advantage.

I feel like I might just send an anonymous comment to the program which tells them to watch out for this since there are rumors about it happening. I don't want to mention any names and tattle, so I'll tell them to just be wary of people falsifying their hours.

lol

I'm sure all the hospital staff are really hurting because that volunteer didn't show up one day.

 

[music2doc]

I volunteered in a hospital for about 50 hours. It was a monumental waste of time. I learned nothing, did nothing, and hated it. It showed me absolutely nothing about 'whether or not medicine is for me' -- that was why I shadowed.

See, I would say the exact opposite from my experience. Shadowing was a complete waste of time -- both as a pre-med and even as a medical student. Following a physician around for a few hours teaches about as much about practicing medicine as following Newton around all day would teach a 5th grader about Calculus. Unless you're getting in there and actually trying things, you're probably not going to get much out of the experience.

That's why I think actual clinical volunteering is so valuable. Sure, you can't get in and do what a physician does, but even if you are just getting BPs, temperatures, HR, a C/C, and the med list, you can still begin to develop an understanding of how physicians arrive at a diagnosis. As a pre-med, I did all of those things at a free clinic and I looked meds and diseases up to try to understand each patient's presenting pathology as best I could. I would encourage others to do their best to take advantage of clinical opportunities. That would impress an interviewer much more than would saying you'd hung out at the hospital for XYZ hours.

 

[music2doc]

lol

I'm sure all the hospital staff are really hurting because that volunteer didn't show up one day.

We don't, but it sure does reflect poorly upon the volunteers in general when one or more fail to meet expectations. You do that enough times and you could ruin it for everyone. Trust needs to be earned and there's no way I'd trust a volunteer who half-asses everything when my license, the RN's license, and the MD's license are all on the line.

 

[The Kraken]

See, I would say the exact opposite from my experience. Shadowing was a complete waste of time -- both as a pre-med and even as a medical student. Following a physician around for a few hours teaches about as much about practicing medicine as following Newton around all day would teach a 5th grader about Calculus. Unless you're getting in there and actually trying things, you're probably not going to get much out of the experience.

That's why I think actual clinical volunteering is so valuable. Sure, you can't get in and do what a physician does, but even if you are just getting BPs, temperatures, HR, a C/C, and the med list, you can still begin to develop an understanding of how physicians arrive at a diagnosis. As a pre-med, I did all of those things at a free clinic and I looked meds and diseases up to try to understand each patient's presenting pathology as best I could. I would encourage others to do their best to take advantage of clinical opportunities. That would impress an interviewer much more than would saying you'd hung out at the hospital for XYZ hours.

You shadowed the wrong way if you feel it was "waste of time". You will always remember an AKA with a gigli saw because the power saw didnt work that morning on a patient with hepatitis + diabetes who you just saw on rounds that morning and talked to. You will always remember their defeated/kicked dog look when they wake up from surgery without a leg. You will always remember them learning how to use crutches and crying in frustration. You will always remember seeing them progress and cleaning their stump that used to be a leg and just talking to them. Thats meaningful shadowing, and something pre meds should see.

 

[medguy13]

See, I would say the exact opposite from my experience. Shadowing was a complete waste of time -- both as a pre-med and even as a medical student. Following a physician around for a few hours teaches about as much about practicing medicine as following Newton around all day would teach a 5th grader about Calculus. Unless you're getting in there and actually trying things, you're probably not going to get much out of the experience.

That's why I think actual clinical volunteering is so valuable. Sure, you can't get in and do what a physician does, but even if you are just getting BPs, temperatures, HR, a C/C, and the med list, you can still begin to develop an understanding of how physicians arrive at a diagnosis. As a pre-med, I did all of those things at a free clinic and I looked meds and diseases up to try to understand each patient's presenting pathology as best I could. I would encourage others to do their best to take advantage of clinical opportunities. That would impress an interviewer much more than would saying you'd hung out at the hospital for XYZ hours.

Too bad you can't do this at most (all?) hospitals since they consider volunteers a liability. Only clinics. I cannot touch patients. All I get to do is make beds. Oh and run around the hospital doing chores like a b----.

 

[Planes2Doc]

We don't, but it sure does reflect poorly upon the volunteers in general when one or more fail to meet expectations. You do that enough times and you could ruin it for everyone. Trust needs to be earned and there's no way I'd trust a volunteer who half-asses everything when my license, the RN's license, and the MD's license are all on the line.

Well in many cases, the damage has already been done. Given the extensive volunteer commitments that pre-meds do, don't you think that they would have a wonderful reputation? Kind of like people and organizations that are actually altruistic and do good in the world?

Sadly, pre-meds have ruined it, and continue to keep ruining it for other people. In my opinion, I think that the hospitals should start cracking down on people who either half-ass everything or sign-in but then leave. The latter would have never been possible where I volunteered because it was a small suburban hospital away from any college campuses. In fact, the ED staff couldn't figure out why the hell I was providing free labor there. 🙄 As for larger hospitals with pre-meds crawling around, I can see how people can either leave hospital property or at least get away with spending their shifts studying, Facebooking, or doing other beneficial things like shadowing physicians.

It should be the responsibility of the hospital volunteer department to make sure pre-meds aren't doing such things. It's their job, right? But then again, why should anyone have to police things that people are doing BECAUSE THEY WANT TO OUT OF THE GOODNESS OF THEIR HEARTS? Well, unless there is an ulterior motive of course.

 

[music2doc]

You shadowed the wrong way if you feel it was "waste of time". You will always remember an AKA with a gigli saw because the power saw didnt work that morning on a patient with hepatitis + diabetes who you just saw on rounds that morning and talked to. You will always remember their defeated/kicked dog look when they wake up from surgery without a leg. You will always remember them learning how to use crutches and crying in frustration. You will always remember seeing them progress and cleaning their stump that used to be a leg and just talking to them. Thats meaningful shadowing, and something pre meds should see.

If you were talking w/ the pts and getting real interaction, you weren't really shadowing anymore. You were getting involved in a form of patient care. Personally, I much prefer to be the one in the driver's seat for my clinical experiences. I've never been the kind of person who wants to sit around and watch. (I also hate watching TV or playing sports and would much prefer to be either on the stage or out on the field.) Observing is just plain boring, IMO, and if you're interacting w/ pts, you're basically doing what a volunteer should be doing anyway.

 

[Goro]

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. Attributed to Emund Burke

There is good evidence that dishonest doctors start out as dishonest students. Do you want this guy doing surgery on your mom?

Do the right thing. Yeah, I know...hard to do.

This isn't about lying on AMCAS. This is about something different.

I was at my pre-med club's summer meeting, and I was talking to one guy that is part of a volunteering program in the nearby hospital. He says that for the first 50 hours of the program, he went to all his shifts and stayed there the whole time, to get some clinical experience. However, he said that after the first 40 hours, he just started going in to the hospital's lobby, signing in (on the sign-in sheet), and going back home. He did this until he met the 200 hour requirement. So basically, in reality he's not going to his volunteer shifts anymore, but if someone looks at the sign-in sheets, they'll think he is and give him credit for the hours.

My question is, what can be done about this? Will the hospital find out? Would medical schools be able to find out? If he puts 200 hours on the AMCAS, then even if ADCOMS call the hospital to verify, the hospital would just check the sign-in sheet records and see that he "volunteered" 200 hours even though he actually didn't (he just signed in and left). Its not fair that he's getting away with that while everyone else has to work for it.

 

[circulus vitios]

See, I would say the exact opposite from my experience. Shadowing was a complete waste of time -- both as a pre-med and even as a medical student. Following a physician around for a few hours teaches about as much about practicing medicine as following Newton around all day would teach a 5th grader about Calculus. Unless you're getting in there and actually trying things, you're probably not going to get much out of the experience.

That's why I think actual clinical volunteering is so valuable. Sure, you can't get in and do what a physician does, but even if you are just getting BPs, temperatures, HR, a C/C, and the med list, you can still begin to develop an understanding of how physicians arrive at a diagnosis. As a pre-med, I did all of those things at a free clinic and I looked meds and diseases up to try to understand each patient's presenting pathology as best I could. I would encourage others to do their best to take advantage of clinical opportunities. That would impress an interviewer much more than would saying you'd hung out at the hospital for XYZ hours.

The residents whom I shadowed took the the time to explain the underlying science behind their medical decisions, even though most of it was well over my head. They also allowed me to read through the patient's charts on the EMR system, and let me watch them present to the attendings. I thought it was much more valuable than volunteering, and it definitely gave me a much clearer idea of what it means to be a physician.

 

[Geebeejay]

See, I would say the exact opposite from my experience. Shadowing was a complete waste of time -- both as a pre-med and even as a medical student. Following a physician around for a few hours teaches about as much about practicing medicine as following Newton around all day would teach a 5th grader about Calculus. Unless you're getting in there and actually trying things, you're probably not going to get much out of the experience.

That's why I think actual clinical volunteering is so valuable. Sure, you can't get in and do what a physician does, but even if you are just getting BPs, temperatures, HR, a C/C, and the med list, you can still begin to develop an understanding of how physicians arrive at a diagnosis. As a pre-med, I did all of those things at a free clinic and I looked meds and diseases up to try to understand each patient's presenting pathology as best I could. I would encourage others to do their best to take advantage of clinical opportunities. That would impress an interviewer much more than would saying you'd hung out at the hospital for XYZ hours.

I agree that shadowing is a bit overglorified, but most volunteers can do none of those things. I don't see why any hospital would allow a non-paid non-employee do anything that eventually gets charted...

 

[Planes2Doc]

I agree that shadowing is a bit overglorified, but most volunteers can do none of those things. I don't see why any hospital would allow a non-paid non-employee do anything that eventually gets charted...

It's all pretty over glorified. It doesn't take hundreds of hours of volunteering or shadowing to decide whether being a doctor is for you and also to get accustomed to the clinical environment. It's much less than that.

Secondly, even if you were to spend way more time doing entry-level clinical work with direct patient contact, it still doesn't resemble what you would do as a physician in the future.

It's just one giant rat race to get as many hours as possible for many.

 

[SunsFun]

I agree that shadowing is a bit overglorified, but most volunteers can do none of those things. I don't see why any hospital would allow a non-paid non-employee do anything that eventually gets charted...

Agreed. Besides I think most patients coming to the hospital would prefer to have paid and trained full-time employee to do those things rather than some college kid volunteering several hours a week.

 

[KnuxNole]

Too bad you can't do this at most (all?) hospitals since they consider volunteers a liability. Only clinics. I cannot touch patients. All I get to do is make beds. Oh and run around the hospital doing chores like a b----.

Makes sense. If you want to be involved in that patient care aspect, DONT GO TO HOSPITALS. Being involved in free clinics is one way. Remember, hospital volunteering is far from the only way to get clincal exposure. 😉

I'm assuming the reason it's so popular for pre-meds to volunteer there is because of the easy access...

 

[KnuxNole]

It's all pretty over glorified. It doesn't take hundreds of hours of volunteering or shadowing to decide whether being a doctor is for you and also to get accustomed to the clinical environment. It's much less than that.

Secondly, even if you were to spend way more time doing entry-level clinical work with direct patient contact, it still doesn't resemble what you would do as a physician in the future.

It's just one giant rat race to get as many hours as possible for many.

Agreed. I think hours tends to be over glorified sometimes....

 

[Radon XP]

I'm a huge fan of the idea that if medical schools really want to see this sort of thing, they should just call it mandatory and develop a mechanism through which pre-meds can document their hours and find opportunities. I think Planes2Doc was talking about something along these lines.

 

[music2doc]

I agree that shadowing is a bit overglorified, but most volunteers can do none of those things. I don't see why any hospital would allow a non-paid non-employee do anything that eventually gets charted...

Who ever suggested getting your clinical experience in a hospital? Think outside the box a bit.... There are SOOO many other opportunities, it's insane and if you're CV and supposedly no other resources around, then go create one! Don't try and tell me there aren't any obese or high risk individuals who are also low SES in your area. There are surely some people you could serve, so go get the proper training, find a healthcare provider willing to mentor you, and start doing some public health work, screenings, etc. Or maybe do some advocacy work to get a free clinic established nearby, etc.

 

[Geebeejay]

Who ever suggested getting your clinical experience in a hospital? Think outside the box a bit.... There are SOOO many other opportunities, it's insane and if you're CV and supposedly no other resources around, then go create one! Don't try and tell me there aren't any obese or high risk individuals who are also low SES in your area. There are surely some people you could serve, so go get the proper training, find a healthcare provider willing to mentor you, and start doing some public health work, screenings, etc. Or maybe do some advocacy work to get a free clinic established nearby, etc.

fortunately I'm an EMT and have no problem finding clinical jobs. These seem like good ideas for someone who wants to get the toes wet though (and has a decent amount of free time on their hands). I would, however, feel a little suspect caring for low SES without any certification - sorta like I'm exploiting them a little bit. But no harm no foul, right?

 

[Geebeejay]

It's all pretty over glorified. It doesn't take hundreds of hours of volunteering or shadowing to decide whether being a doctor is for you and also to get accustomed to the clinical environment. It's much less than that.

Secondly, even if you were to spend way more time doing entry-level clinical work with direct patient contact, it still doesn't resemble what you would do as a physician in the future.

It's just one giant rat race to get as many hours as possible for many.

There are other reasons why a premed may seek a clinical experience than just emulating what a physician does and deciding whether the career is "for them".

 

[Blackxp]

It happens often apparently. The people I volunteer with are so appreciative that I actually help out. I guess previous volunteers either did homework or slept. It comes out though. You can claim 200 hours but you can only go so far in life that way. Chances are they were rejected because they could not talk much about their volunteer experiences during an interview. In addition to that. Having the experiences you gain from actually volunteer do make your personal statement/essays much much better.

 

[rosekendell]

Would schools weigh clinical volunteering hours vs. shadowing hours more than the other? I did some volunteering every summer as an undergrad, but I didn't really learn much from it. I worked in two departments: radiology (I sat in an office room writing out addresses on outgoing mail) and surgery (answered phones, none of the attending doctors were interested in having me shadow them during rounds). At another hospital, I volunteered at a NICU, but even then, there isn't much an inexperienced UG can do except stock supplies. I've been shadowing a doctor for less than a month and gaining lots more experience and patient interaction than I ever did volunteering.

 

[Geebeejay]

Would schools weigh clinical volunteering hours vs. shadowing hours more than the other? I did some volunteering every summer as an undergrad, but I didn't really learn much from it. I worked in two departments: radiology (I sat in an office room writing out addresses on outgoing mail) and surgery (answered phones, none of the attending doctors were interested in having me shadow them during rounds). At another hospital, I volunteered at a NICU, but even then, there isn't much an inexperienced UG can do except stock supplies. I've been shadowing a doctor for less than a month and gaining lots more experience and patient interaction than I ever did volunteering.

I could be wrong, but I believe schools weigh volunteering higher, because you actually contribute something when you volunteer. Though you might learn more shadowing, you would have learned it eventually anyway (i.e. in medical school), so I don't think that would weigh very much. I'd say that if you're concerned with which will look "better", just do both (which I realize you have).

 

[joshyabs]

I'm kind of surprised people will just sit around and play cards. When I was volunteering, I spent my entire time either asking nurses about different procedures, reading the medical books they had behind the counter, checking patient's vitals, visiting patients, going to the lab to ask about different tests and acronyms, and even got to act as a patient with an allergic/seizure reaction in their qualification classes. Good times!

 

[bear2roo]

I'm kind of surprised people will just sit around and play cards. When I was volunteering, I spent my entire time either asking nurses about different procedures, reading the medical books they had behind the counter, checking patient's vitals, visiting patients, going to the lab to ask about different tests and acronyms, and even got to act as a patient with an allergic/seizure reaction in their qualification classes. Good times!

Yah it's nice you can check vitals, visit patients, go to lab, *gasp he's moving around the hospital AND he's a volunteer!* and do all that stuff.

But at the closest hospital near me when I did not have a car, volunteers could ONLY do administrative work....or shadow. Like I could not even walk into a patient's room, could not even get a patient's relative water to drink, could not follow nurses around to gain a better sense. And yes I asked countless times to help/do anything else. I was always stuck behind a counter taking calls, and acting like a secretary. It was a good experience in actually being in the env....but not much longer than the 50 hours I put in. Most of which were me sitting around.

 

[joshyabs]

Wow, I was really fortunate. Try a rural military VA hospital, they usually like the change of pace, and someone who is trying to go to medical school breaks the monotony for them.

 

[Planes2Doc]

It happens often apparently. The people I volunteer with are so appreciative that I actually help out. I guess previous volunteers either did homework or slept. It comes out though. You can claim 200 hours but you can only go so far in life that way. Chances are they were rejected because they could not talk much about their volunteer experiences during an interview. In addition to that. Having the experiences you gain from actually volunteer do make your personal statement/essays much much better.

I think people overestimate the amount of time needed to find something meaningful. Who knows, maybe you'll find something meaningful that will become the focus of your PS on the first day? Therefore, someone with under 50 hours may have had something "better" than someone who volunteered for 500 hours. I still think that people will likely embellish, or even make up plausible things, since there is no way for ADCOMs to check.

So even though people are saying quality > quantity, I think both are important. But as I've mentioned before, quality is only bounded by the applicant's imagination. Therefore, someone who falsified hours (but not on AMCAS) like in the original post who either experienced good stuff early on or made it up, will likely look pretty good to the ADCOMs.

 

[baratheonfire]

.

 

[deleted647690]

I've been documenting all of my volunteer experiences in a journal. Do you think it would be too much to bring my journal to an interview to verify my experiences? I was pretty descriptive, and I have many, many experiences.

 

[baratheonfire]

I've been documenting all of my volunteer experiences in a journal. Do you think it would be too much to bring my journal to an interview to verify my experiences? I was pretty descriptive, and I have many, many experiences.

i feel like thats overkill bro

 

[Reckoner]

I've been documenting all of my volunteer experiences in a journal. Do you think it would be too much to bring my journal to an interview to verify my experiences? I was pretty descriptive, and I have many, many experiences.

Definitely too much. Plus a journal doesn't verify anything. You could have written it the night before the interview for all they know.

Verify your experiences by showing that you remember the things in your application and can speak intelligently about them.

 

[texan2414]

I did 200 hours of stocking shelves, making beds, and wiping down seats last year. Made me feel like a janitor. Hated it.

This year I'm pretty much doing what your friend is doing. Walking in, signing in, and studying for the MCAT (or shadowing doctors). Is it wrong? Yes and no

I don't really think this makes me entirely unethical. I've been volunteering twice a month at my local soup kitchen for the past 12 years (parents started bringing me there when I was 7). I still do it, because I love it. No idea how many hours I've spent, probably 2000+. I'd like to think that makes up for how I'm cheating the hospital.

Also the hospital staff really couldn't care less. First day this year they ran out of tasks to give me within 30 minutes, and I'm pretty sure they forgot I was there really quickly.

You already have an otherwise fabulous volunteer/service profile so why do you feel the need to lie and cheat on the hospital hours??? I just can't imagine people thinking that a couple dozen hours will help solidify an admissions decision.
Also, at the end of the day, you should be accountable to yourself. What kind of doctor do you want to be? Say one thing in front of others but do unethical/questionable things behind their back? Premeds may not have control over their admissions decisions but at least they have control of their character - and integrity should be the top character attribute if you are entering this profession.

 

[terra330]

You already have an otherwise fabulous volunteer/service profile so why do you feel the need to lie and cheat on the hospital hours??? I just can't imagine people thinking that a couple dozen hours will help solidify an admissions decision.
Also, at the end of the day, you should be accountable to yourself. What kind of doctor do you want to be? Say one thing in front of others but do unethical/questionable things behind their back? Premeds may not have control over their admissions decisions but at least they have control of their character - and integrity should be the top character attribute if you are entering this profession.

I imagine he's trying to eliminate gaps where he's doing nothing on paper.

 

[baratheonfire]

I imagine he's trying to eliminate gaps where he's doing nothing on paper.

Yeah, pretty much. I want to look consistent, but I also don't want to do any more janitorial work.

You already have an otherwise fabulous volunteer/service profile so why do you feel the need to lie and cheat on the hospital hours??? I just can't imagine people thinking that a couple dozen hours will help solidify an admissions decision.
Also, at the end of the day, you should be accountable to yourself. What kind of doctor do you want to be? Say one thing in front of others but do unethical/questionable things behind their back? Premeds may not have control over their admissions decisions but at least they have control of their character - and integrity should be the top character attribute if you are entering this profession.

Well it's really 100+ hours, not a few dozen. But I get what you're saying. The problem is that it doesn't matter what kind of doctor I want to be if I don't get into med school. And I'd like to do as much as possible to maximize my chances.

 

[LizzyM]

Interesting trip down memory lane including revisiting the posts of an applicant who was admitted to med school and who left after less than a year to do something in accounting. (true story)

 

[texan2414]

So disgusted and repulsed by what you're doing. You are lying even though you have objectively speaking, the right amount of hours. But the fact that you're lying wipes out whatever you might have done (how do I know you didn't lie and cheat about your food pantry hours, prior 200 hospital hrs, etc.)

 

[baratheonfire]

So disgusted and repulsed by what you're doing. You are lying even though you have objectively speaking, the right amount of hours. But the fact that you're lying wipes out whatever you might have done (how do I know you didn't lie and cheat about your food pantry hours, prior 200 hospital hrs, etc.)

Well I know they're true. It doesn't really matter to me whether or not you believe it. I don't really care for your opinion of me either. I just wanted to post a personal anecdote here, that's all.

 

[WedgeDawg]

Well I know they're true. It doesn't really matter to me whether or not you believe it. I don't really care for your opinion of me either. I just wanted to post a personal anecdote here, that's all.

Why post a controversial personal anecdote on a 2.5 year old thread if you didn't care about other people's opinions...?

 

[baratheonfire]

Why post a controversial personal anecdote on a 2.5 year old thread if you didn't care about other people's opinions...?

bored tbh

 

[deleted647690]

Definitely too much. Plus a journal doesn't verify anything. You could have written it the night before the interview for all they know.

Verify your experiences by showing that you remember the things in your application and can speak intelligently about them.

My journal entries are pretty descriptive and authentic. I think I'd be hard to believe they were made up

 

[Reckoner]

My journal entries are pretty descriptive and authentic. I think I'd be hard to believe they were made up

Then it should be easy to talk about them in your interviews.

If I asked someone about one of the lived experiences in their application and they started reading from a journal I'd think they were making it up. Or had no concept of interview etiquette.

 

[Govols22]

I did 200 hours of stocking shelves, making beds, and wiping down seats last year. Made me feel like a janitor. Hated it.

This year I'm pretty much doing what your friend is doing. Walking in, signing in, and studying for the MCAT (or shadowing doctors). Is it wrong? Yes and no

I don't really think this makes me entirely unethical. I've been volunteering twice a month at my local soup kitchen for the past 12 years (parents started bringing me there when I was 7). I still do it, because I love it. No idea how many hours I've spent, probably 2000+. I'd like to think that makes up for how I'm cheating the hospital.

Also the hospital staff really couldn't care less. First day this year they ran out of tasks to give me within 30 minutes, and I'm pretty sure they forgot I was there really quickly.

The difference between 200 hours vs 300 hours of volunteer service will not make or break your application.
There is no reason for you to lie. The punishment is far greater than the award.

At 200 hours you are in a good position, you shouldn't feel that you need to embellish.

Regardless, I do as well feel that clinical volunteering is overrated.

 

[arc5005]

The fact that clinical volunteering is basically a necessity to get into medical school is stupid. The volunteering part needs to be re-vamped. How many people are passionate about re-stocking things, sitting at a desk, or etc... I'll be hopeful if I have about ~100 clinical volunteering hours by the time I apply, but I'm sure my scribing experience and other volunteer / extracurricular will be much more important than the "clinical volunteering" that pretty much every other applicant has.

 

[LizzyM]

The fact that clinical volunteering is basically a necessity to get into medical school is stupid. The volunteering part needs to be re-vamped. How many people are passionate about re-stocking things, sitting at a desk, or etc... I'll be hopeful if I have about ~100 clinical volunteering hours by the time I apply, but I'm sure my scribing experience and other volunteer / extracurricular will be much more important than the "clinical volunteering" that pretty much every other applicant has.

Frankly, volunteer hours in a hospital are not required. What is required is clinical exposure through shadowing and/or work and/or volunteerism AND a demonstration of a altruistic service to others, particularly the needy, homeless, poor, illiterate, etc. This does not have to be clinical! Tutor refuges in English as a Second Language, help at a soup kitchen or pantry, be a "big brother" or a friendly visitor to the elderly or a person with a serious mental illness, get involved with a blood or bone marrow drive; there are so many possibilities.

 

[aalamruad]

This isn't about lying on AMCAS. This is about something different.

I was at my pre-med club's summer meeting, and I was talking to one guy that is part of a volunteering program in the nearby hospital. He says that for the first 50 hours of the program, he went to all his shifts and stayed there the whole time, to get some clinical experience. However, he said that after the first 40 hours, he just started going in to the hospital's lobby, signing in (on the sign-in sheet), and going back home. He did this until he met the 200 hour requirement. So basically, in reality he's not going to his volunteer shifts anymore, but if someone looks at the sign-in sheets, they'll think he is and give him credit for the hours.

My question is, what can be done about this? Will the hospital find out? Would medical schools be able to find out? If he puts 200 hours on the AMCAS, then even if ADCOMS call the hospital to verify, the hospital would just check the sign-in sheet records and see that he "volunteered" 200 hours even though he actually didn't (he just signed in and left). Its not fair that he's getting away with that while everyone else has to work for it.

😕

 

[arc5005]

Frankly, volunteer hours in a hospital are not required. What is required is clinical exposure through shadowing and/or work and/or volunteerism AND a demonstration of a altruistic service to others, particularly the needy, homeless, poor, illiterate, etc. This does not have to be clinical! Tutor refuges in English as a Second Language, help at a soup kitchen or pantry, be a "big brother" or a friendly visitor to the elderly or a person with a serious mental illness, get involved with a blood or bone marrow drive; there are so many possibilities.

I have volunteered in the past in an area I enjoy. I moved to a new city and I joined a new organization that does similar work, but unfortunately their volunteer opportunities rarely match up w/ my schedule, so I chose to volunteer at the hospital, like many others on SDN have suggested. I don't enjoy it, but they were extremely flexible and I have already made a commitment to them, and it fits in with my scribe working and MCAT studying. I don't think my volunteering will be the make or break of my application anyways.

 

[ZedsDed]

I did 200 hours of stocking shelves, making beds, and wiping down seats last year. Made me feel like a janitor. Hated it.

This year I'm pretty much doing what your friend is doing. Walking in, signing in, and studying for the MCAT (or shadowing doctors). Is it wrong? Yes and no

I don't really think this makes me entirely unethical. I've been volunteering twice a month at my local soup kitchen for the past 12 years (parents started bringing me there when I was 7). I still do it, because I love it. No idea how many hours I've spent, probably 2000+. I'd like to think that makes up for how I'm cheating the hospital.

Also the hospital staff really couldn't care less. First day this year they ran out of tasks to give me within 30 minutes, and I'm pretty sure they forgot I was there really quickly.

That's some seriously broken logic right there

 

[Dr Tony T. Chopper]

It is extremely dishonest but I don't know if I wanna report him. I don't want to be a tattle-tale ("snitches get stitches").

Don't be a tattle tale, be a whistle blower 😉

 

[Dr Tony T. Chopper]

People who falsify volunteer hours are probably the same doucheballs who ditch their rotations early without telling their attending.

 

[LizzyM]

I have volunteered in the past in an area I enjoy. I moved to a new city and I joined a new organization that does similar work, but unfortunately their volunteer opportunities rarely match up w/ my schedule, so I chose to volunteer at the hospital, like many others on SDN have suggested. I don't enjoy it, but they were extremely flexible and I have already made a commitment to them, and it fits in with my scribe working and MCAT studying. I don't think my volunteering will be the make or break of my application anyways.

You are choosing to volunteer... it is not being forced on you. If you don't like it, quit and leave it off your application. I don't think your volunteering will be the make or break of your application anyway. Don't whine; be proactive about living your life as you choose, not in a way that you THINK will please others.

 

[Dr Tony T. Chopper]

Scripps hospital near UCSD actually started cracking down on premeds for signing in then leaving. Several got caught but I didn't know if any actions were taken..

 

[aalamruad]